Prediction 2019 "Hypothetical Trade, FA, random player you wish we could get" thread..

[Ned Ryerson]

I've watched a lot of his games this year it's not the same thing as a bloke like cousins getting 30 in the VFL. You need to watch the way he moves and positions himself, and the way he kicks. He's absolute class. He put them over the goal umpires hat from 50 with absolute ease.

Tom Boyd was a consensus first pick in his draft - was apparently going to come in and dominate at AFL level. It never transpired. I'm not saying that Anderson will end up this way - I am not saying he doesn't look excellent playing in the NAB League. However the step up from that level to AFL is immense and it's why the best player in most drafts isn't the number 1 pick in retrospect. There is a lot of water to go under the bridge - and overpaying for an untested kid is absolutely high risk.

 

[Changa10]

Spot on - it's a discussion - these keyboard warriors stroll in and claim it's a fact. Happy for them to make suggestions, just don't lie and say it's 100% certain when you have no idea.

Yep - but it won't - not a chance in hell we trade for pick 2.

Hmmm, well played keyboard warrior!! And these two posts are within 1 minute of each other.......just sayin'

 

[Bugs1977]

It's not about the fact that it's a good "Hawthorn story" - it's that this kid is a genuine jet. You don't average 30 touches and close to 3 goals a game at any level of competition unless you're an unbelievable prospect.

That's exactly what Anderson averaged over the NAB League.

Don't even worry about explain yourself Rogie. The fact some one here think that the club would let go of a quality player/s + our 2020 1st for a kid just because he was close to being a FS and not the fact that he could very well end up being the best player in the comp I find absolutely laughable. I honestly and truly believe that Noah Anderson has the chance to be a top 10 player in the next 5 years.

Cast your mind back to midway through the season when we were 5 wins and 9 losses. I started to advocate us playing some of our Box Hill kids and to give guys Smith, Gunston and others a rest because you could clearly see they were playing hurt. Most called this strategy tanking which I don't totally agree with as I don't see playing your kids as tanking but more so development stage. The reality is that we were never going to finish lower than GC but if we finished say where Carlton or Melbourne did then the chance of dealing for Noah would be a lot easier than it is now. I've said all along that Noah would've been a great insurance policy if Coniglio ended up staying and the worse thing that could happen would be is to miss out on both.

 

[Spursfan]

 

[WWSD]

Trading out established players for picks has now defeated the whole purpose of getting Mitchell, Wingard and O’Meara. They were all told that the club will be trying to win a Premiership with this group. How do you think they’d feel right now?

 

[Dewnior]

Frankly I'm disgusted at all this talk of trading Smith + Bruest or Gunston + a draft pick for pick 2.

Excuse me but precisely when did Dean Anderson suddenly become Hawthorn royalty?!? He is no Hawk legend, didn't even play 100 games for the club, he was a handy player who'd struggle to break into the top 50 Hawthorn players I've seen in my lifetime. We have no moral obligation whatsoever to move heaven & earth to get his child to Hawthorn, and if the club offered either of them assurances we would then it acted irresponsibly.

From what I understand Noah Anderson is a possible future A grade midfielder. POSSIBLE. Not certain. Handing over the likes of Bruest or Gunston along with Smith and the rest of the kitchen sink when the league is littered with young-ish mids at other clubs who could be lured cheaper (Wines, Crouch etc) suggests the primary reason our club would go to such desperate lengths to grab Anderson at any cost is due to the family connection.

Well folks, there is little room for sentimentality in football if you aim to win Premierships. If we can lure Anderson in a few years after his GC contract expires, well and good. If not, tough t***ies and I won't lose a wink of sleep because of it. We need to be money-balling players with untapped potential not paying through the nose for hyped 19 year olds. If GC have any sense whatsoever they'll sniff Hawthorn's desperation and bend us over a barrel - no thanks!

You need to tell this to Clarko. Unfortunately he's a stubborn bastard. When he gets an idea in his head he's like a dog with a bone.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

Trading out established players for picks has now defeated the whole purpose of getting Mitchell, Wingard and O’Meara. They were all told that the club will be trying to win a Premiership with this group.

As I said it shows disjointed list management and a via in direction. But I don't think the current direction is going to get us the ultimate prize I must add.

 

[Holy Rioli]

why are we melting like it's 100% confirmed we are going after pick 2? It's all just rumour at this stage.

 

[HODGEYROAD]

why are we melting like it's 100% confirmed we are going after pick 2? It's all just rumour at this stage.

I think that's just the norm around here, melting left right and centre before anyone really knows what's going to happen haha.

