Leigh Matthews Trophy most prestigious individual award

[Vankri]

This is simply not true

Perhaps you think it applies this season with Bont beating out Cripps, Heeney, Hogan and Daicos for the MVP ???

But looking back through the honour roll of past winners, none of them were chosen based on their reputation.
They were all voted for based on having an exceptional season.

Brayshaw... Lachie Neale during Covid... Tom Mitchell... Swan... young Judd at West Coast... a young Nick Riewoldt.. Benny Cousins... Darcy... Crawf.... Banger Harvey... McKernan... Stynes... Millane.... Healy... Roosy.... Greene... TD...

I think people are far too critical of the players not giving a stuff, not watching games, not being footy heads, etc... They know who they believe the best player is. Maybe you don't need to watch every game. Who watches every game anyway?

I see people on here acting like they're opinions are better than everyone else's, but I bet they don't watch half the games either. That doesn't stop them from gobbing off with their crappy opinions, or from bagging the All Australian selection committee and the players' MVP voting.

I'm wouldn't matter what scoring system or voting system we had - people would still find faults and reasons to complain (mainly because their favourite player didn't win the award)



I personally think people get carried away by the week-to-week form of the top midfielders. The Brownlow and AFLCA awards are won and lost based on the weekly accumulation of BOGs... But I don't think this is always an accurate guide to who the real best player is.

I like the MVP award because it snaps back to reality - Bontempelli IS the best player, in my opinion. He gets robbed of many votes because he can play anywhere and his coach moves him around and he often parks him up forward.

Bont >>> Heeney, Cripps, Hogan and Daicos (in 2024)

It's close between Bont and Daicos, but I think Bont still edges him slightly.


MVP
1982 Leigh Matthews
1983 Terry Daniher
1984 Russell Greene
1985 Greg Williams
1986 Paul Roos
1987 Tony Lockett
1988 Gerard Healy
1989 Tim Watson
1990 Darren Millane
1991 Jim Stynes
1992 Jason Dunstall
1993 Gary Ablett
1994 Greg Williams
1995 Wayne Carey
1996 Corey McKernan
1997 Robert Harvey
1998 Wayne Carey
1999 Shane Crawford
2000 Anthony Koutoufides
2001 Andrew McLeod
2002 Michael Voss, Luke Darcy
2003 Michael Voss
2004 Nick Riewoldt
2005 Ben Cousins
2006 Chris Judd
2007 Gary Ablett Jr
2008 Gary Ablett Jr
2009 Gary Ablett Jr
2010 Dane Swan
2011 Chris Judd
2012 Gary Ablett Jr
2013 Gary Ablett Jr
2014 Nat Fyfe
2015 Nat Fyfe
2016 Patrick Dangerfield
2017 Dustin Martin
2018 Tom Mitchell
2019 Patrick Cripps
2020 Lachie Neale
2021 Marcus Bontempelli
2022 Andrew Brayshaw
2023 Marcus Bontempelli
2024 Marcus Bontempelli

You know I actually don’t disagree with you despite the tone of your response. I just define ‘best player in the game’ differently to the seasons’s best player. And I think because of lack of accountability and a logical bias the player’s trophy has a skew towards a bigger body of work than a single season.

I’ll leave Daicos aside because his age skews the conversation towards picking him in any scenario but if you told me I can start a team to win a flag in the next 3 years I pick Bont first. But if you tell me who had the best 2024 season I pick Cripps or Heeney.

I agree that every single award and voting system has pros and cons. I prefer the accountability of the Coaches vote but don’t mind if you go another way. I will never concede though that the Brownloas is the most flawed despite its media and general public prestige.

No Ross Lyon team is ever going to win a game by 200 points. Pies were cooked. Even then, the commentators were discussing his team feeding it to him on every occasion they could vs the Dees. One of the all time stat padding masterclasses

Plus, Flys said on numerous occasions that he felt Nicky was robbed of the awards last year due to injury. This year it was pretty clear that Fly was willing to take that into his own control and award him charity votes to make sure he'd get over the line at the end

You couldn’t find a better way to show your bias if you tried.

Nick played an exceptional game against the Dees because he was not tagged due to the dead rubber nature of the game. He’s one of the very hardest runners in the game and if you put no one on him he will get 40 touches. Yes we feed the ball to him because he finds the space and he’s our most dangerous mid going forward for scoring (you know, the point of the game). His stats sure said so but so did the coaches and a basic view of his impact on that game. Not sure his votes can be contested in that game in any way.

