Team Mgmt. Makeup of our team II - Strengths & deficiencies, player development

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ant555 said:
If we scorch the earth now it will take 10 to 15 years.
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Tbf, I've been talking about a more aggressive approach to rebuilding for years, at the very least we should've cashed in on Parish, tested the waters on McGrath, moved on from Shiel and Stringer a few years ago. Don't bring in blokes like Gresham.

I don't think we need to go scorched earth now, but cutting a little deeper and trading McGrath, Draper and Parish for 5-6 2nd rounders is fine by me, I don't even want top 5 picks, give me a draft hand that looks like Kako, 20, 24, 27, 29, 35, 36, 38, 40
 
Yoda_ said:
Remember a few people ribbed me for Adrian Dodoro not having any luck? This just another example of another club having the fall of the ball player in drafting. Some clubs just have all the luck whilst others have none. They then pot development when it sounds like a lot in the industry suggest luck is just as much a factor as it is development and s&c etc
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Nup. A 20-year pattern is not 'luck'. Failure to draft even a single 'superstar' level player (however you choose to define that) for 20 years straight ain't luck, it is catastrophic failure.
 

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What concerns me about an Essendon rebuild is that we are still 'rebuilding' the club into being a professional competitive organisation. Scott came into a club that openly admitted that on-field success was not it's primary focus and #1 priority for the last decade. That's just how far back he started.

It's interesting to look at recent successful rebuilds and contrast/compare to Essendon, but no other club - even Melbourne that was by all accounts a shitshow behind closed doors - has had to so fundamentally change their culture to place 'being successful' as the primary goal and driver of its decisions and actions. Essendon haven't (and maybe never will) do a 'scorched earth' rebuild of the playing list but they have done that with the administration and I'd say they still have work to do there.

All in all I think we are coming from further back than we like to admit (even to ourselves).
 
You guys actually aren't far off it.
You are flakey right now. I see it every week. I dont trust you.

But you're best is good. Need to find some resolve. Easier said than done. Get that right and any downhill skiers that you have (everyone club needs them) will lift.

Cant downhill ski when you think the ball will just bounce straight back into your defensive area.
 
I don't know if our team really needs that a big rebuild with our young playing list.
If something needs fixing it's that poor percentage that shows how awful our scoring ability has been all year.

We are bottom 4 worst conversion from fwd 50 in the league. Fix that up and to at least mid range and we likely would still be in the 8. Couldn't be any more glaring than a team that kicks 1.9 in the last quarter in a game we had to win.
 
Pretty sure I heard from Daniel hone that we have 4 (remember) of our back 6 in the bottom 25% in the league for 1 v 1 losses this year.

Some probably don't even have 2, we have 4 of our back 6 in this category.

McGrath, Kelly, Redman, Laverde.. Midfield hanging them out to dry but this is a damning stat iirc
 
I said to myself I wouldn't do another one of these until after the season was done. However this is my scorched earth scenario, I'll probably have something more realistic post season.

3 years: Jones (pending the trigger)
2 years: Guelfi
1 year: Wanganeen, J Davey, Baldwin

Retire: Heppell, Goldstein
Delist: Hunter, Kelly, Setterfield

Trade:

1. Darcy Parish to Geelong for F1 and 33
2. Sam Draper and pick 7-10 to Adelaide for pick 4 and F1
3. Dylan Shiel to WB for Caleb Daniel
4. Jake Stringer, Nick Hind and F3 to Melbourne for 38, F2 and 49
5. Sam Weideman to North for pick 65.
6. Jayden Laverde to St Kilda for F3
7. Josh Sinn and Dante Visentini for 33 and F2
8. Alex Davies for 65
9. Nick Haynes UFA (or Josh Rotham if he chooses Carlton)
10. Jarryd Lyons UFA

12 out. 7 (including SEH) in. Leaves us with 4, 29, 38, 46 and 49

Pick 5 (post Ashcroft bid): Josh Smillie (194 IM)
Pick 11 (post Ashcroft/Lombardi bids): Isaac Kako (use 29, 38, 46 and 49 to match, 178 SF)
Trade Geelong F1 to get back into the back end of the first, draft Jobe Shanahan (194 KPF)
Last pick: James Barrat (190 MD)

NGA: Jayden Nguyen (177 HBF), Amin Naim (187 MF)

DFA/SSP: Mature age ruck

List profile:

Defence:

Key Defenders: Lewis Hayes, Kaine Baldwin, Zach Reid, Ben McKay
Medium Defenders: Nik Cox, Jordan Ridley, James Barrat, Nick Haynes/Josh Rotham
Small Defenders: Andrew McGrath, Mason Redman, Luamon Lual, Archie Roberts, Caleb Daniel, Jayden Nguyen

Midfield:

Inside Midfielders: Elijah Tsatas, Jye Caldwell, Zach Merrett, Ben Hobbs, Sam Durham, Alex Davies, Josh Smillie, Jarryd Lyons
Outside Midfielders: Harrison Jones, Xavier Duursma, Nic Martin, Saad El-Hawli, Josh Sinn, Alwyn Davey jr
Rucks: Nick Bryan, Dante Visentini, DFA/SSP

Forward:

Key Forwards: Peter Wright (ruck), Nate Caddy, Vigo Visentini (ruck), Jobe Shanahan
Medium Forwards: Kyle Langford, Archie Perkins, Amin Naim
Small Forwards: Jade Gresham, Matt Guelfi, Jayden Davey, Tex Wanganeen, Jye Menzie, Isaac Kako
 
P Money said:
Nup. A 20-year pattern is not 'luck'. Failure to draft even a single 'superstar' level player (however you choose to define that) for 20 years straight ain't luck, it is catastrophic failure.
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oh absolutely, but the times we have had an opportunity to launch an attack on breaking he curse we've been * outta luck.

