List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 8

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List Mgmt. - Trade & Free Agency Part 9

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[Noidnadroj]

If we ended up with 4, I'd be okay using one on Lukosius.

I agree. Kicked 39 goals in an average GC team in 2023. Beautiful kick and has not reached his potential yet IMO, so plenty of upside - we’d be highly unlikely to get anyone key position size better than him with a mid-teens pick. A forward line containing Balta, Lukosciois and Lefau is a good mix of power, bash/crash ability and skill to take us into the future.

I would only do it if we had at least 2 other top-20 picks in the draft, and I wouldn’t trade a top-10 pick.


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[Noidnadroj]

If Baker nominates the eagles would they accept Baker + a pick in the 8-12 range for their first round pick?

We could package up the latter picks that we have then trade them with either gold coast or brisbane for a pick in that range, then we'd have 2 top 5 picks and an early second heading into the draft

Assuming they finish bottom-3, no way the Eagles give that up for a 27yo and a later pick.

Eagles would be crazy to get Baker given where their list build is at and their lack of elite young players.. we need to trade with Freo if he wants out.

Given Saad, Cerra and Prestia were all ‘valued’ around pick 6-10, that’s what we’d command for Baker.


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[TheOptimum18]

Assuming they finish bottom-3, no way the Eagles give that up for a 27yo and a later pick.

Eagles would be crazy to get Baker given where their list build is at and their lack of elite young players.. we need to trade with Freo if he wants out.

Given Saad, Cerra and Prestia were all ‘valued’ around pick 6-10, that’s what we’d command for Baker.


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Given the best prospects are currently all midfield type players, do WCE really need another young midfield prospect?

That would be the only question I ask in terms of whether WCE are willing to trade away their first pick.

Of course, maybe we see more KPP further along the season, which I think WCE are missing a young KPD who has elite potential, and this becomes a moot point.

But at the moment, with what we know so far about the crop of draftees this season, I don't think it's a ridiculous conversation to have.

 

[Noidnadroj]

I think we need to stop dreaming if we think anyone is giving up a first round pick for Lynch. A mid-late 20’s pick would be best case, and not sure I’d take it if Lynch comes back this year and plays half a dozen games.

I’d be interested in thoughts of others, but here is where I see the ‘value’ of players who have been discussed as trade options :

Lynch: 26-30
Graham: 36-40
Short: 26-30
Broad: 46-50
Baker: 8-12
Macca: nothing

I’d trade all of Graham, Short or Broad if they were open to a move and we got an offer in the above range.


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[THE_GUN]

Has not laid a tackle this season. Red flag.

Great another bloody dusty thats all we need

 

[TheOptimum18]

I think we need to stop dreaming if we think anyone is giving up a first round pick for Lynch. A mid-late 20’s pick would be best case, and not sure I’d take it if Lynch comes back this year and plays half a dozen games.

I’d be interested in thoughts of others, but here is where I see the ‘value’ of players who have been discussed as trade options :

Lynch: 26-30
Graham: 36-40
Short: 26-30
Broad: 46-50
Baker: 8-12
Macca: nothing

I’d trade all of Graham, Short or Broad if they were open to a move and we got an offer in the above range.


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Considering Taylor Adams went for pick 33, I think we can potentially get a club to go at a similar pick for Graham.

If Broad picks up a bit of form, then I think we can get a minimum of somewhere around 35-40 as well. Not many players can stop Jeremy Cameron the way he did last season, and he's not at the age where he would suddenly lose the physical aspect of the game (not that he relies on it in the first place). Underrated ability to read the play and intercept mark as well, and also offers massive amounts of leadership in defence.

You look at a club like Freo, who have 3 KPD prospects in Murphy, Draper and Hughes, and whilst Pearce, Cox and McDonald aren't necessarily over the hill, so to speak, Cox seems to get a serious soft tissue injury every season, McDonald is an unknown after being delisted by Melbourne and Carlton and suffered quite a serious injury this season, and it wasn't that long ago when it felt like Pearce was out of the team with injuries quite a bit before becoming one of the best KPDs this season.

Broad rarely misses a game due to injury (can't remember the last time he missed games through injury), and can offer a lot of experience and leadership to a defensive group such as Freo's.

 

[THE_GUN]

If Lukosciois wanted to move GC get a top 10 pick every day of the week and we wouldnt even get a sniff

Port & Crows would be all over him like a cheap suit

 

[TheOptimum18]

If Lukosciois wanted to move GC get a top 10 pick every day of the week and we wouldnt even get a sniff

Port & Crows would be all over him like a cheap suit

If we're talking about trading Lukosius in at the end of this current season, then very unlikely that the Suns ask for a top 10 pick, since they have their own academy player in this draft which they wouldn't want to waste a high pick with in matching a bid.