You seem to have your knickers in a knot over the second Carlton game because you think your coach was right to give him 0 votes and ours biased to give him 5. This is for a 28d, 1 goal, 15 CP, 7 clearances, 8 i50s, 7 IPs, and 21 PA if you didn’t think his defensive efforts were there. Sure if you want to argue he shouldn’t have got the 5, but you really think our best mid on the night shouldn’t even have 1 or 2 votes in a game we won?

Maybe it’s not our coach that has a problem with the voting system, but yours.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Mah, it's a vibe award.
Also can be heavily manipulated. Can't remember which team it was, but they gave franklin no votes in 2008, but franklin kicked something like 12 goals against them over 2 games

 

[beerbandit]

Has to be the most prestigious award for the home and away season. Bontempelli has won this three times now, only Ablett Jnr with five has more.

Usually this is far more accurate than they other award. Bont was the best player this season.

Fairly good list the year:


Leigh Matthews Trophy 2024 (MVP)
1. Marcus Bontempelli
2. Patrick Cripps
3. Isaac Heeney
4. Nick Daicos
5. Jesse Hogan

I think most would agree Bont is the best player.

But not a chance was he this seasons best player.

Cripps, Daicos or Heeney should of been MVP for 2024.

It is a bit of a popularity contest.

 

[Walter H White]

The game Daicos was gifted 5 by McRae he was awarded 0 by the other coach - Voss. Nicky went at 54% for the game with 8 clangers.

And re Cripps. Had 12 touches at 75% including 5 clearances in the 3rd while being tagged. Ridiculously bad take.

When a player wins the award by 4 votes and his coach is giving out 5 voters for performances like that the awards integrity has to be questioned.

Another against the Don's went at 42% for the game (in a loss) and one of the coaches bizarrely awards him 2 votes.

This is why the Brownlow and MvP will always be held in higher regard to me

The AFL need to release the voting records of individual coaches NOW. Mcrae can't keep getting away with this.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

The AFL need to release the voting records of individual coaches NOW. Mcrae can't keep getting away with this.

Agreed. Don't know why they don't do it this already

 

[Lunchtime]

In my opinion i also rate the AFLCA Gary Ayres Award (Player of the Finals) highly too. The coaches vote on this one also.

The award started in 2016, makes you wonder why it was introduced before that year.

Anyway recognition for players efforts in Finals is important, Finals Footy is when it truly matters most.

But like the Gary Ayres Award: the AFLPAMVP, AFLCA Champion Player of Season and Brownlow medal...they are still "opinion awards"...its not 100% accurate, no award is.

The only award that's clear cut and not based on opinion is the Coleman medal.

 

[beerbandit]

In my opinion i also rate the AFLCA Gary Ayres Award (Player of the Finals) highly too. The coaches vote on this one also.

The award started in 2016, makes you wonder why it was introduced before that year.

Anyway recognition for players efforts in Finals is important, Finals Footy is when it truly matters most.

But like the Gary Ayres Award: the AFLPAMVP, AFLCA Champion Player of Season and Brownlow medal...they are still "opinion awards"...its not 100% accurate, no award is.

The only award that's clear cut and not based on opinion is the Coleman medal.

Premiership medallions aren’t based on opinion.

And they are the only 1 that counts to anyone who plays the great game, all the others are nice and all but they/we all play or played to win premierships

 

[Back One Out]

Mah, it's a vibe award.

No different to the MVP awards in American sports such as the NBA, NFL, MLB, NHL... Or the Player Of the Year awards in the English Premier League... Or the Ballon D'Or and the FIFA Player Of the Year for European and world soccer... or the Golden Ball award for the World Cup...

Yep... Pretty much EVERY individual award in football & other major sports around the world is a "vibe award". They are all "popularity contests" voted on by the media; or by the coaches & managers; or by hand-picked committees.

When Michael Jordan won the popularity contest (also known as the NBA MVP award) for the first time in 1988, did everyone complain that it was just a "vibe" award for the new superstar and that Larry Bird or Magic Johnson were robbed?

No, they didn't... People just accepted that was how voting went and they moved on.

Also can be heavily manipulated. Can't remember which team it was, but they gave franklin no votes in 2008, but franklin kicked something like 12 goals against them over 2 games

In 2008, the Collingwood players snubbed Buddy Franklin after he had a run-in with journeyman Pies forward, John Anthony at a night club earlier in the season. If memory serves me correctly, a cocky young Buddy carried on like a peanut and threw his drink over Anthony. He probably cost himself a maximum of 132 votes (44 x 3) and Ablett was perhaps gifted an extra 44 votes (assuming every Pies player put Gazza down for their 3 votes.)


