Draft Watcher Knightmare's 2013 phantom draft

[Knightmare]

Love your work KM. A great read and source of reference for rundowns on potential draft picks

I see you currently have the Suns first pick at #9 but I think we'll end up with pick #5, the same position we are currently at. If this turns out to be the case who do you think we should target? I still believe we need to improve our midfield depth first and foremost, and need an inside / outside mid with elite disposal especially by foot who can spot up targets inside forward 50. I see James Aish was spotted having dinner with Gaz and co on the coast last week. any chance of him sliding?

At pick 5 Jack Billings would be the choice if available as that really elite ball user into the forward 50.

Unfortunately for Gold Coast and all the other teams who would like for him to slide it's difficult to see him sliding past pick 2, and even more difficult to see him sliding past pick 3. But Toumpas/Grundy slid last year further than anticipated so you can never say never at this time in the year.

 

[TheSunGod]

At pick 5 Jack Billings would be the choice if available as that really elite ball user into the forward 50.

Unfortunately for Gold Coast and all the other teams who would like for him to slide it's difficult to see him sliding past pick 2, and even more difficult to see him sliding past pick 3. But Toumpas/Grundy slid last year further than anticipated so you can never say never at this time in the year.

Cheers. Will have to rely on Clayton being able to possibly trade up a couple of spots then. Not sure how and if we have the currency to do that though. Still Jack Billings sounds alright.

 

[Sunny_]

Isn't Billings a small forward? Didn't know he was full-time mid material. Would you liken him to Brandon Matera, KM?

 

[Knightmare]

Isn't Billings a small forward? Didn't know he was full-time mid material. Would you liken him to Brandon Matera, KM?

Billings is projected by many as a full time midfielder and he can go through the midfield but I just like him more as a forward first who can rotate into the midfield as more part of a secondary midfield group.

Billings is much stronger than Matera. Not big bodied but just wins all the 1v1s and is an incredibly strong mark at his size.

He's more a Jimmy Bartel/Nick Dal Santo class type or a less freakish Mark LeCras.

In any case I see Gold Coast winning to many games to have a chance at Billings. To me anyway you fellas look much better than a bottom 5/6 team with Ablett and Bennell in the team alongside O'Meara. It's a team almost pushing towards the top 8 with an easy run home.

 

[DeeWong6996]

Hey KM, been hearing whispers from reliable sources that Kelly is more of a chance to go #2 to Melbourne. I'm personally a bit disappointed because it seems we are going for more of Sidebottom than a Pendlebury (Aish). Would that be a fair comparison? How do you think Kelly will transition into the AFL? Seems very lightly built and predominantly a flashy outside player, Melbourne have taken a few like that in the past and royally screwed them up (Scully, Morton, Gysberts, Blease)

And lastly, any good mature agers running around in the state leagues? Loving the work of Terlich and Jones this year, I suspect we might pluck a few again given the success we had.

 

[Sunny_]

Not with our current injury list, KM! I can only see two more wins. But thanks for the thought.

 

[Knightmare]

Hey KM, been hearing whispers from reliable sources that Kelly is more of a chance to go #2 to Melbourne. I'm personally a bit disappointed because it seems we are going for more of Sidebottom than a Pendlebury (Aish). Would that be a fair comparison? How do you think Kelly will transition into the AFL? Seems very lightly built and predominantly a flashy outside player, Melbourne have taken a few like that in the past and royally screwed them up (Scully, Morton, Gysberts, Blease)

And lastly, any good mature agers running around in the state leagues? Loving the work of Terlich and Jones this year, I suspect we might pluck a few again given the success we had.

Kelly isn't nearly as able to win his own footy as Sidebottom who is more your combo inside/outside player. Aish while he is excellent in traffic as Pendlebury is I'm not seeing him becoming anything close to that same quality inside player.

I'd say it's more Andrew Gaff (Kelly) v Corey Enright (Aish - shorter version).

I'd go with Aish anyday. His ceiling is much higher and as productive as Kelly is I see him hitting that ceiling within his first few seasons and not having all that much more growth left in his game as that outside only player. Aish can take his game much further.

Melbourne have done very well with their state league recruits this year. It's rare that you find A-graders in the state leagues but you can often find some pretty immediate pieces who can help you right away and go on to have long careers if you spot the right guys.
I'd strongly recommend George Hampson this season as a classy utility. Has an injury history but he's worked through that and become an exceptional player in the WAFL this season with his running game excellent with that exceptional endurance he has an superb skills.
Western Bulldogs could do worse than take a shot at young Hampson also.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

What would Gawn and Fizpatrick bring to the Bulldogs as they could come cheap. Assuming Minson is used as a trade bait do you think them two could replace him along with Cambell in the VFL who has played well.

We would not trade Gawn, he would not come cheap.

