Autopsy Rd 8: Dogs battle bravely and come up just short against Hawks

[Fossie 32]

Would have been good if the blind boys gave Libba a free for getting kicked in the head riGhT in fRoNt of them

 

[Fossie 32]

I think we have a very talented list, the issue isn't the talent for me it's is the imbalance of the list.

Probably part of it but I would say not playing up to their abilities is the main problem. Who on the list is doing that? I think Libba, Jones and Bonti, Ed when he’s in defence …….

 

[Mojorisin]

Probably part of it but I would say not playing up to their abilities is the main problem. Who on the list is doing that? I think Libba, Jones and Bonti, Ed when he’s in defence …….

Whilst alot aren't performing as expected I think alot of that could be related to structure and not leaning into their strengths for example naughton playing as the deepest forward as opposed to up the ground, Garcia forward and as you mention Richards forward. Not exactly setting them up to succeed.

 

[The Slitherin' Snake]

While some of the pressure and quality of defending ball movement was a bit off, on the outside, the midfield more or less did their job to allow Hawks to only get 49 inside 50's, 4 below their season average. It was the defenders defending that lost us the game.

The defenders were pretty poor no doubt about that (only really Jones and Dale were acceptable). But the quality of inside 50s teams get against us each week is usually very good. No pressure on the ball carrier and lots of space in their forward 50 makes it hard to be a defender

 

[Johnny_Dogg4]

The defenders were pretty poor no doubt about that (only really Jones and Dale were acceptable). But the quality of inside 50s teams get against us each week is usually very good. No pressure on the ball carrier and lots of space in their forward 50 makes it hard to be a defender

easily fixable - doesn't require talent but does requires footy smarts and leadership (not sure we have enough of)

 

[threenewpadlocks]

The defenders were pretty poor no doubt about that (only really Jones and Dale were acceptable). But the quality of inside 50s teams get against us each week is usually very good. No pressure on the ball carrier and lots of space in their forward 50 makes it hard to be a defender

Agreed - it wasn't great. It was a more minor issue than the poor turnovers from the defenders themselves and their failure to do poor defensive work though. That's the bigger issue here.

 

[Thunderoad]

Umps had nothing to do with the final result.

Question, when was the last time we looked like a hardened, mature side who doesn't get pushed around? (I'm not counting BS wins like the Suns in Ballarat). So much of this can be traced back to the 2021 granny, followed by the cherry on top 2022 elimination final. A lot of players, coaches and certainly the club as a whole have been forever scarred from those events.

I agree with what you're saying here but I'm not sure why you would discount the win against the Suns in Ballarat.

That's the only game this season where we have been able to play with an intensity of what I would expect from a genuine top 6 side.

It wasn't cold or especially windy in Ballarat that day so I don't think the Suns would have brought those issues up as a reason why they were well beaten.

We need to be asking the question as to why we can't play with the level of commitment which we did in that game on a much more regular and routine basis.

 

[Mr. Walker]

I think a lot of the blame should be on the players for poor work rate. It didn’t seem to matter which way the ball went Hawks always outnumbered us. Defending or attacking the Hawks out ran us. When we finally did get the ball back they had a free defender to mark the dump kick. It was always a dump kick because we never had free players. That’s purely work rate.
And don’t get me started on handballs missing targets. Five meter handballs falling short or wide. How does that happen.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Has anyone had the stomach to listen to the post match presser or the email brief? Was there any anger? Any genuine disappointment and determination or just more bull*** 'we need to get better with a few things' platitudes?

 

[Doggy]

Has anyone had the stomach to listen to the post match presser or the email brief? Was there any anger? Any genuine disappointment and determination or just more bull*** 'we need to get better with a few things' platitudes?

Think it was put in here last night.

More bullshit.

 

[geoffjennings79]

Hawks mids attacked every contest. Watch the last quarter - they get the ball and keep pushing through the contest with intent. Their handballs in congestion also are fast and at their team mate, not their team mate's feet or wide of them. Many of our tackles were brushed aside, yet every time Hawks pinned our blokes on the ground, again with intent.

