Autopsy Round 24, 2024 - Saints defeat Boos

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Klaatu said:
Not sure how you can say Toce got Garcia where's the proof, it could of been Joe Smith looking over a fence & informing our recruiting staff, recruiting staff are many not 1 guy every club has spies around Australia.
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Still under his watch. He was the head recruiter
 
Getting in top 10 draft picks is one thing. But the later Ryan Byrnes type picks complete the team
 
So many valuable lessons learned in that game by a whole band of players.

You can train scenarios as much as you like, but nothing beats the experience of actually trying to implement them in a competitive environment.

And say what you might, Carlton brought some heat early, then late in the third and in the last.

We learned about our system. Players learned about each other and about themselves. Coaches got really good insight into the value of role players as I’m sure did list management.

As a keen watcher that game crystallised for me that Zak Jones absolutely still has value. It’s like he’s morphed into his older brother. His handballing in that game was bordering on exquisite. Not only has he got much to give, but young inside mids like Garcia will learn just by playing alongside him. If we trade him in for Shiel it would be a monumental misstep.
 

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beside the seaside said:
We have an epic win with ten seconds to go and there's about 20 pages of a so called supporter sooking it up that we should have lost?

If that's how you feel fine you're a muppet post it once but do you really need to bang on about it for pages and pages.

Especially in this draft where there doesn't even seem to be a clear top ten.
Click to expand...


And another 40 pages of people whinging about his opinion, who gives a ****. It’s not a church. He can have alternate views and it doesn’t matter.

He loves this draft and is disappointed to be out of the sweetest picks. Doesn’t sound that unreasonable to me.
 
luca77 said:
At the end of the day, we sucked less than the Dees and GC and deserve a later pick. Tanking is basically cheating.
It's not the players' job to throw games and there are careers on the line.
Not finishing low, and earning respect helps with keeping good sponsors.
We lost a few close ones and finished 2 wins and perc. behind the blues. That doesn't give us a 'right' to the players we want. Need to put it behind you now and keep fingers crossed we make the right calls in November.
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Yep. Good to win another close one after the Swans.
And after losing a few of them.
Could’ve put the cue in the rack in the last minute when momentum was against us. But didn’t. You cannot be unhappy with that.
 
Sully111 said:
How solid is Jimmy Webster? I can see why Ross rates him.
Click to expand...

He’s an old school hard bodied defender that plays fair but brutal. Love the way he plays. His kick to his mate Membrey was elite too.
 
CursingFijian said:
So many valuable lessons learned in that game by a whole band of players.

You can train scenarios as much as you like, but nothing beats the experience of actually trying to implement them in a competitive environment.

And say what you might, Carlton brought some heat early, then late in the third and in the last.

We learned about our system. Players learned about each other and about themselves. Coaches got really good insight into the value of role players as I’m sure did list management.

As a keen watcher that game crystallised for me that Zak Jones absolutely still has value. It’s like he’s morphed into his older brother. His handballing in that game was bordering on exquisite. Not only has he got much to give, but young inside mids like Garcia will learn just by playing alongside him. If we trade him in for Shiel it would be a monumental misstep.
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Zac Jones has been excellent for 6 weeks. Amazing what a run injury free will do for you.
His impact in the last few minutes was exceptional and instrumental. In the last two minutes he take the ball through the midfield takes the tackle gets it NAZ for the Pou shot.
From the stoppage gets the ball moving into the 50. Next stoppage contests, pushes forward to the contest and gets the quick handball to Higgins for the goal.
5 seconds to play a last kick inside the 50, he leaves Cripps and effects the block.

I always said if he was 75% as good as Nathan we would have a player. Well he hS been just about our best midfielder for the past 6 games.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
Joffaboy said:
Zac Jones has been excellent for 6 weeks. Amazing what a run injury free will do for you.
His impact in the last few minutes was exceptional and instrumental. In the last two minutes he take the ball through the midfield takes the tackle gets it NAZ for the Pou shot.
From the stoppage gets the ball moving into the 50. Next stoppage contests, pushes forward to the contest and gets the quick handball to Higgins for the goal.
5 seconds to play a last kick inside the 50, he leaves Cripps and effects the block.

