Game Day Suns out Guns out - Crows V Suns

[beartoo]

14 wins 37 losses. He's had enough rope to hang himself with by now.

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[cmndstab]

Thing is, he's right, at this stage it's not about wins and losses. It's about seeing improvement, getting good structures in place, getting the youth involved, etc.

Which is why it's so frustrating to see us constantly react to expected losses by bringing back the old guard, and refusing to use our youth in the roles they will be playing when we're actually good again (if ever!)

Nicks' job right now is to sell hope and visions of the future to the fans, and for whatever reason he's either unwilling or unable to do it.

 

[LeftyLuke]

Thing is, he's right, at this stage it's not about wins and losses. It's about seeing improvement, getting good structures in place, getting the youth involved, etc.

Which is why it's so frustrating to see us constantly react to expected losses by bringing back the old guard, and refusing to use our youth in the roles they will be playing when we're actually good again (if ever!)

Nicks' job right now is to sell hope and visions of the future to the fans, and for whatever reason he's either unwilling or unable to do it.

Nicks job is to teach the players how to play. Selling the club isn't his role. Wins will do that.

 

[WetCrow1991]

Well we finally got rid of Mackay. That’s the same thing isn’t it.

But we didn't want to get rid of him.

 

[maxlilly]

Media getting stuck into DeGoey for going to Bali and having some fun. I bet he cones back in great form.


Doedee holidayed on the Gold Coast during the break. His worst game of the year.

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Hahahaha

 

[LeftyLuke]

Media getting stuck into DeGoey for going to Bali and having some fun. I bet he cones back in great form.


Doedee holidayed on the Gold Coast during the break. His worst game of the year.

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DeGoey just having a bit of fun. That's a total non story.

 

[cmndstab]

Nicks job is to teach the players how to play. Selling the club isn't his role. Wins will do that.

The players already know how to play. And to the extent that there are deficiencies in their individual games, that is the job of the line coaches.

Nicks' job is to set the overall direction of the club, to head up strategic and structural planning, and to make the tough calls when they need to be made. He is the one who decides whether we're going to take one step back today in order to move several steps forward in the future by giving our youth more responsibility, or if we're going to just play the established senior players in their preferred roles because that is most likely to give us a win today. That's a balancing act that depends (or should depend) on how the club is going, whether we're in a premiership window, and so on. That might be a difficult choice if we're 8th on the ladder... but not when we're in the bottom four and have been for years.

If the fans/media turn on the club, the coach is the one who ends up in the gun. It is absolutely part of his job to sell the club - a big part. At the moment, we're not winning games, even when we put all of our most experienced players in their preferred roles. The only thing that Nicks can sell is hope for the future.

 

[LeftyLuke]

The players already know how to play. And to the extent that there are deficiencies in their individual games, that is the job of the line coaches.

Nicks' job is to set the overall direction of the club, to head up strategy and structural planning, and to make the tough calls when they need to be made. He is the one who decides whether we're going to take one step back in order to move several steps forward by giving our youth more responsibility, or if we're going to just play the established senior players in their preferred roles because that is most likely to give us a win today. That's a balancing act that depends (or should depend) on how the club is going, whether we're in a premiership window, and so on. That might be a difficult choice if we're 8th on the ladder... but not when we're in the bottom four and have been for years.

I don't think he is teaching them how to play. The same mistakes they were making two years ago are still present. I'm no professional coach but I can see their game plan stinks. He should focus on getting them to play a brand of footy that can improve the team as he is quickly running out of time. That performance today was embarrassing.

 

[Afcprophet]

I think you’ll find his win rate in one on one defence was better than Butts today

Intercept marks are for Doedee and Dawson

If you want to go and spend capital on a key defender go for it

I’ll take him and butts and go and get some mids and classy forwards

Where did you find his one on one win percentage? That's also entirely missing the point of what I'm saying. Defence isn't about one on ones anymore... And hasn't been for about 20 years. Do you seriously think he'll play any role in a premiership? He stinks.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Where did you find his one on one win percentage? That's also entirely missing the point of what I'm saying. Defence isn't about one on ones anymore... And hasn't been for about 20 years. Do you seriously think he'll play any role in a premiership? He stinks.

