Next out of Carlton, Essendon, Melbourne, North Melbourne and St Kilda to win a flag?

[Asifhe Givashe]

i went for north. dont know why though

I think you will be right, we will be the only premier out of this group by 2030.

Saints have topped up to finish 6th and carry an historical impost that is equivalent to carrying 80kg in the Melbourne Cup. Reckon they are a bit vanilla outside of of a couple of kids.

Essendon are aging but historically strong and able club, would have them 2nd.

Melbourne have a great team but are just nowhere (don’t know what’s wrong with them).

Carlton look good, but it would only take Cripps to leave/get injured and they’d be a longgg way back, still can’t play well as the hunted.

So yeah, North or Essendon, for mine.

 

[CarnTheScray]

Good thinking.

On SM-N960F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Nobody in here is an oracle here so whats the point. Any team could come out the woodwork and win one.

 

[Fadge]

No it's not.

The star power is the most important factor in a side, if they perform then it makes the rest of the team look good - why do you think its only successful teams that are able to pluck jets from the rookie list? Richmond couldn't even nail a first rounder, then it all clicked and all of a sudden their whole forward line are former rookie picks; you think the recruiter was a genius all of a sudden?

You telling me Richmond dominance hasn't been off the back of Dusty, Rance (when he played), Riewoldt, Prestia, Lynch, Edwards? It was off the back of blokes like Castagna and Pickett?

Please.

If your top 6 perform every week, like they should, then your bottom 6 isn't as important. GWS have a top 20 and are a rabble.

So how well has having the alleged best top 5 in the comp worked out for Carlton over the journey?

I refer to Judd, Fevola, Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer...

 

[Fadge]

You telling me Richmond dominance hasn't been off the back of Dusty, Rance (when he played), Riewoldt, Prestia, Lynch, Edwards? It was off the back of blokes like Castagna and Pickett?

Hmmmm.

Houli has been second best on ground in both Grand Finals.

Grimes and Astbury handy defenders.

You wouldn't have included Prestia before last season (and he's barely played this year).

I could on...

 

[chunkylover53]

So how well has having the alleged best top 5 in the comp worked out for Carlton over the journey?

I refer to Judd, Fevola, Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer...

Geez you talk rubbish. In what world was those top 5 best in the league? Fev was gone before we were much good, Gibbs and Kreuzer never even got close to an AA selection. Murphy and Judd were our only genuine stars, and Murphy only had one dominant year. Therein lied one of our biggest problems.

Meanwhile, Geelong would have minimum 5-6 bona-fide stars consistently perform every year - GAJ, Scarlett, Enright, Johnson, Bartel, Milburn; you really reckon that Carlton 5 you just listed could compete with them? Hawthorn had Mitchell, Hodge, Lewis, Cyril, Birchall, Buddy, Roughead.

I mean seriously, you spent 2009-2015 telling us we were overrated, now all of a sudden we had the best star power in the league?

Hmmmm.

Houli has been second best on ground in both Grand Finals.

Grimes and Astbury handy defenders.

You wouldn't have included Prestia before last season (and he's barely played this year).

I could on...

Ah yes, is that All Australian half back Bachar Houli? Yeah real battler that bloke, a real lift for that bottom 6. Houli belongs in Richmond top echelon of players easy.

Oh Grimes, the other All-Australian? Yeah nah, you're not making any sense here. He's also one of their better players and has been since 2016.

Tell me of these bottom tier players that take teams to flags, go on.

 

[Fadge]

Ah yes, is that All Australian half back Bachar Houli? Yeah real battler that bloke, a real lift for that bottom 6. Houli belongs in Richmond top echelon of players easy.

Oh Grimes, the other All-Australian? Yeah nah, you're not making any sense here. He's also one of their better players and has been since 2016.

Tell me of these bottom tier players that take teams to flags, go on.

That was my point you imbecile.

None of these players were mentioned in the top 5 or 6 for Richmond in the post I referenced.

So tell me again why you want to invest time and energy in debating which club has a better top 5?!?

 

[La Dispute]

Gut feel? Carlton will take Collingwood’s spot in the finals.

Treloar goes, Collingwood are declining anyway. Otherwise not a heap of upside with their midfield group another year older and a very suspect spine.

Going after a geriatric Neville Jetta (why didn’t they just keep Scharenberg if they wanted a broken down back pocket?) kind of sums up where they are at.

Interesting times ahead for Collingwood supporters.

 

[Fadge]

Gut feel? Carlton will take Collingwood’s spot in the finals.

Treloar goes, Collingwood are declining anyway. Otherwise not a heap of upside with their midfield group another year older and a very suspect spine.

Going after a geriatric Neville Jetta (why didn’t they just keep Scharenberg if they wanted a broken down back pocket?) kind of sums up where they are at.

Interesting times ahead for Collingwood supporters.

Ooh, it must be October!

 

[Fadge]

Tell me of these bottom tier players that take teams to flags, go on.

