List Mgmt. 2017 Trade & Free Agency Discussion Thread

[GarnerSmash]

As was Sam Wright too I think .

Nope

 

[Snake_Baker]

Nope

Came through the bushies on time with JZ, correct?

 

[GarnerSmash]

Came through the bushies on time with JZ, correct?

Yep

 

[RobZombie]

We couldn't land them when we were making prelims either. We don't offer enough media attention/personal sponsorship deals/paths into high visibility careers after football. I think that's a major deterrents for star players and their managers would be telling them that money now at North might not be worth as much as less money at Collingwood or Richmond in the long run.

Even then though, the conventional wisdom was that we were pushing for a year or two then destined to go off a cliff. So young stars might have looked at other lists as better positioned for sustainable success. That's assuming that success is a major factor in choosing where to play. The ones we did get were at a point in their career where a short term push was a good bet.

The post-Carey era list management stuffups have had very long-reaching consequences.

Once the rebuild gets some momentum I don't think the small club thing will hurt that much. Word gets around and all the guys who have come in have said how much they enjoyed the change of scene.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Waldron stuffed up our plans by revealing them a long way out and Martin & Kelly were subjected to a long drawn out psychological bombardment.

The begging, in Martins case, is something that is unprecedented in my time of watching footy.

Once Richmond came good with the coin, there was enormous pressure on Martin to re-sign.

As for Kelly, something shifted very late in the picture. As it turned out it really isn't a big issue in the short term as he needs players to compliment him. We will be much better positioned in a couple of years.

This whole idea of "destination envy" is a fallacy.

 

[Shermanator]

Waldron stuffed up our plans by revealing them a long way out and Martin & Kelly were subjected to a long drawn out psychological bombardment.

The begging, in Martins case, is something that is unprecedented in my time of watching footy.

Once Richmond came good with the coin, there was enormous pressure on Martin to re-sign.

As for Kelly, something shifted very late in the picture. As it turned out it really isn't a big issue in the short term as he needs players to compliment him. We will be much better positioned in a couple of years.

This whole idea of "destination envy" is a fallacy.

Yep true dat Tef.

The pressure the media put on these young kids is astronomical.

The railroading comments created by the commenters (Exhibit A - wreck-em Ralphy) pushing their clubs agendas is sickening. It would be bloody gut wrenching making a multi million dollar decision in your mid twenties nowadays, let alone the fanboi media firing out guilt trips at every opportunity...

 

[lockheed]

...smartass by nature

Isn't that the minimum qualification for being on this board

 

[Tas]

Waldron stuffed up our plans by revealing them a long way out and Martin & Kelly were subjected to a long drawn out psychological bombardment.

The begging, in Martins case, is something that is unprecedented in my time of watching footy.

Once Richmond came good with the coin, there was enormous pressure on Martin to re-sign.

As for Kelly, something shifted very late in the picture. As it turned out it really isn't a big issue in the short term as he needs players to compliment him. We will be much better positioned in a couple of years.

This whole idea of "destination envy" is a fallacy.

I think you have to chase players because of the time it takes to develop players, if you recruit certain players to fill required roles and they don't make it but others do, you are left with gaps you can't quickly fix, it takes time to draft a new player and develop them. Trading and free-agency can help to fill those gaps, like Hawks when they were poaching players to fill holes.

But they had enough of the elements of a good team already.

I don't think we do. I think if Kelly signed we would have gone from a bad team to a more competitive team, it would have cost us a lot to get him and we would have likely gone back to being a side that is in contention for the last couple of spots in the top 8. I don't think that is setting our sights high enough.

I think perhaps the Martin and Kelly deals was somewhat symbiotic, I think if Martin chose to move, Kelly would have as well. I think if you inject two A grade mids and combine that with Cunnington, you could then bump off the B/C graders then add McDonald, Dumont, Clarke and Ahern to the lesser roles then that would provide a significant step-up. I don't blame the club trying to do that.

However, now that ship has sailed, I think we need to go back to overhauling that development. Which teams do you think have the best midfield structure? Which clubs develop midfielders the best, from recruitment to development? I think our poaching efforts need to move into the off-field. We have a lot of young developing mids atm and I think we should be getting a whole bunch more over the next couple of off-seasons. I think we have to focus on creating the best developing environment. At this moment, Cunnington is the only midfielder we have that is worth anything, yet even he needs a lot of work on what he should be doing outside of stoppages.

 

[GreatBradScott]

I like Smith, but it's not really on the list of priorities if he can't win clearances.

 

[FastLife]

Is Toby Greene open to returning to Victoria?

 

[koshari]

Is Toby Greene open to returning to Victoria?

you rated his prelim?

