List Mgmt. 2020 List Management, Free Agency & Trade thread

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This is Part 1

The thread is continued in part 2:

 
I don’t think you need to include Cox in that though...
1. Sydney get JH, CB and pick 10. Give pick 4 (plus change either way)
2. Norf get pick 4 plus Schultz and Bewley. Give pick 2 (plus change either way?)
3. (Sorry joao) Adelaide get Crowden, Giro and pick 2. Give pick one (plus change)

Then we can use next years first to try get another pick inside this draft.

That said, if we can’t get LMcD, I’m really keen on Hollands

Sorry IMO, no way would NM give up pick 2 for Bewley. Shultz and pick 2. They are both fringe players that are a dime a dozen in the VFL/WAFL/SANFL. They could draft equally as good players from any of those leagues for nothing and keep pick 2. Same applies for Crowden and Giro, neither are best 22 players so why give up anything for them


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Cameron, Lynch, and Dixon weren't top ten picks, and Patton is an example of a disappointing pick.
Cameron was a mini draft pick to be fair but your point still stands. Patton is a bust and Bicco also left out Jono ORourke, the pick 2 from 2012 and another bust
edit: O’Rourke was an inside mid and not a key forward, my bad.
Interestingly stringer was pick 5 that year, another Underachieving key forward
 
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Think of Aaron Naughton drafted as a defender and is now killing it as a forward 🤷‍♀️ Or we switch Cox back to forward and Taylor can take the 3rd tall defender
You'd need to qualify "killing it". He's promising, but still pretty inconsistent and has a ways to go to be a sure bet as a forward.
 

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We’d obviously get later picks back for academy prospects. Hence the “and change”
Just a way to get there without giving up a b22 player

Sorry throwing in a number of worthless players doesn’t make a trade worth more. Pick 1 is worth 3000 draft points. If you were really really generous and said Hogan was worth pick 20, Blakely 30 and Bewley/Shuktz/Giro worth 40 each, they still only add up to 2828 points. You ALWAYS have to give up something to get something, no way any club would give up pick 1 for those players.


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I agree, but clearly the club doesn't. It's a Hogan fire sale, and desperate sellers tend not to get good deals.
Ross the Boss commented the same thing about the North Melbourne and Ben Brown.

Not sure the club is shopping Hogan around. Media make a lot of bs at this time of year.

Hogan's manager might be shopping him around.

If the club is looking to trade Hogan, they must play the denial game and don't approach any club.

Bell and co need to let Hogan's manager tell the world he wants to be traded to either the Giants or the Swans.

When approached by the Swans/Giants, Bell says he is a required player and won't listen to offers.

Swans/Giants then put an offer to us and tell them they are dreaming and need to come up with something special for the trade to made.
 
Walker was alright considering there weren't many to replace him at the time. Toia? Webster (always injured)? Bootsma? Our midfield was non-existent at the time and Walker was a handy little speedster.

Miss the days where it was:

Mitchell McManus Delaney

Burton Toia Callaghan
 
Think of Aaron Naughton drafted as a defender and is now killing it as a forward 🤷‍♀️ Or we switch Cox back to forward and Taylor can take the 3rd tall defender
Nah. With Pearce and Hamling playing, then Logue would be third tall. Ryan, Wilson and Young round out the back six.

Cox and Hughes better spend the summer working on their forward/wing craft.
 
Nah. With Pearce and Hamling playing, then Logue would be third tall. Ryan, Wilson and Young round out the back six.

Cox and Hughes better spend the summer working on their forward/wing craft.
It’s long overdue that people started to realise Ethan Hughes is a B22 player. He will be one of the first names on the team sheet for every game next season regardless of who is available. Yes - he may be an unfashionable Rookie draft pick. But he’s now an established B22, like it or not.
 
It’s long overdue that people started to realise Ethan Hughes is a B22 player. He will be one of the first names on the team sheet for every game next season regardless of who is available. Yes - he may be an unfashionable Rookie draft pick. But he’s now an established B22, like it or not.
Oh I like him, I think he's our Mihocek in sheep's clothing.
 
It’s long overdue that people started to realise Ethan Hughes is a B22 player. He will be one of the first names on the team sheet for every game next season regardless of who is available. Yes - he may be an unfashionable Rookie draft pick. But he’s now an established B22, like it or not.
Not sure he is best 22.

