Message to OZ- IR is over

[Father Jack]

The Pearse tackle was a more serious offence than the O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed. I'll leave the sensationalist adjectives to you. The O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed were minor incidents in comparison with the Pearse tackle. You are completely wrong in saying that headbutting and knee dropping are WAY more seriously viewed in Australian culture than a lingering tackle that results in an injury. The proof is in the Lloyd and (that recently retired Richmond ruckman whose name I can't recall) cases. Lloyd got off his headbut charge because he caused no harm. Same with our Richmond ruckman and his knee drops. Barry Hall was able to play in a Grand Final because his punch was said to have caused no harm. You are entitled to your view on what is acceptable in Australian culture and to express it. But you are wrong.

sorry, but i feel I must wade into this debate with some reasoned arguments. They are as follows:

You. Are. Wrong.

Thank you for your time and I wish you all the best in your future endeavours.

uxpld

 

[Black Panther]

The proof is in the Lloyd and (that recently retired Richmond ruckman whose name I can't recall) cases. Lloyd got off his headbut charge because he caused no harm.

Do check you facts before you post old chap

Lloyd got suspended for 1 week for that and missed a Preliminary Final

 

[royalist]

Who won todays Crown Oaks?

 

[Sir_Adrian84]

Who won todays Crown Oaks?

Miss Finland

 

[Grimreepah]

I would have been spewing if we'd lost the last ever IR series. At least we go out as winners

 

[King Elvis]

Meh, just ignore D Mitchell's ********.

Anyone who can keep a straight face while arguing that a legal tackle gone wrong is worse than deliberately kneeing or headbutting someone is a complete idiot.

Go back to Ireland, your presence here is lowering the average IQ of our nation.

 

[Jimthegreat]

The Pearse tackle was a more serious offence than the O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed. I'll leave the sensationalist adjectives to you. The O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed were minor incidents in comparison with the Pearse tackle. You are completely wrong in saying that headbutting and knee dropping are WAY more seriously viewed in Australian culture than a lingering tackle that results in an injury. The proof is in the Lloyd and (that recently retired Richmond ruckman whose name I can't recall) cases. Lloyd got off his headbut charge because he caused no harm. Same with our Richmond ruckman and his knee drops. Barry Hall was able to play in a Grand Final because his punch was said to have caused no harm. You are entitled to your view on what is acceptable in Australian culture and to express it. But you are wrong.

You mate have absolutely no idea. The tackle was legal, he grabbed below the shoulders and pinned his arms. By our 77kg enforcer...Pearce. Then hit his head on the ground and knocked himself out. It's happens in a body contact game. If you think headbutting or kneedropping aren't as bad as a legal tackle, then you're either a complete idiot or biased fool. anyone with the slightest amount of intelligence knows that.

I have never seen such whinging and sooking from one group of people. The Irish tried to play a man's game, tried a few things on and soon as there was retaliation they ran to their mummies. You coach and president are 2 of the weakest men I've come across. Absolute weak sooks. Couldn't believe how that weak c*** Boylan carried on after the game. It was a hard game, lots of hard tackling, hard bumps, wrestling, but not much in the way of cheap shots, except maybe a head butt or a knee drop,and that wasn't from the aussies. If the Irish want to play that game they pay the price. If they are so weak they can't take it then wear pink and take up playing the girls at netball, although after the insipid sooking of the other night I'm sure they be too tough for them too causing them to run to their mummies. Might as well abandon the series because the Irish don't have the balls to take on men.

Go have a cry. "Waaaaa mummy"

 

[burner1]

DMitchell no one has ever, and I mean ever, got in trouble for laying a legal tackle in the afl, even if it does unfortunately cause injury - its a contact sport people get injured playing inside the rules.
To say that a heatbutt or kneeing someone in the face - clearly both outside the rules in both afl and in rules - is a less serious offence irrespective of the outcome shows that you have no idea what your talking about.