I always said if he was 75% as good as Nathan we would have a player. Well he hS been just about our best midfielder for the past 6 games.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...
You are definitely right in getting his body right has allowed him to have a good run. We know he’ll always give maximum effort. I think the biggest thing I’ve noticed over the last 6 weeks is he is taking the easy, safe option rather than trying to pull off the x factor play. He doesn’t have the skill set to show pony
I hope they give him another year
 
akaifu said:
A terrible win. Saints fans celebrating like we've won the premiership when in reality we beat an undermanned team without their two Coleman Medallists. Also hilarious you guys keep shitting on Blues fans for "not making finals" when in the end, as expected, they did. 2 hours of dopamine before crashing back down to earth, and now fans are scrambling to climb up the order or hoping for "luck" to go our way in the draft

Also the "culture" piece. How is one win going to define culture? Is it really that fragile and weak? You know what would build culture? A full year of winning and a premiership cup, which is what losing against the Blues would've helped to increase the likelihood of for the years to come

I know I sound like a major pessimist and a massive dickhead, but I'm looking to the future. I want our club to set ourselves up for long-term and sustained success and the best draft picks give us the best chance at achieving this - not some petty rivalries that in the grand scheme of things, mean nothing when they have more premierships than us

The draft this year has a clear top 6. We now have picks 7&8. There is a reason why experts are calling it a weaker top-end - because it is! And now we do not have priority access to it. Please do not compare this to the Pou and Wilson drafts, it is a completely different scenario and doing so would render you clueless of this year's crop

I won't get started on the fixture effect because tbh if we can't beat the better sides then we don't deserve to achieve anything. But it IS another factor that could help us achieve great things

Saints fans. If you want to reply to this, do not hold back. I want to hear opinions because these are my thoughts and I'm sinking with depression because of it. Please help me see the light
Click to expand...

I'll bite - Look at teams that should be better but struggle, Gold Coast and Essendon

They are so used to having the season over round 12 that they are not used to being mentally switched on each and every game. Old Habbits die hard. So when they have a chance they bottle it. This is where the issues at those clubs run deep and until they fix it with all their talent they will be mediocre.

This year has shown its less around talent but being prepared and switched on for as long as possible and for as many games as possible. Each week game day is 3hrs, training + recovery + whatever the players do is the majority of the week, you build those habbits the gameday should be better. Over the past 15 years we have always started well and faded or started poorly and come back strong, which clearly needs to be fixed - talent, draw etc doesn't matter you want to win the GF you got to be able to beat everyone.

That is what will make a difference in the coming years. If you can mentally switch on for a game that meant "nothing" in round 22, 23, 24 then come this time next year and the year after i have more confidence the team will be better prepared and experienced to see out the grind of the season and win the games that are hopefully deciding our position in the top 4/8.

The difference to previous years is this is exactly what Ross and the club has said it is trying to do as its an area that they see needs to be a focus.

Time will tell if it actually does matter or if the pick was a bust - but as much as we want to win another one they are so hard to do. Best chance is be at the pointy end for as long as possible for as many years as possible. Thats what we need to build, list, culture, development its a whole of club thing. Just look at Melbourne how the wheels have fallen off. As much as the second premiership will be EPIC, when we win that second we will want no.3 and no. 4. Sustained success thats the goal it will take time but winning does help.
 
CaptainRisky said:
Ok I have a confession

Ryan Byrnes played his best game ever for us on the weekend , he may have had games with bigger numbers than yesterday but yesterday he was damaging when he got the ball and took a few really strong marks , so well done young fella I was wrong.
I was your biggest fan many years ago and dropped off you , so glad to see you fight your way through a lean period and come out the other side
Click to expand...

Its interesting to look at the team stats from Yesterday.