 

[cherrypie]

I think a lot of the blame should be on the players for poor work rate. It didn’t seem to matter which way the ball went Hawks always outnumbered us. Defending or attacking the Hawks out ran us.

There was a moment in Hawthorns forward 50 with under a minute to go, they had a free player who was clearly about to receive the ball and have a shot to seal it. We had two players nearby him basically not moving and relied on Vandermeer sprinting from 30m away to chase him down and keep us alive.

I’m not a fan of Vandermeer but when it comes to work rate he puts the effort of some others to shame.

 

[hutchy31]

I agree with what you're saying here but I'm not sure why you would discount the win against the Suns in Ballarat.

That's the only game this season where we have been able to play with an intensity of what I would expect from a genuine top 6 side.

It wasn't cold or especially windy in Ballarat that day so I don't think the Suns would have brought those issues up as a reason why they were well beaten.

We need to be asking the question as to why we can't play with the level of commitment which we did in that game on a much more regular and routine basis.

The Suns just got their asses handed to them by an injury-affected Brisbane team who won by six goals despite kicking 0.9 in the third quarter.

I know some in the media like to talk up the Suns, but they’re not a decent measuring stick imo - particularly away from home at a ground hardly any of them would’ve played at before.

We did play well that day, but also converted extraordinary well early to give us a decent break. 9.1 at qt meant the game was almost over as a contest before it began. From the second quarter onwards the score was 9.6 to 8.5. That doesn’t negate how good the first quarter was, but it wasn’t an old-fashioned four quarter thumping.

We’ve beaten GC, WC and Saints - none of whom will make finals. We might beat Richmond this week, but there’s a world of pain coming after that if performances remain at this level.

 

[_Cerberus_]

Hawks mids attacked every contest. Watch the last quarter - they get the ball and keep pushing through the contest with intent. Their handballs in congestion also are fast and at their team mate, not their team mate's feet or wide of them. Many of our tackles were brushed aside, yet every time Hawks pinned our blokes on the ground, again with intent.

Agree. I was at the game, and saw plenty of off the ball action. And there was a gulf in intent between the two teams. And we were LAZY as well. Heaps of jogging on the spot. Heaps not picking up their man.

On one play, I saw Dale in the center square, look over to the opposite wing, to see two Hawks and just one of our guys there. They were stuck in their defensive 50, looking for an option. It is clear they wanted the switch play. Did Dale run to the spare man? He had heaps of time to. He knew they had a spare man there. They didn't kick it for a few more seconds. Nope. He just stood in the middle of the ground, with nothing but grass around him. Next second, they pull the trigger on the switch to the opposite wing, and move it up the ground with a spare man.

Where Hawks players were running hard to cover ground and pick up opponents defensively. We had a lot of "someone else will pick him up" mind sets. It shows the different work rates and mind set of both teams.

I have a rule when it comes to tackling that you never say out loud. You want to tackle someone and make them HURT. We look like we are scared we will break a nail with our tackling efforts, that it looks like we are trying to hug someone. Also our tackling technique is poor footwork and body wise. Has been for awhile. When the Hawks caught us in a tackle, we were done for, not breaking out of it. Their technique was much better.

 

[dcs84]

The players look uninspired. They look as if they are scared to 'swim outside their lane', afraid to take the game on. The talent is there but it appears as though the culture and, most importantly, the playing structures and styles are severely damaged if not entirely broken. Is it really the case that three current or former All-Australians are past it, or could it be that they have completely lost their confidence due to the directives and strategies of an inflexible coach?