 

[cos789]

. Ryan was as entitled to try and kick the ball as Brown was to try and pick it up. .

As Brown was trying to pick the ball up would be the reason he wasn't entitled to kick the ball .
You're not entitled to do any "legal" moves in a way that is reckless .e.g.
Atempt to punch the ball but connect with the ball with the two ears .

. I don't think there is a kicking in danger rule in International rules. If not, then neither committed an offence.

There doesn't have to be . Most rules have been re-worded to be open-ended in their translation . e.g. the yellow card would be invoked for any reckless , unnecessary rough play etc , not specifivcally for kicking in danger .
The fact is that he didn't "kick in danger" he actually kicked him .

.

 

[Genesis67]

The Pearse tackle was a more serious offence than the O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed. I'll leave the sensationalist adjectives to you. The O'Mahoney tackle and whatever it was that caused O'Keefe's nosebleed were minor incidents in comparison with the Pearse tackle. You are completely wrong in saying that headbutting and knee dropping are WAY more seriously viewed in Australian culture than a lingering tackle that results in an injury. The proof is in the Lloyd and (that recently retired Richmond ruckman whose name I can't recall) cases. Lloyd got off his headbut charge because he caused no harm. Same with our Richmond ruckman and his knee drops. Barry Hall was able to play in a Grand Final because his punch was said to have caused no harm. You are entitled to your view on what is acceptable in Australian culture and to express it. But you are wrong.

The overwhelming number of viewpoints expressed here by the various Australian posters would indicate that he is, in fact, NOT wrong. That he is, in fact, spot on.

PS. Pearce is spelt with a "c"...

 

[IRserious]

As time goes by we are purposefully picking a lesser and smaller team to play them each year.

Less "thuggery" between the teams than 5-10 yrs ago... but more physicality from professional athletes. It is being interpreted as the same thing whenever they lose.

From what we are told the actual skill/talent level and standard of the GAA may be a fraction lower at the moment than in the past.

Rule changes wont help...it is a simple mismatch of professional v amateur.

Options to consider:
1. Invade Ireland.
2. Dump the series.
3. Drink more beer.
4. Ban women and children
5. Shake hands and agree that the experiment failed....drink more beer and agree to revisit the concept in 5 yrs time.

Personally i favour the dumping of the series and replacing it with an agreement between the two codes. Ally them more closely and make it a much easier option for the young talent base of each country to access each others game.

Set up a 16 man draft for U18's in both countries and make it an education based scholarship arrangement for elite schoolboy footballers. Both countries are reasonably civilised and can easily make some form of reciprocal tertiary education arrangement. Make academic ability an important part of being nominated for this particular draft.

It will very quickly become one of the most highly prized scholarships within both countries....and the professional and amateur status of each code are not compromised...simply enhanced by choice.

If education is involved the sponsorship $ will flow from the business community of each country...even if they have no guaranteed return they will be highly visible dollars being spent.

Each club/county retains a 3 to 5 yr option on that player whatever he decides to do (stay/return) after 3 yrs. Iron out a few details to retain fairness for all clubs/counties.

At worst each country ends up each year with 16 well known highly educated and competitive 21 yo's who will be prized in the business community as well as sport. Its not a problem if they dont work out to be great footballers....but there's a good chance at least 3 or 4 each year will end up future stars.

Dump the IR series as it stands...agree to revisit the concept in say 3 yrs time.

You 'bollox' you are exactly right. I favour no. five. There is no way a game can be played next year with any credibility. Park it until Nicky Brennan is long gone and make an attempt again later on to revive it. This is what happened in the early nineties. Irish Indo today said most Irish players want to play on. Leave it for a while and see what's possible in five years time. Sorry folks can't keep up with this thread. I'm about three pages behind.

 

[IRserious]

Jeez guys, calm down. It's just turned into a rant. My understanding is that D Mitchell is Australian, no?

