Is Josh Kennedy the best tall forward in the game?

[JackOutback]

JK was taking marks in the backline today. He's mostly a traditional full forward but it's not like he's rooted to the 50m arc.

 

[avishka5]

If Darling was a tad more taller and more of KPF, then there would be swapping between positions between those two. JJK has an excellent tank and is a pretty decent contested mark but also possess excellent skills and footy brain that would make him a create outside 50. He'd probably play his twilight years working between the arcs.

 

[Great8]

He's 2 goals behind brown and buddy and 4 behind daniher. Also averaging pretty much a goal per game more than all of them.

So he should though to be fair. Kennedy is a gun stay at home forward. Joe spends plenty of time in the ruck or up the ground. Think JK will still win the Coleman

 

[Scotland]

So he should though to be fair. Kennedy is a gun stay at home forward. Joe spends plenty of time in the ruck or up the ground. Think JK will still win the Coleman

If being a 'stay at home forward' is so easy why doesn't everybody do it?

Kennedy and Daniher have taken the same amount of marks inside 50 for the year.

 

[Great8]

If being a 'stay at home forward' is so easy why doesn't everybody do it?

Kennedy and Daniher have taken the same amount of marks inside 50 for the year.

Didn't say it was easy and JK is the best pure full forward by a mile. Daniher is our second ruck option and spends some of the game in the ruck which includes centre bounces and work in the D50 so he isn't inside F50 as much as JK is

 

[jod23]

If he can come back and win the Coleman for a third straight season, the hall beckons. Not to mention, he should end his career with close to 700 goals.

 

[Yippy Yi Yeo]

Didn't say it was easy and JK is the best pure full forward by a mile. Daniher is our second ruck option and spends some of the game in the ruck which includes centre bounces and work in the D50 so he isn't inside F50 as much as JK is

He averages 3.7 taps a game, that's essentially a non factor

 

[christoff91]

I'd say as a traditional full forward then Kennedy is absolutely the best. Fantastic mark and set shot backed up with a brilliant work rate.

For X-factor and a more varied game style it would have to be buddy. I would have to say that buddy probably depends less on service from his team mates then Kennedy due to their different game styles.

Love them both! Imagine if they were in the same team!


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[Ok Boomer]

Franklin was the best last year, Kennedy was better in 15

Explain? Buddy was great last year but Kennedy kicked more goals in less games in 2016 compared to 2015 and the team was worse.

 

[avishka5]

I'd say as a traditional full forward then Kennedy is absolutely the best. Fantastic mark and set shot backed up with a brilliant work rate.

For X-factor and a more varied game style it would have to be buddy. I would have to say that buddy probably depends less on service from his team mates then Kennedy due to their different game styles.

Love them both! Imagine if they were in the same team!


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Bring state of origin back,

Imagine a forward line of JJK at FF, Hogan at CHF and buddy playing as a HHF.

 

[Zuma]

Who's not a poor team?

He had 5 against Adelaide last time we played them.
3 against Geelong and GWS.
9 against port across the last 2 times we've played them.
5 against hawks last year.

Who else do you not rate?

Half these numpties have NFI
Josh is a champion and there is no forward like him

 

[jod23]

JK is another victim of playing for an interstate team. Just at WCE alone, much like Cox, Cousins, Kerr, Matera, Jakovich, McKenna etc etc before him. They are simply not rated as highly as they should be. Yet if the same players were playing at Carlton, Hawthorn, Essendon, Collingwood etc the goo would be unbearable.

 

[fidstar]

JK is another victim of playing for an interstate team. Just at WCE alone, much like Cox, Cousins, Kerr, Matera, Jakovich, McKenna etc etc before him. They are simply not rated as highly as they should be. Yet if the same players were playing at Carlton, Hawthorn, Essendon, Collingwood etc the goo would be unbearable.

I think everyone rates those guys highly over there.

Cox is rated the best ruckman of the last 30 years by most East pundits.

Jakovich as the best CHB.

Not sure what you really want people to be saying about them.

 

[jod23]

I think everyone rates those guys highly over there.

Cox is rated the best ruckman of the last 30 years by most East pundits.

Jakovich as the best CHB.

Not sure what you really want people to be saying about them.

Cox and Jako were rated, but had they played in Melbourne, they would have been absolutely fawned over.

It's like they say it through gritted teeth. Like... oh ok, yeah I guess Cox is the best ruckman of the last 30 years. Whereas had he played at Carlton or something, there would have been parades and songs written about him haha.

Cousins is underrated over east. Kerr criminally underrated. Matera too. McKenna was legit one of the greatest HB flankers you will ever see. Is rarely spoken about over east.

 

[jod23]

Then we have JK. Criminally under rated over east.

If he played for Collingwood and won back to back Coleman's.... well the media would lose their shit.

 

[fidstar]

Cox and Jako were rated, but had they played in Melbourne, they would have been absolutely fawned over.

It's like they say it through gritted teeth. Like... oh ok, yeah I guess Cox is the best ruckman of the last 30 years. Whereas had he played at Carlton or something, there would have been parades and songs written about him haha.

Cousins is underrated over east. Kerr criminally underrated. Matera too. McKenna was legit one of the greatest HB flankers you will ever see. Is rarely spoken about over east.

