Discussion 2022 General AFL Discussion

[ScrappyDo]

Lol rightio.

Im 35 so im old enough to remember Waverley and the good old days.

The broadcast is 100 times better than what it was. I dont like the gambling sponsorship either and im not advocating for it, just pointing out that nostalgia for the good old days doesnt mean they were better (we also used to be sponsored by a cigarette company so was that better too)?

Nostalgia isn't the driver here.
Irrespective of where their money comes from they have ducked the game day experience with a handful of specific inclusions. And it's the broadcasters that make the broadcast better, the AFL has absolutely nothing to do with it.
And before Sports Betting was the religion the AFL were doing just fine. They don't need the money, and should treat it like tobacco or racism. There's nothing that makes it ok to push on kids.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Daughter and Partner did Maple Leafs when in Canada, $350 each.

Supply and demand. In AFL we are oversupplied so the costs have to remain cheap enough for the family. Also it is a provincial game with a small population potentially attending. Not the luxury of 400 million in Europe or 350 million North Americans for their sports.

I'm mentioned a few times, but the NHL are big on the game day experience and so you can see it flow through to full stadiums and high ticket prices. Even if fans can only go once a year, they have an amazing time.

 

[Joffaboy]

I'm mentioned a few times, but the NHL are big on the game day experience and so you can see it flow through to full stadiums and high ticket prices. Even if fans can only go once a year, they have an amazing time.

Yes smaller arena, great light show, fun times cleaning the blood off the ice

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

I appreciate the nostalgia of the outer and suburban grounds and the like but if it stayed that way the game would be dead or at least in a tonne of debt.

they could always do a few marquee games at suburban grounds, just raise the prices to maintain profit due to smaller crowd size. Make it something special like a one off premiership points match at RSEA charge heaps and include signings from the players and meet and greets. Heritage round or something

 

[phantom13]

Nostalgia isn't the driver here.
Irrespective of where their money comes from they have ducked the game day experience with a handful of specific inclusions. And it's the broadcasters that make the broadcast better, the AFL has absolutely nothing to do with it.
And before Sports Betting was the religion the AFL were doing just fine. They don't need the money, and should treat it like tobacco or racism. There's nothing that makes it ok to push on kids.

I agree on the last point but you’re just objectively wrong on the rest.

The broadcasters only have the money for the rights and the progression of the broadcast (cameras, stats, production) from sponsorships and advertising, most of that money comes from betting agencies. The broadcast is quite literally better (to the point heaps of people don’t feel the need to go) because of gambling money.

 

[phantom13]

they could always do a few marquee games at suburban grounds, just raise the prices to maintain profit due to smaller crowd size. Make it something special like a one off premiership points match at RSEA charge heaps and include signings from the players and meet and greets. Heritage round or something

This would be cool, I think Carlton has lobbied for a while for games at princes park which is a great idea imo.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

This would be cool, I think Carlton has lobbied for a while for games at princes park which is a great idea imo.

yeah undeniably unsustainable financially for a prolonged period of time but imagine one round where EVERY club plays at a heritage ground the AFL adds some funds to really make it special and make each venue shine. Bring back old players and stuff. Tons of food trucks and stuff. One off even if they have to charge more but make it an event

 

[jwikked]

The money that gambling sponsorship and the like has brought in has grown the game and turned the braodcast into one of the best presentations going.

I appreciate the nostalgia of the outer and suburban grounds and the like but if it stayed that way the game would be dead or at least in a tonne of debt.

I disagree with this. The broadcast is subpar at best and growing the game hasn’t improved it one bit.

I don’t subscribe to the idea that the AFL is better with more money pouring in. Even the players - is the sport better with millionaires on field? Or was it better to watch when they still had jobs?

 

[bergholt]

Fixture for rounds 20 - 22:

R20 - Saturday arvo v Hawthorn on pay
R21 - Saturday night v Geelong on FTA
R22 - Friday night v Brisbane on FTA

Pretty good fixture for us if the players feel like standing up and performing in those games.

 

[puppy_dog7]

Trying to put a positive spin on us after our loss on the weekend. So I've compiled a list of the the last 5 premiers (excluding 2020 covid affected year) and it's not all doom and gloom as some might suggest.

Interesting to note though that Melbourne lost Adelaide 15th, Collingwood 17th, Giants 7th with a draw against Hawks 14th. So they really struggled to get up for games against lesser opposition last year.

