Game Day JLT Community Series - Carlton v Fremantle Gameday Discussion

[Stig O'Hara]

I am Frank Zappa.

Gimmee back my peaches!!!

You hot rat.

 

[LordLucifer]

Gimmee back my peaches!!!

You hot rat.

Are you Bobby Brown ??

 

[cisco82]

Has KJ ever looked ripped?
To me he looks like AFL players look when they're 2 yrs retired.

Hell SOS still looks more ripped than him.

 

[Blue Baggers]

I think we're missing a trick not playing KJ along with Cas and McKay. This would mean teams need to play 3 talls down back and also provides multiple options coming out of defence, can have cas and KJ pushing up to the wings. I don't know what KJ has done but obviously he has been set targets that he hasn't met. IMO he's 22yrs old he's a tall and always take longer to develop and he hasn't had a fair crack at it since arriving with illness and injury. I'm a KJ fan he has a junior highlight reel that would rival any star and hopefully he can reach those heights.

 

[Jimmae]

I think we're missing a trick not playing KJ along with Cas and McKay. This would mean teams need to play 3 talls down back and also provides multiple options coming out of defence, can have cas and KJ pushing up to the wings. I don't know what KJ has done but obviously he has been set targets that he hasn't met. IMO he's 22yrs old he's a tall and always take longer to develop and he hasn't had a fair crack at it since arriving with illness and injury. I'm a KJ fan he has a junior highlight reel that would rival any star and hopefully he can reach those heights.

Taking out A.Silvagni and White, currently the side has Plowman, Marchbank, Weitering, Rowe, Macreadie, C.Curnow, McKay, Casboult and J.Silvagni lined up for round 1.

Given that in the past Jaksch totally lacked anything of AFL quality other than the ability to kick the ball long (if he managed to get it), what exactly elevates him to, let alone separates him from that pack.

He has to show more than one game given his arse is already on fire.

 

[footyfan1978]

Sorry to turn this into a list management post....

Ability, maybe lack of application, immature....better not turn into another Laidler.

Seems he has to put blocks of games together to even be considered.

He got one game?? last year when the Cows belted us, then back to Cramer St.

Anyone???

I thought it was the game against Eagles at MCG.
From memory we barely got the ball up forward in the times he was up there so limited chance but then later in game remember seeing him in backline and whatever he did I remember was absolute terrible costly error that caused an easy goal for Eagles. That was his one chance for season. It at least showed me he should not be in the backline.

 

[footyfan1978]

Looking at 27 man squad to goto Perth I am expecting Harry McKay, Macreadie and Cam Polson all travelling more for learning experience and be the 3 most likely ones not named in final 24 on the night.
Suspect they play in whatever practice game is organised for reserves players the following weekend.
SPS due to play next weekend too.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Taking out A.Silvagni and White, currently the side has Plowman, Marchbank, Weitering, Rowe, Macreadie, C.Curnow, McKay, Casboult and J.Silvagni lined up for round 1.

Given that in the past Jaksch totally lacked anything of AFL quality other than the ability to kick the ball long (if he managed to get it), what exactly elevates him to, let alone separates him from that pack.

He has to show more than one game given his arse is already on fire.

Im not a jaksch fan but i think your selling his performances in the twos last year a little short there . Hes had some pretty good form to go by last year yes ? . Of the players you have mentioned both Macreadie and Mckay have been elevated to the senior side with absolutely no solid form in the reserves to earn such an elevation yet they have been preferred over jaksch . Macreadie has just arrived at the club and hes in and whilst i like the kid should he earn a spot before jaksch at this stage ? There are plenty of other examples throughout the 2 jlt games of players off no form because they have just arrived at the club getting games polson pickett to name 2 . Obviously there is something amiss here but if the club arent even going to give him a jlt game then i dont see the point why we retained him on the list for this year . Maybe he should have been delisted and another side pick him up as a DFA and see what they can do with him ? Imo right now we are doing him a disservice no matter what the issue is . Will be interesting to see what happens here if he does string some good form together in the twos to start the year .

