Preview Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Teams and Discussion Thread

[Hawkinspired]

This match is pretty much set in stone and what a match it will be. Recent home and away history shows that Geelong have won 6 of the last 6 matches by an average of 7 points. Everyone of these matches we have been in a position to win but we have fallen at the last hurdle.

Oh wait, it's not a home and away match... It's a final! Some say this accounts for little, but Geelong carry somewhat of a large burden when it comes to finals against the Hawks. Staggeringly they haven't won a final against us since the 1963 Grand Final. Sure we've only played 4 finals since then but it must be on there minds just as much as the recent history is for us.

Recent History - All Geelong Wins

Rd 12 2011 - 88-83
Rd 5 2011 - 117-98
Rd 15 2010 - 85-83
Rd 2 2010 - 100-91
Rd 17 2009 - 99-98
Rd 1 2009 - 111-103

Finals Records - All Hawthorn Wins

Grand Final 2008 - 26 pts
Elimination Final #1 2000 - 9 pts
Semi Final #2 1991 - 2 pts
Grand Final 1989 - 6 pts

Team Selection

At this stage as far as team selection goes for Hawthorn, we're pretty close to our best 22. The main indication i'm getting is that Clarko wants Schoenmakers in the side over Lilse so i wouldn't bother putting his name up at this stage. Bateman just doesn't look right so i hope he can get match fit by finals because he will be important for us. Bruce is probably on his last chance. My gut feeling is Clarko thinks he can impact in September and will give him every chance to do so. That said if Savage can knock the door down at Box Hill (which he has yet to do) it could be a straight swap. Speaking of knocking the door down, Cheney has had two crackers at Box Hill and will surely come into contention this week.

It will be interesting to see what Geelong do with team selection. With Vardy out for the season with hip surgery, Hawkins will probably find himself back in the side along Pods and Mooney.

Gameplan

I'm just loving the defence at the moment. I honestly think the 'Gorilla Defender' or lack thereof is media beat up. It seems very team oriented with help always available from guys like Birchall, Guerra and Murphy to effect the spoil. Most teams go tall to try to expose us but unless they take the grab the ball is quickly swept up and accurately turned into attack.

I'm really excited about this game! Go Hawks!!

 

[Roddy]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

It may be 'set in stone' to some degree, but this is what you call 'jumping the gun'.

 

[Hawkinspired]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Yes that is true, it may be premature but it's a good discussion point. Never say never but we'd have to loose to the Dogs and Suns to drop to 4th, with West Coast winning there last two games. Geelong have a thread with over 100 posts on it so why can't we?

 

[Neville Bartos]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Here's how we'll win it:

1. Do what we usually do against them for the first 3 quarters
2. In the last quarter.... STICK TO THE F***ING GAMEPLAN CLARKO!!!

Having a 1-man forwardline and trying to defend a 3 goal lead against the best tight finishes team in the AFL is absolutely madness and without a doubt cost us the win in our last game. Yes I understand that losing the Rough at the start of the last and having Renouf try to ruck with what turned out to be a 4 month serious injury really hurt us, but the fact that we were able to clear the ball from defence on about 15 occasions yet still weren't able to score was just absolutely ridiculous. It was probably the worst coached quarter I've ever seen from Clarkson.

It should be a different affair with Gibson only able to improve on his last effort against the J-Pod, having Hale and Franklin as practically permanent forwards, Bailey in the ruck, Rioli much fitter than last time and in his suited position and a slightly fitter Hodge to hopefully do some damage against Cameron Ling.

What still astounds me is when one of our players like Hodge is getting badly tagged in the middle, why doesn't he get sent to full-forward? Defence is easily Ling's worst position on the ground and his lack of pace can be a disaster for Geelong as shown by Breust nailing him for HTB last time. Instead Clarkson sends Hodge to play HBF which means Ling goes to half-forward and starts kicking goals and ruins Hodge's confidence even more.

We always fall into the exact same mistakes against the Cats and I really hope that after 6 consecutive losses (unforgiveable against any side) we finally work out what to do.

I don't buy this moronic "We always get the Cats in the finals" talk. They've got our measure, they're inside our head and they've moved on (supporters excluded) from 2008.
In case you've forgotten what's happened since 2008:

1. They ruined our flag unveiling by beating us in Rd1 2009.
2. They ruined our finals chances by beating us with the last kick of the day later in 2009.
3. They punished us for shocking goal kicking in 2010.
4. They ruined our chances of making the top 4 or hosting a final in 2010.
5. They completely shut out Buddy, made Mitchell brownlow ineligible and put us in a panic at 3-2 at the start of the year.
6. They kept us scoreless in the quarter that mattered and they sniped our players before taking a win they didn't deserve.