We've beaten some good teams this year and have only really had 1 bad loss. I think we still make finals, but it certainly isn't going be to be easy. Lets just hope were not the North Melbourne of the 2016 season (finishing 8th with 12 wins after being 10 - 4 after round 14)

Premiers	after Round 14	after round 23
Bulldogs 2016	7th with wins - 4 losses - 120%	7th with 15 wins - 7 losses - 115%
Richmond 2017	6th with 8 wins - 5 losses - 111%	3rd with 15 wins - 7 losses - 118%
West Coast 2018	3rd with 10 wins - 4 losses - 121% (were 10 & 1 after round 11 and then lost 3 in a row) losing to Essendon and Adelaide who were both outside the 8.	2nd 16 wins - 6 losses 121%
Richmond 2019	9th with 7 wins - 6 losses - 92%	3rd with 16 wins - 6 losses - 113%
Melbourne 2021	1st with 11 wins - 2 losses - 132%	1st with 17 wins - 4 losses - 1 Draw - 131%

 

[phantom13]

I disagree with this. The broadcast is subpar at best and growing the game hasn’t improved it one bit.

I don’t subscribe to the idea that the AFL is better with more money pouring in. Even the players - is the sport better with millionaires on field? Or was it better to watch when they still had jobs?

1- The broadcast is subpar... compared to what? We have more cameras, more commentators and experts, more stats and more engagement than ever before. Worth noting that it has exactly grown exponentially because the adverstising used to be booze and cigs and is now gambling. You might not be a fan of the broadcast personally but objectively its more interactive and dynamic than it has ever been.

2- How do you figure growing the game hasnt helped it? We have more reach and more kids playing the game than ever before as well. Im not even sure what part of that could be considered a bad thing.

3- Are you seriously asking if the sport is better with full time professional athletes instead of part timers? Go ask any womens sport if theyd rather stay part time.

 

[phantom13]

yeah undeniably unsustainable financially for a prolonged period of time but imagine one round where EVERY club plays at a heritage ground the AFL adds some funds to really make it special and make each venue shine. Bring back old players and stuff. Tons of food trucks and stuff. One off even if they have to charge more but make it an event

The NHL does its winter special at an outdoor stadium every year and its unreal. Even the NBL does an open air game once a year.

Its a great concept that should surely be able to work in some capacity. If we can play in Ballarat and Cairns i dont see why it couldnt be done for a suburban ground.

 

[Dard Ball Get]

It’s not expensive to take the kids to the footy if you don’t have em

 

[ScrappyDo]

I agree on the last point but you’re just objectively wrong on the rest.

The broadcasters only have the money for the rights and the progression of the broadcast (cameras, stats, production) from sponsorships and advertising, most of that money comes from betting agencies. The broadcast is quite literally better (to the point heaps of people don’t feel the need to go) because of gambling money.

Sorry, wrong.
Whilst the networks will sell the add slots to the highest bidder which is the gambling agencies, there will always be a next highest bidder which could be chemist warehouse or whatever. Though there will be marginally less revenue if you eliminate the gambling agencies, it's not like that money isn't largely replaced by someone else. Sports codes went through it all before with tobacco and they all survived just fine.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

The NHL does its winter special at an outdoor stadium every year and its unreal. Even the NBL does an open air game once a year.

Its a great concept that should surely be able to work in some capacity. If we can play in Ballarat and Cairns i dont see why it couldnt be done for a suburban ground.

That’s a good point! Do this instead of the cairns game

 

[phantom13]

Sorry, wrong.
Whilst the networks will sell the add slots to the highest bidder which is the gambling agencies, there will always be a next highest bidder which could be chemist warehouse or whatever. Though there will be marginally less revenue if you eliminate the gambling agencies, it's not like that money isn't largely replaced by someone else. Sports codes went through it all before with tobacco and they all survived just fine.

They went through it with tobacco and alchohol which was replaced with...

Gambling.

I wouldnt have a clue how much of a drop in revenue that would be but any drop would mean a drop in profit and quality.

Again, i dont like it either, i dont gamble, i dont like the odds on the AFL website but trying to deny that money hasnt improved elements of the game like broadcasting and the like is naive.

