Mega Thread VICBias - Genuine Discussion

[PenfoldsFan]

Yet we're all still here including the clubs we all follow, in fact vic clubs have more fans and members in their history.

If that's your definition of broken then the dictionary disagrees with you.

Unless youre a Melbourne supporter and can afford ski's, footy and shit coffee is all you have in Winter so its hardly surprising that the great unwashed flock to the G to forget all else.

 

[JackOutback]

I've found that no amount of evidence can ever sway someone with a deep seated belief in a conspiracy.

Likewise, to paraphrase Upton Sinclair, it is difficult to get a man to understand something when his premiership success depends on his not understanding it.

 

[sr36]

Oh well.

Keeping 100yr old VFL clubs entrenched in the bottom 10 whilst we blow finals for fun is worth it dont ya think..lol

I was at Adelaide Oval to watch you guys get knocked out last year. Port fans didn't seem to be having fun - except when you were spitting at your coach.

Port are only in the league to make us Pies fans look classy in comparison.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Yes we have. And back when Vic Park was our home ground, we lost more grand finals to mcg tenants with a home ground advantage than most Non-Vic teams will in 100 years. Did we sook? Did we claim it was unfair? No. We accepted it as it was the best biggest most iconic ground in the comp where the grand final belongs. Still is.

Thats not a great comparison to the modern day we live in. Travelling from Vic park or Brisbaen, SA, WA etc

 

[sr36]

Thats not a great comparison to the modern day we live in. Travelling from Vic park or Brisbaen, SA, WA etc

The home team won the same percentage of games in the VFL as they do in the AFL.

 

[Coolangatta]

Yes we have. And back when Vic Park was our home ground, we lost more grand finals to mcg tenants with a home ground advantage than most Non-Vic teams will in 100 years. Did we sook? Did we claim it was unfair? No. We accepted it as it was the best biggest most iconic ground in the comp where the grand final belongs. Still is.

Nah Optus is better. Not bigger, but better. Though our shit turf doesn't do us any favours.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Thats not a great comparison to the modern day we live in. Travelling from Vic park or Brisbaen, SA, WA etc

And now we are back to traveling.
The cycle continues.

The Grand Final is at the G for another 30 years, probably many more years after, sooner or later you will just have to deal with it.

If you want to keep bring up how traveling is so bad, bring some stats with you, because so far I have seen nothing that tells me teams lose games because of it.

Home ground advantage was a thing in the VFL and guess what, teams never flew.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

I was at Adelaide Oval to watch you guys get knocked out last year. Port fans didn't seem to be having fun - except when you were spitting at your coach.

Port are only in the league to make us Pies fans look classy in comparison.

Dogs, Bombers, Cats, Tigers, Hawks and Roo's fans didnt get a chance to spit on their coach in September though hey..lol

Their coaches were holidaying in the Bahama's whilst their loyal paying members hid under their doona's to keep warm.

 

[sr36]

Nah Optus is better. Not bigger, but better. Though our shit turf doesn't do us any favours.

What is the story with the turf? It's terrible.

On a dry day, Sidebottom did the old fashioned touch the ball on the ground rather than bouncing it because no one who'd bounced it had controlled it.

 

[sr36]

Dogs, Bombers, Cats, Tigers, Hawks and Roo's fans didnt get a chance to spit on their coach in September though hey..lol

Their coaches were holidaying in the Bahama's whilst their loyal paying members hid under their doona's to keep warm.

Yes. They were all very envious of Port fans saliva escapades. Those Vic's are a bit soft and prefer holidaying in the Bahamas than spitting on their coach.

Pies fans don't spit on our own coach, but Malthouse used to wear a rain jacket as he walked down the race at vic park whilst coaching WCE.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Yes. They were all very envious of Port fans watching their team reach mid September.

I agree.

 

[JackOutback]

And now we are back to traveling.
The cycle continues.

The Grand Final is at the G for another 30 years, probably many more years after, sooner or later you will just have to deal with it.

If you want to keep bring up how traveling is so bad, bring some stats with you, because so far I have seen nothing that tells me teams lose games because of it.