Enough is enough, we have some serious payback of our own now. I'm not content with 1 flag from the last 4 years.

 

[Goody1971]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

What NB said

 

[Hungry Hawk]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

I dont buy that "havent beaten us if finals" crap neither Nev and I am sick of losing to these pussies.

The first game this year during the day I thought we would run them off their legs in the heat, but nooooo! The the night game we had a good break at three quarter time and we got shot in the arse.

They have had our measure full stop, but the reward on offer should be all the motivation we need. With each one of these narrow losses we get ever closer to rolling the Cats.

Hoping that finals umpiring (as opposeed to home and away) will not give the Cats an epic free kick count which some of their players are used to.
They are reaching the end of a great era and it would be appropriate that it be the Hawks to signal it with a crushing defeat.

On that note I had better go and start the GF thread.

 

[buddy23]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Here's how we'll win it:

1. Do what we usually do against them for the first 3 quarters
2. In the last quarter.... STICK TO THE F***ING GAMEPLAN CLARKO!!!

Having a 1-man forwardline and trying to defend a 3 goal lead against the best tight finishes team in the AFL is absolutely madness and without a doubt cost us the win in our last game. Yes I understand that losing the Rough at the start of the last and having Renouf try to ruck with what turned out to be a 4 month serious injury really hurt us, but the fact that we were able to clear the ball from defence on about 15 occasions yet still weren't able to score was just absolutely ridiculous. It was probably the worst coached quarter I've ever seen from Clarkson.

It should be a different affair with Gibson only able to improve on his last effort against the J-Pod, having Hale and Franklin as practically permanent forwards, Bailey in the ruck, Rioli much fitter than last time and in his suited position and a slightly fitter Hodge to hopefully do some damage against Cameron Ling.

What still astounds me is when one of our players like Hodge is getting badly tagged in the middle, why doesn't he get sent to full-forward? Defence is easily Ling's worst position on the ground and his lack of pace can be a disaster for Geelong as shown by Breust nailing him for HTB last time. Instead Clarkson sends Hodge to play HBF which means Ling goes to half-forward and starts kicking goals and ruins Hodge's confidence even more.

We always fall into the exact same mistakes against the Cats and I really hope that after 6 consecutive losses (unforgiveable against any side) we finally work out what to do.

I don't buy this moronic "We always get the Cats in the finals" talk. They've got our measure, they're inside our head and they've moved on (supporters excluded) from 2008.
In case you've forgotten what's happened since 2008:

1. They ruined our flag unveiling by beating us in Rd1 2009.
2. They ruined our finals chances by beating us with the last kick of the day later in 2009.
3. They punished us for shocking goal kicking in 2010.
4. They ruined our chances of making the top 4 or hosting a final in 2010.
5. They completely shut out Buddy, made Mitchell brownlow ineligible and put us in a panic at 3-2 at the start of the year.
6. They kept us scoreless in the quarter that mattered and they sniped our players before taking a win they didn't deserve.

Enough is enough, we have some serious payback of our own now. I'm not content with 1 flag from the last 4 years.

You forgot they also contributed to Roughy's injury!

I'm all about getting in early for this game - let's get the banter going. I'm sure while the hawks players will still be going through the motions for the next two games, but the coaching staff will have their minds well and truly set on this Geelong game.

Time for revenge!

 

[Mullarkey]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Here's how we'll win it:

1. Do what we usually do against them for the first 3 quarters
2. In the last quarter.... STICK TO THE F***ING GAMEPLAN CLARKO!!!

Epic two point plan!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

I'm all for us thinking about this game and putting our thoughts forward, but let's just make sure it doesn't become a thread of trolling and baiting like last weeks vs Carlton.

That goes especially for any stray Cats that wander in.

 

[Pessimistic]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Just wanted to shed some light on the Wood factor

Have listed the games finishing with a margin 20 and less back to 1963. close games illustrate the wood more than anything

Hawks won 24 close ones, Geelong 19. 33 close games over48 years is a pretty amazing number in itself.

Geelongs current 7 out of 8 games is pretty good - the only win by the hawks being well ... in 2008 ~!!!

Before that we have a run of 17 from 20 going back to 1983 - including 10 in a row from 85 to 97

Before 85 its 7 close wins each.

