Toast Welcome to Hawthorn, Finn Maginness “absolute Hawthorn nuffie” and a Hawk to 2027

[MrPremiership]

Can he provide the same level of output in the middle as Nash has done? Why can't he get into the middle and use his body to help us at stoppages?

 

[burner1]

Can he provide the same level of output in the middle as Nash has done? Why can't he get into the middle and use his body to help us at stoppages?

No reason he can’t with time/development - reckon issue was our midfield was getting smashed early and we didn’t want to put more rookies like Finn into midfield mix.

Was great to see his gut running. Want to see more of his burst from congestion.

 

[James Buchanan]

Over the past 3 weeks, I've seen a number of people here saying that Finn should be the next/first player dropped. There has been criticisms of his disposal and/or I guess, the number of disposals he is accumulating.

At the same time, over those 3 weeks Finn has been #1 for kms run every game, even outrunning a gut running specialist like Sam Walsh

18

Sam Walsh

Age

24

Ht

184cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

25.1

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

3.4

5star

No current season stats available

D

26.2

5star

K

15.4

5star

HB

10.8

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

4.8

5star

this most recent weekend. Moreover, he is always in the top 5 for workrate for both offence and defence, meaning that he is running hard both ways.

I think that people are underestimating how significant this effort is and/or how it is/may be appreciated internally at the Hawks.

For me, it has become clear that part of Sam's gameplan is to be able to outrun our opponents. To have a team of elite runners who can/will open up the game by using their speed and endurance to wear down their opponents and put themselves in positions where we can get time and space and provide options to facilitate the fast rebound style that Sam seems to be working towards.

However, I don't think this is the only part of how Sam sees the value of hard running. We were given a particularly useful insight into his/the club's perspective on this in the video they released after Round 1: Coaching Craft | Round 1 - Gut running on display

In that video, Ward runs hard to stay with Jy Simpkin

12

Jy Simpkin

Age

26

Ht

183cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.0

4star

K

7.9

3star

HB

8.1

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

3.3

5star

CL

2.9

4star

D

20.6

5star

K

11.0

4star

HB

9.6

5star

M

2.0

2star

T

3.5

4star

CL

5.5

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

5.6

3star

HB

4.4

4star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.4

4star

CL

0.2

2star

and because he is staying with him, he takes away an overlap option which means that the North player kicks elsewhere, resulting in a turnover. There is no statistic associated with that - its not a disposal, tackle or 1%, its not even a pressure act as I understand them - but as Sam so clearly observes, that gut running that Ward does is critical in creating the situation where the turnover occurs.

I suspect that, at least in part, this is what Finn is bringing to the team at present. By using his elite running skills he is removing options from the opposition players and preventing them from getting into time and space where they can open the game up. Alternatively, he is creating options and while these may not be being taken, his very presence he is demanding a player cover him instead of another option which we end up taking.

Other than his kms and his workrate numbers I don't have a whole lot to hang this on, but I would suggest that his contribution to the team is much more significant than what is recorded on the stat sheet. I'd be interested to know if anyone has seen any examples of this option denial/creation through running by Finn.

 

[Manila_Hawk]

Can't bat or bowl.... but fields well... that's what I'm hearing.....

 

[eldorado]

I was reminded by a fellow supporter at the game that Finn has only played six games.

I was expressing some dissatisfaction with his disposal and decision making at the time.

Six games is a babe in the woods still...

 

[Hawks1994]

Wasn't prolific with the amount of ball he got against the Blues, very true. However I did start to notice him more as the game progressed and we were closing the gap on them

Will probably make way for either Impey/Bramble at this stage, but I'm hoping to see further improvement in the ball winning capacity, cause his ability to run out games better than just about everyone else of the field is an asset that can certainly be utilised

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

unfortunately don't think there's a spot for him in our back 6 once everyone is fit and ready to go

not giving up on him as a midfielder though

 

[kirbatron]

I'll trust & back in Sammy with selection on this one.

Give him some Centre bounces. you never know

 

[Brishawk]

I'll trust & back in Sammy with selection on this one.

Give him some Centre bounces. you never know

Could it really hurt given how bad we have been?

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

I am glad we are giving guys like Finn muliple games in a row to gain some experience.

 

[James Buchanan]

Can't bat or bowl.... but fields well... that's what I'm hearing.....

More like - is holding up an end and not conceding any runs without taking any wickets, then fielding sweeper and preventing boundaries, without taking any catches.

 

[James Buchanan]

I'll trust & back in Sammy with selection on this one.

I think that needs to be the case, irrespective.