McGrath, McCluggage, Taranto all could have been number 1 picks. The fabled top 10 were all covid so largely going off potential. Hobbs fell into our lap but was taken on the proviso of best available when we didn't really need more sub 180cm midfielders.

Im not defending Dodoro, im a hater probably more than anyone but the chances hes had really have almost been cursed.
 
Tony Barber said:
You guys actually aren't far off it.
You are flakey right now. I see it every week. I dont trust you.

But you're best is good. Need to find some resolve. Easier said than done. Get that right and any downhill skiers that you have (everyone club needs them) will lift.

Cant downhill ski when you think the ball will just bounce straight back into your defensive area.
Click to expand...
Downhill skiers or flaky. The guys who consistently play well when we lose are the ones I trust if we ever get good.
 

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P Money said:
What concerns me about an Essendon rebuild is that we are still 'rebuilding' the club into being a professional competitive organisation. Scott came into a club that openly admitted that on-field success was not it's primary focus and #1 priority for the last decade. That's just how far back he started.

It's interesting to look at recent successful rebuilds and contrast/compare to Essendon, but no other club - even Melbourne that was by all accounts a shitshow behind closed doors - has had to so fundamentally change their culture to place 'being successful' as the primary goal and driver of its decisions and actions. Essendon haven't (and maybe never will) do a 'scorched earth' rebuild of the playing list but they have done that with the administration and I'd say they still have work to do there.

All in all I think we are coming from further back than we like to admit (even to ourselves).
Click to expand...
8 years perhaps is on the money
 
if we're planning on doing a long rebuild then I hope we trade Zach Merrett because he deserves success playing in a good side
 
Honestly we don’t really need to cut too deep to have a rebuild. Kelly Heppell hind Shiel leverde Goldstein are likely gone in the 1-2 seasons, and with potentially of trading setterfeild parish 2mp stringer. We will see a lot more youth through the seniors.

I’d look to play Merrett off the half back for the next two seasons, prolong his career and let him get cheap ball setting us up from defence instead of getting bashed inside. while we create room for Hobbs and tsatas

Considering this is a mids draft maybe we will be able to suit the best flanker available.
 
Tony Barber said:
You guys actually aren't far off it.
You are flakey right now. I see it every week. I dont trust you.

But you're best is good. Need to find some resolve. Easier said than done. Get that right and any downhill skiers that you have (everyone club needs them) will lift.

Cant downhill ski when you think the ball will just bounce straight back into your defensive area.
Click to expand...

Flakey reminds me of Tigers 2013-2016.

Doesn't mean success isn't around the corner once things 'click'.
 
TheFrenchCut said:
Laverde, McKay, Kelly, (tonight Weideman, but give or take the usual Cox, Heppell, etc) is just a mix you cannot run with in your back half.

Your backline mix should have more good/composed users of the footy than not. It's a massive area to fix for next year.
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failed forwards or c grade defenders will never work

McGrath with better players around him could be one of the best in the league but surrounded by shit, he is shit
 
Forward line is a rabble with little to no forward pressure. Lacking a marking small forward. Little effort to open up leading lanes shows with the constant bombs inside 50

Midfield lacks defensive running. We look brilliant with ball in hand but the effort to go the other way shows when running into D50

The backline lacks class and decent ball users. The key defenders are crap. McKay should be ok but the ball coming inside 50 is free for all so back to the wall already



Dont even know where to start
 
We need an exodus badly.

Our midfield is actually pretty good this year, but the two ends are awful. We really need to select a few first round picks on top of Kako. Basically 2020, but done properly this time.
 
What do Mason Redman, Sam Weidemann, Jayden Laverde, Harry Jones all have in common?
 
JayJ20 said:
We need an exodus badly.

Our midfield is actually pretty good this year, but the two ends are awful. We really need to select a few first round picks on top of Kako. Basically 2020, but done properly this time.
Click to expand...
IMO our midfield is the big reason why the back line and foward line look so bad.
 
Nuggs Bunny said:
IMO our midfield is the big reason why the back line and foward line look so bad.
Click to expand...
It's not the midfield making forwards kick behinds and making the backs either drop marks, lose an easy one-on-one, lose a 3-on-1 or make unforced errors by hand/foot.

Our midfield used to be terrible and we still had a solid back 6 under Woosha and Hird. Our back 6 is genuinely terrible now. Same for our forwardline.
 

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Team Mgmt. Makeup of our team II - Strengths & deficiencies, player development

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