List Mgmt. 2017 Trade Period - Done and dusted for 2017. Thank you SOS!

[BluesRule]

Basing next years positions on this year's fraught with danger...

Probably right, but no doubt will be reminded by many if the above doesn't eventuate.

Would be a classic if we get up to that 9th to 13th range.

Post trades and delistings/retirements a lot of teams may move a fair bit in 2018.

Now if we can just get some ready to go draftees like LDU/Rayner.

 

[Blueyourmyboy!!]

So who SOS got in mind for pick 10??

 

[ParapMarkets]

I actually think Adelaide did well out of the trade period overall, they over paid for 29 yo Gibbs but got overs for Cameron and Lever, they now have 2 first round picks in what is being called a Super draft next year and moved up from pick 16 to 12 this year.

I am a fan of Gibbs but we had to take that deal, it will assist our long term prospects. I think we had a perfect storm; They lost the grand final, then got paid 2 first rounders for Lever (the fact that Melbourne coughed up early helped us as it gave them time to deal for Gibbs), then Cameron wanted to leave so they had an abundance of first rounders with a need to bring talent in the door.

 

[Blue__Balls]

Basing next years positions on this year's fraught with danger...

Probably right, but no doubt will be reminded by many if the above doesn't eventuate.

Best case scenario for them is they gave up Pick 10, and downgraded their 16 (2017) and 35 (2018) to 20 and 38 (2018).

Best case.

Entirely possible that they fall short in September given they've lost players in Lever, Cameron and Smith while only bringing in Gibbs to their best 22. Also possible that we rise a few more spots given we've only lost Gibbs but have brought in Kennedy and Lang as likely starters, and we'll regain Cripps and Curnow who missed the last 8 or so rounds.

Worst case scenario for Adelaide is it was Pick 10 and downgrade 16 and 30 to 25 and 43.

I don't think we reamed them that hard, but it's certainly a steep price for a 28yo mid. Offset a bit in the grand scheme because they secured good deals for Lever and Cameron. So in fairness, given we judge our trade period on the overall ins and outs, if we do the same for Adelaide they've probably broken even.

OUT: Lever, Cameron, Wigg, 16, 35, 54, 91, future third, future fourth
IN: Gibbs, Gibson, 12, 54, 77, future first (Mel), future second (Car), future third (Car)

Lost two starting 22 players, brought one in plus a reliable senior role player.
Upgraded their first round pick this year.
Added another first round pick next year.
Gave up their second rounder this year.
Grabbed an extra second rounder next year.

 

[agro]

I see you're still saying this even though I explained to you why it was smart list management, although you did just ignore that.

I don’t see it as smart List management to extend a contract beyond 1 year, when there are no other suitors for the player - it’s actually quite stupid.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

I don’t see it as smart List management to extend a contract beyond 1 year, when there are no other suitors for the player - it’s actually quite stupid.

It's not at all. It is smart to extend a contract when other clubs aren't interested at the time. No one to drive his price up. It's strange to think waiting till he's in demand is the right time to sign him up as his price would be higher. That's stupid.

Plus Sos and the coaches are confident he'll come good, so the logical decision is to lock him in before he does and the resulting price rise. It's strange that you can't see either point.

 

[HARKER]

Gibbs for a pick #10 wouldn't have been completely unfair. (Mitchell went @ 14 last year) but it's still wonderful what came about with the #16 though.
Turned an ordinary pick into Kennedy a pick #30 down from our #40 (good get in a shallow draft) and a future 2nd. in a good draft that could be a ~#25
Impressive.

Also: What happened to Matt Shaw?

 

[Gethelred]

And our 2nds went to poo after we lost Phillips

Just quietly, they also went to shit as their starting KPD all either got injured or promoted, too...

 

[bluemahogany]

How long is the DFA period, so I dont have to keep worrying about picking up Matt Shaw

 

[Luv_our_club]

IMO, Carlton WIN trade period by a mile! Well done.