I keep hearing that Sam has a bloody brilliant footy brain. It certainly seems consistent with how well he's gotten the team playing. It's probably better than our amateur efforts.

So, you'd have to think that if Finn keeps getting picked then he's doing something right according to Sam's gameplan. That might not be something we can measure with touches or tackles or otherwise - but whatever he is doing is meeting the objectives the club is setting him.

 

[rjslcM]

Can't bat or bowl.... but fields well... that's what I'm hearing.....

More like - is holding up an end and not conceding any runs without taking any wickets, then fielding sweeper and preventing boundaries, without taking any catches.

Loving the cricket analogies.

 

[MrPremiership]

He is improving every game.

Should be given more time.

 

[rei154]

One of his strengths as a junior was being a speedy big body. That strength doesn't always translate immediately into the big leagues due to bodies being... bigger and stronger.
I think Finn is developing just fine- given this is a growth season, and he has a very high ceiling, we don't lose much by having him in the side, and if anything greatly benefit from helping to speed up his development.

 

[The Chad and I]

He was a ball-winning/attacking midfielder who has been asked to learn the defensive side of the game in order to round him out.
He is playing in the seniors doing just that. HUGE change for him and his form is earning him a game doing something that didn't come naturally to him.

I think he has demonstrated an ability to learn and be coached.
I wonder if it will all come together when he is asked to play a more balanced role.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I was reminded by a fellow supporter at the game that Finn has only played six games.

I was expressing some dissatisfaction with his disposal and decision making at the time.

Six games is a babe in the woods still...

He’s a very wise and good looking rooster that fellow supporter, I hear.

 

[Roddy]

For me, it's a case of the jury being very much out on Finn. Probably needs to be given more time, but needs to start producing this year.

 

[Glebehawk]

He’s not your silky skilled type and never will be. If running is he’s asset at the moment, he’s gotta tag the elite mids out there. Learn that craft, then learn to find the ball.

 

[burger09]

Finn is obviously a very hard worker.

As supporters we just want to see glimpses of smart quality ball use. When compared to Ward, Newcombe and McDonald, who are giving us this, Finn has so far seemed a bit slow of mind and lacking the same awareness and nous. They aren't perfect and muck up, as kids do, but also do some impressive poslished things.

Lets hope it clicks for him. If it does he'll be a very handy soldier.

 

[Brishawk]

He’s not your silky skilled type and never will be. If running is he’s asset at the moment, he’s gotta tag the elite mids out there. Learn that craft, then learn to find the ball.

He is playing defence roles on the oppositions hff and wingers that pose a threat on the outside. It is pretty hard to tag inside mids without wrecking your midfield zone so often more efficient tot at the outside players and let guys like Cripps hack it forward out of congestion.

 

[James Buchanan]

I decided to re-watch yesterday's game and try and pay attention to just what Finn was doing. His work off the ball was massive. He was constantly either filling the hole or manning up to prevent the short kick to release pressure and providing a release option at contest after contest. He was always running hard to provide outside options. There were several times he would run from half back to the forward pocket or vice versa to provide a release option which wasn't used. There were a number of times that he would get into position to close off the fat side of the ground, forcing Carlton to go back into congestion which allowed other players to contest the ball. I figured he was doing something right from his tracker numbers but it's another thing to watch it in action. I'd say he is absolutely contributing more than his stats indicate.

 

[TheFourPillars]

I decided to re-watch yesterday's game and try and pay attention to just what Finn was doing. His work off the ball was massive. He was constantly either filling the hole or manning up to prevent the short kick to release pressure and providing a release option at contest after contest. He was always running hard to provide outside options. There were several times he would run from half back to the forward pocket or vice versa to provide a release option which wasn't used was huge. There were a number of times that he would get into position to close off the fat side of the ground, forcing Carlton to go back into congestion which allowed other players to contest the ball. I figured he was doing something right from his tracker numbers but it's another thing to watch it in action. I'd say he is absolutely contributing more than his stats indicate.

Excellent observations. Finn was out a few times and wasnt used as well

 

[Fleabane]

I decided to re-watch yesterday's game and try and pay attention to just what Finn was doing.

That is dedication! Seriously though, it's interesting to hear your observations.

 

[James Buchanan]

Excellent observations. Finn was out a few times and wasnt used as well

Yeah, I noticed that as well.

There was a particularly significant/noticeable one in the last few minutes where Finn got himself free and the ball was kicked to either Worpel or Morrison who was being double teamed.

But in most cases, it was often because he was placing himself 20 odd metres infront of the player for a releasing disposal, but they regularly took the longer option.