List Mgmt. 2023 List Management thread - Pt2 Now With Added Wailing & Gnashing of Teeth

[Lore]

Hello Dockers fans!

The embedded resources below are kept up to date by the trade board mods (as much as possible – we are human after all). Enjoy!

Spoiler: 2023 Draft Order

Spoiler: 2024 Draft Order, aka Future Picks

Spoiler: Blue Tick Rumours

 

[wakojako]

Any predictions on the Trade Grade we are gonna get?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I do find it hard to reconcile the result with the individual trades. I love the Port deal, like the Schultz deal, hate the Henry deal but cant help but feel we had an absolute stinker. Played the value game I suppose, Pies are the third oldest premiership list ever and Ken has a proven record in finals now. I think there's a decent chance one of the picks is top 10.

I hope we can use that St Kilda pick to get back into the draft somewhere

 

[Purple Jesus]

Any predictions on the Trade Grade we are gonna get?

Who ****in cares.

We finished 5th last, lost more players and have our first pick starting at 34.

LIFE'S GOOD FOR A FREO SUPPORTER!

 

[Yeti]

How many skinny half back flankers can we grab in the draft?

Should be able to get some forwards in the rookie draft as well.

Ah to be a Freo fan.

 

[Joao]

Hard to not say we haven’t got significantly worse tbh.

chance to trade in to this year’s draft but nothing that will make up for Schultz

I think Sturt or Freddy really breaking out might be the only way we could cover Schultz. Both are possible I think but 50/50 at best I'd say.

The only reason I am not really down is because
A) I reckon we're a decent chance at 1 of GC 20s picks
B) Wallsy and co will find at least one bloke late in the draft/rookie draft that gets us excited.

I do find it hard to reconcile the result with the individual trades. I love the Port deal, like the Schultz deal, hate the Henry deal but cant help but feel we had an absolute stinker. Played the value game I suppose, Pies are the third oldest premiership list ever and Ken has a proven record in finals now. I think there's a decent chance one of the picks is top 10.

I hope we can use that St Kilda pick to get back into the draft somewhere

34 + F2 for ~25 + later pick swaps is my prediction.

 

[Tonga Bob]

Two feeder clubs. One will get three high end academy picks, the other will get something to look forward to in 12 months time.

Club	Player In	Player Out	Net Result
Port Adelaide	4	1	3
Sydney	4	1	3
Essendon	4	2	2
West Coast	2	0	2
Hawthorn	4	3	1
North Melbourne	3	2	1
Western Bulldogs	2	1	1
Brisbane	2	2	0
Melbourne	3	3	0
Adelaide	1	2	-1
Carlton	1	2	-1
Collingwood	1	2	-1
Geelong	0	1	-1
GWS	0	1	-1
Richmond	1	2	-1
St Kilda	2	3	-1
Fremantle	0	3	-3
Gold Coast	0	3	-3

 

[Joao]

Two feeder clubs. One will get three high end academy picks, the other will get something to look forward to in 12 months time.

Club	Player In	Player Out	Net Result
Port Adelaide	4	1	3
Sydney	4	1	3
Essendon	4	2	2
West Coast	2	0	2
Hawthorn	4	3	1
North Melbourne	3	2	1
Western Bulldogs	2	1	1
Brisbane	2	2	0
Melbourne	3	3	0
Adelaide	1	2	-1
Carlton	1	2	-1
Collingwood	1	2	-1
Geelong	0	1	-1
GWS	0	1	-1
Richmond	1	2	-1
St Kilda	2	3	-1
Fremantle	0	3	-3
Gold Coast	0	3	-3

Maybe 1 or both will look like genius in 12 months, but I'd rather our trade period than PA's or Essendon's. And I do think a fit McKay is better than B grade.

 

[Dayts]

Can or will the slime grab Sharp before us ?

 

[Lach72]

I think Sturt or Freddy really breaking out might be the only way we could cover Schultz. Both are possible I think but 50/50 at best I'd say.

The only reason I am not really down is because
A) I reckon we're a decent chance at 1 of GC 20s picks
B) Wallsy and co will find at least one bloke late in the draft/rookie draft that gets us excited.



34 + F2 for ~25 + later pick swaps is my prediction.

maybe…we are now significantly younger too, even adding in the one year for each player.

winning games is going to be an issue.

the area we suck most in is now worse. Hard to see us kicking enough goals to improve on last year

 

[Joao]

maybe…we are now significantly yiunger too, even adding in the one year for esch player.

winning games is going to be an issue.

the area we suck most in is now worse. Hard to see us kicking enough goals to improve on last year

The squad is significantly younger and I think it could be a big problem if we get injuries. The B23 I think is fine. Especially if Sharp is Henry's replacement.

We'll probably lose 10 -15 goals to whomever takes Schultz spot from them not being as good, but real forward half improvement wouldn't come from there anyway. It will come from better mid/forward connection and cohesiveness between the talls, which is almost entirely independent of Schultz.

It's not ideal but its not a big deal either.

 

[Lach72]

The squad is significantly younger and I think it could be a big problem if we get injuries. The B23 I think is fine. Especially if Sharp is Henry's replacement.