Just shows the wood can change with a bang !!



R12 A LOSS 2.1 9.2 13.5 13.5 83 5.2 10.2 10.6 13.10 88 L M.C.G. 63476 11-Jun-2011
R5 H LOSS 5.3 8.3 12.6 15.8 98 5.2 6.7 13.10 17.15 117 L M.C.G. 78579 26-Apr-2011
R15 A LOSS 4.4 6.7 8.14 11.17 83 3.3 5.6 8.8 12.13 85 L M.C.G. 69220 10-Jul-2010
R2 H LOSS 6.4 9.9 11.10 13.13 91 4.2 5.9 10.12 14.16 100 L M.C.G. 68628 05-Apr-2010
R17 A LOSS 3.3 8.7 13.10 14.14 98 4.2 6.5 10.6 15.9 99 L M.C.G. 64356 25-Jul-2009
R1 H LOSS 3.2 8.4 10.6 16.7 103 4.8 8.16 14.19 15.21 111 L M.C.G. 69564 27-Mar-2009
GF F WIN 5.2 8.3 14.5 18.7 115 5.3 6.12 9.18 11.23 89 W M.C.G. 100012 27-Sep-2008
R17 H LOSS 3.2 6.5 9.8 11.11 77 6.3 8.10 9.12 12.16 88 L M.C.G. 86179 25-Jul-2008
R4 H WIN 0.3 4.7 8.9 10.16 76 3.3 4.8 8.13 9.18 72 W York Park 17120 22-Apr-2007
R22 A WIN 5.3 7.5 8.6 11.9 75 0.2 4.6 6.7 8.9 57 W Docklands 41600 30-Aug-2002
R11 A LOSS 3.2 5.4 9.8 13.12 90 2.5 5.5 10.8 14.9 93 L Docklands 37526 09-Jun-2001
EF F WIN 4.2 6.3 11.5 14.8 92 3.4 6.5 9.9 12.11 83 W Docklands 44709 11-Aug-2000
R21 H WIN 2.2 10.6 14.11 15.13 103 5.4 11.5 14.7 15.11 101 W Waverley Park 31603 21-Aug-1999
R6 A WIN 5.4 7.8 10.12 14.16 100 2.5 8.8 11.11 14.14 98 W Kardinia Park 27341 01-May-1999
R21 H WIN 2.2 5.9 8.12 11.18 84 2.3 4.7 5.11 8.15 63 W Waverley Park 28833 23-Aug-1998
R6 A LOSS 3.5 4.11 7.12 10.13 73 5.0 7.4 11.9 13.12 90 L Kardinia Park 23267 02-May-1998
R12 A WIN 4.4 8.8 11.9 13.10 88 3.1 7.3 11.5 12.10 82 W Kardinia Park 22871 14-Jun-1997
R15 A WIN 3.5 6.7 6.7 11.8 74 2.5 5.6 8.10 10.12 72 W Kardinia Park 22207 13-Jul-1996
R7 A WIN 3.7 6.9 8.11 11.12 78 2.3 4.8 5.16 9.19 73 W Kardinia Park 24842 13-May-1995
R16 A WIN 4.6 10.7 13.13 16.18 114 2.2 6.5 8.7 14.11 95 W Kardinia Park 26257 04-Jul-1992
R1 H WIN 4.3 7.10 15.13 21.15 141 5.3 12.8 14.10 18.13 121 W Waverley Park 34677 21-Mar-1992
SF F WIN 3.11 6.13 10.13 13.17 95 2.1 5.2 11.8 13.15 93 W Waverley Park 63733 14-Sep-1991
GF F WIN 8.4 12.9 18.13 21.18 144 2.0 7.2 13.7 21.12 138 W M.C.G. 94796 30-Sep-1989
R6 H WIN 5.3 9.5 16.9 26.15 171 8.4 17.6 19.10 25.13 163 W Princes Park 17430 06-May-1989
R22 A WIN 3.2 6.6 11.9 19.12 126 2.6 6.12 13.15 17.21 123 W Kardinia Park 27030 29-Aug-1987
R12 H WIN 6.2 9.7 14.11 17.15 117 4.4 8.6 10.9 13.10 88 W Princes Park 11393 15-Jun-1985
R11 H LOSS 3.3 6.7 10.12 12.16 88 3.4 7.4 8.6 14.11 95 L Princes Park 13482 04-Jun-1983
R2 H WIN 3.7 7.9 9.16 13.19 97 1.3 2.5 8.8 11.12 78 W Princes Park 15600 03-Apr-1982
R17 A LOSS 2.2 3.3 6.8 8.9 57 1.1 3.5 6.7 10.11 71 L Kardinia Park 24753 25-Jul-1981
R7 H LOSS 4.3 5.4 7.7 8.8 56 0.5 4.12 4.14 7.17 59 L Princes Park 13273 09-May-1981
R5 A LOSS 3.2 6.5 10.6 13.11 89 6.2 11.4 12.7 14.10 94 L Kardinia Park 34498 25-Apr-1980
R15 A WIN 3.4 4.5 9.11 11.13 79 4.2 9.6 10.11 11.12 78 W Waverley Park 20777 14-Jul-1979
R21 A WIN 2.1 7.6 8.6 13.10 88 4.1 8.2 10.7 13.8 86 W Kardinia Park 21663 26-Aug-1978
R11 H WIN 3.3 5.11 9.17 11.22 88 4.3 7.6 9.8 11.10 76 W Princes Park 33692 14-Jun-1976
R18 A LOSS 4.3 6.7 11.8 14.10 94 1.1 7.8 10.10 14.11 95 L Kardinia Park 13546 04-Aug-1973
R3 H WIN 5.6 9.8 12.14 16.19 115 5.2 10.4 13.7 16.11 107 W Glenferrie Oval 14094 17-Apr-1971
R1 H LOSS 5.2 8.7 12.9 19.12 126 4.4 10.5 15.8 21.9 135 L Glenferrie Oval 20509 04-Apr-1970
R19 A LOSS 7.4 9.7 12.8 14.11 95 3.2 7.6 10.12 16.14 110 L Kardinia Park 31569 23-Aug-1969
R8 H WIN 5.11 7.13 11.16 13.16 94 2.3 6.5 9.10 13.12 90 W Glenferrie Oval 21888 24-May-1969
R17 A LOSS 3.2 5.8 6.8 7.9 51 3.1 5.3 10.5 10.7 67 L Kardinia Park 20822 10-Aug-1968
R6 H LOSS 3.0 5.6 8.8 10.11 71 3.2 5.4 9.7 12.10 82 L Glenferrie Oval 10468 18-May-1968
R14 H WIN 5.5 7.7 9.11 11.12 78 1.2 4.5 4.11 7.16 58 W Glenferrie Oval 12556 29-Jul-1967
SF F LOSS 2.7 7.10 8.13 11.16 82 4.4 9.6 12.12 14.17 101 L M.C.G. 91471 21-Sep-1963

