Ultimate Glory 2023 Trade speculation and Shinbeggars discussion

[Hawkspot]

We’re going to talk ourselves in to this being a successful off season no matter what happens, but it will be very disappointing to miss out on McKay.

What’s the point of having cap space if we can’t find anyone to pay?

I would be surprised if we don’t have massive contracts in front of next years free agents early on. Naughton, McLuggage, Marshall, and Duggan.

 

[Leather Poisoning]

If we lined up all the key defenders in the league at the start of the season without known their contract or FA status I think Ben McKay

32

Ben Mckay

Age

27

Ht

202cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

7.5

2star

K

3.7

1star

HB

3.8

3star

M

2.7

3star

T

1.7

4star

MG

77.2

1star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

M

2.5

3star

T

1.5

2star

MG

88.5

2star

D

7.0

2star

K

3.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.0

4star

MG

67.8

1star

would probably be ranked around 20-25.
For pure lockdown KP defenders I dunno - but still not great.

 

[RoughysMullet]

Unfortunate to miss on McKay but no where near the end of the world - we obviously had our price and pitch to him and it didn’t work out… if the bummers or swans want to overpay him- let them do it.. it might just hurt them in the long run- we were all disappointed about missing on Dylan Shiel

9

Dylan Shiel

Age

31

Ht

182cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

24.6

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.1

3star

T

3.9

5star

CL

4.9

5star

D

23.4

5star

K

13.6

5star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.2

2star

T

3.4

4star

CL

6.4

5star

D

19.8

5star

K

8.4

4star

HB

11.4

5star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

3.8

5star

at the time and look how that one worked out…

Other options for key defenders will come along- I don’t think there’s any point rushing the rebuild by overpaying on free agents - we just need to continue to get more talent in via the draft - the reality is we aren’t quite there yet…

As we improve the list the free agents will be more inclined to get on board to fill the list holes… we saw some progress this season but just need to be patient…

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

I've done a 180 on trading f1.

Unless it's to trade up for Reid which is unlikely, I think it would be stupid and short sighted.

The list is exciting but its not deep. Hawthorn are only a injury to Sicily or Lewis away from bottom 4 again.

 

[RX Hawk]

Jacob Blight from Peel Thunder would be a handy pick up. 21 years old, 195cm and 96 kg. Just named WAFL team of the year CHB.

Has anyone got a highlight package of this guy?

 

[The Golden Glenferrie]

Not often you hit when you miss.

Even if we have a quiet period and hit the draft, we might be at the pointy end of the draft again next year. More top end talent and another 12 months into the team.

Either way, I am happy with our progress and would rather be us.

 

[The German Hunter]

I am more than happy to miss on McKay. The unrest that can be caused by altering the pay scale can be detrimental. In 3/4 years when we are asking our stars to stay for unders to keep the premiership team together we won’t have an average blow in on bullshit money

 

[TheFourPillars]

We were never going to stray from the plan. The plan includes a pay structure that will take us to our next premiership. We r not into sugar hits. If a player doesnt want to be part of the vision for our future we move onto some one else who will buy into what we r trying to do.

Stay on target stick to the plan dont waiver or get distracted. Lets keep moving forward.

 

[Adrian Dodoro]

Any talls at Werribee worth drafting? They have lost one game in VFL all year with no listed AFL players

only forwards, no clue why garoni has never been given a go at AFL level, boyd also would do ok for mine

 

[eldorado]

Jarrad Boumann would be handy right now.

He would have been handy back then too...if he wasn't such a complete f**kstick...

 

[Judd2Sewell]

If we lined up all the key defenders in the league at the start of the season without known their contract or FA status I think Ben McKay would probably be ranked around 20-25.
For pure lockdown KP defenders I dunno - but still not great.

I disagree. Can you name 19 better KPD's?

