Review Round 21 - West Coast @ Optus Stadium - 2nd August 2024 - 8:30pm AEST

[Orange crush]

That's exactly what's been happening.
2018-2020 was the first major rebuild post inception and that didn't really work out (hence Dew getting sacked), and now second partial rebuild of 2022-2025 (Humphrey, Walter, Read, Rogers, Lombard, Uwland, Andrew) to add to the first rebuild core.

So another mini rebuild next year …. Not just a couple of pieces. Ok

 

[1990crow]

So another mini rebuild next year …. Not just a couple of pieces. Ok

Wouldn't say that. Next year GC just happen to have access to Uwland through academy so more of an added benefit than rebuild.
This year should be the last down year before Hardwick turns over some more players this offseason and goes all in next year onwards.
Growing pains this year whilst Walter, Rogers, Humphrey, Andrew have made a start without being able to make much of an impact yet.

 

[SandyToes]

We all keep saying this every year l guess one day it will happen.

On SM-A546E using BigFooty.com mobile app

I've posted this thought every year for 15 years
AFL like all pro-sport is an arms race
You don't have to just improve on your previous year you have to go to another level-because every team-good and bad-will improve
We need someone in the team who understands success and can push a list of players that has the talent to know they can be the best
Self belief.Arrogance.The knowledge you can win anywhere anytime.
If Dimma wasn't on his knees to Martin before last night he will be now
Whteher its a dinky little pass to King or a handball to Rosas into space he would have won 3 games for us this year vs
St Kilda North and Weagles
At least
You don't have to be Nostradamus to have written last night's script
Good enough to win
Team that has been battered from pillar to post for a couple of years with nothing to lose hangs hangs in at home and runs over the top of a team that has so much anxiety about actually winning that they give up the important moments that win sporting contests

 

[SAweagle]

I'm oddly relieved the season is officially over. It was mentally exhausting feeling like we could 'get up' and win all these games when were clearly nowhere near the mark when it counts.

Also, I've never really bought into we have a losing mentality culture until tonight. It's just like the players don't believe they can win when the pressure is on. It's a worry when a triple premiership coach can't make them believe. I just feel like we need a forward who u can look at and lift the forward line when the chips are down.

Good to see Ben king in some form now tho. I wonder if his confidence being low was a bigger contributor to his inaccuracy than his technique.

Just exhausted and disappointed

*Triple premiership coach with a club that plays 15 games at the MCG and travels for a month of the year

 

[Jen2310]

“Well, (the loss) can be shattering, or the next three weeks could be defining for what it looks like moving forward,” he said.

“We were disappointed to lose. The fact of that matter is you got to play the game a certain way.

“You’ve got to play a September brand of footy and we didn’t tonight.


“Our contest work… in fairness, the last couple of weeks... it hasn’t been to the level that we’d like.

“We’ve also got to be better in critical moments and play moments better and that’s the disappointing thing from our point of view.

“When we have a chance to be stronger over the ball and get the ball going forward, we just didn’t get it done.”

“We’ve got three weeks to turn something around,” he said.

“We’ve never had a winning season. You know, I think our max wins 10, so let’s work towards something.

“We want to make sure we sit there and finish off the way we should finish the season off.

“So we’re gonna make some tough calls about what that September brand looks like.”

‘Tough calls’ ahead for Suns after finals fail as Hardwick eyes ‘defining’ finish to season

‘Tough calls’ ahead for Suns amid Dimma’s honest finals reality check

www.foxsports.com.au

Interesting to see what happens here.

 

[robo_1]

Interesting to see what happens here.