 

[88HawksBestEver]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Been on the Geelong board in their final v us thread and the absolute confidence that we will be soundly beaten by them feels eerily like 2008.

The thing is they are wheeling out the same things each opposition board says every week:

"Hawks have small back line, we will test them with our talls, Cyril is over-rated and goes missing, Buddy plays for free kicks etc etc"

In the words of our late great Yabby:

"Every wins brings you closer to a loss..."

Hoping this applies to Geelongs last 6 wins bringing them closer to the inevitable loss they have to have against us in the first week of the finals!

 

[Pessimistic]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Its a crucial final as well as having the Hawks-geelong thing.

Ecstasy for the winning fans and absolute hell for the losers

"You know you've cost us the game, don't you ?" just about sums it up

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Will be a blinder of a game. The week off for the winner and a likely Prelim against the Pies for the loser. I know which I would prefer. oh.. and what NB said.

 

[PottSie2]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Here's how we'll win it:

1. Do what we usually do against them for the first 3 quarters
2. In the last quarter.... STICK TO THE F***ING GAMEPLAN CLARKO!!!

Having a 1-man forwardline and trying to defend a 3 goal lead against the best tight finishes team in the AFL is absolutely madness and without a doubt cost us the win in our last game. Yes I understand that losing the Rough at the start of the last and having Renouf try to ruck with what turned out to be a 4 month serious injury really hurt us, but the fact that we were able to clear the ball from defence on about 15 occasions yet still weren't able to score was just absolutely ridiculous. It was probably the worst coached quarter I've ever seen from Clarkson.

Agree 100%.

 

[Partridge]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Been on the Geelong board in their final v us thread and the absolute confidence that we will be soundly beaten by them feels eerily like 2008.