 

[Jesse Deluxe]

I think we're missing a trick not playing KJ along with Cas and McKay. This would mean teams need to play 3 talls down back and also provides multiple options coming out of defence, can have cas and KJ pushing up to the wings. I don't know what KJ has done but obviously he has been set targets that he hasn't met. IMO he's 22yrs old he's a tall and always take longer to develop and he hasn't had a fair crack at it since arriving with illness and injury. I'm a KJ fan he has a junior highlight reel that would rival any star and hopefully he can reach those heights.

None of those 3 would get a game of any other team on a consistent basis. Playing all 3 would be laughable come season proper. They might have 5 kicks between them all game. Imagine the defenders rebounding from them.

Nothing in 4-5 years has lead people to believe at 2 clubs KJ is up to it... Timid, no engine, average kick and mark no leadership qualities. All meat no potatoes as they say.

 

[TooBlue14]

None of those 3 would get a game of any other team on a consistent basis. Playing all 3 would be laughable come season proper. They might have 5 kicks between them all game. Imagine the defenders rebounding from them.

Nothing in 4-5 years has lead people to believe at 2 clubs KJ is up to it... Timid, no engine, average kick and mark no leadership qualities. All meat no potatoes as they say.

Whereas I've watched many vfl games over the past two years and I think KJ deserved a crack last year before SOS and Jones. Both these players had 3-4 good games in a row next to KJ but I thought Jaksch was much more deserving. Once they got the call up he continued with his form despite being looked past. As a VFL player KJ tends to be the player that swings forwards and backwards all game to cover gaps in the structure. And he has been successful in all them. Imagine if they let him settle forward all day. Expect 4-5 goals every week. If this happens and we still don't pick him expect a team without a strong forward line to snatch him up as a DFA next year and make us look stupid once again. He is a much better version of White. If he had that intensity and attitude he'd be picked quite quickly every week. I'm hoping we see him soon.

 

[StandByyourMan]

Taking out A.Silvagni and White, currently the side has Plowman, Marchbank, Weitering, Rowe, Macreadie, C.Curnow, McKay, Casboult and J.Silvagni lined up for round 1.

Given that in the past Jaksch totally lacked anything of AFL quality other than the ability to kick the ball long (if he managed to get it), what exactly elevates him to, let alone separates him from that pack.

He has to show more than one game given his arse is already on fire.

Agree. Jaksch has not shown anything to date when called up. However it might have been an idea to play him in all three JLTs to give him some continuity with no risk. He now continues to be in no mans land with the only real chance of a call up seemingly being only to cover injury for a game here or there at best.

 

[StandByyourMan]

Im not a jaksch fan but i think your selling his performances in the twos last year a little short there . Hes had some pretty good form to go by last year yes ? . Of the players you have mentioned both Macreadie and Mckay have been elevated to the senior side with absolutely no solid form in the reserves to earn such an elevation yet they have been preferred over jaksch . Macreadie has just arrived at the club and hes in and whilst i like the kid should he earn a spot before jaksch at this stage ? There are plenty of other examples throughout the 2 jlt games of players off no form because they have just arrived at the club getting games polson pickett to name 2 . Obviously there is something amiss here but if the club arent even going to give him a jlt game then i dont see the point why we retained him on the list for this year . Maybe he should have been delisted and another side pick him up as a DFA and see what they can do with him ? Imo right now we are doing him a disservice no matter what the issue is . Will be interesting to see what happens here if he does string some good form together in the twos to start the year .

Mcreadie has shown bucket loads more than Jaksch already IMHO.

 

[StandByyourMan]

Jaksch is the guy that always made the state squad and noone knew why. He looks good but has no ticker or mongrel. Not good qualities, especially when trying to get a game under Bolts.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Mcreadie has shown bucket loads more than Jaksch already IMHO.

Agreed he looks great but thats not the point i was making on jaksch .

 

[StandByyourMan]

Agreed he looks great but thats not the point i was making on jaksch .

Yep. I TOTALLY agree with your sentiment though. I think it's a waste of resources not to pay him in all three JLTs. No down side all upside.