In: Matthew Kennedy, Darcy Lang, Matthew Lobbe, pick 10, 30, 73, 2018 second-round pick (Adelaide), 2018 second-round pick (Western Bulldogs), 2018 fourth-round pick (Geelong)

Out: Bryce Gibbs, pick 40, 58, 77, 95, 2018 third-round pick, 2018 fourth-round pick

Win: Young onballers and bolstered hands for the next two NAB AFL Drafts

Lose: Arguably their best midfielder

2017 draft picks: 3, 10, 30, 73

 

[agro]

It's not at all. It is smart to extend a contract when other clubs aren't interested at the time. No one to drive his price up. It's strange to think waiting till he's in demand is the right time to sign him up as his price would be higher. That's stupid.

Plus Sos and the coaches are confident he'll come good, so the logical decision is to lock him in before he does and the resulting price rise. It's strange that you can't see either point.

Because it’s Andrew Phillips and he’s not that good, no-one was and will be knocking on his door.

 

[SkyhorseTamer]

Because it’s Andrew Phillips and he’s not that good, no-one was and will be knocking on his door.

Jeez. You're impossible. You don't know his ceiling better than our own coaches. You clearly don't understand that if his form picks up he'll ask for more money next contract regardless of whether other teams are interested. It really is not difficult.

 

[Aphrodite]

Good grief!

 

[ferrisb]

Port Adelaide need to get Lobbe off their books to accomodate the salaries of Rockliff, Motlop and Watts.

We offer to take Lobbe and his salary in exchange for our pick 95 and for Port throwing in an earlier pick in return to us.

If Port don’t do the deal then they are stuck with Lobbe and his salary and can’t accomodate the three players they want to bring in.

We stand our ground/hold our nerve till they do the deal or we walk away.

Port can’t delist Lobbe without his salary being included in their cap, they will want him off the books so they can bring the other three players in.

It’s not that hard to grasp.

Would the AFL allow a trade where a player has a definitive negative value?

It would have been nice to get Lobbe AND pick 46 for pick 95, but dont think it would be allowed.

In our GWS4 trade, Sumner and Lamb had negative value, but it was implied rather than explicit.

Although I consider getting Plowman for pick 28 to be the xxx-type of explicit.

 

[BIGGUS 64]

But most of those comments are still in play..... (God forbid) an injury to Martin in the preseason and a tough draw could easily see pressure on the Tigers next year. A premiership hangover like the WB could see calls for Hardwick and a slow start could whip up the +90k supporter base (mostly bandwagoners) into microwaves and chicken shat after initial expectations. These comments relate to the supporters as much as the club so they are ever present.

The only thing that has changed are comments related to winning finals/ premierships/ the rebuild . God knows a lil pressure could lead to 9thmond again next year

And it's such a great song. I'm not ready to let it go just yet!

 

[Shambolic]

No trades today?

 

[Shambolic]

Jeez. You're impossible. You don't know his ceiling better than our own coaches. You clearly don't understand that if his form picks up he'll ask for more money next contract regardless of whether other teams are interested. It really is not difficult.

Cheap back-up in a tough position in a list = Insurance. Clever list managers protect for that.

If Phillips was on $1m we'd all agree that that's a terrible idea. But he's not.

EDIT: With Lobbe on the list Phillips won't play another game now

 

[rog1995]

Gibbs for a pick #10 wouldn't have been completely unfair. (Mitchell went @ 14 last year) but it's still wonderful what came about with the #16 though.
Turned an ordinary pick into Kennedy a pick #30 down from our #40 (good get in a shallow draft) and a future 2nd. in a good draft that could be a ~#25
Impressive.

Also: What happened to Matt Shaw?

That pick 16 ended up getting us Matt Kennedy and pick 30 and a future second rounder.

 

[The Dominator7]

Would the AFL allow a trade where a player has a definitive negative value?

It would have been nice to get Lobbe AND pick 46 for pick 95, but dont think it would be allowed.

