List Mgmt. 2017 Trade and Free Agency Discussion - #Leverpulled and #Harleyrevved

[Topkent]

You mean the team who has a glaring weakness in midfield and has done very little to rectify it? Don’t get me wrong, in terms of what they gave up the Bombers did very well. They still have a very imbalanced midfield and they can’t be a serious contender until they fix it.

Couldn't have said it better. They have done nothing to fix the defencinsies in their side and have just grabbed a handful of good players in positions they already have them. They will end up failing in finals again against the strong contested sides but absolutely look amazing when the momentum with them.

 

[RandB]

Compared to Adelaide's trade for Gibbs, we got Lever for a steal. What the heck were Adelaide thinking there?

Adelaide's desperation for Gibbs makes our early trade of two 1st rounders for Lever even worse.

Our first and a second was more than fair and there's no excuse for not at least waiting until week 2 to make the trade - especially given Balic was our only other consideration and a formality.

 

[pjfairbairn]

Interesting that with both of our new boys, it's clear that we were into them in their draft year and have then maintained a level of contact/interest. Sign of the times, with greater player movement, especially when players have to leave Victoria to head interstate.

 

[Demon bhoy]

Adelaide's desperation for Gibbs makes our early trade of two 1st rounders for Lever even worse.

Our first and a second was more than fair and there's no excuse for not at least waiting until week 2 to make the trade - especially given Balic was our only other consideration and a formality.

That's was my initial thoughts, I'm thinking now don't muck around get it done and in good faith and establish a good reputation as fair to deal with.

I don't think there was anything to wrong with the deal, the dees are instantly a better team and the club improved their hand in this years draft with the extra second rounder, which if you believe the so called experts is wide open after pick 5.

Melbourne are a better team now than 2 weeks ago so from that point of view you would have to call it a success

 

[saj_21]

Actually pretty excited about picks 29, 31 and 36.

Taylor plucked Hannan out of nowhere with 46 last year and ANB at 40 a few years back. Gawn was a 34th selection and both the McDonalds/Nev Jetta were over 50 picks. So it’s not as dire as a lot are making it out to be.

Historically the club has always done really well with our mid-late picks. But we've stuffed our top end picks which is what you need to nail and get some elite talent into the club. Touch wood looks like we've done well with Trac and Oliver.

The last 10 years aside from Jones then Frawley and Scully who have both left none of our high end picks even amounted to good footballers.

 

[TheCount]

Melbourne are a better team now than 2 weeks ago so from that point of view you would have to call it a success

This.

And while I would have liked to hold firm for a bit longer on Lever, it's no guarantee to have worked out ... Gold Coast took until the last minute and spent Pick 2 on Weller. Weller was taken with the pick before Lever in the draft, he's played 9 less games admittedly, but if you go to the AFL Rankings to at least get an idea on how they're tracking, Weller is ranked 42nd for Small/Medium Defenders and 237th overall ... Lever is ranked 4th for Key Defenders, and 88th overall.

We may have overpaid, but it was hardly the worst deal going around, and as I've said, I don't actually mind the Weller deal just because of Gold Coast's situation ... nor do I mind the Lever deal, because he'll play a big part in us playing finals next year and beyond.

 

[Djcjdees]

This.

And while I would have liked to hold firm for a bit longer on Lever, it's no guarantee to have worked out ... Gold Coast took until the last minute and spent Pick 2 on Weller. Weller was taken with the pick before Lever in the draft, he's played 9 less games admittedly, but if you go to the AFL Rankings to at least get an idea on how they're tracking, Weller is ranked 42nd for Small/Medium Defenders and 237th overall ... Lever is ranked 4th for Key Defenders, and 88th overall.

We may have overpaid, but it was hardly the worst deal going around, and as I've said, I don't actually mind the Weller deal just because of Gold Coast's situation ... nor do I mind the Lever deal, because he'll play a big part in us playing finals next year and beyond.

That Weller deal is pure incompetence though. I can't believe more is not being made of it. It was effectively Matera + Pick 2 for Weller. That is pure insanity and borderline AFL-needs-to-step-in-and-take-over territory.

They've traded out their BnF winner, best running back, and best small forward/goal sneak plus their best pick in the draft for a 25-gamer who looks ok-ish, and end of first/start of 2nd round pick, Aaron Young, a player yet to debut, a future 2nd round pick and a bunch of future 3rd round picks.