The thing is they are wheeling out the same things each opposition board says every week:

"Hawks have small back line, we will test them with our talls, Cyril is over-rated and goes missing, Buddy plays for free kicks etc etc"

In the words of our late great Yabby:

"Every wins brings you closer to a loss..."

Hoping this applies to Geelongs last 6 wins bringing them closer to the inevitable loss they have to have against us in the first week of the finals!

Sorry to intrude guys, but if you're talking about the same post I've seen, I wouldn't quite call it absolute confidence. We're nowhere near as good as 3 years ago for one thing.

Some of them are quietly confident no doubt, I guess they figure the recent run means something. As for me I'm never confident about any game, least of all to you guys.

I think it's too close to call. Again. Both sides are playing excellent football. Amazing to think a side could be 16-4 with a percentage of nearly 150 and not even be in the top 2. Insane.

This will be the game of the finals for sure.

 

[SHAKESPEARE]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

So who do we play in the semi final?

 

[Agent Smith]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Stratts on J-Pod will prevent a semi final happening for us.

 

[jpzhawk]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

my wish list -

Collingwood and geelong hurt each other in round 24 .

we win the flag , but if we dont , anyone else but collingwood wins it .

that is all .

 

[Sixpence]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Some of them are quietly confident no doubt, I guess they figure the recent run means something. As for me I'm never confident about any game, least of all to you guys.

I think it's too close to call. Again. Both sides are playing excellent football. Amazing to think a side could be 16-4 with a percentage of nearly 150 and not even be in the top 2. Insane.

This will be the game of the finals for sure.

There's a difference between confidence and arrogance. (A line mostly crossed by Pies supporters on BF!)

I'd expect most Cats supporters to be confident. They have every reason to be - they're a great side. That shouldn't be confused with arrogance. Conversely, I'm quite confident we can win. That doesn't mean I think it's a dead cert or a walk in the park though. I don't begrudge anyone for being confident in their own team.

The only certainty about it is it's going to be a great game!

 

[parsons nose]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

I'll be interested to see how well the new improved versions of Whitex, Hale, Bailey and Smith go. These guys are in far superior form when compared to the last time the two teams met. Of course we'll be missing the services of Roughie, however he was having minimal impact in that game before succumbing to his disastrous achilles. I reckon we've improved an extra 10% since the two teams last met. Not convinced the absence of Changa or Savo will be all that detrimental to our prospects of a win.

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

1 week at a time.

 

[groga]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Hey guys just coming over to post a question.

Me and my mate (massive hawks supporter) are planning on flying over for the semi-finals. If it's hawks vs collingwood or Hawks vs Eagles, do you guys think their will we be tickets available for the general public a day after members get a crack?

Thanks guy

(just want to see if it's worth getting plane tickets already)

 

[Buddy and Roughy]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

its impossible for hawthorn to play either in the semis

assuming you mean the prelim, well tickets will definitely be available for vs WC; and still probably (though it will certainly sell out fast once available to the g. public) vs collingwood.

 

[cryptor]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Hey guys just coming over to post a question.

Me and my mate (massive hawks supporter) are planning on flying over for the semi-finals. If it's hawks vs collingwood or Hawks vs Eagles, do you guys think their will we be tickets available for the general public a day after members get a crack?

Thanks guy

(just want to see if it's worth getting plane tickets already)

Top 4 can't play in a semi against each other so I assume you're talking Prelims? Hawks v Eagles you would have a chance. Hawks v Pies I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

[clarkoscluster]

Re: Qualifying Final #2 - Hawthorn v Geelong - Discussion Thread

Hey guys just coming over to post a question.

Me and my mate (massive hawks supporter) are planning on flying over for the semi-finals. If it's hawks vs collingwood or Hawks vs Eagles, do you guys think their will we be tickets available for the general public a day after members get a crack?

Thanks guy

(just want to see if it's worth getting plane tickets already)

Which weekend are you talking about? The 2nd week is the semi-finals, which means the Eagles will either have a week off, or will be playing at Patersons Stadium. In week 1 and 3, it's highly unlikely an Eagles matches will sell out in Melbourne, especially against Hawthorn (Collingwood would be a slim chance given their 70k members).

If the Hawks play Collingwood in week 3, the match would be a very good chance to sell out, but there will almost certainly be a general public selling period. Although the clubs have 120,000 members between them, alot live interstate etc, so would not be able to make it. There may not be heaps available (5000 or less??), so you'd need to get in fast, but if you're quick and are prepared to queue up nice and early, you shouldn't have a problem.