List Mgmt. 2023 Trade Thread - Part II

[#gosaintas]

He seems to be at least half decent in the forward line too, which might let him challenge a bit earlier.
( and i think the club is trying to develop that further ).

reckon Heath is ready to play next year and is maybe a true fwd/ruck

 

[pebblesofsand]

reckon Heath is ready to play next year and is maybe a true fwd/ruck

In which case King will need to learn to around the forward line a bit more and Caminiti will be at Sandy.

 

[Joffaboy]

Let's make it 2 1sts and a second then. I think it's worth the risk to get a top quality kid that has all the attributes we need.

You know I have been reading your posts regarding #4 and have been thinking 2 firsts for a kid on potential is way too much....
....but thinking about it a couple of things
1) I have banged on for years about topline midfielders.
Richmond had Dusty and Cotchin with some excellent A- support mids
Geelong Danger and Selwood with some excellent A- support mids.

I think we have the A- support mids but we don't have those absolute champions that win flags.

2) Lyon said you can't go to Woolies to get these players and we don't have the hand to do it. Also he said no rush on the build.

So with this in mind and note I know absolutely nothing about Zane Duursma, your suggestion has real merit.

Duursma could be Trac or Toumpas, but unless we risk it, how do we get this quality?



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[Oh When the Saints]

Marshall has absolutely shown that he plays elite footy when he is the #1 ruck. He is not and never has been a forward and this year should have settled that debate. He went to another level without Ryder.

You can either choose an elite tap ruckman who struggles to impact the contest in the midfield, or an elite midfield contested player who struggles a bit in the hitouts. The only player in the comp to do both at elite level is Max Gawn

11

Max Gawn

Age

32

Ht

209cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

6.7

4star

CL

2.8

4star

HO

35.3

5star

D

18.5

4star

K

11.5

4star

HB

7.0

4star

CL

3.5

4star

HO

29.2

5star

D

8.4

3star

K

3.6

2star

HB

4.8

4star

CL

1.0

3star

HO

15.6

5star

.

We have to recognise what Marshall is - the best 'follower' in the game who is an average to slightly above average tap-ruckman. There is no point trying to over-correct the part of the game that he isn't as good at (hitouts) by spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on another player which then forces Marshall out of the contest for 50% of the game. The definition of robbing Peter to pay Paul.

What we need is to improve the midfield around Marshall and continue to develop young/back-up ruckmen.

Much better off spending our time and salary cap elsewhere in my view.

 

[bergholt]

How good is having Ross.

At the very worst, guys like Gresham, Billings etc who clearly have talent, will come back to us after copping an almighty reality check from the league in terms of where they thought they sat and the money they thought they'd get.

Billings got that reality check a couple of years ago, didn't make any difference

 

[Captain Paddy]

Kane Cornes talking on the trade segment with Tom Morris this morning said that the player he would trade from us would be Steele.

Said he has the most valuable and is in a position most expendable to us in terms of the inside mid but a position the other teams need.

 

[Minga]

2 Natural mids in Dow (former pick 3) and Philips (former pick 3), both wins clearances and slick hands to team mates on the move.. exact what we need in the midfield.. add them to Crouch, Steele, Owens, Winghager will improve the midfield a lot. Still missing the star mid, hopefully Owens or Windhager can become one. Think Henry also has the potential to become a Shai Bolton type.

Paddy Dow


Will Philips (swap for Clark)


Liam Henry

Could Dow be our Parish? A top 5 pick, slow burn mid, whose speciality is at the clearance? That’s the ceiling we’d be hoping for.

And as for Henry, well… the idea of adding a young player like that with Sinclair, Nasiah, Hill and Wood is just about mouthwatering. Imagine that delivery to the King twins

 

[Joffaboy]

Don't mind keeping Gres. We jump off players too soon.
Acres was almost BOG in a QF and has been excellent all year for Carlton.
We used him as steak knives, Freo flicked him for a 3rd.
Sometimes players take years to mature.

Gres showed in the weekend he can still play excellent pressured footy.

We need to be patient especially on our kids.

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[Sun Ra]

The interesting thing about this thread is that the Club will do what the Club is going to do.
Our discussions and ideas are all very good and a bit of fun and shows out passion for the Club.
But RTB and SOS won't be reading them for tips. Just saying.

 

[Verdun]

Kane Cornes talking on the trade segment with Tom Morris this morning said that the player he would trade from us would be Steele.

Said he has the most valuable and is in a position most expendable to us in terms of the inside mid but a position the other teams need.

Kane is full of it, goes for the headline does not look beyond that

 

[mighty_sainters]

By no means would I expect Dow to all of a sudden do what Flanders did in the last weeks of the season, but sometimes a run of games is all that’s needed to hit your potential.

New coach, new role, new teammates could be all that’s needed.

Worth a shot.

 

[Nutsngum]

Kane Cornes talking on the trade segment with Tom Morris this morning said that the player he would trade from us would be Steele.

Said he has the most valuable and is in a position most expendable to us in terms of the inside mid but a position the other teams need.

Cornes is a shit stirrer but generally not a moron. Surely there was more to it then "trade the best player in a position we are absolutely the weakest in"?

 

[gringo2011]

What I think we get out of picking up a player like Grundy is flexibility around Marshall.