Most know. Rinse and repeat 2010-2024

 

[SandyToes]

Most know. Rinse and repeat 2010-2024

Maybe
I wasn't super confident for this season
My best case scenario was make the 8 and not go much further
Hardwick knows what we need
He is definitely the Coach to take us forward
I'm actually more certain of that now than ever
I always feel our wins are lucky in strange way
It's like "We're winning.What do we do now??"
Some games it clicks and we all feel like we're on our way but even our great wins nver seem like they're based on a week in week out reproducible formula
There's nothing in our DNA that knows how to win tough or smart
No-one in our first 22 has that "knowledge"
Nor has there ever been anyone in the team with that knowledge since Gary Ablett
Thre's no-one our young guys can look to and say "That's how you do it!"
Our team needs some strong immunity and that's going to need a bone marrow transplant from a healthy donor with winning white cells
Doctor Hardwick knows

 

[SandyToes]

I hope you guys appreciate the quality I bring to this board by the way
Sometimes I'm in awe of myself

 

[Jirik13]

I hope you guys appreciate the quality I bring to this board by the way
Sometimes I'm in awe of myself

Yeah, your unwavering trust in Doctor Dimma is impressive. Hopefully, the Doc will not kill the patient.

 

[SandyToes]

Yeah, your unwavering trust in Doctor Dimma is impressive. Hopefully, the Doc will not kill the patient.

I have no doubt we have 80% of a finals contending team as he stated
I think everyone who ever got 80% on an exam thought that meant we were nearly there!
BUT, given that means we need about 26 players who can rotate easily and seamlessly through the first 22 in reality we have to find another 6 players who could play finals footy because at the moment the cupboard's pretty bare after player 20
Hopefully we get a Rioli and a Martin but we really need another 2 or 3 strong players on list to move forward

 

[GC2015]

What tough calls?
They need to harden up

'Tough calls' ahead as Suns fail again, 'simple focuses' help Eagles

A disappointed Damien Hardwick says the Suns have big decisions to make after their loss to the Eagles

www.afl.com.au

Now that this season is all but over, I do wonder if the biggest issue we faced this year was that we went too young and inexperienced - particularly in the second half of the season. Jed Walter for example played 12 games this year and probably only had 2 or 3 decent games for the season. Under normal circumstances, Walter would have spent most of the season developing in the VFL but Dimma insisted on pumping games into the draftees because it should pay dividends later.

However, if you are going to commit to this kind of youth policy then I think you have to supplement it with a decent portion of experienced players/vets and preferably those who have had success at other clubs to know what it takes. The logic for building a future premiership side is obviously there but I don't think we have enough experienced players/veterans on our list to successfully balance that kind of commitment to our recent draftees.

Look at the successful experienced players/vets that GWS had in 2016 when they made the jump into the top 4: Heath Shaw - 30years old/200+ games/premiership player at Collingwood, Shane Mumford - 30 years old/150 games/premiership player at Sydney, Ryan Griffen - 30 years old/150 games, 10+ finals including multiple prelims, Steve Johnson 32 years old/250+ games/multiple premiership winner at Geelong.

Who do we have that's of that ilk? Basically no one. This is why we need to go and get players who are experienced and have had the ultimate success elsewhere like Dusty and Rioli to show these guys how to stand up in the big moments. That's needed if we're going to continue with this youth policy.

 

[Jen2310]

Now that this season is all but over, I do wonder if the biggest issue we faced this year was that we went too young and inexperienced - particularly in the second half of the season. Jed Walter for example played 12 games this year and probably only had 2 or 3 decent games for the season. Under normal circumstances, Walter would have spent most of the season developing in the VFL but Dimma insisted on pumping games into the draftees because it should pay dividends later.

However, if you are going to commit to this kind of youth policy then I think you have to supplement it with a decent portion of experienced players/vets and preferably those who have had success at other clubs to know what it takes. The logic for building a future premiership side is obviously there but I don't think we have enough experienced players/veterans on our list to successfully balance that kind of commitment to our recent draftees.

Look at the successful experienced players/vets that GWS had in 2016 when they made the jump into the top 4: Heath Shaw - 30years old/200+ games/premiership player at Collingwood, Shane Mumford - 30 years old/150 games/premiership player at Sydney, Ryan Griffen - 30 years old/150 games, 10+ finals including multiple prelims, Steve Johnson 32 years old/250+ games/multiple premiership winner at Geelong.