 

[Coach_Required]

If we're talking about trading Lukosius in at the end of this current season, then very unlikely that the Suns ask for a top 10 pick, since they have their own academy player in this draft which they wouldn't want to waste a high pick with in matching a bid.

I will lose my ****ing shit if we give up quality draft capital for Lukosius

 

[eaglevision]

Assuming they finish bottom-3, no way the Eagles give that up for a 27yo and a later pick.

Eagles would be crazy to get Baker given where their list build is at and their lack of elite young players.. we need to trade with Freo if he wants out.

Given Saad, Cerra and Prestia were all ‘valued’ around pick 6-10, that’s what we’d command for Baker.


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Given the best prospects are currently all midfield type players, do WCE really need another young midfield prospect?

That would be the only question I ask in terms of whether WCE are willing to trade away their first pick.

Of course, maybe we see more KPP further along the season, which I think WCE are missing a young KPD who has elite potential, and this becomes a moot point.

But at the moment, with what we know so far about the crop of draftees this season, I don't think it's a ridiculous conversation to have.

We would love Baker but realistically we can’t afford him pick wise. Our 2R will end up pick 25 at absolute best and that’s assuming we finish last. You won’t accept that and nor should you.

I think O’Sullivan and Smith would complement our midfield nicely, we need some outside class and kick penetration and I’ve got them both going top 5. If we split the pick we’d miss both and still need to get a high end KPD. I just don’t see us leaving the draft with Baker, a KPD, outside mid/wing/HBF at a pick in the mid/late 20s and whoever we select at pick 60 odd (you have our 3R).

If Baker leaves it will be to Freo for one of their 1R picks, can’t see it realistically being any other way (unless there’s a big multi club trade) but personally I hope he stays at the Tigers and is a one club player.

 

[THE_GUN]

If we're talking about trading Lukosius in at the end of this current season, then very unlikely that the Suns ask for a top 10 pick, since they have their own academy player in this draft which they wouldn't want to waste a high pick with in matching a bid.

2025 1st rounder + 2024 2nd rounder for points

 

[THE_GUN]

We would love Baker but realistically we can’t afford him pick wise. Our 2R will end up pick 25 at absolute best and that’s assuming we finish last. You won’t accept that and nor should you.

I think O’Sullivan and Smith would complement our midfield nicely, we need some outside class and kick penetration and I’ve got them both going top 5. If we split the pick we’d miss both and still need to get a high end KPD. I just don’t see us leaving the draft with Baker, a KPD, outside mid/wing/HBF at a pick in the mid/late 20s and whoever we select at pick 60 odd (you have our 3R).

If Baker leaves it will be to Freo for one of their 1R picks, can’t see it realistically being any other way (unless there’s a big multi club trade) but personally I hope he stays at the Tigers and is a one club player.

Is Elijah home sick yet ?

 

[eaglevision]

Is Elijah home sick yet ?

He’s a Perth boy. Ballet physio and surgery will have him dancing in a few weeks. What about Shai?

 

[TheOptimum18]

We would love Baker but realistically we can’t afford him pick wise. Our 2R will end up pick 25 at absolute best and that’s assuming we finish last. You won’t accept that and nor should you.

I think O’Sullivan and Smith would complement our midfield nicely, we need some outside class and kick penetration and I’ve got them both going top 5. If we split the pick we’d miss both and still need to get a high end KPD. I just don’t see us leaving the draft with Baker, a KPD, outside mid/wing/HBF at a pick in the mid/late 20s and whoever we select at pick 60 odd (you have our 3R).

If Baker leaves it will be to Freo for one of their 1R picks, can’t see it realistically being any other way (unless there’s a big multi club trade) but personally I hope he stays at the Tigers and is a one club player.

Yeah, I do think it will be easier dealing with Freo than with you guys if Baker did want to move back.

Interesting that you think you guys still need 2 midfielders in O'Sullivan and Smith. I obviously don't pay as close of an attention to WCE as you would, but I would've thought a core midfield group of Reid, Ginbey, Hewett, Hall, Culley and Chesser was a decent mix? Obviously Hewett under a bit of an injury cloud, and Hall is yet to debut so no one really knows what he might be at AFL level, but that midfield mix can be anything with another 12-18 months of development, imo.

However, I can see the appeal in getting O'Sullivan and/or Smith is if given the chance. Hoping we pick one of them up with out 1st pick this season as well.

 

[TheOptimum18]

He’s a Perth boy. Ballet physio and surgery will have him dancing in a few weeks. What about Shai?

Unofficial word on Shai is that clubs have asked the question (I believe?), but he apparently loves Melbourne and isn't as interested at going back to WA as Baker currently is rumoured to be.

 

[wegetpumped]

He’s a Perth boy. Ballet physio and surgery will have him dancing in a few weeks. What about Shai?

