Round 3 Trades

[South of the Yarra]

Hurn on anyone’s radar?

 

[stevebbb]

Thanks mate but I should've mentioned without making a trade, as the poster above said. If I can't, then that's definitely an annoying hiccup.

all good, I misread it

Can't do that unfortunately.. it would be very handy

 

[enobrien]

Hurn on anyone’s radar?

Plenty, main guy kicking out of their backline as he always has been. Hibberd > Hurn is so sideways tho.

Definitely a target of mine for sure, after his bye possibly in rd 12

 

[iobjectsir]

Keep moving the goal posts. Next ill have to review ever player from every game for the last three years and compare stats to see if it's deemed fair. If finding 4/4 non tackles paid as tackles in a half isn't adequate evidence he was KOTD nothing will be.

Can you review Bont's game on the weekend for me? He did SFA when the game was well and truly over in the last quarter and somehow got a ton. Disclaimer: I am a Bont owner, and am well aware that he is one of a few players KOTD by Champion Data

 

[ROB Appreciation Page]

Tuohy?

Playing Sicily at F4, can't swing him back without making another trade which IMO is a waste

 

[iobjectsir]

According to CD a tackle isn't a tackle if the player being tackled effectively disposed of the ball

This. People seem to think that wrapping your arms around a player constitutes a tackle / +4, but if the player disposes of it to a teammate, then it will be no tackle. A lot of the time, a simple pressure act that causes a ball to go into dispute / turnover will be classified as a tackle.

 

[TheDutchman]

I'm glad you asked about points, scaling and weighing. My exact argument is that Martin has been scaled up for no good reason, and it shows in his score.
Lets look at Dustys HT to FT SC scores.

1st Half: DT: 80, SC: 84
Stats: Kicks - 13, HB 4, MK 2, Tackle 3, Goals 3, CP 9, CL 6, Clanger 1, DE 70, FF -, FA 1

2nd Half: DT: 47, SC 76
Stats: Kicks - 6, HB 2, MK, 1, Tackle 4, Goals 2, CP 5, CL 1, Clanger 3, DE 87.5, FF -, FA 2

Supercoach 84 | 76
Disposals 17 | 8
Kicks 13 | 6
Handballs 4 | 2
Marks 2 | 1
Tackles 3 | 4
Goals 3 | 2
CP 9 | 5
Clearances 6 | 1
Clanger 1 | 3
DE 70 | 88
Free Against 1 | 2

Now lets go through each of those touches.

Q3. 5 Possessions - 29.5 SC points (should've been 21.5 SC points) - Tigers lose qtr by 10 points
Possession 1 (3 points)
Contested possession (intercepts crow handball) - 3 points
Kick to contest (short) (centre clearance) - 0 points

Possession 2 (9.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Long effective kick to i50 - 5 points
Score assist - 3 points

Possession 3 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Tackle (4 points)
Watch the replay, they call this a tackle on CEY and its clearly not. Shouldn't have gotten points for this

Free Against (-4 points)

One Percenter/Turnover (8 points)
Tackle - 4 points - once again, this wasn't a tackle
Knock on to advantage - 4 points

Possession 4 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Q4. 5 Possessions - 40 SC points (should've been 32 SC points)- Tigers lose qtr by 14 points
Possession 5 (13 points)
Contested mark I50 - 4 points
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 75)

Tackle (4 points)
Third non tackle he is given points for, he TOUCHES CEY's arm and that counts as a tackle apparently

Possession 6 (10.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 82)

Possession 7 (3 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective handball - 1.5 point

Tackle (4 points)
Fourth non-tackle award points, he touches CEY's hips as CEY handballs/falls to the ground

Free Against (0 points)
Hardball Get - 4 points
FA - -4 points

Possession 8 (5.5 points)
Looseball Get - 4 points
Effective handball - 1.5 point


Conclusion:
I can only seem to find 70 SC points for Dusty's second half according to the AFL statistics and their replays. Once you adjust for the three incorrect tackles it should've been 54 points. Yet amazingly he ended up with 76 points for the half!

Now sure, you can argue that the score of his first half contributed to the second half via scaling. And that is a legitimate argument, however, given he was also gifted 16 points from non-existent tackles in one half alone and the fact the Tigers got pumped by 36 and it doesn't appear his second half score had much scaling go the other way I don't buy it.

Remember he had a +33 DT/SC game differential, when other Tigers who had great first halves weren't scaled up by similarly crazy amounts (e.g. Nankervis +10 , Caddy -1). Match winners Josh Jenkins (+1 DT/SC) and Laird (-21 DT/SC) didn't receive super scaling, Dusty's direct opponent CEY copped it hard (-24 DT/SC).

