List Mgmt. Trade & F.A. 2017 (if a scenario sounds wrong - read on before posting)

[danielnajdek]

At the same time though or were people only suggesting to trade one of them?

Do you really want me to go through and quote every single person. How about you go look through the last 8 pages and see for yourself.

Even suggesting we trade Treloar and Pendlebury is dumb. Our 2 best players. And I'm not sure why people are raging so much over Adams disposal. We all knew he was terrible in the first year for us. So doesn't surprise me when he turns the ball over.

 

[DaVe86]

The top seven to eight players are pretty good. We are going to get a very good player at 4/5.
No particular order my likes.
Rayner (187 cm)
Davies-Uniacke (189 cm)
Fogarty (193 cm)
Ballenden (198 cm)
Brander (194 cm)
Stephenson (189 cm)
Higgins (178 cm)
O'Brien (184 cm)
Sutherland (195 cm)
Clark (186 cm)
CCJ (199 cm)

I would be pretty disappointed to trade out a top 5 pick this year. We haven't had a top pick in a while as we've invested heavily in trades.

I'd actually like a really classy outside ball user with speed if we have a top 5 pick. Someone like a Stephen Hill or Josh Kelly. I know it adds to our already over-stocked midfield, but it's the sort of player we lack to be honest.

The dream scenario would then be to attract Sam Reid via FA so we don't lose our top pick. Then you can usually pick up a quality crumbing forward at a 2nd round pick.

 

[wicksy]

Do you really want me to go through and quote every single person. How about you go look through the last 8 pages and see for yourself.

Even suggesting we trade Treloar and Pendlebury is dumb. Our 2 best players. And I'm not sure why people are raging so much over Adams disposal. We all knew he was terrible in the first year for us. So doesn't surprise me when he turns the ball over.

Your post suggested that people were crazy because they wanted to trade all 3 of them.
I don't think anyone has suggested to trade all 3.
If Collingwood traded Treloar and managed to get a Hipwood, Patton, Lynch, Cameron type, I would be ecstatic.

 

[Apex36]

RE: Adams.... 14 possessions in the first quarter... 10 clangers. That's not 1 or 2 turnovers.
Let me ask you.... Given our current list profile, if GC offered a trade of Tom Lynch for Treloar, would you do it?

You know that there are other ways to get clangers besides turnovers right?

Not defending Adams' performance this week, but simply pointing to the clangers stat as evidence of lots of turnovers is completely flawed.

 

[wicksy]

You know that there are other ways to get clangers besides turnovers right?

Not defending Adams' performance this week, but simply pointing to the clangers stat as evidence of lots of turnovers is completely flawed.

And at the same time, i'm not suggesting we trade him because of one quarter. It's just an example.
The Queen's B'day game was the most critical in my opinion. Twice, he destroyed our momentum by attempting a ridiculous kick in the centre of the ground which he completely shanked and led to two easy goals.

He wasn't the only reason we lost that game but he was damn important in it.

 

[Apex36]

And at the same time, i'm not suggesting we trade him because of one quarter. It's just an example.
The Queen's B'day game was the most critical in my opinion. Twice, he destroyed our momentum by attempting a ridiculous kick in the centre of the ground which he completely shanked and led to two easy goals.

He wasn't the only reason we lost that game but he was damn important in it.

There were plenty worse than Adams on the QB game too though. He cops heat because of his foot skills, but honestly he's trying to do what other more skilled players should be doing because we have poor structures and lazy players who don't work hard on the outside. End result is he picks up the slack because he's one of the few we have who is actually willing to put in the work and run hard all day.

 

[wicksy]

There were plenty worse than Adams on the QB game too though. He cops heat because of his foot skills, but honestly he's trying to do what other more skilled players should be doing because we have poor structures and lazy players who don't work hard on the outside. End result is he picks up the slack because he's one of the few we have who is actually willing to put in the work and run hard all day.

You'd be great in PR.

 

[Apex36]

You'd be great in PR.

Quality response. Would read again.

 

[wicksy]

Quality response. Would read again.

Likewise. Very concise. Less spin though.

 

[Leviathan Pie]

There were plenty worse than Adams on the QB game too though. He cops heat because of his foot skills, but honestly he's trying to do what other more skilled players should be doing because we have poor structures and lazy players who don't work hard on the outside. End result is he picks up the slack because he's one of the few we have who is actually willing to put in the work and run hard all day.

If its that systemic, then thats another appalling failure from Nathan Buckley.

Personally, I think Adams needs to spend a week in the twos. He's been deplorable of late.

 

[Apex36]

If its that systemic, then thats another appalling failure from Nathan Buckley.

Absolutely. There no doubt he needs to go now. He has a good football brain, but in his desperation to create a winning game style I think he's neglecting the basics. If the club has any initiative they should be finalizing a shortlist of candidates already.

Personally, I think Adams needs to spend a week in the twos. He's been deplorable of late.