You are over reacting. McKenna is the only one on that list that may actually be true.

The superstars the WCE have had are highly rated over there. You might be right if you had talked about other players a little further down the list of all time greats at West Coast. Someone like Darren Glass or MacIntosh.

 

[fidstar]

Then we have JK. Criminally under rated over east.

If he played for Collingwood and won back to back Coleman's.... well the media would lose their shit.

Isn't he basically accepted as the best stay at home full forward in the game for the last 3 years. I'm not sure what you want them to do. Suck his dick when he comes to Melbourne?

 

[jod23]

Isn't he basically accepted as the best stay at home full forward in the game for the last 3 years. I'm not sure what you want them to do. Suck his dick when he comes to Melbourne?

He just never gets mentioned much. The media dont talk too much about him. Buddy however is god's gift. Having said that, the media over east barely speak about us anyways.

 

[jod23]

You are over reacting. McKenna is the only one on that list that may actually be true.

The superstars the WCE have had are highly rated over there. You might be right if you had talked about other players a little further down the list of all time greats at West Coast. Someone like Darren Glass or MacIntosh.

I dont believe that. Cousins is one who is absolute top shelf yet gets left out when peopple bring up the tired old Hird/Voss/Buckley discussion. Cousins was every bit as good as any of those three.

Simon Black and Ricciuto suffer interstate fatigue too.

Matera another one. Doesnt get mentioned when talking about greats of the past.

But this all comes back to vic media not really talking about WC or interstate teams much at all. It's why I stopped watching the Footy Show when I was growing up. They simply never spoke about us.

 

[fidstar]

He just never gets mentioned much. The media dont talk too much about him. Buddy however is god's gift. Having said that, the media over east barely speak about us anyways.

Buddy might be one of the best to have ever played the game, so are you surprised that he gets a good run in the media?

 

[fidstar]

I dont believe that. Cousins is one who is absolute top shelf yet gets left out when peopple bring up the tired old Hird/Voss/Buckley discussion. Cousins was every bit as good as any of those three.

Simon Black and Ricciuto suffer interstate fatigue too.

Matera another one. Doesnt get mentioned when talking about greats of the past.

But this all comes back to vic media not really talking about WC or interstate teams much at all. It's why I stopped watching the Footy Show when I was growing up. They simply never spoke about us.

I think he gets left out of the Hird/Voss/Buckley conversation because those guys played more at the same time as each other. That's why they get mentioned in the same breathe. Cousins was a few years later. Also I find it funny in a discussion of underrating you didn't have Harvey in there.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I though if you asked most people who the best wingman in the last 30 years was, Matera would probably win the vote. Do you think that's underrated?

I agree with you on Simon Black.

 

[Jables]

I'd still take Buddy even after seeing the worst game he's played in his life on Friday, They are really very different players though so you can't say it definitively (right now anyway, obviously Buddy has had a better career), would be perfect together. Well he and Roughy were alright too I guess.

JK is another victim of playing for an interstate team. Just at WCE alone, much like Cox, Cousins, Kerr, Matera, Jakovich, McKenna etc etc before him. They are simply not rated as highly as they should be. Yet if the same players were playing at Carlton, Hawthorn, Essendon, Collingwood etc the goo would be unbearable.

What a load of ... literally the first year Buddy went to Sydney the media was saying he was playing better there then he ever did at Hawthorn (and it was bs obviously). How about Brad Hill, all of a sudden a star at Fremantle while everyone insisted he was shit compared to his brother when he was here.

But yeah none of those guys you mentioned are rated at all mate, no one would know who Cousins was if he didn't play at Richmond, absolutely. Wasn't Jakovich that dude who Carey dominated? I know Kerr was the hamstring guy, you got me.

 

[WeaselWJ]

How about Brad Hill, all of a sudden a star at Fremantle while everyone insisted he was shit compared to his brother when he was here.

lol? He's getting a bit more attention because he's getting more of the ball, but he's still a soft outside player with overrated disposal. Is still shit in comparison to his brother and I can't see that changing.

 

[Scotland]

Explain? Buddy was great last year but Kennedy kicked more goals in less games in 2016 compared to 2015 and the team was worse.

Buddy does more than kick goals. Got 17 touches a game last year and was 3rd for I50s at the Swans. Last year was a bit of an outlier in that regard, but he's playing less of a pure inside 50 role at the Swans. A lot of that is due to playing half his games at the SCG which is 10-15m shorter than the MCG.

We don't set up well at either coming from Subiaco which is long and narrow. Franklin at Sydney has settled in to a higher role where in playing CHF the difference between an attacking lead for a shot for goal and a get out kick from defence is less. Also helps that he kicks goals form 60, would probably lead the comp in those (I have no stat).

 

[Scotland]

FWIW I just looked at the season heat maps for Franklin and Kennedy.

Franklin is 82% time in forward half with a thick red block about 30m deep traversing the ground across the 50m markings on the arc. If you break the oval into 4 segments from FB to FF his possessions are 5/50/146/114.

Kennedy is 85% time in forward half and his possessions are concentrated more centrally. If you break the oval into 4 segments from FB to FF his possessions are 0/24/35/101.

They both work right up the ground but it's Franklin's possessions between centre wing and about 30-40m out that are the difference (accounting for 18 games vs 13).