Home ground advantage was a thing in the VFL and guess what, teams never flew.

I'm not sure it will be... back in the 90s, it was a requirement to have finals at the G every week regardless of ladder positions. The deal was locked in, expected to remain forever, it ended up changing pretty rapidly.

Despite what Victorians think, the MCG isn't some mythical place, it's a stadium and one that doesn't stack up to others at the moment. Melburnians have also seen that it's possible to have a grand final away from the G and the world will not come to an end. Thirty years is a long time, I suspect somewhere along the journey, a change will be made, even if it's just one GF elsewhere every five years.

 

[Grin]

Likewise, to paraphrase Upton Sinclair, it is difficult to get a man to understand something when his premiership success depends on his not understanding it.

Richmond's premiership success did not depend on me not understanding anything.
I take no credit whatsoever for Richmond's premierships.
Although I was living in Port Adelaide in 2017 and came home from the Grand Final to a heroes welcome. Slaps on the back, gifts of single malt whisky with a "well done mate". You would have sworn I'd kicked the winning goal.

Bad sports and sore losers try to denigrate Richmond's magnificent success and how it changed the way the game is played. In my book they're sad, insecure people with inferiority complexes and chips on their shoulders. More to be pitied than laughed at imo.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I'm not sure it will be... back in the 90s, it was a requirement to have finals at the G every week regardless of ladder positions. The deal was locked in, expected to remain forever, it ended up changing pretty rapidly.

Despite what Victorians think, the MCG isn't some mythical place, it's a stadium and one that doesn't stack up to others at the moment. Melburnians have also seen that it's possible to have a grand final away from the G and the world will not come to an end. Thirty years is a long time, I suspect somewhere along the journey, a change will be made, even if it's just one GF elsewhere every five years.

Wanna bet?
2057 I think is when the contract runs out, and I would also bet it will be extended before that date.

So dream on.

 

[JackOutback]

Richmond's premiership success did not depend on me not understanding anything.
I take no credit whatsoever for Richmond's premierships.
Although I was living in Port Adelaide in 2017 and came home from the Grand Final to a heroes welcome. Slaps on the back, gifts of single malt whisky with a "well done mate". You would have sworn I'd kicked the winning goal.

Bad sports and sore losers try to denigrate Richmond's magnificent success and how it changed the way the game is played. In my book they're sad, insecure people with inferiority complexes and chips on their shoulders. More to be pitied than laughed at imo.

Just trying to get you to understand the inherent advantage of being a Victorian club in the AFL, nothing more, nothing less. Though a fool's errand, I know.

 

[LoungeLizard]

Richmond's premiership success did not depend on me not understanding anything.
I take no credit whatsoever for Richmond's premierships.
Although I was living in Port Adelaide in 2017 and came home from the Grand Final to a heroes welcome. Slaps on the back, gifts of single malt whisky with a "well done mate". You would have sworn I'd kicked the winning goal.

Bad sports and sore losers try to denigrate Richmond's magnificent success and how it changed the way the game is played. In my book they're sad, insecure people with inferiority complexes and chips on their shoulders. More to be pitied than laughed at imo.

In my book they're sad, insecure people with inferiority complexes and chips on their shoulders. More to be pitied than laughed at imo.

This needs to be stickied to the top of every page, well said.

 

[Grin]

Just trying to get you to understand the inherent advantage of being a Victorian club in the AFL, nothing more, nothing less. Though a fool's errand, I know.

Look I'd genuinely agree with you if you had any evidence.
Why can't any of you produce any solid evidence, apart from some very cherry picked stats and made up 'facts' like WA players have shorter careers?
I've produced a lot of evidence that there is no net bias to non Victorian clubs. I'm met with anger and personal insults as though that constitute evidence.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

And now we are back to traveling.
The cycle continues.

The Grand Final is at the G for another 30 years, probably many more years after, sooner or later you will just have to deal with it.

If you want to keep bring up how traveling is so bad, bring some stats with you, because so far I have seen nothing that tells me teams lose games because of it.

Home ground advantage was a thing in the VFL and guess what, teams never flew.