Tom Campbell is not going to make AFL level. Max Heath is at least one, probably 2 years away. Right now, Marshall goes down and we are in all sorts. Just don't see how we do not have a slight need for a ruckman.

Grundy ticks a lot of boxes. Can do a job in the ruck, is handy around the ground, frees up Marshall. The guy is 2 times All Oz and still young. Not saying we should give away the farm but not likely to cost picks, just a matter of how many dollars.

Marshall was ordinary when we had Paddy Ryder rucking. I think he's a main man or trade to be honest. I'd rather keep him and invest the money in a gun extractor.

Marshall has never been a particularly reliable player as a stay at home forward. He needs to move around the ground to have maximum impact. Gawn and Grundy didn't work so I doubt he's the answer to our short comings.

 

[#gosaintas]

In which case King will need to learn to around the forward line a bit more and Caminiti will be at Sandy.

I still think Caminiti is worth trying as a back. Would solve a large problem if he could make it back there.

 

[snails13]

That's his level. A very good VFL footballer.. Will never be up to AFL standard.

He was excellent late last year when he broke into the side. Disagree he's a VFL footballer only. He'd be best 22 at the Saints IMO. He's probably limited to a Zac Jones type level but he'd be great depth at a minimum. The Lions just have too many good mids to fit in their best 22.

100% agree
I watch him play every home game and he would be of great value to us
He would come from a strong club and not playing seniors only because of a very talented Brisbane midfield.
Not frightened to get in and under in any circumstance and a great team player

 

[gringo2011]

In which case King will need to learn to around the forward line a bit more and Caminiti will be at Sandy.

Don't think Marshall has ever kicked more than 12 goal in a season. I can't see him becoming a gun KPF. I think you'd have Caminiti forward over Marshall to be honest. For the 5 minutes of ruck chop out per quarter it doesn't make sense.

 

[gringo2011]

By no means would I expect Dow to all of a sudden do what Flanders did in the last weeks of the season, but sometimes a run of games is all that’s needed to hit your potential.

New coach, new role, new teammates could be all that’s needed.

Worth a shot.

Ross is an expert at extracting every drop. He's worth a crack. Doubt he costs much and they owe us for Acres being their best finals player.

 

[gringo2011]

Kane is full of it, goes for the headline does not look beyond that

Yeah, he likes to rub lemon juice on paper-cuts to get attention.

 

[gringo2011]

100% agree
I watch him play every home game and he would be of great value to us
He would come from a strong club and not playing seniors only because of a very talented Brisbane midfield.
Not frightened to get in and under in any circumstance and a great team player

I love his energy too. He's a real pace setter and fire starter. Lyon's sides can look a bit dour so someone with a bit of enthusiasm can be really valuable. Has a touch of Balantyne about him the way he shits the opposition.

 

[bergholt]

Grundy ticks a lot of boxes. Can do a job in the ruck, is handy around the ground, frees up Marshall.

The "frees up" argument is usually pretty bad. We saw it with Sinclair on Saturday. He was OK in the midfield but he's not an AA level midfielder, while he is an AA level half-back. So what's the point of "freeing him up" from a position where he's elite to move him to somewhere he isn't?

Same with Marshall. He got in the AA squad as first ruck, but playing as second ruck/tall forward he was nowhere near it. So why would we "free him up" from the position where he was approaching A grade?

 

[Captain Paddy]

I still think Caminiti is worth trying as a back. Would solve a large problem if he could make it back there.

I got laughed at when I mentioned it a few weeks ago, but other clubs have asked about Caminiti and he would be traded if someone who needs a key tall comes forward with a good pick.

King, Sharman, Ownes, Caminiti, Membrey (although maybe not now), Heath, Bing (2025) simply don't all fit together. We need to rebalance the list and generate more speed across the ground but especially the midfield.

 

[stavro#4]

I am going to make this clear.

I have no ****ing clue if this is true. I don’t believe it to be true. I think it’s utter BS.

But I got told this morning, that this player is gettable from someone who is heavily involved in another Melbourne club. I put it in my group chat with the core group of guys I go to our games with… 2 mention they have heard similar


Steele is gettable.


Anyone heard similar?

 

[crasha301]

Wasn't Marshall a key fwd before we drafted him?

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[gringo2011]

Could Dow be our Parish? A top 5 pick, slow burn mid, whose speciality is at the clearance? That’s the ceiling we’d be hoping for.

And as for Henry, well… the idea of adding a young player like that with Sinclair, Nasiah, Hill and Wood is just about mouthwatering. Imagine that delivery to the King twins

Parish is probably a bit more true extractor. Dow is a bit like Stuv in that he hits already on the move. Parish is a better pure extractor but Ross Lyon probably prefers spread runners who can win their own ball over old school inside rovers anyway.

 

[Cro19]

The "frees up" argument is usually pretty bad. We saw it with Sinclair on Saturday. He was OK in the midfield but he's not an AA level midfielder, while he is an AA level half-back. So what's the point of "freeing him up" from a position where he's elite to move him to somewhere he isn't?

Same with Marshall. He got in the AA squad as first ruck, but playing as second ruck/tall forward he was nowhere near it. So why would we "free him up" from the position where he was approaching A grade?

Our worst patch of footy for the year were the weeks Sinclair had to play midfield, he has far more impact on games from half back.