Training 2023 pre-season

[caesar88]

I suspect Stephens might also spend some time inside in the near future.

As for Sheldrick - he offers to help plug our biggest weakness in a post-JPK world … stoppage clearances and hard ball gets. It’s an area we were often belted in last year, never more so than in the GF.

Sheldrick might be a year or two off - but he’s a first possession specialist & could add a dimension to the side.

I just don't agree. If there's a need for a 19 year old who will be coming in 6th in the order, then the mids we have now mustn't be as good as we think. I happen to be incredibly optimistic about them, so I don't share the urgency for what Sheldrick can bring that the likes of you and rusty have.

 

[Kiama Chris]

Sarcasm is hard to communicate on this type of platform,, but, that came through loud n clear haha
Lions v Suns is as regular as Swans v Giants.. Lions aren't playing Suns this year, so theres hope for us yet.


Some posters reckon we should not read into the 2km time trial results.. but they do give an indication of who committed their 'off season' to the up coming season.
Stephens and Gulden is to be expected, but I still love that result. Two young emerging stars predominately outside players winning the time trial is ace.
Strong showing from Sir Dane.. absolutely committed to his final year(s) .. and leading from the front
Corey Warner, McDonald, Campbell & Gould.. all yet to cement themselves but are giving themselves every chance

Im one of those holding Goulds potential higher. I reckon if he was 3cm taller, there'd be a few more.. cards have to fall his way, but if/when they do, I wouldn't be surprised if he holds his spot for a loooong time.

Pleased that McDonald has been working hard too. Looks to have bulked up a bit but has improved his 2k time. Great stuff!

 

[anotherletdown]

Gee I hope the 'official' game is v GWS, because we hardly ever play them.

Me too. It's a lovely little earner as well!

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

I suspect Stephens might also spend some time inside in the near future.

As for Sheldrick - he offers to help plug our biggest weakness in a post-JPK world … stoppage clearances and hard ball gets. It’s an area we were often belted in last year, never more so than in the GF.

Sheldrick might be a year or two off - but he’s a first possession specialist & could add a dimension to the side.

Agree. That is his point of difference over Rowbottom

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Agree. That is his point of difference over Rowbottom

Like caesar88, I'm very optimistic re: our midfield.

However, I see one residual area of weakness - stoppages & clearances.

Traditionally, when an opposition team gained a run-on (like Collingwood did in the PF), we'd slow the game down & create stoppages. Only problem - our stoppage / clearance work kinda sucked last year ... hence that tactic wasn't available to us and we couldn't stop the opposition momentum.

Whilst some "blame" lies with our ruck division - I’m convinced that we desperately missed JPK. I'm not sure who of the GF mids is going to develop into that hard ball / stoppage beast.

Hence my view that Sheldrick could become a key cog.

 

[caesar88]

Agree. That is his point of difference over Rowbottom

**** me this is such a shit take. Shiny New Toy Syndrome at its finest

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

**** me this is such a s**t take. Shiny New Toy Syndrome at its finest

And you led a small chorus of disapproval on Rowbottom for a good slice of 22. And now you are a buzzy bee covered in the nectar of a string of solid performances.

To get beyond his apparent B ceiling JR needs to win a lot more clearances.

Our midfield as a unit is a !ong way from the best. If it is not performing in early 2023 and Gus is doing the biz either in the 2s or winning clearances from ball ups on the fwd line in the seniors then FFS give him a run through the mids.

 

[Dan87]

Looking at player weights and Sheldrick is currently our heaviest (along with Parks) and biggest bodied mid... and he has a 3 sec 20 m sprint

Ofcourse we can use him/he adds something different he just needs to be ready

 

[Dan87]

We need that go to/effort mountain guy that loves getting his head kicked in and that's Drick in a year or two. We need to expose him and get him locked in if he's good enough.

Yeah, he'll play forward at times and have another string for variety but we need that Parker/JPK replacement getting blooded

 

[caesar88]

And you led a small chorus of disapproval on Rowbottom for a good slice of 22. And now you are a buzzy bee covered in the nectar of a string of solid performances.

To get beyond his apparent B ceiling JR needs to win a lot more clearances.

Our midfield as a unit is a !ong way from the best. If it is not performing in early 2023 and Gus is doing the biz either in the 2s or winning clearances from ball ups on the fwd line in the seniors then FFS give him a run through the mids.

Did not and never had disapproval for Rowbottom. You can go back to before we even drafted him to see that I was incredibly bullish on him prior to his "string of solid performances" (that got us to a grand final). Your argument had holes in it everywhere.

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

Did not and never had disapproval for Rowbottom. You can go back to before we even drafted him to see that I was incredibly bullish on him prior to his "string of solid performances" (that got us to a grand final). Your argument had holes in it everywhere.

Oh dear.

 

[rustycrate]

**** me this is such a s**t take. Shiny New Toy Syndrome at its finest

If he is good enough to make the team he will. If not, he won't. No amount of your locking him out of the team for 4-5 years will work.
If he makes the team, it will not be because he is a shiny new toy. It is because he won his spot in the team on work rate and ability.

 

[caesar88]

If he is good enough to make the team he will. If not, he won't. No amount of your locking him out of the team for 4-5 years will work.
If he makes the team, it will not be because he is a shiny new toy. It is because he won his spot in the team on work rate and ability.

And if that happens then good for him. I think Sheldrick's an exciting prospect and I think the discussion about where he does or doesn't fit in the team is a productive one. It veers into the nonsensical when cases for him are made by criticising our own currently very good players.

 

[rustycrate]

And if that happens then good for him. I think Sheldrick's an exciting prospect and I think the discussion about where he does or doesn't fit in the team is a productive one. It veers into the nonsensical when cases for him are made by criticising our own currently very good players.