So yes, a +22 SC point half on what he should've scored seems completely off, and that isn't even looking at the first half of the game.
Don't worry though, definitely all in my head and 100% NOT KOTD

I'm bloody tired and emotional after reading all that!

Boss Level post.

 

[DaveyBoy123]

Cogs - Premo at mid tier price, Will never be cheaper.
Bon - Great price but will he be in your final D6? Perfect for a failing premo like Hibberd
Ryan - Good forward rookie but not a must have, Will have scores in the 40s and 50s some weeks.

Depends on your team.
Ryan for cash generation, then Cogs.
Bonner will fade I think as the year goes on, but could be worth the risk.

All are good but it really depends on what ur team needs.
For me personally I have bonner at the top because I would trade naughton to him who I think is at risk of getting dropped.
But if a mid was a prority for me then id jump on Coniglio

Bonner -> Ryan -> Cogs

I think I just got 4 different answers!

Put it this way, it doesn't help that I have Sicily, Langdon, Hibberd, Naughton & Hunter freakin Clark as well.

I don't have the cash to do simple Clark>Ryan & Naughton>Bonner trades. I could take the risk and trade out Brayshaw instead of Clark. Otherwise, it's Hibberd to 2 of Ryan, Bonner or Coniglio, hence the original question.

 

[Suma Magic]

Excellent post.
I hadn't thought of that.
I've played sc since it began.
Can't remember so many rookie priced players averaging over 90 before.
Golden year!

This is my 4th year. My first time going for overall.

I've had a bad start with Libba and Merrett. So basically going for broke. My strategy at the moment is to focus on getting the best players in. If Kelly, Doedee and Finalayson end up as keepers (even as m9/d7) then it save trades. This could mean that avoiding the poor rookies early, and having the best super-premos could be the difference.

As it type this I'm confusing myself haha... I'm not really sure if I'm making any sense.

But personally, I want to get Yeo and Danger ASAP. Then Gray after his bye. If I could get those 3 players in then it would leave me with Doedee/Finlayson d5/6, Kelly m8 and Petracca f6. I've got no memory of how long that will actually take to do.

 

[TheWoodenSlug]

Thinking I might skip Bonner and go:

OUT: Rioli & O'Meara
IN: Cripps & one of the cheap rookies I don't have (English, Murphy, Fogerty, Venables etc)

 

[Red Syrah]

Trading out Lever to Fogarty/OConnor via Finlayson who has been sitting on the mid bench!

This will give me $350K in bank for upgrades.

Only other player considering to move on is Lobb - $2K short of Lobb > Danger.

So,
Option 1: Lobb to Taranto (save $30K and increase avg 30 pts) and then down the track Taranto to Danger
Option 2: Lobb to Fwd keeper (westhoff? Gray? McLean?) - hold off on Danger until rookies on bubble
Option 3: Lobb to mid premo (oliver, selwood, parker) - hold off on Danger until rookies on bubble
Option 4: Josh Kelly to Danger (very sideways but gets Danger in and Kelly 2nd lowest mid avg and fyfe improving)

What do you think?

 

[Sprout]

Zerrett to Oliver is one of the most satisfying sideways rage trades I’ve ever done.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

I'm glad you asked about points, scaling and weighing. My exact argument is that Martin has been scaled up for no good reason, and it shows in his score.
Lets look at Dustys HT to FT SC scores.

1st Half: DT: 80, SC: 84
Stats: Kicks - 13, HB 4, MK 2, Tackle 3, Goals 3, CP 9, CL 6, Clanger 1, DE 70, FF -, FA 1

2nd Half: DT: 47, SC 76
Stats: Kicks - 6, HB 2, MK, 1, Tackle 4, Goals 2, CP 5, CL 1, Clanger 3, DE 87.5, FF -, FA 2

Supercoach 84 | 76
Disposals 17 | 8
Kicks 13 | 6
Handballs 4 | 2
Marks 2 | 1
Tackles 3 | 4
Goals 3 | 2
CP 9 | 5
Clearances 6 | 1
Clanger 1 | 3
DE 70 | 88
Free Against 1 | 2

Now lets go through each of those touches.

Q3. 5 Possessions - 29.5 SC points (should've been 21.5 SC points) - Tigers lose qtr by 10 points
Possession 1 (3 points)
Contested possession (intercepts crow handball) - 3 points
Kick to contest (short) (centre clearance) - 0 points

Possession 2 (9.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Long effective kick to i50 - 5 points
Score assist - 3 points

Possession 3 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Tackle (4 points)
Watch the replay, they call this a tackle on CEY and its clearly not. Shouldn't have gotten points for this

Free Against (-4 points)

One Percenter/Turnover (8 points)
Tackle - 4 points - once again, this wasn't a tackle
Knock on to advantage - 4 points

