News Thomas and Keefe - 2 year ban - Trade, De-List, Rookie

[Yidaki]

I'm now thinking of going vegan.

No need if you eat organic.

 

[Soaring Magpie]

So if Thomas and Keefe claim the only thing they can think of that would explain this would be getting it from meat what would they have to do to prove innocence?

Surely they can write up a listing of all the places they ate out.

I didn't like the Collingwood presser. They wanted to shift blame away from the club instead of defending the boys.

Wrong...of course they want to make a statement that it didn't come from the football club.
They also stated they would support the boys however it was something totally out of the clubs control. Naturally they are going to defend the brand

 

[speedytiger]

So if Thomas and Keefe claim the only thing they can think of that would explain this would be getting it from meat what would they have to do to prove innocence?

Surely they can write up a listing of all the places they ate out.

I didn't like the Collingwood presser. They wanted to shift blame away from the club instead of defending the boys.

Sometimes you have to step out of the us against the world bunker and do what's right

 

[Stax on the mill]

So if Thomas and Keefe claim the only thing they can think of that would explain this would be getting it from meat what would they have to do to prove innocence?

Surely they can write up a listing of all the places they ate out.

I didn't like the Collingwood presser. They wanted to shift blame away from the club instead of defending the boys.

No basis at this stage until all facts come out on which they could defend players. All they can really say is " presumption of innocence etc, etc". Club could end up looking really stupid if they went off half cocked and players were subsequently found to be fully culpable.

 

[ace andy]

The chances of them being innocent is ridiculously small. Realistically why should the club stick their neck out to protect the reputations of two players who are most probably lying. If we did that we would just be the same as Essendon. Of course they aren't going to come out and say 'yeah you got me'.

The club should just say the facts of the situation and thats it. No defending them or criticising them and grandstanding.The let the facts speak for themselves.

 

[BoxMatrix]

Have you been living under a rock for the past 3-4 years? Drugs drugs drugs more drugs, betting accusations, shithouse integrity, 2 years to sort out this Essendon bullshit? Essendon claiming they haven't done anything wrong when Jobe Watson straight out said he took what wasn't supposed to be taken, then they went back on there word, its taking 2 years to sort that crap out, now this and even more clubs yet to get involved. There's a rapid increase in the drugs theme in the AFL, all this 3 strikes bullcrap, sweeping everything under a carpet like nothing has ever happened and you're telling me the AFL isn't going under?

Riddle me this. Why is the AFL working so frantically to get better atmosphere at games? I'll tell you why, because its slowing dying and they're trying to get more arses on seats. The game we all love is changing, all for the worst.

Football is the number 1 sport in all but two states in Australia. Last year in South Australia was a great example of how the game has grown. 50,000 to each game in Adelaide has shown that the game is gaining massive support. The AFL has only made these gameday "changes" in Victoria due to the low crowds last year. Nowhere outside of Victoria had below average crowds last year...

As I said, drugs are apart of sports, like it or not. The AFL has made a mess of the Essendon saga, but those bomber flogs are not helping the cause either. More drug allegations will emerge in the future. The AFL just needs to evolve with modern sport.

 

[Mkcaptain]

He actually looks like his on the gear, geez hope not!

More like he doesn't need to use it

 

[jmac70]

I didn't like the Collingwood presser. They wanted to shift blame away from the club instead of defending the boys.

I suspect the club is pretty sure the boys are to blame.

 

[Finnishpie]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

 

[jmac70]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

I would say it is taken at the same time.

 

[legendstatus]

Agreed. None of this makes sense unless those two have a combined IQ of about 10...

Or worse an Essendon footballer?

 

[Art Corvelay]

Football is the number 1 sport in all but two states in Australia. Last year in South Australia was a great example of how the game has grown. 50,000 to each game in Adelaide has shown that the game is gaining massive support. The AFL has only made these gameday "changes" in Victoria due to the low crowds last year. Nowhere outside of Victoria had below average crowds last year...

Port suddenly being competitive is hardly something for the AFL to crow about in SA. Just means fans are fickle.

 

[Jade]

It's a shit of a thing.

Here's hoping that either:

a) the B sample comes back negative
-or-
b) this is dealt with in a swift manner

No one wants this bloody thing gone from the game more than EFC fans I suspect.

If I can offer any advice, its to let the facts play out.

Take it easy all.

 

[Black_White]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

Taken at the same time.
From the same batch of test material.
Why it takes another two weeks to test it though has me stumped.

 

[Vicky Park]

If the boys knowingly did this - and we dont know that yet - after all the club and AFL wide education programs and publicity about this topic, it emphasises how they are under enormous pressure to perform. Frightening really, to take that risk.