Allow me to start with my own team's 2010 premiership team.

Arguably the bottom 6 in our Premiership team comprised L. Brown, B. Macaffer, J. Blair, A. Toovey, T. Goldsack and S. Wellingham. All crucial roles in the premiership team.

Among the players who didn't play in the replay - Presti, L. Davis, J. Fraser, T. Lockyer, P. Medhurst and S. O'Bree.

It's that kind of depth that nets you a flag.

Hopefully it takes Carlton another 20 years to work that out.

 

[La Dispute]

Allow me to start with my own team's 2010 premiership team.

Arguably the bottom 6 in our Premiership team comprised L. Brown, B. Macaffer, J. Blair, A. Toovey, T. Goldsack and S. Wellingham. All crucial roles in the premiership team.

Among the players who didn't play in the replay - Presti, L. Davis, J. Fraser, T. Lockyer, P. Medhurst and S. O'Bree.

It's that kind of depth that nets you a flag.

Hopefully it takes Carlton another 20 years to work that out.

Yet not a single Norm Smith vote between them for the Grand Final replay. The top 4? Pendlebury, Sidebottom, Thomas and Swan.

Macaffer, Blair, Toovey, and Goldsack were Collingwood’s equivalent of Castagna, Broad, Soldo and Baker - nice hard working players that were in the right place at the right time.

 

[Fadge]

Macaffer, Blair, Toovey, and Goldsack were Collingwood’s equivalent of Castagna, Broad, Soldo and Baker - nice hard working players that were in the right place at the right time.

Yep, and when (and only when) Carlton have players of a similar ability as numbers 20 to 25 on their list (not to mention the players who missed out) might we see them contending.

 

[La Dispute]

Yep, and when (and only when) Carlton have players of a similar ability as numbers 20 to 25 on their list might we see them contending.

Not hard to find guys of their ilk. We’ve got players like Newman and Gibbons as solid role players, for an easy like to like comparison.

It’s getting 5-6 players to get to being some of the best in their positions. We’ve got Cripps as an elite midfielder, Docherty as one of the best half back flankers in the league, Weitering as one of the best CHB’s and Walsh who is tracking to become an A-grade mid.

It’s then about finding some more elite players, especially in the midfield.

 

[chunkylover53]

Yep, and when (and only when) Carlton have players of a similar ability as numbers 20 to 25 on their list (not to mention the players who missed out) might we see them contending.

- None of the players you listed got a Norm Smith vote
- Wellingham got traded and delisted shortly after
- Jarryd Blair was delisted
- Every other player was in and out of the side for the remainder of their careers

Your bottom 6 was as good as any other contending team.

Your top players? Well you had 3xAA (Swan, Pendles, Didak), Beams, Cloak, Shaw, Thomas. They won you the flag, not your bottom 5. You would've won that game with St Kildas bottom 6 playing for you.

That was my point you imbecile.

None of these players were mentioned in the top 5 or 6 for Richmond in the post I referenced.

So tell me again why you want to invest time and energy in debating which club has a better top 5?!?

Depending on the week you could easily slip Houli and Grimes into Richmonds top 5.

I didn't mention top 5, I was pointing out that your star players do indeed matter more than you were leading on. I think you need at least 6-8 elite players (contending for AA spots every year) and the rest falls into place.

I'm still waiting on examples of teams that lost finals they should've won due to their bottom 6.

 

[chunkylover53]

Allow me to start with my own team's 2010 premiership team.

Arguably the bottom 6 in our Premiership team comprised L. Brown, B. Macaffer, J. Blair, A. Toovey, T. Goldsack and S. Wellingham. All crucial roles in the premiership team.

Among the players who didn't play in the replay - Presti, L. Davis, J. Fraser, T. Lockyer, P. Medhurst and S. O'Bree.

It's that kind of depth that nets you a flag.

Hopefully it takes Carlton another 20 years to work that out.

Can't believe that was 10 years ago.

Considering your window is well and truly about to close, I'd be cautious about gloating about decade-old flags.

 

[Fadge]

Can't believe that was 10 years ago.

Considering your window is well and truly about to close, I'd be cautious about gloating about decade-old flags.

You do realise we've had 3 separate 'windows' since Carlton last contended?

 

[Freomaniac]

Allow me to start with my own team's 2010 premiership team.

Arguably the bottom 6 in our Premiership team comprised L. Brown, B. Macaffer, J. Blair, A. Toovey, T. Goldsack and S. Wellingham. All crucial roles in the premiership team.

Among the players who didn't play in the replay - Presti, L. Davis, J. Fraser, T. Lockyer, P. Medhurst and S. O'Bree.

It's that kind of depth that nets you a flag.

Hopefully it takes Carlton another 20 years to work that out.

Still have a soft spot for Paul Medhurst

 

[Fadge]

Still have a soft spot for Paul Medhurst

He was one of the most reliable kicks for goal I have ever seen.