 

[koshari]

I think if Kelly signed we would have gone from a bad team to a more competitive team, it would have cost us a lot to get him and we would have likely gone back to being a side that is in contention for the last couple of spots in the top 8. I don't think that is setting our sights high enough.

possibly so however you can only attempt to improve the list with means available to you, Iam sure all 18 teams want to win the flag, and all are competing withing the same system to try to improve their lists. the fact GWS recently got a huge leg up on the opposition simply cannot be erased in the short term.

our current weakness is likely attributed to our neglect in recruiting quality mids in recent history, why that was the case only the inner scrotum could answer,

possibly we saw our priorities were KPPs or there was also a beleif to recruit the best available regardless of type of player, maybe we just havnt had enough high pics to get access to the better mids in the last few years, and finally the GWS consessions likely cost all teams access to the top end talent. (which is pretty evedent by every one else picking at the crums or trying to lure the cream of their list the last few years

 

[Unity-28]

you rated his prelim?

he wasnt great in the prelim, but hes a great player.

 

[King Corey]

Is Toby Greene open to returning to Victoria?

Dunno. But that's not a reason not to start a dedicated thread to the topic, take the piss out of McGWS in the process and then enjoy the fallout when he doesn't come.

 

[FastLife]

you rated his prelim?

I think his playing out of Position. His a midfielder imo.

 

[koshari]

he wasnt great in the prelim, but hes a great player.

fair enough , not the first talented player to have a quiet final, cotch is a good example, i suppose the cream are going to have a day out in a final sooner or later, on the other hand you can get the glenn freeborn types that just bob up unexpectedly and really shine in a final.

 

[Horizons_00]

With the lack of contract signings I suspect our plan C is in progress

 

[Twinkletoes]

With the lack of contract signings I suspect our plan C is in progress

C = Crap ourselves.







*not really

 

[Horizons_00]

C = Crap ourselves.







*not really

C = Cry ourselves to sleep because no one wants to come to norf

 

[Firestarter]

More so next year I think mate, with so many blokes coming out of contract and a supposed super-draft looming.

Every year is supposedly the year the coach gets sacked.

Let's clamp down on that cliche.

 

[Tas]

possibly so however you can only attempt to improve the list with means available to you, Iam sure all 18 teams want to win the flag, and all are competing withing the same system to try to improve their lists. the fact GWS recently got a huge leg up on the opposition simply cannot be erased in the short term.

our current weakness is likely attributed to our neglect in recruiting quality mids in recent history, why that was the case only the inner scrotum could answer,

possibly we saw our priorities were KPPs or there was also a beleif to recruit the best available regardless of type of player, maybe we just havnt had enough high pics to get access to the better mids in the last few years, and finally the GWS consessions likely cost all teams access to the top end talent. (which is pretty evedent by every one else picking at the crums or trying to lure the cream of their list the last few years

We needed to replace a lot of our key position players, I agree it was more of a priority back when we started. Brown looks good. Durdin, Nielson and VW look promising as well. Wood looks good, when on the park. Even Preuss looks promising in terms of future ruck stock. By comparison our midfield is bad, real bad and I think it is exacerbated by mediocre midfield recruitment and development. So I think that part of the football department needs to be overhauled. We need a midfield that can run both ways, aggressively, for four quarters. We need to have enough defensive pressure in the middle and on the flanks that we can run with a default back six, we are getting slaughtered when we have to push more back.

 

[Johnny99]

our midfield is bad, real bad and I think it is exacerbated by mediocre midfield recruitment and development. So I think that part of the football department needs to be overhauled. We need a midfield that can run both ways, aggressively, for four quarters. We need to have enough defensive pressure in the middle and on the flanks that we can run with a default back six, we are getting slaughtered when we have to push more back.

To be fair, these type of midfielders (great users of the ball, excellent endurance runners, can hit targets on both feet,etc), are generally found in the pick 1 to 5 territory. Not the pick 10 to 15 territory. Which is what North have had the last 5 years. Sure, you can still pick a gem with a late pick, but this is reliant on luck. Unfortunately north havent been that lucky. Although, Dec Mountford might be an exception....Fingers crossed.

 

[Only Forwards]

Waldron stuffed up our plans by revealing them a long way out and Martin & Kelly were subjected to a long drawn out psychological bombardment.

The begging, in Martins case, is something that is unprecedented in my time of watching footy.

Once Richmond came good with the coin, there was enormous pressure on Martin to re-sign.

As for Kelly, something shifted very late in the picture. As it turned out it really isn't a big issue in the short term as he needs players to compliment him. We will be much better positioned in a couple of years.

This whole idea of "destination envy" is a fallacy.

Fallacy or not we should be using it.

I'd take a team of hard as f*** shinboners who know people don't like us and don't care.

We should build it to be an us against the world mentality.

Hard at the man, hard at the ball, required effort always.

 

[FastLife]

So Daniel Menzel is the latest name linked to the club. I would be ok with that pick up.

 

[giantroo]