Carlton had more:
Disposals
Inside 50s
Better disposal efficiency
Clearances
Centre Clearances
Stoppage Clearances
Higher possession rate.
Tackles
Tackles inside 50.

Saints had better:
Efficiency inside 50.
2 more free kicks.
Hitouts 41-23
Contested possessions. This surprised me .
Marks ,Marks inside 50, contested marks.
One Percenters.

Contested possessions surprised me , because i knew that Cripps and Walsh had got a heap.
Cripps got 18, Walsh got 16.
Our best was Sinclair with 10.
But then we had Wilkie, Steele, Marshall, Dow who all got 9 ( Saad also got 9).
Then we had Wilson who had 8 ( the same as Hewett, Acres , and Pittonet ).
Then we had Sharman, Phillipou, Jones, Higgins , Clark on 7 ( and Kennedy ).

I guess it was a team effort , and Cripps and Walsh can't be everywhere. It seems to have hit home in our playing group that we can't just rely on the high profile players.
 
Saints TV said:
The pres walked past me at half time and we had a chat. He pointed to the coaches box and said 'I know some people want that draft pick but... that bloke wants to win, always' - then went on his way.
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Love it. As it should be.
As supporters some of us wouldn’t have been too unhappy to lose (although I did vacillate on that a lot and when push came to shove I wanted that win badly) but you NEVER want the club admin and players to think that way.
And you can see it in Wood’s quote someone posted. Draft picks were the very last thing on their minds.
 
gubby88 said:
I'm lost, have any saints posters wandered over to the Carlton board???

On SM-A156E using BigFooty.com mobile app
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Handful did and all copped bans or points for SFA TBH. They are a deeply unlikeable bunch the Blues supporters.

Meanwhile theyve come in here for a pity party. Suppose you may as well be kind to the ones about to be slaughtered at the GABBAtoir
 

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CaptainRisky said:
Ok I have a confession

Ryan Byrnes played his best game ever for us on the weekend , he may have had games with bigger numbers than yesterday but yesterday he was damaging when he got the ball and took a few really strong marks , so well done young fella I was wrong.
I was your biggest fan many years ago and dropped off you , so glad to see you fight your way through a lean period and come out the other side
Click to expand...
I really, really like him. He’s improved every year and gives it everything. Far from being a role player he is becoming an integral part of the 22. His kicking and tackling has improved outtasight.
( What # pick was he? )
 
gringo2011 said:
And another 40 pages of people whinging about his opinion, who gives a ****. It’s not a church. He can have alternate views and it doesn’t matter.

He loves this draft and is disappointed to be out of the sweetest picks. Doesn’t sound that unreasonable to me.
Click to expand...
Just seems like a weird hill to die on.
 
Klaatu said:
Not sure how you can say Toce got Garcia where's the proof, it could of been Joe Smith looking over a fence & informing our recruiting staff, recruiting staff are many not 1 guy every club has spies around Australia.
Click to expand...

Its been published but don't know where it is now.
Garcia was spotted by Wayne Hughes ,who brought him to Toce's attention.
Wayne Hughes was also the guy who spotted Jack Steele.
Quietly moved on last year as well ( from his part time position ).

I can't actually read this.
www.theage.com.au

Saints’ win highlights bizarre call, Mitchell’s misstep: Key takeouts from round two

The AFL’s second round is in the books and, as usual, there is plenty to talk about after a weekend of upsets, controversy and magnificent solo performances.
www.theage.com.au www.theage.com.au
 
Plugger35 said:
This was one of our best wins against Carlton since this epic win against Carlton back in 1989.




We didn't play finals that year either but that win set the platform for us to play finals in the 90s.

A win like that was also one of the reasons I chose to become a Saints supporter so maybe that win today will suck in a few more.
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That was one of the best home and away games I've attended. Another great one was 1995 at VFL Park when we were bottom, Blues were on top and we held them goalless to half time.
 
Last edited:
phantom13 said:
Handful did and all copped bans or points for SFA TBH. They are a deeply unlikeable bunch the Blues supporters.