Possession 4 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Q4. 5 Possessions - 40 SC points (should've been 32 SC points)- Tigers lose qtr by 14 points
Possession 5 (13 points)
Contested mark I50 - 4 points
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 75)

Tackle (4 points)
Third non tackle he is given points for, he TOUCHES CEY's arm and that counts as a tackle apparently

Possession 6 (10.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 82)

Possession 7 (3 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective handball - 1.5 point

Tackle (4 points)
Fourth non-tackle award points, he touches CEY's hips as CEY handballs/falls to the ground

Free Against (0 points)
Hardball Get - 4 points
FA - -4 points

Possession 8 (5.5 points)
Looseball Get - 4 points
Effective handball - 1.5 point


Conclusion:
I can only seem to find 70 SC points for Dusty's second half according to the AFL statistics and their replays. Once you adjust for the three incorrect tackles it should've been 54 points. Yet amazingly he ended up with 76 points for the half!

Now sure, you can argue that the score of his first half contributed to the second half via scaling. And that is a legitimate argument, however, given he was also gifted 16 points from non-existent tackles in one half alone and the fact the Tigers got pumped by 36 and it doesn't appear his second half score had much scaling go the other way I don't buy it.

Remember he had a +33 DT/SC game differential, when other Tigers who had great first halves weren't scaled up by similarly crazy amounts (e.g. Nankervis +10 , Caddy -1). Match winners Josh Jenkins (+1 DT/SC) and Laird (-21 DT/SC) didn't receive super scaling, Dusty's direct opponent CEY copped it hard (-24 DT/SC).

So yes, a +22 SC point half on what he should've scored seems completely off, and that isn't even looking at the first half of the game.
Don't worry though, definitely all in my head and 100% NOT KOTD

Mods please move to conspiracies board.

 

[Better Loosen Up]

Trading out Lever to Fogarty/OConnor via Finlayson who has been sitting on the mid bench!

This will give me $350K in bank for upgrades.

Only other player considering to move on is Lobb - $2K short of Lobb > Danger.

So,
Option 1: Lobb to Taranto (save $30K and increase avg 30 pts) and then down the track Taranto to Danger
Option 2: Lobb to Fwd keeper (westhoff? Gray? McLean?) - hold off on Danger until rookies on bubble
Option 3: Lobb to mid premo (oliver, selwood, parker) - hold off on Danger until rookies on bubble
Option 4: Josh Kelly to Danger (very sideways but gets Danger in and Kelly 2nd lowest mid avg and fyfe improving)

What do you think?

Too many options

 

[Better Loosen Up]

I think I just got 4 different answers!

Put it this way, it doesn't help that I have Sicily, Langdon, Hibberd, Naughton & Hunter freakin Clark as well.

I don't have the cash to do simple Clark>Ryan & Naughton>Bonner trades. I could take the risk and trade out Brayshaw instead of Clark. Otherwise, it's Hibberd to 2 of Ryan, Bonner or Coniglio, hence the original question.

This is where you need to make your own decision and live with it like a big boy!

 

[Better Loosen Up]

So with Cyril to LLam Ryan, that leaves me with around 215k. The following I've already done Byrne to Ryan (Freo). I've benched Crouch as I have had Holman on the bench.

My other options are Crouch --> Danger
Or Byrne ----> Marchbank

Any thoughts?

View attachment 478472

Danger

 

[Andrew Birch]

Sicily suspension has forced my trading hand. Loopholing Murray/Murphy for D6. Assuming Kreuzer plays this week...

1 mid-pricer sideways trade (Dunkley > Bonner)
1 rookie correction trade (Naughton > L Ryan)

Increases my upgrade war chest (AKA get Danger) to 419k

 

[Edmund hunt]

Hibberd > Hurn
Dahlhaus > Lynch or Kennedy
yay or nay
if nay any better options?

 

[TiggerMan22]

Keep moving the goal posts. Next ill have to review ever player from every game for the last three years and compare stats to see if it's deemed fair. If finding 4/4 non tackles paid as tackles in a half isn't adequate evidence he was KOTD nothing will be.

Not moving any goal posts. The goal posts for proving bias are always been in the same place, you've just been kicking out on the full.
By your logic if I find any player that has a couple of stats I personally think they shouldnt have got, then the champion data stat keepers are biased towards them. LMAO.

 

[Red Syrah]

Westhoff a likely keeper?

 

[benji21]

Clark/dow to parfitt/CEY??

 

[vast]

250k Players - Allen Christensen, Riley Bonner, Zac Fisher & Scott Lycett (Lol)

I feel like having more than 2 250k rookie is a bit much. Unless you forsee them hitting 400k to 'Step Ladder' you are better off using the money on a premo or a 117k rookie to generate faster cash.

