Meeting the Salary Cap

[Strahany]

Ok, just say we still have to clear out ~$500k. Would anyone be adverse to the possibility of packaging a few players and offering them to GWS for picks or 17 year old picks?

I only say this for one reason, that occurs twice.

Basically, would you rather lose a star such as Goddard, or three average players, such as Ray, Peake, Gram, Dawson, Gilbert (to some extent), Lynch etc.?

I know I would rather keep the star player.

This has a double effect as the pick we receive for these players has a high chance of recruiting a star player.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Q: Hello Brendan, here is a 3 or 4 year deal at as much money as we can afford, will you sign in before the weekend?

A1: Yes

Excellent, you will be the captain next year or the year after

A2: No

Ok. Hey GWS, you want him, give us pick 1 in the mini draft and pick 15 and he's all yours.


If the Saints management doesn't do this and we lose him next year (which we will if he chooses to reject a contract) it will be nothing short of gross incompetence.

What would be the compensation if he went as an uncontracted player at the end of season?

 

[Simple Jack]

What would be the compensation if he went as an uncontracted player at the end of season?

Best case scenario, which it will be considering the cash they'll offer him is something along the lines of pick 12 and 19.

 

[stkildathunda]

SC for next year been announced by Patrick Keane on twitter

TPP amount for '12 represents increase of 7pct on 2011 figure of $8.21 million per club. ASA agreements also increase 7 pct to 613k per club

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Best case scenario, which it will be considering the cash they'll offer him is something along the lines of pick 12 and 19.

Would be OK in next years draft.

 

[OhMyGoddard]

Someone with a better understanding of these things please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Rookies and Veterans outside the Salary Cap, ie. their payments don't contribute to the Total Player Payments?

If this is the case, can I also assume that Rob Eddy was Rookie listed and that Gardi and Bakes were on the Veterans list? This would mean only Mini was contributing to TPP.

 

[Half Back Pocket]

Q: Hello Brendan, here is a 3 or 4 year deal at as much money as we can afford, will you sign in before the weekend?

A1: Yes

Excellent, you will be the captain next year or the year after

A2: No

Ok. Hey GWS, you want him, give us pick 1 in the mini draft and pick 15 and he's all yours.


If the Saints management doesn't do this and we lose him next year (which we will if he chooses to reject a contract) it will be nothing short of gross incompetence.

Jack, we've been saying this for weeks!!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Someone with a better understanding of these things please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Rookies and Veterans outside the Salary Cap, ie. their payments don't contribute to the Total Player Payments?

If this is the case, can I also assume that Rob Eddy was Rookie listed and that Gardi and Bakes were on the Veterans list? This would mean only Mini was contributing to TPP.

Gardiner's full salary would have been under the cap, since he hasn't played enough games with StKilda to qualify as a veteran.
I THINK ( but may be wrong ) that half of Bakers salary would have been under the cap.
McQualter would have been under the cap.
Eddy as a Rookie would not have been under the cap.
If a Rookie is paid extra ( I'm not sure what the arrangement with Walsh is ) I'm not sure if the extra payments are under the cap.

 

[Simple Jack]

Jack, we've been saying this for weeks!!

So did I, but it's even more critical now.

I have a strong feeling we are going to **** this up and get reamed.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

There is a thread called "how is this allowed to happen" on the main board , started by a Blues supporter bitching about how StKilda must be punished for the facts published by the hun.

Its degenerated into a discussion of Carlton's salary cap breaches in 1995 and third party pay deals LOL.


Resist the temptation to join in Saints supporters, he's hanging himself nicely on his own.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/showthread.php?t=881001&page=4

 

[Highlander35]

Someone with a better understanding of these things please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't Rookies and Veterans outside the Salary Cap, ie. their payments don't contribute to the Total Player Payments?

If this is the case, can I also assume that Rob Eddy was Rookie listed and that Gardi and Bakes were on the Veterans list? This would mean only Mini was contributing to TPP.

Mini- Full salary under cap

Gardi- Full salary under cap (only 5 years with St Kilda- 10 years needed for veteran status)

Eddy- Rookie list- 50% salary under cap

Bakes- Vets list- 33% of salary under cap ( 50% for 1 or 2 on list, 33% for 3, 25% for 4 etc.)

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Mini- Full salary under cap

Gardi- Full salary under cap (only 5 years with St Kilda- 10 years needed for veteran status)

Eddy- Rookie list- 50% salary under cap

Bakes- Vets list- 33% of salary under cap ( 50% for 1 or 2 on list, 33% for 3, 25% for 4 etc.)

Is it that simple though GG? Cant they nominate a Veteran inside or outside the list?
For example if you had Fisher, Riewoldt, and Blake on the Veteran list, cant they include 50% of Riewoldt and Fisher's salary and all of Blake's?

Didnt realise the Rookies were 50% under, Eddy may have been on more than the base pay.

 

[Highlander35]

Is it that simple though GG? Cant they nominate a Veteran inside or outside the list?
For example if you had Fisher, Riewoldt, and Blake on the Veteran list, cant they include 50% of Riewoldt and Fisher's salary and all of Blake's?