 

[Billyc]

Tom Boyd was a consensus first pick in his draft - was apparently going to come in and dominate at AFL level. It never transpired. I'm not saying that Anderson will end up this way - I am not saying he doesn't look excellent playing in the NAB League. However the step up from that level to AFL is immense and it's why the best player in most drafts isn't the number 1 pick in retrospect. There is a lot of water to go under the bridge - and overpaying for an untested kid is absolutely high risk.

All reports have him very similar to Petracca as a junior. Every top 2 pick is very highly rated as a junior. Not every top 2 pick ends up being a superstar.

Anyway, let's see what happens. I'm not going to get worked up over internet rumours at this point as they have nearly all been wrong to date. But if we trade very heavily for an early pick that would surprising based on the list management of the last few seasons unless- having finished mid-ladder once again - the club is now looking to change direction (though Patton and Frost don't really fit with that).

 

[Ned Ryerson]

why are we melting like it's 100% confirmed we are going after pick 2? It's all just rumour at this stage.

Nobody is melting - this is civilised discourse...mostly.

 

[A Cut Above]

Trading out established players for picks has now defeated the whole purpose of getting Mitchell, Wingard and O’Meara. They were all told that the club will be trying to win a Premiership with this group. How do you think they’d feel right now?

Precisely.

We don't have the luxury of waiting around while 19 year olds develop hardened bodies capable of impacting finals. Our clock is very much ticking, unless the club feels our chances of pinching a flag in the short or medium term are negligible in which case suddenly changing our attitude towards the value of draft picks might be the way to go. However that'd make the JOM & Wingard trades feel questionable unless we can strike while those two are still in their prime.

 

[PenAndPaper]

No, I said the REASON WE ARE SO DESPERATE is due to his family connection. I did not say that was the SOLE REASON we want him in the first place. Please work harder on your reading comprehension if you're going to argue with me in future as I dislike being forced to make the same point twice.

You wrote "the only reason" that sounds very much the same as the sole reason...

 

[cryptor]

Spot on - it's a discussion - these keyboard warriors stroll in and claim it's a fact. Happy for them to make suggestions, just don't lie and say it's 100% certain when you have no idea.

The only thing that I stated as facts were the things that have already happened. Indisputable. The rest was merely pointing out that the club isn't above trading much loved stars of the club based on that history.

We've done it recently. We've done it multiple times. We've done it for seemingly little to nothing in return.

They may not be popular trades. They may not even happen because there are multiple parties to every trade. But the club is no stranger to making bold, risky and tough calls on current players.

 

[A Cut Above]

You wrote "the only reason" that sounds very much the same as the sole reason...

Which was not my intention, but feel free to take it any way you like.

How about this guys? Convince me chasing a talented 19 year old midfielder is the absolute best way Hawthorn can spend equivalent of two first round picks. Bear in mind there are talented 19 year old midfielders in the draft every. single. year. So what makes this year so special? We all know the answer don't we.

The only thing that I stated as facts were the things that have already happened. Indisputable. The rest was merely pointing out that the club isn't above trading much loved stars of the club based on that history.

We've done it recently. We've done it multiple times. We've done it for seemingly little to nothing in return.

They may not be popular trades. They may not even happen because there are multiple parties to every trade. But the club is no stranger to making bold, risky and tough calls on current players.

Great point.

Look, I'm not worried in the slightest at the prospect of Graham Wright & Clarko making harsh calls on Premiership players. I trust them implicitly and the epic pisstake of recruiting Mitchell Lewis has suitably de-sensitized me. Heck in a comp as cutthroat as this one I'd even argue their willingness to separate emotion from the equation is a distinct advantage.

What's troubling is the rumor we're going after Anderson would seem to contravene that mindset. The notion we'd be willing to get rogered at the trade table largely because his old man played 83 games for club feels disgustingly sentimental and outdated, a world away from the cold calculated decisions to move on Mitchell, Lewis and co.

 

[cryptor]

Trading out established players for picks has now defeated the whole purpose of getting Mitchell, Wingard and O’Meara. They were all told that the club will be trying to win a Premiership with this group. How do you think they’d feel right now?

They might recognise that when Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell were the same age as them the club was still in the early stages of recruiting the young talent that supported them in winning a threepeat of flags. There's plenty of time for them.

 

[daniel23]

Look at some of the top 10 last year how excited would everyone on here be if we had one of those players on our list?. All look like potential a graders with some already making massive improvements to there teams already . Rowell and Anderson are ranked higher then most and would have gone close to number 1 pick last year if they were in it.