Who do we have that's of that ilk? Basically no one. This is why we need to go and get players who are experienced and have had the ultimate success elsewhere like Dusty and Rioli to show these guys how to stand up in the big moments.

I did feel at times it was too inexperienced, too many first year players at once. When it was a season with full of expectation to make finals, had to find a balance between playing kids that were ready, and putting a team out there that you saw can win games. Winning should have been the priority. Let the kids force their way in. Very little injuries, a good draw, I certain had tipped the suns more wins than they have gotten.

This away record is all mental. There is no reason they can't play in the same manner away that they do at home. Why the midfield seems to fall away when out of QLD. They are the first that needs to take responsibility. Games are won or lost in the middle, as by losing that you aren't giving your forwards a chance, and putting too much pressure on the defence.

 

[SandyToes]

Now that this season is all but over, I do wonder if the biggest issue we faced this year was that we went too young and inexperienced - particularly in the second half of the season. Jed Walter for example played 12 games this year and probably only had 2 or 3 decent games for the season. Under normal circumstances, Walter would have spent most of the season developing in the VFL but Dimma insisted on pumping games into the draftees because it should pay dividends later.

However, if you are going to commit to this kind of youth policy then I think you have to supplement it with a decent portion of experienced players/vets and preferably those who have had success at other clubs to know what it takes. The logic for building a future premiership side is obviously there but I don't think we have enough experienced players/veterans on our list to successfully balance that kind of commitment to our recent draftees.

Look at the successful experienced players/vets that GWS had in 2016 when they made the jump into the top 4: Heath Shaw - 30years old/200+ games/premiership player at Collingwood, Shane Mumford - 30 years old/150 games/premiership player at Sydney, Ryan Griffen - 30 years old/150 games, 10+ finals including multiple prelims, Steve Johnson 32 years old/250+ games/multiple premiership winner at Geelong.

Who do we have that's of that ilk? Basically no one. This is why we need to go and get players who are experienced and have had the ultimate success elsewhere like Dusty and Rioli to show these guys how to stand up in the big moments. That's needed if we're going to continue with this youth policy.

Amen

 

[Supersuns]

I hope you guys appreciate the quality I bring to this board by the way
Sometimes I'm in awe of myself

Luckily none of it has gone to your head Sandy, as humble as they come

 

[Giant Strides]

Now that this season is all but over, I do wonder if the biggest issue we faced this year was that we went too young and inexperienced - particularly in the second half of the season.

Look at the successful experienced players/vets that GWS had in 2016 when they made the jump into the top 4: Heath Shaw - 30years old/200+ games/premiership player at Collingwood, Shane Mumford - 30 years old/150 games/premiership player at Sydney, Ryan Griffen - 30 years old/150 games, 10+ finals including multiple prelims, Steve Johnson 32 years old/250+ games/multiple premiership winner at Geelong.

Pardon the intrusion onto your board, but I do think that this point is really important. We had added the highly experienced premiership players Shane Mumford and Heath Shaw a few years before. Mummy put iron into our midfield, and Shaw organised our defence. Both very strong, vocal people. Ryan Griffen and Joel Patfull were then added the previous year (Joel only stayed 2 years); quieter and less influential, but still important. Stevie J being added in 2016 provided some organisation in a very young but talented forwardline. So, all 3 lines had guidance from veterans.

Therefore, I think that getting players of the right capability and mindset is important, but probably notable that it might take a couple of years for the impact to take full effect. But you shouldn't shy away from getting someone (like Dusty) who might only have a year or two left. That might be enough (and your own players are more experienced than the 2016 GWS team).

Good luck for the rest of the year and 2025.