We'll probably lose 10 -15 goals to whomever takes Schultz spot from them not being as good, but real forward half improvement wouldn't come from there anyway. It will come from better mid/forward connection and cohesiveness between the talls, which is almost entirely independent of Schultz.

mid forward connection…
you’re a funny bloke

 

[rgauci]

I think it’s really important we keep our three future firsts. I’d trade the rest of the picks to move up the draft this year.

 

[Joao]

mid forward connection…
you’re a funny bloke

It may not happen, but if it doesn't, we're still not scoring with or without Lachie which was my point.

 

[CaseySibosadoHOF]

Why are people concerned with these departures? What they should be concerned about is our method in the contest.

 

[Purple Jesus]

I think it’s really important we keep our three future firsts. I’d trade the rest of the picks to move up the draft this year.

Can we do that? Don't we have list positions we have to fill?

 

[Joao]

Can we do that? Don't we have list positions we have to fill?

You can use as many draft picks as you have list spots, they just get tacked onto the end of the draft.

We have 34, 46, 60, 64 which will proably end up something like 35, 41, 50, 54 after all the bids. Don't think we take more than 4 and probably only 3 on the night.

Still reckon we trade the Saints 2nd live.

 

[Cheesewheel]

We'll probably lose 10 -15 goals to whomever takes Schultz spot from them not being as good, but real forward half improvement wouldn't come from there anyway. It will come from better mid/forward connection and cohesiveness between the talls, which is almost entirely independent of Schultz.

It's not ideal but its not a big deal either.

In the 2023 season the top 4 needed about 2100-2200 points, and 5-8 needed about 2000-2100.
We scored 1835 points.

So we went into the trade period needing to find about 30ish goals, which sure you could back a young team to find that many, but we left trade period and now need to find 60 goals...

For comparison the teams who kick around 1700 points are North and Hawks. (Edit: The loss of -180 odd points from Schulz's leaving)

For a team that is notoriously shithouse at anything to do with the forward line, 2024 is already looking like a bust just from a flat numbers perspective.

 

[TheMcManusNose]

Yeah as others have alluded you can love the return from each trade (I don't even mind Henry tbh - Saints are an odd list who could finish anywhere from 4th to 14th). In the context of our season and our list they are, in totality, a complete disater.

Young list, potato season. Need to be either taking lots of picks now or bringing in key players now. Not maybe getting someone in 12 months who actually isn't the biggest list need now.

We'll get some natural improvement but also with the subtractions of the guy who's been 2nd in the goalkicking the last 2 years, and even Henry who wasn't really amazing but was kind of getting ok in a position we literally have no actual natural players in. Man.

Hard to get excited about 2024. 2025 maybe but then hey if we trade 3 firsts for Logan and end up with no one to actually get him or Jye the ball on the lead... The window creeps back another 1-2 years.

I don't really feel this is a vent more a wailing and gnashing over the direction of the club. Each year in trade period we do 'well' from a value perspective in either exctracting value for players who are leaving (and there's not much we can do about that in isolation) or by getting players we want in (Jackson) but **** me if you put it all together it is a lot less than the sum of it's parts let me tell you.

 

[Descent]

You can use as many draft picks as you have list spots, they just get tacked onto the end of the draft.

We have 34, 46, 60, 64 which will proably end up something like 35, 41, 50, 54 after all the bids. Don't think we take more than 4 and probably only 3 on the night.

Still reckon we trade the Saints 2nd live.

100% this. Teams are going to get pretty desperate for one of our F1. We need to hold firm and only deal that F2.

 

[Joao]

In the 2023 season the top 4 needed about 2100-2200 points, and 5-8 needed about 2000-2100.
We scored 1835 points.

So we went into the trade period needing to find about 30ish goals, which sure you could back a young team to find that many, but we left trade period and now need to find 60 goals...

For comparison the teams who kick around 1700 points are North and Hawks.

For a team that is notoriously shithouse at anything to do with the forward line, 2024 is already looking like a bust just from a flat numbers perspective.

Yes, hence my point that Schultz is basically inconsequential.

What we need is to radically improve our method and that is almost entirely down to the mid-forward connection and getting the talls experience playing together.

If we improve that, we'll be better in spite of losing Schultz. If we don't, we'll be about the same or maybe a few goals worse off on account of Schultz.

 

[Lach72]

It may not happen, but if it doesn't, we're still not scoring with or without Lachie which was my point.

yeah but I’d argue one of the players who can make some gold with the pig shit we send in there was Schultz…
So we’ve got distinctly worse…

I can’t see anyway Longmuir isn’t sacked by mid season.

wont necessarily be his fault either…but here we are

 

[Lach72]

Yes, hence my point that Schultz is basically inconsequential.

What we need is to radically improve our method and that is almost entirely down to the mid-forward connection and getting the talls experience playing together.

If we improve that, we'll be better in spite of losing Schultz. If we don't, we'll be about the same or maybe a few goals worse off on account of Schultz.

yep should be able to do that with the wingers and better mids we brought in…


ohhh

 

[CapitalA]

Will hurt the hip pocket everytime he re-signs

Not if we all his bluff because we know he doesn't wanna move interstate.

 

[guidodp15]

Just listened to some Liam Henry interviews and all I can say is lucky he is half decent at football.

 

[Tonga Bob]

Why are people concerned with these departures? What they should be concerned about is our method in the contest.

The Contest has requested a trade to Victoria.