Hamling, Logue, and Pearce are best 22 with Cox being the unlucky one out.

Ryan is a no brainer best 22.

Hughes did a great job this year and deserves best 22 but we have a truck load of good defenders.

Hughes will be fighting with Wilson, Young, Conca , and Hill for the remaining three defenders roles.

Hughes most likely gets a game because somebody will be injured.

Should be interesting as 10 doesn't go into 7.
 
Not sure he is best 22.

Hamling, Logue, and Pearce are best 22 with Cox being the unlucky one out.

Ryan is a no brainer best 22.

Hughes did a great job this year and deserves best 22 but we have a truck load of good defenders.

Hughes will be fighting with Wilson, Young, Conca , and Hill for the remaining three defenders roles.

Hughes most likely gets a game because somebody will be injured.

Should be interesting as 10 doesn't go into 7.
On paper he may not be best 22 for some posters who pay attention to draft positions (I’m guilty of that myself at times).
The reality is he’s been voted the players MVP this season. He hasn’t missed a game since 2018 I don’t think? How established does a player need to be?
Watching finals footy in recent weeks gives me a new found appreciation for the warrior like qualities of Hughes.
 

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Hughes finished 7th in the Best and Fairest for a reason, he's a good player, Best 22 easily.
B and F is a good guide but it favors players who play most of the season.

People need to look at the structure and balance of our defense.

Pearce and Hamling ball use is below average.

Logue is ok and Hughes is about the same.

Ryan is awesome with the ball.

Conca is a bad kick.

Hill kicking his year was poor at times but before was elite.

Young will be an elite kick.

Wilson can run and carry.

If Hamling and Pearce come into the team, they need to be surrounded with elite kicks.
 
On paper he may not be best 22 for some posters who pay attention to draft positions (I’m guilty of that myself at times).
The reality is he’s been voted the players MVP this season. He hasn’t missed a game since 2018 I don’t think? How established does a player need to be?
Watching finals footy in recent weeks gives me a new found appreciation for the warrior like qualities of Hughes.
Hughes defensive efforts are elite and his courage is out of this world.

Hughes was a butcher of the ball but he has improved a lot in his area and its not a weakness or a strength.

Your point is that he is better than Logue.

Structurally Logue can play on the talls and smalls. Hughes at a stretch can take a small 2nd tall or a third tall.

My concern is that Hamling and Pearce are not great ball users.
 
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Ben Brown has met with Melbourne, the interview went well, they believe his body is sound,” Ralph said.

“They just haven’t got the cap space to offer him the $700,000 deal he thought he might be on at North Melbourne … Freo still keen on Ben Brown as well.”



Well he does have that McManus, Maine, Logue hairmop Freo needs. Ha.
 
Every year we have this conversation about Hughes. Go back to the B22 thread this time last year and posters will be explaining why he's not B22 whilst a handful of us will explain why he will be. He played 21 games in 2019 (missed one) and all 17 games this year.

He'll be there in the B22 round 1 2021. 7th in the Doig and the players' award during a new coach's first year and people think he's still fringe?!?

I'd also be very surprised if Cox isn't B22 in our backline come round 1. He transformed his body shape last off season and I think he'd have impressed if he played forward this season as well but he seems more comfortable as a defender alongside his best mate so I'd keep him there.
 
Every year we have this conversation about Hughes. Go back to the B22 thread this time last year and posters will be explaining why he's not B22 whilst a handful of us will explain why he will be. He played 21 games in 2019 (missed one) and all 17 games this year.

He'll be there in the B22 round 1 2021. 7th in the Doig and the players' award during a new coach's first year and people think he's still fringe?!?

I'd also be very surprised if Cox isn't B22 in our backline come round 1. He transformed his body shape last off season and I think he'd have impressed if he played forward this season as well but he seems more comfortable as a defender alongside his best mate so I'd keep him there.
B22 is when every player is available.
 
It was very evident from watching Richmond that not every member of a premiership team needs to tick every single box as a player. Just looking at the WA boys who some on here have described as complete spuds, Pickett, McIntosh, Broad and Baker none of these guys are stars but they have talent that is used by the team to achieve an outcome.