It probably wouldn't hurt. Honestly we should be putting the cue in the rack now. Get Treloar off to have surgery because his groin is clearly knackered, keep JDG in the middle for the rest of the year as our main clearance mid, and don't even think about playing guys like Blair again regardless of form. Experience for our younger players is more important now.

 

[Leviathan Pie]

Absolutely. There no doubt he needs to go now. He has a good football brain, but in his desperation to create a winning game style I think he's neglecting the basics. If the club has any initiative they should be finalizing a shortlist of candidates already.

It probably wouldn't hurt. Honestly we should be putting the cue in the rack now. Get Treloar off to have surgery because his groin is clearly knackered, keep JDG in the middle for the rest of the year as our main clearance mid, and don't even think about playing guys like Blair again regardless of form. Experience for our younger players is more important now.

Thumbs up to both statements.

 

[Magpie Monopoly]

Yeah but we're not missing star quality. DeGoey is going to be a star.
Our list profile is hugely out of kilter and needs to be fixed before we can go anywhere.
It'd be like having a starting 5 of Curry, Paul, Westbrook, Irving and Jeff Teague. Surely you trade one of them for a centre right? You might lose the trade but it's done on a needs basis.

I 100% agree with that analogy, our list management is lopsided with too many mid's, im just of the mindset we shop Jeff Teague before we shop Westbrook or Curry. I think Sidebottom is the one who needs to be moved on. A young core of Adams, Treloar and De Goey is lethal and other clubs would kill for that, Sidey is getting on and should be shipped while he still has value.

I don't think we need to sell the farm in the pursuit of Tom Lynch. Using the analogy before, i don't think we need to be chasing Karl Anthony-Towns, i think we need a solid big not a superstar. If we could trade Sidey and a Future First (the years pick will be too high) for someone like a Patton or Lobb from GWS, or even just Sidey and a second for Ben Brown would be ideal.

 

[wicksy]

I 100% agree with that analogy, our list management is lopsided with too many mid's, im just of the mindset we shop Jeff Teague before we shop Westbrook or Curry. I think Sidebottom is the one who needs to be moved on. A young core of Adams, Treloar and De Goey is lethal and other clubs would kill for that, Sidey is getting on and should be shipped while he still has value.

I don't think we need to sell the farm in the pursuit of Tom Lynch. Using the analogy before, i don't think we need to be chasing Karl Anthony-Towns, i think we need a solid big not a superstar. If we could trade Sidey and a Future First (the years pick will be too high) for someone like a Patton or Lobb from GWS, or even just Sidey and a second for Ben Brown would be ideal.

Ok, i think you and I just became best friends.
Sidebottom for a Patton and I'm happy.
We absolutely need Taylor to improve his decision making though.

 

[soreplums]

Tried to do a breakdown of our list and this is what I came up with:

KPD
Dunn
Reid*
Mclarty
Goldsack
Schade
Keeffe

Backs:
Langdon
Shaz
Maynard (prefer wing)
Varcoe*
smith*
Howe
Crisp*
Sinclair
Ramsay
Oxley

Inside Mids
Pendle
Treloar
De goey
Adams
Levi
Crisp*
wills
Sier
Thomas

Outside Mids
Aish .
Sidebottom (prefer forward)
wells
Phillips
Smith*
Varcoe (prefer half back)
Maynard*

KPF
Moore
White
Reid*
Cox*

Medium Forwards
Fasolo
Elliott
WHE
Mayne
Sidebottom*

Small Forwards
Brown
Daicos
Kirby
Blair
broomy

Rucks
Grundy
Cox*

Quality names on the list, but they need support.
Glaring obvious is a lack of quality outside mids and KPF. Need outside miss who can take the game on, move it quickly to forwards and be a match winner.

Howe Dunne Shaz
Crisp Goldsack Varcoe
Wells Treload. Maynard
Sidey. Moore. WHE
Fas. Reid. Elliott

Grundy. Pendles. Adams

De goey, Levi. Phillips Aish/smith/Thomas

 

[wicksy]

Tried to do a breakdown of our list and this is what I came up with:

KPD
Dunn
Reid*
Mclarty
Goldsack
Schade
Keeffe

Backs:
Langdon
Shaz
Maynard (prefer wing)
Varcoe*
smith*
Howe
Crisp*
Sinclair
Ramsay
Oxley

Inside Mids
Pendle
Treloar
De goey
Adams
Levi
Crisp*
wills
Sier
Thomas

Outside Mids
Aish .
Sidebottom (prefer forward)
wells
Phillips
Smith*
Varcoe (prefer half back)
Maynard*

KPF
Moore
White
Reid*
Cox*

Medium Forwards
Fasolo
Elliott
WHE
Mayne
Sidebottom*

Small Forwards
Brown
Daicos
Kirby
Blair
broomy

Rucks
Grundy
Cox*

Quality names on the list, but they need support.
Glaring obvious is a lack of quality outside mids and KPF. Need outside miss who can take the game on, move it quickly to forwards and be a match winner.