Didnt realise the Rookies were 50% under, Eddy may have been on more than the base pay.

Bakes and Lenny were the nominated outside list, normal vet rules apply.

But Blake was also nominated for the Vets list. This meant he was still inside the primary list, so the progressive percentage applied to all 3.

Also, once on the vets list you can't get off until removed from the club full stop, so no, you can't say "Roo and Chips more salary, 50% off them, Blake off list".

 

[Strahany]

I originally thought that Roo was eligible to go on our veteran's list next year, but it would appear he's not old enough (just).

You need to ahve played at a club for 10 years - check

You need to be 30 years old by September the 30th of the year you are nominated for the veteran's list - fail, Roo turns 30 only 12 days later.

12 measly days is costing us ~$400-$600k

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I originally thought that Roo was eligible to go on our veteran's list next year, but it would appear he's not old enough (just).

You need to ahve played at a club for 10 years - check

You need to be 30 years old by September the 30th of the year you are nominated for the veteran's list - fail, Roo turns 30 only 12 days later.

12 measly days is costing us ~$400-$600k

Could re-negotiate a back ended contract if it means that much to you, though I'm not sure Rooey would want to negotiate off the back of his 2011 season.

 

[CHBench]

This is the thing i don't understand, with the salary cap being extended by 11% as of today, are we now under or does it at least help our cause? How could Ken Wood advise us of our 2012 breach without a 2012 TPP even being set until today? Was the breach based on the most recent TPP?

 

[Hammers_Saints]

They're on a witch hunt for us, this is where our club motto will ring true

 

[SaintsSeptember]

This is the thing i don't understand, with the salary cap being extended by 11% as of today, are we now under or does it at least help our cause? How could Ken Wood advise us of our 2012 breach without a 2012 TPP even being set until today?

I think someone suggested that most players would have a contract clause that increases their payment in the event of of a general salary cap increase.

 

[Strahany]

Could re-negotiate a back ended contract if it means that much to you, though I'm not sure Rooey would want to negotiate off the back of his 2011 season.

I don't see why not. The club should approach Roo and say "we need to save X amount of money, will you be willing to renegotiate?".

Of course the club will keep paying him the same amount - would be disgusting if they didn't.

Roo would understand the situation and should agree with the logic. We should try and cut his salary as much as possible and add it on to next year and the year after.

Why not even try and shift $400k from this year? Would prevent a mass exodus of his teammates and/or allow for soem new talent. The possibility of securing Gunston would be some solid motivation for him to do it. Not to mention the fact that it's not like he'd be a big spender at this age, he will already have everything he needs and will be saving for the future - $200 to $300k this year would hardly be a tight budget.

 

[OhMyGoddard]

Thanks for the clarification guys. I always (wrongly) thought Rookies and Veterans whole payments were outside the cap (and I had a total brain-fart about Gardi ), didn't realise it was only a percentage that was exempt.

Is there a limit to how many players you can put on either list, or is it a case of as long as the fit the age and games criteria you can go nuts?

 

[Highlander35]

Thanks for the clarification guys. I always (wrongly) thought Rookies and Veterans whole payments were outside the cap (and I had a total brain-fart about Gardi ), didn't realise it was only a percentage that was exempt.

Is there a limit to how many players you can put on either list, or is it a case of as long as the fit the age and games criteria you can go nuts?

2 veterans outside main list- all others are in primary.

Rookie depends on Vets, I believe it's either 8 (with 1 or 2 vets outside the list) or 10 (with no vets, 2 of which are promoted.

I believe that's how it works.

 

[CHBench]

I think someone suggested that most players would have a contract clause that increases their payment in the event of of a general salary cap increase.

Oh rightio, missed that. Thanks.

 

[stkildathunda]

We get extra $500K in salary cap next year, now if rumours are true and we are only over by $500K surely that means we arent as bad off as the media are making out to be!!

 

[TheLastEmperor]

We get extra $500K in salary cap next year, now if rumours are true and we are only over by $500K surely that means we arent as bad off as the media are making out to be!!

all stirred up by barrett...who is an embarrassment and a flog...looking for a big story.

 

[stkildathunda]

all stirred up by barrett...who is an embarrassment and a flog...looking for a big story.

Wouldnt suprise me, been having a think about this and how the hell are we close to the salary cap for next year and im starting to think its just a Chris Pelchan ruse to get interest in the Saints players. Remember he is the master of trade week.

We get a extra $500K in contract next season.
Gardiner would have been on say $300-$350K
Bakes had part of his contract on vets list so say $150K goes into salary cap
McQualter would have probably been on $250K

So that’s a extra $1.25mil in just rough estimates. Yes few have signed again but surely not that much. We also don’t have Lovett’s payout on the books anymore. We also have more room for another veteran which will free up some more. Could it have just “leaked” by Chris & co so some of our mid-range players would sign on little less and save us money cos we were “close” to the salary cap?