Your guy completing the tackle by falling high on Geraghty and finishing with his arm across his neck seems to me to reflect the spirit of the tackle, rather than its legality. Someone (an Aussie) earlier referred to the fact that the Aussies like to drive your head into the ground if you try to run around them and they ping you. This, plus the concept of the 'bump' crystallises the cultural difference between our two great nations. I watch rugby union, though have never played it. There seems to be a totally different concept of how late is a late tackle. As for rubbing a guys face into the ground after a tackle, there does seem to be some of that in Rugby League (a minority game in Ireland if ever there was one).

Let's just agree that the Irish can make Aussie women come louder than vice versa and agree to meet again in five years time to see have we all grown up.

Ye said ye'd get Geraghty and ye did. Ye think it was fair, we don't. Let's leave it at that.

Your rugby Union team will be here in a couple of weeks. There won't be any histrionics. We'll play hard, we might even beat ye, but normal relations will be restored between the nations.

 

[cavanmaniac]

I gave up on this thread after yesterday, it's like talking to the wall. But looking at it coldly, one guy on a message board like me cannot change the sporting psyche or outlook of a nation any more than the other posters here can change mine. I could say way more but won't, it'd only kick off again.

I'll close off my contribution by once again congratulating Australia on their mostly admirable powerhouse display. Once again Ireland is soul searching about the strengths of its own game as it's now clear we're a long way off anything approaching a professional standard, reason enough in itself to park this hybrid concept. If we re-jigged our preparation/tactical approach and so on we'd be closer to you I'm sure but I think you can win these games any time you like really. Well done again.

Must catch a bit more AFL this year, but I say that every year!

 

[belfast_bomber]

The only problem is the biffo.

geraghty's from meath, not offaly

oh, I get you...

 

[D Mitchell]

DMitchell no one has ever, and I mean ever, got in trouble for laying a legal tackle in the afl, even if it does unfortunately cause injury - its a contact sport people get injured playing inside the rules.
To say that a heatbutt or kneeing someone in the face - clearly both outside the rules in both afl and in rules - is a less serious offence irrespective of the outcome shows that you have no idea what your talking about.

You might be right about the injury and legal tackle, in fact it's more complicated than that because of the interpretative nature of Australian Rules Football rules i.e. if they want to ping you, they'll find a way, but the tackle that Pearce (thanks genesis76) laid was not within the rules of the game being played and should have attracted a free kick ergo it was an offence. If a headbutt occurred, it wasn't shown on TV, we only have Quartermain's commentary and I don't reckon he saw it either, then that's an offence too. No matter how O'Keefe got his blood nose, as long as it was caused by a GAA player, then it's an offence too, high contact. That's not as serious an offence because the injury was minimal, arguably more an offence to O'Keefe's pride than his face. Your post is the first allegation of a knee in the face, do you mean O'Mahoney's knees into Lappin's back ? If so, then that's in the back and unduly rough play, using Australian football terms and O'Mahoney received a yellow card. There's no suggestion that he was in any way injured. Someone said he might have had a bruise on his back. That's a less serious offence, too and, in any event, was punished instantly. The seriousness of offences, relates to the injury or injury potential. Let me give you an example. Kicking in danger is now only paid when contact is made. That's because a kick is no longer as dangerous as it used to be because players wear soft football boots. Up until the '70's, players wore boots with reinforced leather or steel capped toes. Copping a kick from those had the potential for real injury so kicking in danger was given even if contact wasn't made. Another. Tripping. It's a no no, not becaus4e it's somehow less than manly or offensive to some noble culture but because it has the potential to break legs, Peter Foster missed a finals series in just that way.

 

[D Mitchell]

As Brown was trying to pick the ball up would be the reason he wasn't entitled to kick the ball .
You're not entitled to do any "legal" moves in a way that is reckless .e.g.
Atempt to punch the ball but connect with the ball with the two ears .