It’s a funny hill to die on

But no … I don’t think he will play in a premiership

Because none of our current players will

If you go watch the game properly you’ll see his main match up is Casboult who although kicking 3 goals only has 5 possessions from 61 x I50s

And no , he doesn’t stink . He’s a 10 game 2nd year shut down tall defender in a sh1t team that we got for nothing doing a fair job

It’s like blaming Kyle Hartigan for losing the 2017 grand final , literally the least of our worries

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Just….terrible from our experienced defenders tonight.. But let’s be honest, problems all over the ground.

I said we never should have dropped Frampton. He had one deplorable game against Carlton, but there’s been a fair few KPF’s who’ve had their colours lowered by the McKay/Curnow combination. I know a lot of people are happy for a spoiling defender who does nothing else in the game but we already have one of those in Butts. Look at all the best teams and there’s generally one lock down spoiling defender, and there are playmakers down there. Where is our Vlaustuin or Tom Stewart, modern day defenders that can lock down forwards, intercept, and rack up possessions back there by being constantly involved and getting the ball going forward.


Parnell was excellent. Desperately needing the quality in passing displayed by him.

GC scored 13 goals 7 from intercepts, 9 of those in our own half, and most of those errors were from experienced players in Smith, Dawson and Doedee, with Doedee having what was probably his worst game ever, closely followed by Smith, who are both far behind their best.

We are lacking real speed out of the contest, but more importantly we have no speedy players linking up from the Half Back position to assist through the middle. Smith, for all his Metres gained, seemed rooted in the Half Back, and Hamill has all the tools to be a great player but seems lost in being able to read the game, and the play.

Rachele brought back a game too early, Thilthorpe, Milera, McHenry, Keays unable to have any effect during the game, but with only 42 Inside 50’s we’re not really giving forward a chance.

It shows the complete lack of faith we have in our defensive set up that we can’t release Dawson further up the ground.

Our skills are terrible. You’ve got to wonder whether we’re so worried about our field kicking that players have been told to handball it, we lead handballs 195-108 during the game and it’s the sort of stat you don’t want that high. Just a complete overuse that caused turnovers and goals against us. Laird & Crouch loading up on absolute junk disposals, with all GC’s mids under 30 disposals but way more damaging

Who comes in for Thilthorpe?

Bring in McAsey I’d say. Give him a go, can’t be any worse than Tilly and Himmelberg at the moment.


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Yep time to give Mcasey a game for Thilthorpe

Time to release Dawson , The opposition are relieved that they don’t have to counter him further up field

 

[jackster83]

From today's pathetic effort .....WOW, I haven't the words to discuss the absolute festering mess, our midfield and defense is ......truly pathetic and any thought of teamwork should be eliminated from any discussion on this team

Will say, Smith is getting paid under false pretences ....and has been for a month ....looks utterly disinterested

My view of ROB and Crouch was simply validated today ......crap !

Are you ready to admit that we're shit yet?

 

[George Kramer]

Are you ready to admit that we're s**t yet?

It’s been updated to Really Shit. I wonder how many reallys I can get in as the season goes on.

 

[WaynesWorld19]

Are you ready to admit that we're s**t yet?

NO ......I am saying yesterdays game by us was shit though

 

[AFC979810]

I said we never should have dropped Frampton. He had one deplorable game against Carlton, but there’s been a fair few KPF’s who’ve had their colours lowered by the McKay/Curnow combination. I know a lot of people are happy for a spoiling defender who does nothing else in the game but we already have one of those in Butts. Look at all the best teams and there’s generally one lock down spoiling defender, and there are playmakers down there. Where is our Vlaustuin or Tom Stewart, modern day defenders that can lock down forwards, intercept, and rack up possessions back there by being constantly involved and getting the ball going forward.