I realise they were hamstrung with the Ablett thing and did what they could I guess, but if that trade period was the absolute best they could do, they're in deep shite.

Could be wrong, and now I say this, they'll definitely beat us, but I don't see them even being competitive next year. At all.

 

[Topkent]

That Weller deal is pure incompetence though. I can't believe more is not being made of it. It was effectively Matera + Pick 2 for Weller. That is pure insanity and borderline AFL-needs-to-step-in-and-take-over territory.

They've traded out their BnF winner, best running back, and best small forward/goal sneak plus their best pick in the draft for a 25-gamer who looks ok-ish, and end of first/start of 2nd round pick, Aaron Young, a player yet to debut, a future 2nd round pick and a bunch of future 3rd round picks.

I realise they were hamstrung with the Ablett thing and did what they could I guess, but if that trade period was the absolute best they could do, they're in deep shite.

Could be wrong, and now I say this, they'll definitely beat us, but I don't see them even being competitive next year. At all.

May Day Lynch Thompson Wright Swallow Weller Martin Ainsworth Harbrow Hanley. Their is enough KPP talent there that if they can get a team playing for the coach and setting up well behind the ball they are still a good side IMO

 

[DemonTim]

May Day Lynch Thompson Wright Swallow Weller Martin Ainsworth Harbrow Hanley. Their is enough KPP talent there that if they can get a team playing for the coach and setting up well behind the ball they are still a good side IMO

Someone else also pointed out that they had a good few picks in last years and will have again next year in a better draft. They’ll go to two out of three drafts with a good selection of picks.
Pick 2 this year probably wasn’t all that valuable to them in the scheme of things.

Didn’t matera struggle this year too?

 

[TheCount]

That Weller deal is pure incompetence though. I can't believe more is not being made of it. It was effectively Matera + Pick 2 for Weller. That is pure insanity and borderline AFL-needs-to-step-in-and-take-over territory.

They've traded out their BnF winner, best running back, and best small forward/goal sneak plus their best pick in the draft for a 25-gamer who looks ok-ish, and end of first/start of 2nd round pick, Aaron Young, a player yet to debut, a future 2nd round pick and a bunch of future 3rd round picks.

I realise they were hamstrung with the Ablett thing and did what they could I guess, but if that trade period was the absolute best they could do, they're in deep shite.

Could be wrong, and now I say this, they'll definitely beat us, but I don't see them even being competitive next year. At all.

I actually feel sorry for them, it came up too late in the piece for them to get themselves in a better position. Freo do rate him VERY highly tho, most speak of him as their next captain, he's actually played 47 games, and he is a lot better than just "ok-ish" ... but that still doesn't make it a good deal.

I'm surprised St Kilda didn't step in with 7 and 8 for 2 and something a bit later on ... If this draft is really good in the first 4-5, I'd prefer the gun at two than the gambles at 7 and 8, particularly from the recruiting staff that took McCartin over Petracca.

 

[TheCount]

Someone else also pointed out that they had a good few picks in last years and will have again next year in a better draft. They’ll go to two out of three drafts with a good selection of picks.
Pick 2 this year probably wasn’t all that valuable to them in the scheme of things.

Didn’t matera struggle this year too?

Yeah exactly, doesn't really effect the amount of young talent they have on the books, plus Weller actually wants to play there.

Matera has been back and forth from the NEAFL for a couple of years, he's worth bugger all.

 

[DemonZombie_001]

I would suggest if the club is going to suffer for not extracting the maximum out of draft trade values, then this list is not going to achieve what we all want anyways.

The basic list is good enough to go all the way, it should only need minor adjustments now (like adding Lever).

 

[Topkent]

Someone else also pointed out that they had a good few picks in last years and will have again next year in a better draft. They’ll go to two out of three drafts with a good selection of picks.
Pick 2 this year probably wasn’t all that valuable to them in the scheme of things.

Didn’t matera struggle this year too?

Last year they took 5 inside 25 or something and have some good future picks aswell. Talent isn't really a problem for them, they just need some team players and some inside ball winners.

 

[Djcjdees]

Didn’t matera struggle this year too?

It's weird, every time I've seen him play, he's been good.