 

[Jimmae]

Im not a jaksch fan but i think your selling his performances in the twos last year a little short there . Hes had some pretty good form to go by last year yes ? . Of the players you have mentioned both Macreadie and Mckay have been elevated to the senior side with absolutely no solid form in the reserves to earn such an elevation yet they have been preferred over jaksch . Macreadie has just arrived at the club and hes in and whilst i like the kid should he earn a spot before jaksch at this stage ? There are plenty of other examples throughout the 2 jlt games of players off no form because they have just arrived at the club getting games polson pickett to name 2 . Obviously there is something amiss here but if the club arent even going to give him a jlt game then i dont see the point why we retained him on the list for this year . Maybe he should have been delisted and another side pick him up as a DFA and see what they can do with him ? Imo right now we are doing him a disservice no matter what the issue is . Will be interesting to see what happens here if he does string some good form together in the twos to start the year .

If he stays on the same trajectory, clubs are going to want him to go back to state level and show something before they draft him.

Jaksch got the same opportunities as McKay and Macreadie when he first arrived, albeit his contested work wasn't as good (and probably remains as much, at least as of last year) and he wasn't nailing some of the high-pressure aspects the way they are (kicking into tighter zones coming out of defence, kicking into the 50, ground ball contests, etc).

We need some zip, work rate, forward pressure and goal scoring off HF, that's why we're looking at McKay, Polson and Pickett, because they try to offer all four of those things, whereas Jaksch has only ever tried to offer maybe two (and one of them not at a VFL standard). He's been very vanilla so if this is the start of an aggressive streak in terms of making leads and being involved in the play, everything else will flow from that.

He's got a lot of work ahead of him to impress that he can commit to that level of play for four quarters in the VFL. I think when some of the names you've mentioned slide back to the VFL at times this year, their output will shock you. I think we're finally past the point of trying to pick guys based on glimpses of form in the reserves, and that's good news for the overall performance of the squad.

Agree. Jaksch has not shown anything to date when called up. However it might have been an idea to play him in all three JLTs to give him some continuity with no risk. He now continues to be in no mans land with the only real chance of a call up seemingly being only to cover injury for a game here or there at best.

He's in the reserves, not no man's land. Sumner was the only player in no man's land last week.

 

[Iamcarlton]

If he stays on the same trajectory, clubs are going to want him to go back to state level and show something before they draft him.

Jaksch got the same opportunities as McKay and Macreadie when he first arrived, albeit his contested work wasn't as good (and probably remains as much, at least as of last year) and he wasn't nailing some of the high-pressure aspects the way they are (kicking into tighter zones coming out of defence, kicking into the 50, ground ball contests, etc).

We need some zip, work rate, forward pressure and goal scoring off HF, that's why we're looking at McKay, Polson and Pickett, because they try to offer all four of those things, whereas Jaksch has only ever tried to offer maybe two (and one of them not at a VFL standard). He's been very vanilla so if this is the start of an aggressive streak in terms of making leads and being involved in the play, everything else will flow from that.

He's got a lot of work ahead of him to impress that he can commit to that level of play for four quarters in the VFL. I think when some of the names you've mentioned slide back to the VFL at times this year, their output will shock you. I think we're finally past the point of trying to pick guys based on glimpses of form in the reserves, and that's good news for the overall performance of the squad.


He's in the reserves, not no man's land. Sumner was the only player in no man's land last week.

We are both talking about the jlt series arent we ?. You know the games we have made it known we are experimenting or i dam well hope thats the case . Virtually every player thats been fit has had a game in the jlt bar jaksch . Little strange for my liking .

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

To those wishing to replace Casboult with KJ, or give KJ a go instead of Jones as the main key forward when Cas isn't up there.... (Sheik you'd like this!) KJ would be the second shortest key target in the competition. Shorter than him are Gunston/ Roughead... whoever you consider the number 1 at hawthorn. Either way both of those guys are comfortably better than KJ. We'd be an absolute mess if KJ was our number 1 forward. Jones is 5 cm taller and 10 - 12 kg heavier. Clearly play a different role. Harry Mckay has been getting games for exposure as a key forward target. Something KJ IS NOT!