 

[Smokeyr67]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

Taken at the same time, they just use a different container to rule out contamination - i.e. you urinate in a cup, stop mid stream and go into another, all the while a tester is watching you.

 

[Kirby]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

It's definitely taken at the same time, but put in a different container and sealed separately. I'm also fairly certain that when they test a B sample it is sent to a different lab so that there can be no doubt of contamination in the testing process.
It's why there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that the B sample will be clear unless the testing itself was contaminating the sample because they stuffed up in the lab.
I think the chances are about 99.5% likely the B test will also be positive.

 

[Pedro]

Seriously if I had an opportunity at AFL level I'd be the most boring player off field ever, probably wouldn't leave home!!

You say that though as someone who lives in the real world. Not as a kid who goes into a system and is introduced to all these things and wants to fit in. I hear what you're saying and absolutely agree, but as they say, you can't put an old head on young shoulders

 

[ClaytonM]

I don't think the club believes they are innocent and I imagine the club will be doing everything possible to ensure that the players move on pretty quickly from this. There is a chance that Thomas and Keeffe may have a change of heart over the next couple of days and admit their guilt.

So you have found then guilty already. How about we let the process run its course before we get the Hangman.

 

[legendstatus]

Alberto Contador tested positive to 50 picograms of clenbuterol - 0.000000000005 grams - 400 times lower than the minimum level required by WADA. There are laboratories that can detect extraordinarily small quantities - perhaps not in Australia, but it is possible. He used the contaminated steak defence, but he still got a 2-year ban.

B sample is taken at exactly the same time as the A sample. It's just one sample split into 2 containers, sealed, and labelled A and B. Very, very rarely does the B sample produce a different result to the A sample.

So basically two A samples in different jars label sample A and sample B?

 

[pablo disco bar]

What a dissapointing day....needed these two players to step up....I think collingwood carrer us over.....so much time and effort put into both players

 

[ace andy]

It's definitely taken at the same time, but put in a different container and sealed separately. I'm also fairly certain that when they test a B sample it is sent to a different lab so that there can be no doubt of contamination in the testing process.
It's why there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that the B sample will be clear unless the testing itself was contaminating the sample because they stuffed up in the lab.
I think the chances are about 99.5% likely the B test will also be positive.

If you take the odds of a B sample test being wrong as 0.5%. Then the odds that both tests are wrong (since you would assume they are both guilty or both innocent) becomes 0.5% *0.5% which equals 0.0025%.

 

[Boris the Contradiction]

So can someone explain the B-sample to me. Is the sample taken at the same time, or at another time? So is it just to reconfirm the initial result? Or is it possible the drug might be out of their system between the two?

The samples are taken at the same time but tested at different times to "prove" the initial result is not due to contamination or testing error. It is an evidence strengthening exercise and in practice just about always confirms the initial result. As I said, that is the point.

 

[Moe B]

Tha

You say that though as someone who lives in the real world. Not as a kid who goes into a system and is introduced to all these things and wants to fit in. I hear what you're saying and absolutely agree, but as they say, you can't put an old head on young shoulders

That is very true!

 

[Ricky90]

Far out - I'm not trawling through 25 pages.

If you're wondering what the drug clenbuterol is, I'll brief you: It's a bronchodilator, which is basically the same as what's in an asthma puffer. However this particular version is made for race horses. The side effects are increased heart rate which aids in burning fat. It also promotes the use of stored fat to use as fuel rather than carbohydrates or glycogen stores. Those two side effects work in tandem to create a pretty potent fat burner for the human body, and therefore in sport, it's used as a fat burner rather than a bronchodilator. Been illegal for a very long time.

If you're wondering why the would want to take it: It's pretty simple. They wanted to reduce their skin folds quicker. With clenbuterol, you can effectively do the same amount of work but burn more calories, thanks to the increased heart rate and fat use, as mentioned above.

If you're wondering why they thought they could get away with it: I'm sorry but I don't have that answer for you. It's been illegal for a very long time. You can only source it through drug dealers and veterinarians. I'm willing to bet they got their clen from someone very dodgy.

If you're wondering what they should have taken: There are so many legal supplements they could have bought over the counter to aid in fat loss. Heck, I'd even go as far as taking a caffeine supplement the morning of skin fold testing. It will reduce water weight and help you come in leaner for your test.

I don't know what they were thinking, but they've got to go. They've sorely disappointed me and they've let the entire extended family of the Collingwood Football Club down. Good riddance to them both.

For the record, they didn't eat contaminated meat. Clenbuterol doesn't work like that. If they get off citing that, I'll be incredibly surprised.