Rd 07: Hawthorn 24.10.154 d Collingwood 13.11.89
Franklin... 6 goals, 4 behinds, 21 disposals, 10 marks (5 contested), 4 tackles
2 Brownlow votes (Sam Mitchell 39 disposals, 3 votes)

Rd 18: Hawthorn 17.14.116 d Collingwood 8.14.62
Franklin... 8 goals, 6 behinds, 21 disposals, 12 marks (7 contested)
3 Brownlow votes


It wouldn't have altered the result of the MVP award. The voting might've been a tad closer if the altercation never occurred, but Gazza won it quite comfortably, with Buddy in 2nd place, miles in front of Boomer Harvey in 3rd place.

2008 MVP
1. Gary Ablett jr.............1044 votes (minus 44 = 1000)
2. Lance Franklin.............718 votes ( plus 132 = 850)
3. Brent Harvey...............440 votes
4. Matthew Richardson.....148 votes
5. Chris Judd...................140 votes

 

[Back One Out]

You know I actually don’t disagree with you despite the tone of your response

Sorry mate... I wasn't having a personal crack at you.. I was just making a general comment about the way everyone is always soooo critical and negative, whether it's the Brownlow, MVP, AFLCA or the All Australian awards. Not you. I was thinking more about everyone on here who has posted on this subject over the last 10 years... about how the MVP is a stupid award and just a "popularity contest"...

It's such a ridiculous criticism to make.. OF COURSE it's a popularity contest!!

That's how these things work. Players are asked to vote for the season's 3 best players in order... and the winner - AKA, the "Most Valuable Player" - is the player who receives the most votes... i.e the most "popular" response...



I just find it odd the way people get so bent out of shape about this stuff... Like there's a scientific right and wrong answer.

The AFLPA MVP award is the players' voting on who they think is the season's best player. Not necessarily the BEST player talent-wise... Nor the best player to have in your team for next weekend... But the guy who was the BEST player in 2024.



This year, the bulk of AFL players thought Marcus Bontempelli was the best player in 2024. They didn't care that Daicos, Cripps and Heeney received votes in 15 or 16 games (compared to Bont's 13 games when he polled coaches votes).

They've based their decision on his overall worth to the team.




Goals + Assists

Bont........ 31 goals + 26 assists = 57
Heeney.... 28 goals + 16 assists = 44
Daicos..... 20 goals + 18 assists = 38
Cripps...... 16 goals + 12 assists = 28



Score Involvements

Bont........ 192 (no.1 in the AFL)
Daicos..... 169
Heeney.... 166
Cripps...... 162



Metres gained

Daicos..... 493 per game
Bont........ 438 per game
Heeney.... 405 per game
Cripps...... 347 per game




Super Coach

Bont........ 126.4 avg.... 1st in the AFL
Daicos..... 117.2 avg.... 8th
Heeney.... 116.8 avg.... 9th
Cripps..... 110.5 avg... 17th




Champion Data player rating (measuring their effectiveness)

Bont........ 19.60 avg... 1st in the AFL
Cripps...... 18.27 avg... 2nd
Heeney..... 17.64 avg... 3rd
Daicos...... 16.80 avg... 7th




People get far too carried away by the weekly accumulation of votes by the midfielders in all the various awards, be it the the coaches votes, or the umpire's votes (Brownlow), or the various media awards. I think it gives a false idea about who the season's best player was, basing entirely on the accumulation of these weekly votes.

I don't believe it's always a fair reflection of the season's best player. It's more like a measure of the season's most consistent midfielder. Look at how people whine and moan when accumulators like Lachie Neale or Tom Mitchell scoop the awards!



Everyone complains about how most of the individual awards are biased towards the midfielders. They bag the umpires for not giving forwards or defenders their rightful dues.. But the media, fans and coaches are even worse. The real fault for the midfield bias lies with fact that we reward them for simply doing their job every week and ignoring the efforts of the other 70% of the players out on the ground.

Midfielders are always in the thick of the action - from quarter to quarter - and from game to game. Adelaide v Fremantle in 2015, Dangerfield got 38 disposals and 2 Brownlow votes, while his direct opponent Fyfe got 40 disposals and 3 votes. Crazy...

Forwards and defenders are only in the action half the time because the ball is at the other end of the ground...