 

[Jimmae]

We are both talking about the jlt series arent we ?. You know the games we have made it known we are experimenting or i dam well hope thats the case . Virtually every player thats been fit has had a game in the jlt bar jaksch . Little strange for my liking .

Here's the list of the other guys who haven't played and haven't been named this week: JGM, SPS, Sumner, Sheehan, Phillips, Kerr, Gallucci. Of those, you'd say only SPS and Phillips would have been stiff not to play if fit.

Here are the guys who got a token nod in the last two weeks for showing a little something in the pre-season: Korcheck, Boekhorst, Jones, Williamson, Graham, LeBois.

Your contention was simply why isn't Jaksch isn't in that group of names, to which I point out Jones is the only similar type, and despite his short comings, he really does try to put in, but seems to be physically incapable of doing so for four quarters at AFL level. Jaksch's effort has been far too conditional in comparison.

 

[rog1995]

Im concerned about our team structure. We have 9 talls in our squad. This is a big ground and would of liked to see Rowe and White replaced with Lebois and Sumner or another running player.

 

[Jimmae]

To those wishing to replace Casboult with KJ, or give KJ a go instead of Jones as the main key forward when Cas isn't up there.... (Sheik you'd like this!) KJ would be the second shortest key target in the competition. Shorter than him are Gunston/ Roughead... whoever you consider the number 1 at hawthorn. Either way both of those guys are comfortably better than KJ. We'd be an absolute mess if KJ was our number 1 forward. Jones is 5 cm taller and 10 - 12 kg heavier. Clearly play a different role. Harry Mckay has been getting games for exposure as a key forward target. Something KJ IS NOT!

Jaksch is 197, he's not short. He's about 5-8 kgs lighter than what you'd like to see him playing at.

Im concerned about our team structure. We have 9 talls in our squad. This is a big ground and would of liked to see Rowe and White replaced with Lebois and Sumner or another running player.

Look at it this way: we've got Pickett, Cuningham and Polson as our young smalls, and Weitering, McKay, Macreadie, Plowman, J. Silvagni and Marchbank as our young talls. The talls need an option other than Levi on the bench to help with rotations, so one of White or A. Silvagni plays.

As for the rest of the group, they get to operate with one spare in the final pre-season game, which leaves the senior guys in a full dress rehearsal. It checks out, so long as Lamb and one of White and A. Silvagni miss.

 

[Soapy V]

Im concerned about our team structure. We have 9 talls in our squad. This is a big ground and would of liked to see Rowe and White replaced with Lebois and Sumner or another running player.

It's a pre season squad that needs to be trimmed by 3 before game and another 2 for round one. I don't think it's an issue at this point

 

[Iamcarlton]

Here's the list of the other guys who haven't played and haven't been named this week: JGM, SPS, Sumner, Sheehan, Phillips, Kerr, Gallucci. Of those, you'd say only SPS and Phillips would have been stiff not to play if fit.

Here are the guys who got a token nod in the last two weeks for showing a little something in the pre-season: Korcheck, Boekhorst, Jones, Williamson, Graham, LeBois.

Your contention was simply why isn't Jaksch isn't in that group of names, to which I point out Jones is the only similar type, and despite his short comings, he really does try to put in, but seems to be physically incapable of doing so for four quarters at AFL level. Jaksch's effort has been far too conditional in comparison.

Well he should have been delisted then . Contract or not .

 

[Jimmae]

Well he should have been delisted then . Contract or not .

He did enough to earn another year, but the improvement rate was slow.

 

[Soapy V]

Look at it this way: we've got Pickett, Cuningham and Polson as our young smalls, and Weitering, McKay, Macreadie, Plowman, J. Silvagni and Marchbank as our young talls. The talls need an option other than Levi on the bench to help with rotations, so one of White or A. Silvagni plays.

As for the rest of the group, they get to operate with one spare in the final pre-season game, which leaves the senior guys in a full dress rehearsal. It checks out, so long as Lamb and one of White and A. Silvagni miss.

Are the highlighted really talls? Although quite tall I see them as more mobile players. Cripps is tall, do we class him in the same bracket?