I, like you, am very bullish on our current set of young mids. Lots of variety and pace and different skills. Nothing is set in stone and Sheldrick offers another skillset that we lack, clearances and hard ball gets. I don't agree with your lock him out because he is number 6 in order of getting into the midfield. Just because we are young in the midfield does not mean we cannot get better by going younger. I haven't been criticizing our currently good players. I'm just pushing the case of a talented mid who offers something that we need.

 

[SGBeach]

Did not and never had disapproval for Rowbottom. You can go back to before we even drafted him to see that I was incredibly bullish on him prior to his "string of solid performances" (that got us to a grand final). Your argument had holes in it everywhere.

12 months ago you were promoting the idea of trading him. Now your suggesting he has/will overtake Mills as our most important player.
What a difference 12 months can make!

I reckon its widely accepted that Parker, Mills, Rowbum, Warner are our best inside mids, at the moment..
I also reckon its widely accepted that we need to improve our clearance and contested possession game..
I aslo reckon its widely accepted that JPK (who held/holds the AFL record for these stats) is being missed.

So.. IMO Warner, Rowbum and Mills' stats for possessions, clearance & tackles will all improve over the next 2-3 years, just like they have been over the previous 2 seasons. (Mills' stats may be largely determined by how Horse uses him)
So theres an improvement to those key stats.
IMO, the wingers rotating through stoppages also have huge scope to contribute to the teams output in these key stats, ie. Stephens, Gulden, JMac, Campbell + others.. All of whom are young and still developing their game and their physical bodies.. We saw at the end of last year Stephens earn and hold his spot on the wing. We drafted him as an inside/outside mid, and hes returned to start his 4th year bulk up without compromising his elite endurance capacity. Gulden / Campbell are only coming into their 3rd season!

Other rotations through stoppages (not just centre bounces) include Paps and Heeney. Horse seems to do this because of what these two All-Australians can contribute, but also to inject these two All-Australians into the game.

I cant see any reason why a player like Sheldrick who is only coming into his 2nd season doesn't get an opportunity (and a good one) to show what he can do. I reckon theres a very good chance he plays in the forward line and rotes through stoppages.

To quote Dalrymple.. 'You cant have too many mids'

 

[Slingshot Footy]

And if that happens then good for him. I think Sheldrick's an exciting prospect and I think the discussion about where he does or doesn't fit in the team is a productive one. It veers into the nonsensical when cases for him are made by criticising our own currently very good players.

I agree that the conversation is worth having and also that criticising our own crop of current players is nonsensical in this context. But, I also think that calling out other posters in the manner that you have isn't productive either and people are less likely to read or listen to your extremely valuable contributions on the thread if you challenge them so disrespectfully.

 

[caesar88]

I agree that the conversation is worth having and also that criticising our own crop of current players is nonsensical in this context. But, I also think that calling out other posters in the manner that you have isn't productive either and people are less likely to read or listen to your extremely valuable contributions on the thread if you challenge them so disrespectfully.

I try to be measured on here when it comes to disagreement of opinions. It wasn't my intention to be rude or nasty. Horace is a testy poster at the best of times and I believe he can give as good as he gets. It's part of why I like him as a poster. But if I overstepped the mark then I apologise.

 

[Millky95]

You're all gonna feel silly when JMac gets moved to be an inside mid, wins the Brownlow and our B&F

 

[Dubai Quacker]

You're all gonna feel silly when JMac gets moved to be an inside mid, wins the Brownlow and our B&F

I’m feel comfortable going out on a limb here & stating that won’t happen.

First thing JMac needs to do is re-introduce the mullet. Like the story of Samson, the hair was the secret to his strength.

 

[Millky95]

I’m feel comfortable going out on a limb here & stating that won’t happen.

First thing JMac needs to do is re-introduce the mullet. Like the story of Samson, the hair was the secret to his strength.

Hey, it was more realistic than Buddy AA FB, Hayward 60 goals or Gould debuting, OK?

 

[rustycrate]

Hey, it was more realistic than Buddy AA FB, Hayward 60 goals or Gould debuting, OK?

Is Gould ever likely to play? Feels like he is either too tall, too slow, not tall enough, not fast enough. Others are creeping up and overtaking him. Feels like he will fall through the cracks.

 

[Millky95]

Is Gould ever likely to play? Feels like he is either too tall, too slow, not tall enough, not fast enough. Others are creeping up and overtaking him. Feels like he will fall through the cracks.

Look I hope so. I liked his highlights from him being drafted and he looks good in the reserves. Honestly, I think it was just the lack of injuries that kept him out of the side last year

 

[Kiama Chris]

Is Gould ever likely to play? Feels like he is either too tall, too slow, not tall enough, not fast enough. Others are creeping up and overtaking him. Feels like he will fall through the cracks.

TBH I've felt like that for quite a while. I'm really glad that he's overtaken Melican, who I've always seen as an "almost" player but I still have that itching question, like with Campbell, of "where does he fit?"
In my mind he's a big, strong medium defender who probably plays on the third tall, or perhaps the second if he's not too mobile. At the moment that's more Rampe or Fox (albeit he's a lot smaller!). Paddy and Blakey can zone off and are both 195cm so that's not a role for him.
It's not that he's not good enough, but that he's got good players in front of him.

 

[Dan87]

Re Gould

He needs to debut and play well that's for sure. I sort of see him as a defensive version of Darcy Fogarty, big, strong, great leg, not a natural distance runner. Fogarty took a little while to get going and hopefully it comes together for Gould similarly.

Looks like it'll have to be as a key defender

 

[Dan87]

Just watched his VFL player of the year interview. Gould seems a damn good citizen that really wants it.

Really hope it comes together at the Swans for him