 

[mattwa]

Playing Ed Richards

20

Ed Richards

Age

24

Ht

188cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.4

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

5.2

4star

M

2.5

3star

T

2.4

4star

MG

201.4

3star

D

11.3

3star

K

6.0

2star

HB

5.3

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

2.5

3star

MG

198.3

3star

D

14.6

4star

K

9.8

4star

HB

4.8

4star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.6

4star

MG

232.4

4star

who is borderline AA potential HBF as a wing/mid/fwd when we are getting towelled up in defense is sackable

 

[Libbaaaa]

Playing Ed Richards who is borderline AA potential HBF as a wing/mid/fwd when we are getting towelled up in defense is sackable

Regardless of position Ed has been down on form this year for mine, just looks like another guy out there.

 

[Claudonious]

I think we have a very talented list, the issue isn't the talent for me it's is the imbalance of the list.

Correct


Cast Offs or too old

Bramble
Baker
Harmes
Duryea


Not at the level

Vandermeer
Garcia


Developing and Jury out

JOD
Khamis
Gallagher
Clarke

Flakey and out of form

JJ
Williams


That is 12 of the 23. Yes, our top 5 are great - but it falls away.Coach challenges aside - half our team is average or worse.

 

[geoffjennings79]

Agree. I was at the game, and saw plenty of off the ball action. And there was a gulf in intent between the two teams. And we were LAZY as well. Heaps of jogging on the spot. Heaps not picking up their man.

On one play, I saw Dale in the center square, look over to the opposite wing, to see two Hawks and just one of our guys there. They were stuck in their defensive 50, looking for an option. It is clear they wanted the switch play. Did Dale run to the spare man? He had heaps of time to. He knew they had a spare man there. They didn't kick it for a few more seconds. Nope. He just stood in the middle of the ground, with nothing but grass around him. Next second, they pull the trigger on the switch to the opposite wing, and move it up the ground with a spare man.

Where Hawks players were running hard to cover ground and pick up opponents defensively. We had a lot of "someone else will pick him up" mind sets. It shows the different work rates and mind set of both teams.

I have a rule when it comes to tackling that you never say out loud. You want to tackle someone and make them HURT. We look like we are scared we will break a nail with our tackling efforts, that it looks like we are trying to hug someone. Also our tackling technique is poor footwork and body wise. Has been for awhile. When the Hawks caught us in a tackle, we were done for, not breaking out of it. Their technique was much better.

Yep, I was there too. After the first 15 mins or so, Hawks adjusted and increased their intensity. They out ran us across the field.
Agree entirely on tackling - although Liber's sling tackle probably over stepped the mark, but he is one of the few (Bont, Vandermeer, West when he's playing) who seem to tackle with intent.

 

[SSSSSS]

Sorry to intrude but why is Busslinger not playing in the 1s?

Was an absolute brickwall against Box Hill.

 

[Mojorisin]

Correct


Cast Offs or too old

Bramble
Baker
Harmes
Duryea


Not at the level

Vandermeer
Garcia


Developing and Jury out

JOD
Khamis
Gallagher
Clarke

Flakey and out of form

JJ
Williams


That is 12 of the 23. Yes, our top 5 are great - but it falls away.Coach challenges aside - half our team is average or worse.

This is very much true however I was referring the imbalance of where our talent lays. We have great up and coming talls A-grade clearance mids but no players that excell on the spread and no defensive forwards which is just as worrying to me as the point that you have rightfully made.

 

[Hobdog]

I do wonder whether our propensity to be continually “searching for the right mix” has meant that we continually look like a side that has barely played together. Our connection from defence through to the forward line has no cohesion and the less said about the forward line chemistry (or lack of) the better.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[ExRoyboy]

Copped a stud to the face

And had the free kick paid against him as well just for his trouble

 

[ossie_21]

Sorry to intrude but why is Busslinger not playing in the 1s?

Was an absolute brickwall against Box Hill.

Pretty much this whole board wants him to be playing, why not is up to our questionable coaching team.

I would 100% debut him against a weak Richmond team, we have absolutely nothing left to lose at this point.

 

[CarnTheScray]

Sorry to intrude but why is Busslinger not playing in the 1s?

Was an absolute brickwall against Box Hill.

What, you don’t love watching Khamis get destroyed one on one especially by a man with one arm?