A 21 year old 208cm ruck who's kicked goals up forward and got a tonne of hitouts when played first ruck... and tackles, got 7 tackles on the weekend - when's the last time a 208cm bloke laid 7 tackles?

If we can keep him fit, and get his strength up he'll be a long term player for us.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

Although I'd be pretty hesitant to pick a non-mid with a top pick, Billings is the pick of the draft in terms of footballing ability and smarts.

Could you see us picking him up? Especially if he has a big finals series?

He trained with us as an AIS member, word was we were pretty impressed with him.

How do you see his inside game developing? I think he has a pretty good one on one game as a forward, so it seems that could transition.

 

[TheLastEmperor]

KM, would it be fair to suggest Aish has similar lateral movement in traffic to a young Trent Cotchin? Not saying his inside game is as advanced just that he has that quick thinking, clean hands and quick movement as Trent does. From what I've seen of Aish he's a lot quicker around the stoppages than Enright and almost a less talented version of a cross between O'Meara and Cotchin. Thoughts?

 

[loki04]

While the draft order between the highly regarded midfielders may change between now and draft day it looks clear that Tom Boyd is the standout KPP of the draft

We don't know how good Boyd will eventually become but most would at least declare him to become a good player

GWS have made it clear that for them to give up their number 1 draft pick they would need a player that met their criteria

Sheedy stated that a player who had around 100 games under his belt in the 24 age group and was a top 5 player at your club would fit the bill

Many Melbourne supporters think that our forward line has a no vacancy sign on the door and the need for Boyd is not required

Melbourne has 3 key position forwards

Clark is our best performer but injury prone and how many games he has left is anyone guess
Dawes is good without being great
Hogan much like Boyd could be anything

Watts will never have the build to play KP and is probably best suited to a flank or wing

Fitzpatrick is a Forward and Ruck option although i am convinced with his unique speed he could easily be effective at full forward especially if we lost the services of Clark though injury

The question i ask KM is would it be feasible for Melbourne to offer up James Frawley for GWS Draft pick #1

GWS need to strengthen their spine and Frawley could do that as a KP Defender

That would give Melbourne the first 2 draft picks in round one

The added dilemma is would we actually pick Boyd and a much needed midfielder or ignore Boyd altogether and pick 2 Midfielders

Melbourne also has an early pick in round 2 so could either gain 3 Midfielders or 2 and Boyd

A lot would depend on the depth of quality midfielders lasting until round 2

Frawley is contracted until 2015 i believe and their has been some speculation of interests from other clubs

Frawley would be a loss and a hole for Melbourne to fill but the size of the hole might not be that big compared to what we could gain

Your thoughts ?

ie we have no intention of trading the no1 pick we are just paying lip service to get the AFL and media off our backs, just like the mini picks where we traded them for picks.

 

[loki04]

I do think Freeman is available at the Pies selection and while there are others who rate him I'm probably on that extreme high end with how highly I rate his game. He's generally regarded as a 10-20 type prospect and with Collingwood most likely having a selection somewhere closer to pick 10 I'd say more likely than not he's still there. If there he's the perfect fit and my choice in any case with Collingwood lacking some inside power but also that breakaway pace from the inside.

Hows his kicking KM?

I personally hope we take Dom Sheed he is an elite user of the ball from what I witnessed at the champs can win inside ball and break from congestion and also good outside goal kicking mid.

I think the 1 paced question marks on him are harsh he is much like Pendles in that he may not appear to move quick but no one closes him down.

We need elite users for Buckleys game plan to be effective and currently have too many Malthouse turnover merchants which we need to balance out.

 

[paul scholes]

ie we have no intention of trading the no1 pick we are just paying lip service to get the AFL and media off our backs, just like the mini picks where we traded them for picks.

Agree, it's just a smokescreen from Sheedy .
Nobody's going to give up a gun in that age group.
Particularly if that club is entering finals calculations or top 4 .

 

[Knightmare]

We would not trade Gawn, he would not come cheap.

A 21 year old 208cm ruck who's kicked goals up forward and got a tonne of hitouts when played first ruck... and tackles, got 7 tackles on the weekend - when's the last time a 208cm bloke laid 7 tackles?

If we can keep him fit, and get his strength up he'll be a long term player for us.

Jarrod Witts at that same height is a freak tackler and while a worse tap ruckman his tackling game is more advanced having coming from a rugby background.

If he played more ruck minutes as opposed to mostly up forward he'd be able to surpass that mark with time as a guy who has on several occasions at VFL level equaled that mark and even on one occasion this year bettered that mark.

But I'm with you on Gawn. At his height as a guy already playing senior footy he has plenty of improvement left and has the opportunity to become one of the better ruckmen.

Although I'd be pretty hesitant to pick a non-mid with a top pick, Billings is the pick of the draft in terms of footballing ability and smarts.