I think when a side is doing poorly, the small forward goal sneak is always the bloke who looks worst. Like Garlett. When we aren't playing well, he is absolutely absent. Might as well not be on the field. I reckon it's the same with Matera. I would have definitely thrown a third rounder at him to partner up with Garlett. Who else have we got to play that role? And what, you have one bad year and that means you're worth nothing? Stringer had a crap year and was dropped a few times. More runs on the board, sure, but still.

It's not just Matera though, this year has thrown me completely out of whack when it comes to what players are worth in terms of draft picks. Up until now it has at least made some sense, but this period with almost every trade I found myself missing the mark.

Like Watts for 31 but Wigg for 39. Understand they are different situations but I don't get that.

Matera for a future 3rd rounder, but Wigg for 39?? Is Wigg really worth that much more than Matera?

Pick 2 for Weller. OK, he's played 47 games. Averages 17 touches. Is he worth pick 2? Even close to pick 2?

Gibbs for 2 first rounders but Lever for 2 first rounders?

Charlie Cameron for pick 12?!

The list goes on. I know teams spend for what they need (except essendon) and every trade is different but this year is the weirdest I can remember

 

[Djcjdees]

Last year they took 5 inside 25 or something and have some good future picks aswell. Talent isn't really a problem for them, they just need some team players and some inside ball winners.

So you throw away pick 2? I think the game has moved past me and my old fashioned ways of actually valuing the second best pick in the draft.

 

[DemonTim]

So you throw away pick 2? I think the game has moved past me and my old fashioned ways of actually valuing the second best pick in the draft.

Not all drafts are equal. I’ve calmed on the two for lever thing, but even then my main issue was more that it left us with nothing to bargain with
Do Gold Coast want another 18 year old from somewhere in Australia that may or may not pan out? Or do they want a decent kid who wants to go there?

 

[Djcjdees]

Not all drafts are equal. I’ve calmed on the two for lever thing, but even then my main issue was more that it left us with nothing to bargain with
Do Gold Coast want another 18 year old from somewhere in Australia that may or may not pan out? Or do they want a decent kid who wants to go there?

Nah I get the whole wanting a player who wants to play there, but pick 2 was way too high a price to pay, equal drafts or no. I don't know everything that went on behind the scenes obviously but I'd like to think there were WAY more options available to them given a pick that high to do a deal that would have better served their club (and possibly got Weller there anyway). It smells of a decision made in desperation when it looked like it would fall through to me.

 

[Topkent]

So you throw away pick 2? I think the game has moved past me and my old fashioned ways of actually valuing the second best pick in the draft.

Huh? They have a potentially very good midfielder who is super keen to play his career there when they have been losing talent since their creation. Pick 2 will be a Victorian kid who may well be worse than Weller and then decides to go home after his contract.

 

[Demon4123]

Can someone please confirm the following.

Our main list loses Watts, Lumumba, Trengove, Garland, Hulett, Spencer and Kennedy.

In comes Lever, Balic and J Smith (rookie upgrade?)

Leaving us picks 29, 31, 36 and 47 to go to the draft with.

 

[Demon4123]

My previous post also shows that there will be some low jumper numbers up for grabs.

4, 8, 9, 20, 27, 33, and 35.

Also be interested to see if anyone is given the famous 31 jumper for season 2018.

I presume Lever will have first choice.

 

[Topkent]

My previous post also shows that there will be some low jumper numbers up for grabs.

4, 8, 9, 20, 27, 33, and 35.

Also be interested to see if anyone is given the famous 31 jumper for season 2018.

I presume Lever will have first choice.

My guess is Hunt and Maynard will change numbers as well

 

[pjfairbairn]

Anybody on here or here who we'd be interested in?

 

[dee_mac]

Anybody on here or here who we'd be interested in?

Michael Close or Nathan Drummond the only ones that remotely interest me. Can't imagine Lions letting Close go though. Drummond has had 2? ACL's now too

 

[CTHORANGE]

Adelaide's desperation for Gibbs makes our early trade of two 1st rounders for Lever even worse.

Our first and a second was more than fair and there's no excuse for not at least waiting until week 2 to make the trade - especially given Balic was our only other consideration and a formality.

Yes I do wonder if there was any serious discussion in trying to reach a 3 way deal with us, Adelaide and Carlton, where we may have come out a little better

 

[Russian Demon]

Tex coming out saying saying Gibbs ok and has charachter because he took a pay cut.

Left mid contract. Was he a captain?

That penny pinching flog is giving me the sh1ts. What a piss poor individual.


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