Howe Dunne Shaz
Crisp Goldsack Varcoe
Wells Treload. Maynard
Sidey. Moore. WHE
Fas. Reid. Elliott

Grundy. Pendles. Adams

De goey, Levi. Phillips Aish/smith/Thomas

None of these players should be in our starting 22 if we want to play finals.
Also, if we're not going to play Scharenberg or have him in our "best 22", then should we be seriously thinking about trading him? He does have value... Other teams would have been watching him accumulate in our 2's and wondering why the hell we're not rewarding him.

 

[Magpie Monopoly]

Ok, i think you and I just became best friends.
Sidebottom for a Patton and I'm happy.
We absolutely need Taylor to improve his decision making though.

Hahah i agree.

Ofcourse this is all on the assumption we can make those deals. If we can't get anything for Sidey i would agree Adams is next in line and if (a big if) he can pull us an A Grade KPF then i wouldn't be against it.

Agree on his decision making though, never seen a bloke try to kick the leather off the ball so often in such risky situations...

 

[Fonzeno1]

Hahah i agree.

Ofcourse this is all on the assumption we can make those deals. If we can't get anything for Sidey i would agree Adams is next in line and if (a big if) he can pull us an A Grade KPF then i wouldn't be against it.

Agree on his decision making though, never seen a bloke try to kick the leather off the ball so often in such risky situations...

Problem is we trade adams he gets coached well and stops taking the risks and learns hes a precentage ball kind of guy and he becomes a star. There are average kicks in the afl that are absolute stars. They just make good decisions.

 

[soreplums]

None of these players should be in our starting 22 if we want to play finals.
Also, if we're not going to play Scharenberg or have him in our "best 22", then should we be seriously thinking about trading him? He does have value... Other teams would have been watching him accumulate in our 2's and wondering why the hell we're not rewarding him.

Scharenburg should be playing. Those players you have highlighted are looking to fill two positions in the bench. They are capable without being outstanding. I think Aish can still grow into a serviceable player and it's still early for Phillips. My point is actually that we have a lack of outside players that can continue to run on top of the ground late in games and break it open with quick ball movement to our forwards.

 

[Sasuke]

Ridiculous... The players have it all on their terms.
If they want a trade, their contract means nothing. If they don't want to move, they point to their contract.
They have clubs over a barrel and it's bulls***.

Our league light years behind American sport in this regard and is actually laughable.

If they want a trade, the club gets the trade picks or players back in return. "contract means nothing" is bullshit driven by fans who think that everything should revolve around their own club. The clubs sign the contract, it's their fault if they decide the player needs to go and they refuse. The players sign the contract, it's their fault if the club doesnt want to trade them.

 

[swoop42]

Our biggest needs heading to the trade/draft period are IMO:

1.A mature key position forward (via free agency if possible)
2.A young key position forward (1st round selection)
3.A genuinely quick outside midfielder/wing
4.A line breaking and creative half back

 

[Seedsfan]

Our biggest needs heading to the trade/draft period are IMO:

1.A mature key position forward (via free agency if possible)
2.A young key position forward (1st round selection)
3.A genuinely quick outside midfielder/wing
4.A line breaking and creative half back

I would put a young KPD as number 3, McClarty and Schade may work out but it would be wise to take another or take two forwards and then turn one into a defender

 

[Apex36]

I would put a young KPD as number 3, McClarty and Schade may work out but it would be wise to take another or take two forwards and then turn one into a defender

Between Reid, Goldsack, Dunn and McLarty I reckon we're ok if we don't immediately get another KPD. It's certainly a need that needs to be addressed by the end of next year at the latest though.

 

[Bussie]

Delistings..
Sier
Wills
Oxley
Keeffe
Trades:
Blair (GWS or GCS)
Does the Fas want to go home? If he does, I say do the right thing.
Sidebottom (tough call, but good value)
Thomas
Retire:
White
Sinclair (has speed but too injury prone)
Goldsack? Happy to keep for another year.
Players we'll keep for a year to save face:
Mayne
Bring in..
A running half back flanker
A ready made full forward
A goalkicking coach

Sam Reid would fill a gap but he is not the answer.
Jon Patton or Lynch would be too hard to get.
Would anyone want Jack Darling if he came cheap?

 

[Apex36]

Our biggest needs heading to the trade/draft period are IMO:

1.A mature key position forward (via free agency if possible)
2.A young key position forward (1st round selection)
3.A genuinely quick outside midfielder/wing
4.A line breaking and creative half back

1. Reid
2. Sutherland/Brander/Fogarty
3. ???
4. ???

Not really familiar with the outside mids or line breakers in this draft, and I don't think we can afford to be trading too many picks away for established ones.