Could you see us picking him up? Especially if he has a big finals series?

He trained with us as an AIS member, word was we were pretty impressed with him.

How do you see his inside game developing? I think he has a pretty good one on one game as a forward, so it seems that could transition.

Billings is usually rated somewhere around pick 5. He'll have to be on that shortlist at pick 2. He probably gets overlooked in favour of an Aish or Kelly who offer more outside running but Billings still deserves to be in that conversation, and with a big finals series it can't be overlooked.
Billings' inside game does have potential to grow. Perhaps into something of a poor man's Dal Santo which is mostly what he's projected as anyway which is still a pretty handy outcome.

KM, would it be fair to suggest Aish has similar lateral movement in traffic to a young Trent Cotchin? Not saying his inside game is as advanced just that he has that quick thinking, clean hands and quick movement as Trent does. From what I've seen of Aish he's a lot quicker around the stoppages than Enright and almost a less talented version of a cross between O'Meara and Cotchin. Thoughts?

I compared him to a Cotchin earlier on but I'm just not seeing him develop quite that same midfielders game. But he does share those same traits with his ability in trafic to think, have that bit more time and make the right decisions and use his pace which is generally why he's likened by the media to a Pendlebury.

I see Aish more as that early career Enright as more a wingman if anything but his pace is certainly very good with that ability to break away. I just wouldn't have him in that same conversation as O'Meara or Cotchin with his ability to win his own footy not likely to get to that same level.

Hows his kicking KM?

I personally hope we take Dom Sheed he is an elite user of the ball from what I witnessed at the champs can win inside ball and break from congestion and also good outside goal kicking mid.

I think the 1 paced question marks on him are harsh he is much like Pendles in that he may not appear to move quick but no one closes him down.

We need elite users for Buckleys game plan to be effective and currently have too many Malthouse turnover merchants which we need to balance out.

Freeman is a very good user of the footy. Not only an excellent finisher but hits his targets around the ground.

I wouldn't lose any sleep if we ended up with a Sheed either and I agree with your comments.

 

[HereIam86]

Hey Knightmare just wondering your thoughts on Michael Gibbons and which round you see him going?

 

[Knightmare]

Hey Knightmare just wondering your thoughts on Michael Gibbons and which round you see him going?

Gibbons finds the footy but as a small who is a below average user of the pill by foot is probably more a rookie prospect.

So many quality smalls this year - Taylor, Hartung, Impy, Honeychurch among others it's hard to see too many other smalls getting drafted.

 

[Lyyynnnchy]

We would not trade Gawn, he would not come cheap.

A 21 year old 208cm ruck who's kicked goals up forward and got a tonne of hitouts when played first ruck... and tackles, got 7 tackles on the weekend - when's the last time a 208cm bloke laid 7 tackles?

If we can keep him fit, and get his strength up he'll be a long term player for us.

Naitanui had 9 tackles on the weekend

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

Naitanui had 9 tackles on the weekend

Since when is Naitanui 208 cms?

 

[Lyyynnnchy]

Since when is Naitanui 208 cms?

I took it as you meaning when was the last time a ruckman had 8 tackles

 

[Lyyynnnchy]

Knightmare,

West Coast would ideally like a mid in the Dangerfield mould. A medium to tall mid with explosive pace, elite clearance ability and precise kicking skills. I know these mids dont grow on trees but if WC were to be looking for exactly that, who do you think they'd go for?

It looks like Freeman pretty much fits the bill but I'm not sure I'd be keen on WC getting more mids under the 185cm mark. We seem to struggle against the taller, bigger bodied midfields with no mids over the 187cm mark. I also see he's been tipped for around the 10 to 15 mark so maybe WC would be reaching if they picked him up around the 8 to 10 mark?

 

[swansfan51]

If there was a player with explosive pace, elite clearance ability and precise kicking skills in this draft he wouldn't last past pick 1. There are about 5 players in the league that meet that description.

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

I took it as you meaning when was the last time a ruckman had 8 tackles

Haha, fair enough then mate

 

[ThePuppetMaster]

If there was a player with explosive pace, elite clearance ability and precise kicking skills in this draft he wouldn't last past pick 1. There are about 5 players in the league that meet that description.

Interesting to note that Dangerfield lasted well past pick 1....

 

[swansfan51]

Interesting to note that Dangerfield lasted well past pick 1....

And at the time he was drafted he didn't have elite clearance ability and precise kicking skills, or he would have not lasted past pick 2. And that's only because Kreuzer was regarded as an absolute standout tall prospect.

 

[tigs2010]

If there was a player with explosive pace, elite clearance ability and precise kicking skills in this draft he wouldn't last past pick 1. There are about 5 players in the league that meet that description.

Maybe. Of those 5 how many went pick 1?