 

[SandyToes]

Pardon the intrusion onto your board, but I do think that this point is really important. We had added the highly experienced premiership players Shane Mumford and Heath Shaw a few years before. Mummy put iron into our midfield, and Shaw organised our defence. Both very strong, vocal people. Ryan Griffen and Joel Patfull were then added the previous year (Joel only stayed 2 years); quieter and less influential, but still important. Stevie J being added in 2016 provided some organisation in a very young but talented forwardline. So, all 3 lines had guidance from veterans.

Therefore, I think that getting players of the right capability and mindset is important, but probably notable that it might take a couple of years for the impact to take full effect. But you shouldn't shy away from getting someone (like Dusty) who might only have a year or two left. That might be enough (and your own players are more experienced than the 2016 GWS team).

Good luck for the rest of the year and 2025.

Not to mention Sheedy as inaugural coach
I was always of the belief we should have had Pagan or Choco Williams

 

[SnusCG]

we need to overpay a genuinely good player to come up here. I know people don't like overpaying but we need players who can come in and make us better straight away. We have the draft capital to do it, so we need to strike while the team is in the right age bracket.

Do you think Brisbane would be where they are right now if they'd not been able to recruit Neale, Dunkley, Daniher, and Cameron?

Good teams are built through the draft. You tend to need to bring someone in from outside to push you over the edge.

Throw our first to the Dees if they pay half of Clayton Olivers Salary and bring in Dan Rioli with the dogs pick and 19 if we can.

A first choice midfield rotation of Oliver, Rowell, Anderson, Touk under Witts/Moyle is the best in the league.

 

[Iva Bigun]

Not to mention Sheedy as inaugural coach
I was always of the belief we should have had Pagan or Choco Williams

Pagan would of been perfect, the young guys at North walked on glass for him, just look at his under 19 -reserves record, it’s unbelievable

 

[SandyToes]

Pagan would of been perfect, the young guys at North walked on glass for him, just look at his under 19 -reserves record, it’s unbelievable

In my re-imaginings of "How it could have been" I saw the great North v Essendon encounters and rivalries of the 50's-2000's rekindled with Sheedy v Pagan
But the AFL master geniuses knew better than us poor wee dunderheaded little people of course

 

[GC2015]

Pardon the intrusion onto your board, but I do think that this point is really important. We had added the highly experienced premiership players Shane Mumford and Heath Shaw a few years before. Mummy put iron into our midfield, and Shaw organised our defence. Both very strong, vocal people. Ryan Griffen and Joel Patfull were then added the previous year (Joel only stayed 2 years); quieter and less influential, but still important. Stevie J being added in 2016 provided some organisation in a very young but talented forwardline. So, all 3 lines had guidance from veterans.

Therefore, I think that getting players of the right capability and mindset is important, but probably notable that it might take a couple of years for the impact to take full effect. But you shouldn't shy away from getting someone (like Dusty) who might only have a year or two left. That might be enough (and your own players are more experienced than the 2016 GWS team).

Good luck for the rest of the year and 2025.

Agreed. Brisbane did something similar when they made their jump from 15th into the top 2 in 2019. They brought in a multi premiership winning captain in Luke Hodge in 2018 to organise/lead the backline, they identified and recruited the most exciting young small forward in the league (Charlie Cameron) who had just announced himself to the footy world with a 5 goal performance in a prelim win as well as competing in the 2017 Grand Final and the final piece of the puzzle was adding a high quality mid who was just about to enter his prime in Lachie Neale and he had also taken part in a Grand Final (2013) .

All three lines covered with high quality experienced players who had played and won many finals in the past - Hodge in the backline, Lachie Neale in the midfield and Charlie Cameron in the forward line. It feels like a method that works when you commit to the youth like we have and you'd think adding multi premierships players in Dusty and Rioli would essentially get us there.

 

[Azdog11]

I’m not defending the team. I am in agreement that we are a mentally weak side with no killer instinct.

You said and I quote “Anderson never fails to let us down. Can’t handle the pressure, ever.” I was simply pointing out that it’s not fair or true. Noah owns the most clutch moment in our clubs short history.

Well, that was horrendous