Fair point, reckless. I was thinking of free kicks rather than yellow cards. If you look at the vision, you might conclude that Brown was in the process of diving on the ball, that's how the kick came to connect with his groin area. Had he been on his feet, he'd have been struck on the lower leg.

 

[JF_Bay_22_SCG]

Lads, thanks for destroying what was once a relatively enjoyable game. The Irish have nothing against physical aspects of a game. But when your opponents persist on hauling you to the ground, pulling your shirt over your head and punching the 'blind' man, sport leaves the arena and you just have glorified bar room thuggery. The Irish responded in kind to what Australia obviously set out to do, but, not being professionally conditioned athletes, they were always going to come out second best when the Aussies got what they wanted - an all-out brawl. If the Irish refused to engage, they'd have been hammered such was the lack of protection from the refs. Realistically, if you strike, you should see the red card. Striking is a weakness in a field game. It has nothing to do with 'football'. The Irish are used to letting their skill do the talking as the Irish game is based on exactly that - skill. Fast hands, fast feet. Fielding the ball and turning all in the one move. No 'marks' as that slows the game etc etc. Someone posted a ridiculous 'rules of engagement'. Sorry lad but that's not part of our sport.

Some enjoyable games over the years, with some interesting physical clashes. I remember Australia winning a fabulous series in Ireland in 2002 by 6 points overall, highlighted with some great passages of play and the odd one-on-one skirmish, settled manfully. But when the physicality was used to gain the upper hand and became a weapon of intimidation whereby key players were 'taken out', sportsmanship and the series died.

For somebody who used to be the loudest most obnoxious Irish troll on Big Footy you have well & truly got your come-uppance you weak prick. You got pwned at Croak Park & can't handle it.

Geraghty takes out Gilbee & gets away basically scott -free. So the Aussies aims to ******** him up next test. They thing is, they did.

From a footballing perspective Sheedy has got it completely right. We know have a team of players reasonally comfortable now in passing the round ball around. We have picked smaller running types lke Adam Schneider so as to match the Irish running ability. It has worked & because of our physical fitness the Irish have little come-back.

Hopefully I'll be living in Melbourne next year & can go to the IR match. Want to give it to a few weak Irish supporters who wouldn't know sh/it from clay.

JF

 

[D Mitchell]

Hopefully I'll be living in Melbourne next year & can go to the IR match. Want to give it to a few weak Irish supporters who wouldn't know sh/it from clay.

JF

Looks like you'll have to find some other sporting fixture involving Ireland, in that case.

 

[Sir_Adrian84]

Looks like you'll have to find some other sporting fixture involving Ireland, in that case.

do you want to play us in cricket

oh thats right, shane warne spins the ball too much, gilchrist hits the ball too hard and I presume that Ricky Ponting bowls too fast

 

[King Elvis]

do you want to play us in cricket

oh thats right, shane warne spins the ball too much, gilchrist hits the ball too hard and I presume that Ricky Ponting bowls too fast

And we use bad words.

 

[Eagle87]

And we use bad words.

... and we manhandle overseas officials ....

 

[Grimreepah]

Would we be allowed to bowl bouncers?

 

[Eagle87]

Would we be allowed to bowl bouncers?

Probably but they wouldnt be "AFL style" bouncers they would be compromise bouncers. They would be able to pitched short and rear alarmingly at the batsman but at the point of contact they must lose all pace and not actually cause any harm.

Accidental injury is of course outlawed.

We are a bunch of big meanies after all....

 

[wce4premiership]

if they pull the plug then we win, they're weak to start some behind the play niggle and then cry when we retaliate.

 

[coyler]

O'Neill says it all and the stupidity of your responses show why the game has no future. Any comment or criticism it jumped on as whenging.

BTW asking Ireland to play Oz at cricket is like asking Oz to play Ireland in Hurling. There are more people playing Gaelic Football in Australia than Cricket in Ireland!