There's your reason why the game's most awesome players don't win the Brownlow and other individual Player of the Year awards... Guys like Bontempelli, Petracca, De Goey, Greene, Hogan, J.Cameron, Hawkins, Stevie J, Scarlett, Enright, Hodge, Franklin, Burgoyne, Rioli, N.Riewoldt, Goddard and Wayne Carey

The best AFL players can play anywhere. They're not limited to the midfield. Their coaches will throw them forward to win the game off their own boot (or push them back into defence to save the game.) This costs them Brownlow votes, but it also makes them the game's most valuable players

Petracca and Bontempelli dominate in the midfield... and then they push forwards and kick goals... Nick Daicos is at his best when he does the same. He is less of a player when used as a one-dimensional inside midfielder. His greatest value is when he wins the clearance and then sprints forwards of centre and kicks (or creates) a goal from the CHF region.





Or take Isaac Heeney for example... Was he the season's best player? Maybe... Maybe not... Longmire's decision to rest him for the last game of the year ultimately cost him the chance to win the AFL Coaches Award... The backhander he gave to St Kilda's Jimmy Webster cost him any chance of winning the Brownlow... But do either of these things mean that he wasn't the best player in 2024?

It shouldn't matter... These things don't really affect the Players' MVP voting...
But we can all see how it affects the Brownlow and Coaches Award.

 

[TheEscapeClub]

never knew tigs fans were this salty about Bont

They're just salty if anyone bar Richmond players or the Richmond club wins anything.

Hopefully they have big enough shoulders whilst their holding up the ladder for the next few years.

 

[TheEscapeClub]

The only home & away individual award that players desperately want to win is the Brownlow. Regardless of whether you agree with the voting system, the simple reality is that every player would rather win a Brownlow than the MVP or coaches award.

I've little doubt that Bont would trade all his MVP awards for a single Brownlow. And no doubt Ablett would trade all five of his to become a triple Brownlow medalist.

He should be a triple winner, how Judd won his second is beyond me.

 

[RCAB]

To Brisbane supporters,


Where does Neale sit in a ranking amongst Voss, Black, Lappin and Akermanis?

 

[beerbandit]

He should be a triple winner, how Judd won his second is beyond me.

Dane Swan should of won 2010
Chris Judd should of won 2011

So yeah Judd still should have 2 x Charlies

 

[TheEscapeClub]

Dane Swan should of won 2010
Chris Judd should of won 2011

So yeah Judd still should have 2 x Charlies

Just not the one in the season where he elbowed Pavlich in the face and opened up Pav's face. The tribunal ruled it, 'insufficient force'.

 

[RCAB]

I think most would agree Bont is the best player.

But not a chance was he this seasons best player.

Cripps, Daicos or Heeney should of been MVP for 2024.

It is a bit of a popularity contest.

Check Back One Out post earlier would suggest Bont was the best player this year.

From the games I've watched, Bont has been the best this season. His ability to go forward and impact, is well known and unprecedented among midfielders today. While some might think he's the best hybrid forward-mid and that's why he's rated so highly, would be doing a massive disservice to his inside game.

His ability to block to help his team get first possessions or even his tap ons in congestion are unappreciated.

 

[Lingsface]

To Brisbane supporters,


Where does Neale sit in a ranking amongst Voss, Black, Lappin and Akermanis?

I am not a Brisbane supporter but am a big fan of Neale. Since 2016 he has only finished out of his clubs top 2 in best and fairest once in 2021 because of injury and playing only 16-17 games. Will win another one this year so 7 out of 8 years either best and fairest or runner up.

 

[hoianbulldog]

I tend to agree.

The Coaches Association Young Player of the year award is a FAR better indicator of talent than the rising star award as well.

Look at these names...

2024 Harry Sheezel (North Melbourne)
2023Nick Daicos (Collingwood)
2022Jai Newcombe (Hawthorn)
2021Noah Anderson & Caleb Serong (GOLD COAST SUNS & FREMANTLE DOCKERS)
2020Sam Walsh (Carlton)
2019Tim Kelly (Geelong Cats)
2018Tom Stewart (Geelong Cats)
2017Clayton Oliver (Melbourne)
2016Isaac Heeney (Sydney Swans)
2015Marcus Bontempelli (Western Bulldogs)
2014Jaeger O'Meara (Gold Coast Suns)
2013Jeremy Cameron (GWS Giants)
2012Dyson Heppell (Essendon)
2011Nathan Fyfe (Fremantle)
2010Stephen Hill (Fremantle)
2009Cyril Rioli (Hawthorn)
2008Joel Selwood (Geelong Cats)
2007Scott Pendlebury (Collingwood)
2006Ryan Griffen (Western Bulldogs)
2005Adam Cooney (Western Bulldogs)
2004Daniel Wells (North Melbourne)
2003Chris Judd (West Coast Eagles)




Not a Lewis Taylor, Rhys Palmer, Jayden Stephenson or Danyle Pearce in the bunch.

Not many spuds on that list. I didn't even know the coaches a young player of year.