If we get to contend in the next few years I’m sure Hughes will be a big part of it.
 
i’m not sure if he will be best b22 if every single player was fit and ready but injuries are such a common part of the game and particularly with some of our defenders, Hughes will still play a shit ton of footy next season. I’d have our 6 defenders in a b22 as AP/Hamling/Ryan/Logue/Wilson/Young, and I’d have Hughes as the 7th defender on the bench over SHill based on 2020 form
 
Every year we have this conversation about Hughes. Go back to the B22 thread this time last year and posters will be explaining why he's not B22 whilst a handful of us will explain why he will be. He played 21 games in 2019 (missed one) and all 17 games this year.

He'll be there in the B22 round 1 2021. 7th in the Doig and the players' award during a new coach's first year and people think he's still fringe?!?

I'd also be very surprised if Cox isn't B22 in our backline come round 1. He transformed his body shape last off season and I think he'd have impressed if he played forward this season as well but he seems more comfortable as a defender alongside his best mate so I'd keep him there.
The players not in the 22 need to force their way in. Everyone starts on an even keel to start the season but those like Hughes, Cox and Conca have credits after a solid season missing minimal games.

As for Logue and Pearce they will have push their way into the B22 through pre-season games. You expect at least one of them to line up alongside Cox and be KPD. Hamling won’t be ready for a while so he will bide his time in rehab and then conditioning.

If Pearce gets the nod as KPD then Logue does have the capacity to play medium tall and compete with the likes of Hughes. As does Young. If player availability goes great guns someone will miss out and will be on form. Could be Pearce, could Logue or even Cox.

The forward line in 2020 whilst a work in progress had good availability in the back half which meant Hogan missed out.

All this trading talk started because Hogan had to spend a month in the scratchies. The media make their own mind up...asking each week at press conferences...”It’s Hogan what is going on there, why isn’t he getting a game”. Not reflecting on the fact that we played a bunch of games in the pouring rain and some others in slippery windy conditions.

Maybe Hogan got himself frustrated, maybe he didn’t. Is he shopping himself around or is the club due to an attitude concern - I don’t know but the media love this stuff. But if all the KPD are available and some are running around in whatever the second tier comp is there will also be some frustrated players. Im sure if it is Alex Pearce (aka Jim Morrison) he will work his butt off to get back into the team without a word of complaint.
 
Which is actually in Hughes' favour. He's never injured.

How did you rate Hughes' season this year? Did you think he was our 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th or 7th best defender? If not 2nd, who was better than him in your opinion?
Let's agree second best defender this year.

It's about structure and ball use.

McGill was the second best spinner behind Warne. Most likely the third or fourth best bowler at the time. But you don't pick 2 spinners in a team unless its a turning pitch.

This year we had Hamling, and Pearce missed the whole season. Logue miss 10 games and Cox 5 games.

Duiman played 15 games this year but I don't count him as best 22.

Ball users
Elite - Ryan
Good - Wilson, Hill, Cox, Young,
Average users - Hughes, Logue, Duiman, Watson
Below average - Hamling, Conca
Butchers - Pearce

Defensively
Elite - Hamling, Pearce, Ryan, Hughes,
Good - Logue, Conca,
Average - Duiman, Watson, Hill,
Below average - Wilson, Young, Cox
Poor -

Intercepts Marking
Elite - Ryan,
Good - Hamling, Pearce, Cox, Logue
Average - Young, Watson, Hughes, Conca, Hill, Duiman,
Below Average -
Poor - Wilson

Match Ups
Monsters - Hamling. Pearce,
Bigs - Logue, Hamling, Pearce, Cox
Third talls -Hughes, Watson, Duiman, Ryan, Hamling, Pearce, Logue,
General forwards - Conca, Hill, Hughes, Young, Watson, Duiman, Ryan, Hamling, Pearce, Logue
Small Forwards - Wilson, Hill, Conca, Logue

As you can see, it's depends on the balance of match ups, Defensive skills, ball use and intercept marking.
 
Have to chuckle at some of the posts in here saying Cox is squeezed out. Freo fans GOATs at romanticising players when they are off camera.

ALL defs need to intercept and then use it these days, no one just stops. Pearce isn't pushing Cox out. I'm not saying Pearce is no good, but JLo will definitely wear Cox being a less pure defending given he wins it back. FWIW Cox rated the 6th best KPD in league in Player Ratings.
 
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