I really do like Fisher as a player, beautiful clean hands, nice left peg, great goal sense and has a great JS down at the blues. (Could be my Carlton Bias)

400k would be great but ill even take 350k and a quicker cull to get Danger sooner plus better on field scoring options until then.

What role is fisher playing?

Looking at his stats seems to be betting some midfield time at least on a wing.

 

[Hai_Newman]

This is my 4th year. My first time going for overall.

I've had a bad start with Libba and Merrett. So basically going for broke. My strategy at the moment is to focus on getting the best players in. If Kelly, Doedee and Finalayson end up as keepers (even as m9/d7) then it save trades. This could mean that avoiding the poor rookies early, and having the best super-premos could be the difference.

As it type this I'm confusing myself haha... I'm not really sure if I'm making any sense.

But personally, I want to get Yeo and Danger ASAP. Then Gray after his bye. If I could get those 3 players in then it would leave me with Doedee/Finlayson d5/6, Kelly m8 and Petracca f6. I've got no memory of how long that will actually take to do.

With this year crop of rolled gold rookies, not too long I would imagine.

 

[vast]

I'm glad you asked about points, scaling and weighing. My exact argument is that Martin has been scaled up for no good reason, and it shows in his score.
Lets look at Dustys HT to FT SC scores.

1st Half: DT: 80, SC: 84
Stats: Kicks - 13, HB 4, MK 2, Tackle 3, Goals 3, CP 9, CL 6, Clanger 1, DE 70, FF -, FA 1

2nd Half: DT: 47, SC 76
Stats: Kicks - 6, HB 2, MK, 1, Tackle 4, Goals 2, CP 5, CL 1, Clanger 3, DE 87.5, FF -, FA 2

Supercoach 84 | 76
Disposals 17 | 8
Kicks 13 | 6
Handballs 4 | 2
Marks 2 | 1
Tackles 3 | 4
Goals 3 | 2
CP 9 | 5
Clearances 6 | 1
Clanger 1 | 3
DE 70 | 88
Free Against 1 | 2

Now lets go through each of those touches.

Q3. 5 Possessions - 29.5 SC points (should've been 21.5 SC points) - Tigers lose qtr by 10 points
Possession 1 (3 points)
Contested possession (intercepts crow handball) - 3 points
Kick to contest (short) (centre clearance) - 0 points

Possession 2 (9.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Long effective kick to i50 - 5 points
Score assist - 3 points

Possession 3 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 points
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Tackle (4 points)
Watch the replay, they call this a tackle on CEY and its clearly not. Shouldn't have gotten points for this

Free Against (-4 points)

One Percenter/Turnover (8 points)
Tackle - 4 points - once again, this wasn't a tackle
Knock on to advantage - 4 points

Possession 4 (4.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective kick (short) - 3 points

Q4. 5 Possessions - 40 SC points (should've been 32 SC points)- Tigers lose qtr by 14 points
Possession 5 (13 points)
Contested mark I50 - 4 points
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 75)

Tackle (4 points)
Third non tackle he is given points for, he TOUCHES CEY's arm and that counts as a tackle apparently

Possession 6 (10.5 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Kick - 3 points
Goal - 6 points (Score after goal - 91 v 82)

Possession 7 (3 points)
Uncontested handball receive - 1.5 point
Effective handball - 1.5 point

Tackle (4 points)
Fourth non-tackle award points, he touches CEY's hips as CEY handballs/falls to the ground

Free Against (0 points)
Hardball Get - 4 points
FA - -4 points

Possession 8 (5.5 points)
Looseball Get - 4 points
Effective handball - 1.5 point


Conclusion:
I can only seem to find 70 SC points for Dusty's second half according to the AFL statistics and their replays. Once you adjust for the three incorrect tackles it should've been 54 points. Yet amazingly he ended up with 76 points for the half!

Now sure, you can argue that the score of his first half contributed to the second half via scaling. And that is a legitimate argument, however, given he was also gifted 16 points from non-existent tackles in one half alone and the fact the Tigers got pumped by 36 and it doesn't appear his second half score had much scaling go the other way I don't buy it.

Remember he had a +33 DT/SC game differential, when other Tigers who had great first halves weren't scaled up by similarly crazy amounts (e.g. Nankervis +10 , Caddy -1). Match winners Josh Jenkins (+1 DT/SC) and Laird (-21 DT/SC) didn't receive super scaling, Dusty's direct opponent CEY copped it hard (-24 DT/SC).

So yes, a +22 SC point half on what he should've scored seems completely off, and that isn't even looking at the first half of the game.
Don't worry though, definitely all in my head and 100% NOT KOTD

You should review Dangers last qtr yesterday there was some definite KOTD there. I know you get extra for contested possessions but a fair amount were also also ineffectve but he got full value for them.

 

[DERIBERATE]

I wanted to hold trades early but Hibberd is pissing me off something chronic