You can have him he knows ballet will blend in ok for you.

 

[eaglevision]

Yeah, I do think it will be easier dealing with Freo than with you guys if Baker did want to move back.

Interesting that you think you guys still need 2 midfielders in O'Sullivan and Smith. I obviously don't pay as close of an attention to WCE as you would, but I would've thought a core midfield group of Reid, Ginbey, Hewett, Hall, Culley and Chesser was a decent mix? Obviously Hewett under a bit of an injury cloud, and Hall is yet to debut so no one really knows what he might be at AFL level, but that midfield mix can be anything with another 12-18 months of development, imo.

However, I can see the appeal in getting O'Sullivan and/or Smith is if given the chance. Hoping we pick one of them up with out 1st pick this season as well.

Our contested game has been a huge improvement this year, which we’ve obviously drafted for in the last two years (Reid, Ginbey, Hewett, Hall) and are clearly making that the focus of a new game plan. What we do lack is some outside class. You can see with the Demons what that leads to, even having an A Grade contested midfield. They can win the ball but can’t deliver it to a dysfunctional forward line. Gets found out in pressure finals against quality opposition so they’ve lost their last 4 finals after finishing top 4. We also lack a class HBF and winger who can provide overlap and a penetrating, accurate kick. So a couple of players with that outside class and a KPD would be our draft focus I’d imagine. I actually think Smillie will end up going #1 and if we do have that pick I’d hope we look at trading down to address those list needs.

Interesting reading tiger supporters views, seems to be quite a variety of opinions regarding what you guys need out of the draft?

 

[TheOptimum18]

2025 1st rounder + 2024 2nd rounder for points

The Suns actually have the highest amount of points out of all the clubs for the draft, mostly because they have their own first rounder as well as the Dogs' first round pick, as well as the Lion's second round pick.

I actually see us giving a few of our later picks for one of the Suns' first round picks depending on how the season goes in all honesty.

Also, I'm not really advocating for Lukosius anyway. I mentioned it earlier, but personally, there's only a specific set of circumstances where I would even consider doing a trade for Lukosius, to play a role that could be easily draftable (imo).

 

[eaglevision]

Unofficial word on Shai is that clubs have asked the question (I believe?), but he apparently loves Melbourne and isn't as interested at going back to WA as Baker currently is rumoured to be.

I don’t think we have, I know we poached Clarke from you guys but surely he knows there is no way we have the draft currency to afford him under contract? He’d be a game changer at Freo and a few other clubs as well. As good as he is, he isn’t going to be the difference between top and bottom 8 for us. Mentioned it here before but what you guys do with your bounty of picks (other than get as high as possible) and your stars with currency will be fascinating as there’s no clear right answer.

 

[TheOptimum18]

Our contested game has been a huge improvement this year, which we’ve obviously drafted for in the last two years (Reid, Ginbey, Hewett, Hall) and are clearly making that the focus of a new game plan. What we do lack is some outside class. You can see with the Demons what that leads to, even having an A Grade contested midfield. They can win the ball but can’t deliver it to a dysfunctional forward line. Gets found out in pressure finals against quality opposition so they’ve lost their last 4 finals after finishing top 4. We also lack a class HBF and winger who can provide overlap and a penetrating, accurate kick. So a couple of players with that outside class and a KPD would be our draft focus I’d imagine. I actually think Smillie will end up going #1 and if we do have to at pick I’d hope we look at trading down to address those list needs.

Interesting reading tiger supporters views, seems to be quite a variety of opinions regarding what you guys need out of the draft?

I can definitely see the need for some outside class with you guys. Hell, we need it ourselves atm, hoping that players like Clarke and Banks can provide it once given more exposure to AFL footy.

The common consensus is a midfielder and KPF. Jagga Smith and Tom Gross both trained with us during pre-season this year, so can easily see us picking either of them based on that, but like you've alluded to yourself with the potential to be the best kid in the draft, it's hard to pass up on someone like Josh Smillie if you have the option (insert obligatory comparison to the Bont or Cripps here because of their height). Not sure a clear KPF has shown themselves to the draft yet, although Jack Whitlock seems to have had a good start to the season.

I don’t think we have, I know we poached Clarke from you guys but surely he knows there is no way we have the draft currency to afford him under contract? He’d be a game changer at Freo and a few other clubs as well. As good as he is, he isn’t going to be the difference between top and bottom 8 for us. Mentioned it here before but what you guys do with your bounty of picks (other than get as high as possible) and your stars with currency will be fascinating as there’s no clear right answer.

Yeah, I also don't see either WA teams having the resources (both in terms of picks or player trades) that will be enough for us to budge on Shai. Clarke was less involved with trading from memory, and was more associated with the draft, but it's a safe bet to assume that Clarke would have an understanding of what would be needed to even begin a convo in this regard.