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I completely understand Frampton's limitations and how his 1 on 1 defending isn't up to standard.

But what is continually overlooked in Defense is the group as a whole. Sure Murray and Butts are both better defenders but both players combined for 16 touches and 4 rebound 50's and 275 meters gained with 2 score involvements against Gold Coast. Having two players that are less than worthless with the ball in their hands really limits the way we can move the football.

Frampton in his last game against Carlton where he was dropped had 15 touches, 7 rebound 50's and 389 meters gained with 4 score involvements.

As a team we are much better off looking like this next week:

Parnell Butts Doedee
Smith Frampton Hinge

 

[Danger in Texas]

I completely understand Frampton's limitations and how his 1 on 1 defending isn't up to standard.

But what is continually overlooked in Defense is the group as a whole. Sure Murray and Butts are both better defenders but both players combined for 16 touches and 4 rebound 50's and 275 meters gained with 2 score involvements against Gold Coast. Having two players that are less than worthless with the ball in their hands really limits the way we can move the football.

Frampton in his last game against Carlton where he was dropped had 15 touches, 7 rebound 50's and 389 meters gained with 4 score involvements.

As a team we are much better off looking like this next week:

Parnell Butts Doedee
Smith Frampton Hinge

I don't see a problem with persisting with two negating defenders, as long as those surrounding them are attacking. We made a grand final with two guys who were primarily negators in Talia and Hartigan

 

[AFC979810]

I don't see a problem with persisting with two negating defenders, as long as those surrounding them are attacking. We made a grand final with two guys who were primarily negators in Talia and Hartigan

I think the game has changed since 2017 and its easier to get away with two negating defenders when the rest of your team is absolutely stacked.

 

[FR0GGY]

Development development development
Who has got better since they arrived?
Jones - nope
Thilthorpe - nope
Pedlar - - nope
McHenry - nope
Mcasey - nope
Doedee - currently going backwards fast
Himmelberg- no
Rowe - no
Milera - no
Billy - no
Fog - on the fence but positive signs
Gollant - possibly
Berry - yes
Butts - yes
Crouch - going backwards at a rate of knots
Davis - no
Hamill - yes
Hately - no
Parnell - yes
Schoenberg- disaster of a year
Sholl - gone backwards
Worrell - who would know the coach’s don’t seem to know he exists.
Soligo - looks promising

 

[George Kramer]

Development development development
Who has got better since they arrived?
Jones - nope
Thilthorpe - nope
Pedlar - - nope
McHenry - nope
Mcasey - nope
Doedee - currently going backwards fast
Himmelberg- no
Rowe - no
Milera - no
Billy - no
Fog - on the fence but positive signs
Gollant - possibly
Berry - yes
Butts - yes
Crouch - going backwards at a rate of knots
Davis - no
Hamill - yes
Hately - no
Parnell - yes
Schoenberg- disaster of a year
Sholl - gone backwards
Worrell - who would know the coach’s don’t seem to know he exists.
Soligo - looks promising

Who was it that posted that we focus on players deficiencies and not their strengths? Drugs Are Bad Mackay? Bearded Clam maybe? That would part explain it. As would a shitty game plan they are required to play, roles that they are not suited for, lack of game time, prefferencing senior players and generally crap drafting.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

I don't see a problem with persisting with two negating defenders, as long as those surrounding them are attacking. We made a grand final with two guys who were primarily negators in Talia and Hartigan

This.....right here....is our number 1 problem. No offence but we have recruiters, selectors and supporters who don't seem to understand that the game quickly evolves. There is simply no need for 2 dour key defenders in a squad. Richmond have barely run with any, and teams like Geelong recruit smart in getting players who can cover ground quickly, who play taller than their height, and are play makers. Even Melbourne only has Steven May as a true KPD, and even he manages to get into double digits with his disposals regularly.

We keep recruiting like it's 1982, and it shows. We are incredibly slow both in terms of movement of players themselves and moving the ball along decisively/accurately.