Taylor
Weitering
Moore
Andrews
May
Himmelberg
Grimes
McGovern

Lever *
Sicily *
Stewart *

He'd be at the top end of this group:
Aliir Aliir
T. McCartin (?)
Laverde
BZT
SDK
Keath



* better players for sure, but they aren't really KPD's

 

[Simon Crawshay]

We’re going to talk ourselves in to this being a successful off season no matter what happens, but it will be very disappointing to miss out on McKay.

What’s the point of having cap space if we can’t find anyone to pay?

I would be surprised if we don’t have massive contracts in front of next years free agents early on. Naughton, McLuggage, Marshall, and Duggan.

The difference is we will be putting massive contracts in front of genuine A graders like Naughton and Marshall instead of a massive contract for really pretty average footballer in McKay.

I don't think many on this board would mind offering $800k+ to Rowan Marshall for instance. He would be worth every penny.

But as I said previously offering that kind of money to McKay is just bad business and bad for team morale.

 

[H00t]

I disagree. Can you name 19 better KPD's?

Taylor
Weitering
Moore
Andrews
May
Himmelberg
Grimes
McGovern

Lever *
Sicily *
Stewart *

He'd be at the top end of this group:
Aliir Aliir
T. McCartin (?)
Laverde
BZT
SDK
Keath



* better players for sure, but they aren't really KPD's

You’ve missed a chunk out there.

Better not listed KPD’s include Ballard, Collins, Pearce, Balta, Wilkie, Barrass, Cox, Tomlinson, Doedee, Battle, Murphy, and Payne.

He sits around the Keath, Bruce, Howard level.

Even players like Borlase or Young will overtake him in a year or two.

 

[The Chad and I]

"Missing out" on McKay reminds me of the good fortune we had of missing out on Ferguson from Melbourne, when the trade for a yet to mature Brad Sewell

Brad Sewell

Age

40

Ht

181cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.1

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

11.5

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

4.5

5star

CL

4.1

5star

No current season stats available

D

9.4

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

4.8

4star

M

2.4

3star

T

2.2

4star

fell through. THANK GOD!!!!

I'm happy to miss out on targets of convenience and wait for targets of desire.
IMO a player has to look like a good footballer first and foremost.
Both McKays still move like newly born giraffes.
No thank you!

How could we settle for that?
The club of Buddy, Roughy, Dunstall, Dermie, Knights, Matthews, Hudson.
...and now we're gonna pin our hopes on donkeys like that?
FFS if any club knows what a KP forward looks like, it's us.
Keep looking pls.

 

[Crankyhawk]

I've done a 180 on trading f1.

Unless it's to trade up for Reid which is unlikely, I think it would be stupid and short sighted.

The list is exciting but its not deep. Hawthorn are only an injury to Sicily or Lewis away from bottom 4 again.

I’m ok with f1 for gc first pick this year, it is close enough that if we are bottom 4 next year I won’t feel too burned.

 

[Alite]

"Missing out" on McKay reminds me of the good fortune we had of missing out on Ferguson from Melbourne, when the trade for a yet to mature Brad Sewell fell through. THANK GOD!!!!

I'm happy to miss out on targets of convenience and wait for targets of desire.
IMO a player has to look like a good footballer first and foremost.
Both McKays still move like newly born giraffes.
No thank you!

How could we settle for that?
The club of Buddy, Roughy, Dunstall, Dermie, Knights, Matthews, Hudson.
...and now we're gonna pin our hopes on donkeys like that?
FFS if any club knows what a KP forward looks like, it's us.
Keep looking pls.

I have struggled to say these very sentences. thank you The Chad and I for finding the right sentences.

In a compromised competition we should never settle for what is on offer. Make our team worthy to be chased.

Every commentator, even the worst in the business, know now the Hawks are fulfilling their projections.

MM has a big task and yet it is simple. Get the best with Money and develop the rest. Of the best is not available, Don’t!!

Aside: Is there any world where an anti-moneyball actually works? Ben McKay on big money is 100% an anti-moneyball.