Meanwhile theyve come in here for a pity party. Suppose you may as well be kind to the ones about to be slaughtered at the GABBAtoir
Click to expand...
they didn't leave unscathed
 
So, now very keen to see who gets contracts for next year.

By all accounts Webster, Stocker and Sharman have signed.

I’d be very happy to see Timmy and Jones get at least another year.
According to stavro#4 theres been interest in Timmy and if so he’d probably be offered at least 2 elsewhere. If it comes to the choice I wonder what he would do. After only one game ever at the Swans he’s basically our one club player.

Who else?

And most importantly - although we probably all know - what’s the go with Battle?
 
Thoughts:

  • I completely refute the argument that winning yesterday will have a deleterious effect on our future. Regardless of the cattle argument, Carlton threw the kitchen sink at us (as they should have given the importance of the game) and we still won. Yesterday was finals intensity for four quarters, we lost the lead with no obvious reason to regain it, and kept coming. If you don't see how that will make each of those players better, especially the younger ones, you have an inability to see what is right in front of your face.
  • It's amazing how much Higgins has improved, and how it is all related to his attitude. His ability to work through challenges in games and be selfless (and selfish when required like all good small forwards) in much improved. He keeps going on the same trajectory and plays another 6-7 seasons, we will rate him above Schneider when all is said and done.
  • The harsh brutal call is still to delist Zac Jones, but geebus he's been good the last six weeks.
  • Three of the most beautiful kicks yesterday by Brad Hill. Just gorgeous.
 
Ryan Byrnes has become a real player...has always been fit, desperate and courageous, but now lowers his eyes and uses the ball so well.
Some of his kicks into the corridor would make Nasiah proud.
Well done kid, pushing for that 22nd spot most weeks, but has proved his worth.
 
Diehard Saint said:
I really, really like him. He’s improved every year and gives it everything. Far from being a role player he is becoming an integral part of the 22. His kicking and tackling has improved outtasight.
( What # pick was he? )
Click to expand...

Some of his off the ball stuff is fantastic and often goes unrewarded, so he can go under the radar.

On the weekend I’m pretty sure I saw him gut run past the man in possession to get into space for a down the line receive, where a lot of other players would have hung around for a lateral pass.

He’s brave with the ball in hand and his physicality is getting better every season.

He needs to use his run to get into position to kick more goals (how good was his snap?) to really cement himself as a first picked player.
 
CursingFijian said:
So many valuable lessons learned in that game by a whole band of players.

You can train scenarios as much as you like, but nothing beats the experience of actually trying to implement them in a competitive environment.

And say what you might, Carlton brought some heat early, then late in the third and in the last.

We learned about our system. Players learned about each other and about themselves. Coaches got really good insight into the value of role players as I’m sure did list management.

As a keen watcher that game crystallised for me that Zak Jones absolutely still has value. It’s like he’s morphed into his older brother. His handballing in that game was bordering on exquisite. Not only has he got much to give, but young inside mids like Garcia will learn just by playing alongside him. If we trade him in for Shiel it would be a monumental misstep.
Click to expand...

Great post. I am one of the 'full speed ahead and damn the draft picks' types so I guess a bit of confirmation bias, but I thought it was super valuable that both Wilson and Pou got the chance to kick for a huge game (effectively) late and while they didn't convert, they'll be much better for the experience; and we won anyway!
 
Diehard Saint said:
I really, really like him. He’s improved every year and gives it everything. Far from being a role player he is becoming an integral part of the 22. His kicking and tackling has improved outtasight.
( What # pick was he? )
Click to expand...
He was in the 50's and when i first saw him play he reminded me of a young lachie neale, I was at a scratch match during covid when the rest of the team was up at Noosa and he played a blinder and I thought this kid could be a gun but he never seemed to improve for a year or two but he has finally started to get it all together.
Still not convinced he will ever be a star but he sure is doing more than enough to keep his spot if he can keep playing like he did on the weekend, his tackling still needs to improve but with time it should
 

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Autopsy Round 24, 2024 - Saints defeat Boos

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