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

R20-22 FIXTURE: Friday night blockbusters, derbies locked in

The AFL has released the fixture for rounds 20-22

www.afl.com.au

Friday night football vs Brisbane and Saturday night prime time vs Geelong

 

[ScrappyDo]

They went through it with tobacco and alchohol which was replaced with...

Gambling.

I wouldnt have a clue how much of a drop in revenue that would be but any drop would mean a drop in profit and quality.

Again, i dont like it either, i dont gamble, i dont like the odds on the AFL website but trying to deny that money hasnt improved elements of the game like broadcasting and the like is naive.

Actually there was a solid gap between tobacco and gambling. And my point is still valid. Someone else will buy the air time at 95%

 

[phantom13]

Actually there was a solid gap between tobacco and gambling. And my point is still valid. Someone else will buy the air time at 95%

You have no idea if its 95% that is a total guess and even if its accurate (i really doubt it is) we still lose 5% of revenue which is a minimum 5% impact on quality of broadcast etc etc (id wager substantially more given the CBA and football departments wont take that cut)

 

[Diehard Saint]

Depends who you ask. A low-middle income family of 2 or 3 kids living in the burbs would have to make it a once or twice a year treat.

I always take my own food. Far cheaper and definitely more healthy.
Refuse to pay those prices, except for the very occasional beer.
We've all got very comfortable watching footy at home over the past two years, a few steps away from the kitchen for drinks and snacks.

I will still go to every home game I can, as I have a reserved seat, but the AFL are going to have to work very hard to get the average fan back.
I also believe the rolling fixture is a problem. People like to plan when and where they are going to travel well ahead of time.

 

[phantom13]

I always take my own food. Far cheaper and definitely more healthy.
Refuse to pay those prices, except for the very occasional beer.
We've all got very comfortable watching footy at home over the past two years, a few steps away from the kitchen for drinks and snacks.

I will still go to every home game I can, as I have a reserved seat, but the AFL are going to have to work very hard to get the average fan back.
I also believe the rolling fixture is a problem. People like to plan when and where they are going to travel well ahead of time.

100% between kids and other comittments i usually pick my games when the fixture is released. I get the need for it but it does make it harder.

 

[ScrappyDo]

You have no idea if its 95% that is a total guess and even if its accurate (i really doubt it is) we still lose 5% of revenue which is a minimum 5% impact on quality of broadcast etc etc (id wager substantially more given the CBA and football departments wont take that cut)

Broadcasting is not to only source of revenue and it really doesn't matter what the drop in revenue might be. I could make more money dealing Ice but I choose not to, and live within the means available to be under the ethics I choose to have. Not to sound like an SJW but it's an ethical decision, not a financial one.

 

[phantom13]

Broadcasting is not to only source of revenue and it really doesn't matter what the drop in revenue might be. I could make more money dealing Ice but I choose not to, and live within the means available to be under the ethics I choose to have. Not to sound like an SJW but it's an ethical decision, not a financial one.

Its the major one, and were discussuing the quality of the broadcasting now, as far as im aware advertising is the only revenue stream for broadcasters?

Ive never said otherwise with regards to the ethics but you keep implying that the quality of the product wouldnt be affected if we changed the revenue stream and banned gambling advertising and thats not true.

I wouldnt have any issue if they banned gambling advertising. At best its inane and repetitive at worst its a lecherous disease but when the quality of the broadcast diminishes and people complain just remember why.

 

[ScrappyDo]

Its the major one, and were discussuing the quality of the broadcasting now, as far as im aware advertising is the only revenue stream for broadcasters?

Ive never said otherwise with regards to the ethics but you keep implying that the quality of the product wouldnt be affected if we changed the revenue stream and banned gambling advertising and thats not true.

I wouldnt have any issue if they banned gambling advertising. At best its inane and repetitive at worst its a lecherous disease but when the quality of the broadcast diminishes and people complain just remember why.

I was exclusively discussing the game day experience. I understand your points on the other topics and you're right about it. But I don't care about their revenue if their product has turned to crap, and their promoting gambling to get it. Overall I think the AFL has become a sick organization. They need a clean out.

 

[phantom13]

I was exclusively discussing the game day experience. I understand your points on the other topics and you're right about it. But I don't care about their revenue if their product has turned to crap, and their promoting gambling to get it. Overall I think the AFL has become a sick organization. They need a clean out.

I think theyve geared the game day experience more towards kids now (bright lights, bands, mascots) which i get. Its not for me so im pretty apathetic to it.