I do deal with. It is what it is.
I know when we play a GF against a Vic club we are disadvantaged. I know we have to basically run up a slippery slope to win the game which is why when Non Vic sides do win flags they should be given far more credit.
They know they are starting each and every time a few goals behind and they just turn up and do their best.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I do deal with. It is what it is.
I know when we play a GF against a Vic club we are disadvantaged. I know we have to basically run up a slippery slope to win the game which is why when Non Vic sides do win flags they should be given far more credit.
They know they are starting each and every time a few goals behind and they just turn up and do their best.

Yes I know you know, but what I asked for was stats to show why you know.

We are just going to keep going around and around with the same arguments about travel

It was even shown during covid, that home ground advantage was more to do with crowds than anything else.

During the VFL days, home ground advantage was as big a thing then as now, does traveling from Richmond to Vic Park tire players?

 

[sr36]

Likewise, to paraphrase Upton Sinclair, it is difficult to get a man to understand something when his premiership success depends on his not understanding it.

I can't believe anyone could have seen that premiership and then seen everything that's followed - upto and including this year and not realise that the Tigers were miles ahead of Adelaide. The tigers didn't just have a good finals series like the conception at the time. They changed the game.

 

[Coolangatta]

What is the story with the turf? It's terrible.

On a dry day, Sidebottom did the old fashioned touch the ball on the ground rather than bouncing it because no one who'd bounced it had controlled it.

Not sure, but I'd fall off my chair if it met AFL standards for pitch quality. And it's been that way for a few years now. Don't wanna see a gun like Reid get injured but you could see it happening there.

 

[Checksider]

Any statistical evidence of an advantage to the Melbourne based club in Grand finals at the MCG? Any at all?
("I'm highly entitled and have been raised to believe the world owes me, and if it doesn't deliver, I'll have a tantrum" isn't evidence)

The statistical evidence is across every league of every sport in the world where home advantage is seen and directly measurable in win/loss results.

**** me, its not complicated mate.

 

[Grin]

The statistical evidence is across every league of every sport in the world where home advantage is seen and directly measurable in win/loss results.

**** me, its not complicated mate.

Yes I agree. Your club arguably does get a bigger home ground advantage when it plays clubs from another state than my club gets when it plays a home games against fellow MCG tenants or home games at venues that aren't its home ground.

Thing is, there's no evidence that Victorian clubs get a net advantage over non-Victorian clubs. If anything it's the other way around. But that's a matter of geography, the number of clubs in each state etc. I'm not going to whinge infernally about that, and angrily demand unsporting concessions for the club I follow.
I guess we're different that way.

 

[sr36]

The statistical evidence is across every league of every sport in the world where home advantage is seen and directly measurable in win/loss results.

**** me, its not complicated mate.

Yep. Nba finals for instance runs at about 60% home team Vs 40% away team. Assuming a similar advantage and that approximately half the GFs should be Vic Vs Non-Vic. You'd expect home ground advantage to result in 1 extra gf being won by a Vic team every 20 years or so.

So for us supporters of Vic teams, who barrack for a team rather than for or against a state, that's going to work out at an extra premiership gifted for our team roughly once in every 200 years ... Same for non-Vic teams....

Oh and 10 million extra fans getting to watch the gf during that time. A lot more than that if talking about grounds smaller than Perth.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Yes I know you know, but what I asked for was stats to show why you know.

We are just going to keep going around and around with the same arguments about travel

It was even shown during covid, that home ground advantage was more to do with crowds than anything else.

During the VFL days, home ground advantage was as big a thing then as now, does traveling from Richmond to Vic Park tire players?

Like you said it is crowds more than anything, then also playing on what is a pretty foreign ground for most non vic clubs and I know you guys keep saying it’s nothing but the travel has to have an efffect.
That two sides going into GF have such vastly different routines must mean something.
How much any or all if this is I don’t factually know as much as you guys keep asking for stats.
I just can’t see how any sensible person could think the VIC side is not at an advantage on GF day against a non VIC side.
It beggars belief mate the denial of this. Not necessarily by you mate.