In our GWS4 trade, Sumner and Lamb had negative value, but it was implied rather than explicit.

Although I consider getting Plowman for pick 28 to be the xxx-type of explicit.

I honestly don't know whether you can get away with that sort of thing, didn't the AFL tighten things up after the Veale deal ??

 

[Soapy V]

As they say, the easiest person to fool is yourself.

He's not far off. The best way for us is to win the flag next year and hope Crows slide.

 

[Zlatan]

Gibbs for a pick #10 wouldn't have been completely unfair. (Mitchell went @ 14 last year) but it's still wonderful what came about with the #16 though.
Turned an ordinary pick into Kennedy a pick #30 down from our #40 (good get in a shallow draft) and a future 2nd. in a good draft that could be a ~#25
Impressive.

Also: What happened to Matt Shaw?

I’m unshaw

 

[Metalcrusher]

If you live to be 70 years old you will spend TEN YEARS of your life on Monday

 

[mediumsizered]

I don’t see it as smart List management to extend a contract beyond 1 year, when there are no other suitors for the player - it’s actually quite stupid.

Given you have such wisdom in the ways of list management, I would encourage you to forward your CV to the Carlton Football Club at your earliest convenience. We are obviously being sold short by our current crew.

 

[My name geoff]

I actually think Adelaide did well out of the trade period overall, they over paid for 29 yo Gibbs but got overs for Cameron and Lever, they now have 2 first round picks in what is being called a Super draft next year and moved up from pick 16 to 12 this year.

I am a fan of Gibbs but we had to take that deal, it will assist our long term prospects. I think we had a perfect storm; They lost the grand final, then got paid 2 first rounders for Lever (the fact that Melbourne coughed up early helped us as it gave them time to deal for Gibbs), then Cameron wanted to leave so they had an abundance of first rounders with a need to bring talent in the door.

I don't agree with the consensus that the crows got overs for Cameron. I would have taken Cameron over pick 10.

Just turned 23 years of age and ready to explode. Already a pretty proven finals performer and once he gets up to around the 100 game mark will be an absolute weapon. Reminds me of Michael Long the way he plays and funnily enough in 1993 Long turned 24 years of age.

Reckon of all the Crows dealings this off season, they will hurt the most for Cameron.

 

[Boy with chook]

Ratings are a bit of fun, but every club has different objectives.

For 9 days we were seemingly being compared to Essendon and Port with the whole "can't attract players" narrative, but from the outside seemed to be headed down completely opposite paths.

Both clubs would be thrilled they landed their targets, but neither come into the draft until around the mid 40's, whilst we obviously now have 3 in the top 30, as well as 2 in the top 10.

The type of player are also polar opposites. Smith/Saad/Stringer and Rockliff/Motlop/Watts are absolute boom or bust in terms of output and attitude.

Eventually that might be the kind of risks we need to take to complete what we've started, but it just feels to early for this group to take that risk.

Lang/Lobbe/Kennedy are more meat and potatoes, but from the outside have zero question on character and attitude and will fit in to what we are building. Lobbe in particular never has a bad word spoken about him, and was made Vice Captain for a reason.

Whilst not high profile, Kennedy was chased by Brisbane, Hawthorn, Essendon and Lang, Nth and Gold Coast, so we aren't the lepers people are making us out to be.

What can't be underestimated is the fact that no other players bar Gibbs were seeking a trade, with the majority of the young players keen to sign extensions.

Yesterday was another step towards out goal. Congratulations to the club for ignoring outside noise and continuing down this road.

Previous "rebuilds" have been rushed to the point where as an example when we were supposedly challenging from 2009-2011, we still had the likes of Bower, Ellard, Davies, Hadley, Warnock, Joseph, Setanta etc in our finals best 22.

Rather than a hail mary at a flag, the club is sticking to the sustained success road map.

Next year can't come soon enough.

Can’t like this enough


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