I'm probably in the minority in thinking that we don't need to go into a full rebuild, and that as long as we cover gaping list needs such as a high quality KPF, then the rise back up the ladder might be quicker than some might expect (both internal fans, and outside noise).

 

[eaglevision]

I can definitely see the need for some outside class with you guys. Hell, we need it ourselves atm, hoping that players like Clarke and Banks can provide it once given more exposure to AFL footy.

The common consensus is a midfielder and KPF. Jagga Smith and Tom Gross both trained with us during pre-season this year, so can easily see us picking either of them based on that, but like you've alluded to yourself with the potential to be the best kid in the draft, it's hard to pass up on someone like Josh Smillie if you have the option (insert obligatory comparison to the Bont or Cripps here because of their height). Not sure a clear KPF has shown themselves to the draft yet, although Jack Whitlock seems to have had a good start to the season.



Yeah, I also don't see either WA teams having the resources (both in terms of picks or player trades) that will be enough for us to budge on Shai. Clarke was less involved with trading from memory, and was more associated with the draft, but it's a safe bet to assume that Clarke would have an understanding of what would be needed to even begin a convo in this regard.

I'm probably in the minority in thinking that we don't need to go into a full rebuild, and that as long as we cover gaping list needs such as a high quality KPF, then the rise back up the ladder might be quicker than some might expect (both internal fans, and outside noise).

My read on Gross is that he can win his own footy but panicked/unreliable disposal. Jagga is so evasive and clean, just needs to put on some weight and slight concern is that he’s a January birthday and may have less upside than other top end players. I presume preseason observers would have opinions somewhere in that vicinity but would love to hear if otherwise.

Whitlock has been solid, Hutchison might be an option in MSD if available but is only 190cm. Shanahan should be available around the mark where I’d expect your natural 1R to be.

Definitely enough talent on your list to not have to drop to the bottom, but also don’t want to get stuck in mid table purgatory like Bombers and Saints who have half baked it. Nailing your draft trade up deals with the array of picks you have and selecting talent this year will probably make the decision for you IMO.

 

[TheOptimum18]

My read on Gross is that he can win his own footy but panicked/unreliable disposal. Jagga is so evasive and clean, just needs to put on some weight and slight concern is that he’s a January birthday and may have less upside than other top end players. I presume preseason observers would have opinions somewhere in that vicinity but would love to hear if otherwise.

Whitlock has been solid, Hutchison might be an option in MSD if available but is only 190cm. Shanahan should be available around the mark where I’d expect your natural 1R to be.

Definitely enough talent on your list to not have to drop to the bottom, but also don’t want to get stuck in mid table purgatory like Bombers and Saints who have half baked it. Nailing your draft trade up deals with the array of picks you have and selecting talent this year will probably make the decision for you IMO.

I think Gross might be an option mid to low end of round 1 of the draft?

I would be lying if I said that Jagga's size doesn't worry me. Cal Twomey had him listed as 70kg last Nov, and going by the pictures, I can't see him being too far off this weight (obviously with the new rules around player weights, that information isn't available anymore).

I think we might target a KPF closer to your traditional key forward (so around Lynch's height) rather than a medium-tall forward in Hutchinson? But that's partially me guessing, and partially my preference speaking there.

The biggest factor as to whether we're stuck in purgatory like the Saints and Bombers, or whether we are able to get back into genuine finals contention probably lies more with how Sonsie, Brown, Gibcus, Clarke and Banks develop, as well as what we do at the end of this season.

You could easily be looking at 8 - 10 players picked within the first 30 picks of the draft with those players and potential picks there, and we need to see more ticks than crosses come the end of this season with the 5 players mentioned above. Shame that Gibcus and Clarke have ACLs (although you could probably put a tick next to a fit and healthy Gibcus?), while Brown has seriously impressed a lot of Tiger's supporters this season (finally conversations around Van Rooyen can stop). Sonsie could've gone at pick 1 in that draft, but seeing him slide down to where he did, he and Banks need to step up this season.

 

[Ashman OG]

Do we have a first round pick next draft or did we give that way for hopper?

Bump srs question

 

[TheOptimum18]

Bump srs question

We have our first round picks for 2024 and 2025.

We gave our 2023 first round pick for Hopper (as well as some other picks from 2022, iirc).

 

[Mr Magic]

To get a player like him, means overpaying in every sense. Carlton did it with Martin, Williams, McGovern. Luckily for them they have managed to draft some decent talent.
we are in a situation now where we need a couple of years of high end draft talent. We’ve chased and landed plenty of established players since 2016, enjoyed success, now back to the start of the rebuilding cycle. And do it before Tassie is taking all the best kids.

We could not over pay for Lukosious. I watched a replay of Gold Coast v Hawthorn and he was not that impressive and he is 23