Be clear, IMO Ben McKay on OK money is fine. He will do OK. But if we have excess money and do not have a player we want, give our current players bonuses to get us to the 90% salay cap. And move on.

 

[Alite]

I’m ok with f1 for gc first pick this year, it is close enough that if we are bottom 4 next year I won’t feel too burned.

Agreed, but what would you do with said pick 4(5).

 

[FB19]

Why not Dougal Howard

20

Dougal Howard

Age

28

Ht

199cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.9

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

3.1

3star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.4

3star

MG

176.2

3star

D

9.9

3star

K

8.4

3star

HB

1.4

1star

M

4.7

4star

T

0.6

1star

MG

171.9

3star

D

9.0

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.8

5star

MG

133.8

3star

then would come cheap out of favour at the saints? Only 27 as well think he’s solid and has players to give it to rather than use the ball

 

[FB19]

Agreed, but what would you do with said pick 4(5).

Take one of the elite players or trade it back with gws or crows for a later first and another this year or next. Lots of options.

 

[Alite]

Why not Dougal Howard then would come cheap out of favour at the saints? Only 27 as well think he’s solid and has players to give it to rather than use the ball

A curious option. A backup option at best. An SSP in 2024 maybe depending on our list makeup.

 

[lethalselbow]

WE'RE AFTER PLAYER X

--- Yay.

PLAYER X DOESNT WANT TO COME TO HAWTHORN.

---- Didn't want him anyway


(Rinse repeat)

 

[Alite]

As I understand it the Cold Coast Suns have an extended List to help them be competitive. 50 players!

when does their extended list run out? And by how many reductions in players per year? Surely their charity will have to run out once the Tassie charity kicks in.

My question specifically relates to 1 player: Elijah Hollands

The GCS have 50 players on their list. Not fair.

check it out: Official AFL Website of the Gold Coast SUNS

Frankly I am stunned about the level that the AFL is going to to make their pet project successful.

How hard will they go with Tassie?

I am 100% out of any Tassie player for the draft! Trusting the AFL… is like trusting a crocodile to not take you by the head and drag you under while you try to drink.

 

[Dewnior]

I disagree. Can you name 19 better KPD's?

Taylor
Weitering
Moore
Andrews
May
Himmelberg
Grimes
McGovern

Lever *
Sicily *
Stewart *

He'd be at the top end of this group:
Aliir Aliir
T. McCartin (?)
Laverde
BZT
SDK
Keath



* better players for sure, but they aren't really KPD's

In no particular order, here are 24 Key Defenders ahead of McKay

Taylor
Weitering
Moore
Andrews
May
Ridley
Ballard
Balta
McCartin
Wilkie
Himmelberg
Barrass
Grimes
McGovern (1)
Lever
Sicily
Stewart
Pearce
Murphy
Aliir Aliir
Cox
SDK
Keath
Collins

And you could mount an argument the following are also ahead of him

Battle
Payne
Kemp
Laverde
Haynes
McGovern (2)

 

[peetoo]

No chance for Gresham now ‘powerhouse’ Essendon is interested

I kid you not

Victorian powerhouse reportedly pursuing unsigned Saint: AFL trade news

The Saint had previously been linked to one rival club for the majority of the year.

www.zerohanger.com

 

[The Chad and I]

My question specifically relates to 1 player: Elijah Hollands

I don't understand what happened to this kid.
These highlights look every bit as good as Harley Reid's:
In some respects even better.
His game sense and ball handling are as good as any draftee I have seen.

Is he averse to hard work?
Because he would need to hit the gym hard (and the track) to make it in the AFL.
He is far too skinny to make it on talent alone, and would be limited as an outside player unless he had an elite tank.
So what's the story?

Could be a sneaky chance to parlay Brockman+Kosi+whatever utensils we have spare, into Hollands.
That would be an intriguing proposition.

He looks like he has developed physically a bit here: AFL Latest Videos - AFL.com.au

He looks a natural.
I am very interested.