That beautiful little fade.

 

[Freomaniac]

He was one of the most reliable kicks for goal I have ever seen.

That beautiful little fade.

He was one of the main reasons Freo made their 1st ever finals appearance in 2003.

Yes he kicked 50 goals that season and should of got in the AA team that year.

 

[Freomaniac]

I think you will be right, we will be the only premier out of this group by 2030.

Saints have topped up to finish 6th and carry an historical impost that is equivalent to carrying 80kg in the Melbourne Cup. Reckon they are a bit vanilla outside of of a couple of kids.

Essendon are aging but historically strong and able club, would have them 2nd.

Melbourne have a great team but are just nowhere (don’t know what’s wrong with them).

Carlton look good, but it would only take Cripps to leave/get injured and they’d be a longgg way back, still can’t play well as the hunted.

So yeah, North or Essendon, for mine.

north is a weird one. Anything can happen in 5-7 years time. North have finished bottom 4 this season. Will get at least 5-7 kids in this draft. North will get bottom 6 in 2021 and 2022. Again another 5-7 kids next season and season after.

Thats 15-21 kids recruited in 3 years. Elim finals in 2023 and preliminary final in 2024 then grand finals in 2025-6

 

[Plugger35]

I think you will be right, we will be the only premier out of this group by 2030.

Saints have topped up to finish 6th and carry an historical impost that is equivalent to carrying 80kg in the Melbourne Cup. Reckon they are a bit vanilla outside of of a couple of kids.

Essendon are aging but historically strong and able club, would have them 2nd.

Melbourne have a great team but are just nowhere (don’t know what’s wrong with them).

Carlton look good, but it would only take Cripps to leave/get injured and they’d be a longgg way back, still can’t play well as the hunted.

So yeah, North or Essendon, for mine.

North and Essendon will be next to win a spoon not a flag.

 

[Freomaniac]

North and Essendon will be next to win a spoon not a flag.

Ironic...... Considering your team has won 27 wooden spoons lol.

North have not won a wooden spoon since 1972.

 

[Plugger35]

Ironic...... Considering your team has won 27 wooden spoons lol.

North have not won a wooden spoon since 1972.

They nearly won one this year, only percentage saved them from it and they are likely to get worse next year with their rebuild.

 

[Freomaniac]

They nearly won one this year, only percentage saved them from it and they are likely to get worse next year with their rebuild.

this is North we are talking about here. They would rather fold the club than get the Spoon.

as bad as their playing list is, they wont get the spoon. They have pride.

 

[aussierulesrules]

this is North we are talking about here. They would rather fold the club than get the Spoon.

as bad as their playing list is, they wont get the spoon. They have pride.

With the way Adelaide finished off the year (once they got to play so much at home), it looks likely to be North and then daylight for next year's spoon.

Adelaide are bad, but every 2nd week they have a big home ground advantage, which will ensure them wins like they got this year once they returned there.

 

[Freomaniac]

With the way Adelaide finished off the year (once they got to play so much at home), it looks likely to be North and then daylight for next year's spoon.

Adelaide are bad, but every 2nd week they have a big home ground advantage, which will ensure them wins like they got this year once they returned there.

You dont know the crows best 22 like I do..... As you know, I live in SA, that means I watch a lot of Port and Crows games.

Rory Atkins has done his 8 years and played 100 games at the crows. Brad Crouch is Obviously a free Agent.

Backline is the biggest concern for me....

Kyle Hartigan is a tall KPD and he is a free agent. Like Rory Atkins, he has done his 8 years and 100 games and I can see a Vic Club or 2 that can offer him a 2-3 deal. He does turn 29 in November though.

Rory Laird is out of contract next season and he Will be a free agent.

Daniel Talia is a free Agent next season. Yes he just turned 29 on october 2nd. So he turns 30 this time next year. I dont see him staying at the crows beyond 2021. I can see him go to a team Like Geelong or Collingwood for 2-3 seasons to play finals or possibly even a flag.

Midfield isnt the best. Rory Sloane doesnt have too many years left. There are some solid players like Wayne Milera and Seedsman.

Forward Line is a mess. Taylor Walker turned 30 on Anzac Day this year. Tom Lynch is 30 as well. You got Himmelberg and Billy frampton who both play KPF and 2nd ruck.

Himmelberg Played 11 games and kicked 9 goals. Frampton played 5 games and kicked 5 goals. Crows need one of these blokes to kick 25-30 goals a season.

They have tyson Stengle and Shane McAdam as forward pockets. I predicted at the start of the season, out of these 2, if either of these guys will ever be a 25-30 goal a season forward, It would be Shane McAdam.

I saw McAdam Play for Sturt in the 2018 season. Kicked 31 goals from 17 games for Sturt.

Crows recruited him and he played for the Crows ressies in the SANFL 22 goals from 14 games. Would of got an AFL debut game last season if it wasnt for injury