As for as poor list management I see it the other way , you have to be ruthless in footy these days and our club has been thats why success has followed . Trade off older players with value while they have some decent footy in them but lets get real we arent winning a flag in the next 2 years by that time these players rumoured to be tradeable decline . The way our trading has gone its set up to pinch a flag without sustained success , i hope the club does go down a younger path . You just have to look at what worpel did this year to show what a young player is capable of if they have the ability .

As far as trading in o'meara, Mitchell , Wingard it's still the right move they're our core with along Sicily, Lewis, Hardwick, scrimshaw and worpel the others to build around. Nail you're drafting and you're competing with that team in 2/3 years .

 

[Platten44]

They might recognise that when Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell were the same age as them the club was still in the early stages of recruiting the young talent that supported them in winning a threepeat of flags. There's plenty of time for them.

No - when Hodge and Sam were 24/25 we were trading out draft picks to bring experienced talent in

 

[The Kipster]

100%. The weird romance Hawk fans feel toward Anderson (who doesn't support Hawthorn) because his dad played some games here is irrelevant.

I remember how good he was, he is a Hawthorn Premiership player twice...hardly irrelevant, as he went on to play great footy at the Aints as well.

 

[cryptor]

What's troubling is the rumor we're going after Anderson would seem to contravene that mindset. The notion we'd be willing to get rogered at the trade table largely because his old man played 83 games for club feels disgustingly sentimental and outdated, a world away from the cold calculated decisions to move on Mitchell, Lewis and co.

Who says that's the actual reason we're interested in him? I'd suggest the fact that he's proven to be an elite, young talent to be way more relevant, and more than enough reason to move mountains to get him.

Remember when the club moved mountains to get pick 1 to draft some fat kid from Colac?

If Wrighty sees something in Noah Anderson that makes him want to make a big move to get him now then I'll gladly back him. If that is the case then I'd say he probably reckons he'd cost more than that top 2 pick to trade for him down the line.

 

[cryptor]

No - when Hodge and Sam were 24/25 we were trading out draft picks to bring experienced talent in

Yeah, and drafting Rioli, Shiels, Smith, Breust, Stratton, Puopolo, Hill, Suckling, Duryea, Whitecross, Schoenmakers...

 

[Platten44]

Yeah, and drafting Rioli, Shiels, Smith, Breust, Stratton, Puopolo, Hill, Suckling, Duryea, Whitecross, Schoenmakers...

Yep and none with a pick higher than Rioli at 12

 

[A Cut Above]

Look at some of the top 10 last year how excited would everyone on here be if we had one of those players on our list?. All look like potential a graders with some already making massive improvements to there teams already

We already had a young potential A grader in Burton whom we traded for a 26 year in Wingard. That was the direction our list management's been headed, following on from the Mitchell & JOM trades - a distinct medium term focus.

Succeeding that up by blowing most of our wad on a 19 year old would constitute a radical change of direction which I've yet to be convinced is advisable or necessary. Anderson may be a "special" prospect but the draft contains a handful of "special" prospects each and every year. So why now? If the answer is family, that's a very poor answer. Particularly when you consider recent ruthlessness towards multi-Premiership players.

I'll say it again - Dean Anderson was NOT a Hawthorn legend or even close. He was a good-but-not-amazing half forward flanker.

Who says that's the actual reason we're interested in him? I'd suggest the fact that he's proven to be an elite, young talent to be way more relevant, and more than enough reason to move mountains to get him.

Remember when the club moved mountains to get pick 1 to draft some fat kid from Colac?

If Wrighty sees something in Noah Anderson that makes him want to make a big move to get him now then I'll gladly back him. If that is the case then I'd say he probably reckons he'd cost more than that top 2 pick to trade for him down the line.

We've been trading away our first round picks steadily for about a decade and even gone on record as saying we think they're overvalued, then suddenly an elite prospect who's dad played for Hawthorn comes along and its tyre screech time, complete 180 turnaround even though there's probably a midfield prospect on par with Anderson in just about every single draft.

Its possible we're into him purely for his talent. Its also possible we don't feel jibbed out of a father/son. Just not probable.

 

[cryptor]

Yep and none with a pick higher than Rioli in the teens.

Do guys drafted earlier than the back half of the first round and later rounds take longer to develop or something? Weird. Seems to me that a lot of them look pretty damn AFL standard relatively quickly. Especially those taken in the top few picks.

 

[SodaPop]

Noah will play almost every game next year. He’ll play mid and forward and play both exceptionally well.
If our club has a crack then they rate him highly enough to offer up something that will hurt.
I don’t think GC will seriously listen to any offers especially after hearing the interview with Rowell yesterday.