List Mgmt. 2023 Trade Thread - Part II

[longlivelenny]

Not long ago I was feeling bullish about the draft period. Today I am a lot glummer.

It seemed like we would get two useful players for 2024 in Henry and Dow (and that seems to be the case) and then a bundle of kids in the draft where Toce could hopefully work his craft to snag a few good players.

The latter was predicated on us being able to trade out a batch of players to generate a bundle of useful picks such as second round draft picks. The gossip over the last day, or two, seems to have that crop of useful picks drying up with seemingly Howard being the only possible trade that would achieve a good return.

If so, then this year is hardly going to land a likely bunch of new kids. That mythical beast of an inside mid that we all are so desperate for is starting to look like being most unlikely this draft/trade period.

Hopefully there will be some more positive news once trades begin. But the vibe at present seems to be that Toce is only going to have a weak draft hand to find talent with.

Yeah it's hit me like that recently too

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[bird_man]

Dangerous to base an opinion on one game…Melbourne seem keen to keep him so must be a handy player

He was pretty good last year I thought. Seems to be struggling to find form this year and was ordinary last night.

 

[longlivelenny]

Ratings are nice and all but Sam Walsh was the best player on the ground by a long way.

You honestly think that? He had a mare of a last quarter. Almost lost it for Carlton with his dodgy kicking and got caught holding the ball 3 times.
I don't rate Walsh at all, he's basically a little bit better version of Ryan byrnes

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[Diehard Saint]

If you're a bloke like Billings, staring down at your footy mortality, wouldn't you just throw it to the wind, put in a massive preseason - go for broke in one last chance?

Got little to lose at this point.

Question is does he have it in him or does he fade into obscurity without so much as a whimper?

At some point pride has to kick in you'd reckon.

And who said he didn’t put in other pre seasons?
He’s been plagued by injuries - back, broken leg etc.
He may not have become the player we all hoped for but who are we to decide that he doesn’t/hasn’t had pride in his performance thus far?

 

[Jesuswasacarpenter]

I understand though, I’m still hoping Freeman and Weller come good.

And Hanners

 

[ScrappyDo]

Billings wasn't considered that bad when he re-signed. I'd actually argue billings had more capability to be an AFL player.

Hunter ain't it. Sell before it's too late.

I don't disagree, but the reasons Billings stands out is that he's career trajectory has been anonymously bad.
I tend to think that RTB is ruthless enough to not let that happen here. Thats exactly why JB is now looking for a new home.

 

[Captain Paddy]

How depressing is it thinking that McCartin, Acres, Dunstan and Billings should all be in their primes right now and leading us to top 4 positions

 

[Diehard Saint]

Acres play a lot of footy on the wing for us. He was a very average footballer at our club. Maybe that was the coaching or maybe he's just one of those players that had to go to another club and get a kick in the arse for it to finally click for him?

Ones things for sure, he looks to work a hell of a lot harder now than he did in our clours. Busts his arse every week. He constantly just looked like he was cruising with us.

He was a kid badly mismanaged by a lousy coaching set up with very little development nous.
( Funny how port swore Richo was the best development person - probably wanted to get rid of him)
He was played, then dropped, played then dropped. Scapegoated ( pun intended) for our losses.
The club should wear that, not an 18 year old kid Who needed decent development.

 

[Hayes4PM]

Acres is becoming a poor mans Mason Wood.

I reckon they’re about par…both very good wingers

Acres staunched Langdon tonight, multiple times Landon shat himself or just made little hesitations when playing on a big bodied opponent like Acres. It’s all well and good to have a hard running and fairly fast accelerating player like Langdon or Hill covering the ground and putting in repeat sprints, but I think you need that balanced out with a Wood or Acres who gives aerial presence as well as strength.

Very happy with our balance at the moment with Hill, Wood, Sinclair and Nas spending time on our wings, Nas developed an aerial presence this year as well.

Now if Melbourne were open to parting with Trent Rivers instead of James Jordon, that’s something I would be very interested in

 

[Diehard Saint]

He didn't get much of a run ever under Richo. He'd be first out or benched and never given a consistent role. He looks a classic case of a coach that always wanted to point out what the deficiencies of his players were instead of playing them to their strengths. Plenty complained about the misuse of him under Richo at the time.

IIRC didn’t Gears and the leadership team have to point that out to Richo at some stage?
You know, concentrate on the positives?

 

[Premium]

By not much of a run, you mean he played games in the high teens for the last 4 years he was at the club and majority of the games he missed were due to injury.

We need to move on from talking about our past players , we are all glad Acres has found a home where he is settled and playing good football but it must be remembered he was more or less moved on from Fremantle and only got picked up by Carlton on a low ball offer from Carlton which was said to of been around 300k.

 

[Mowman]

He was a kid badly mismanaged by a lousy coaching set up with very little development nous.
( Funny how port swore Richo was the best development person - probably wanted to get rid of him)
He was played, then dropped, played then dropped. Scapegoated ( pun intended) for our losses.
The club should wear that, not an 18 year old kid Who needed decent development.

 

[Moorabbin Ghost]

He was a kid badly mismanaged by a lousy coaching set up with very little development nous.
( Funny how port swore Richo was the best development person - probably wanted to get rid of him)
He was played, then dropped, played then dropped. Scapegoated ( pun intended) for our losses.
The club should wear that, not an 18 year old kid Who needed decent development.

I don’t think supporters still realize what an absolute farcical appointment Richo was. Refused to interview for the position, we gave him the job anyway, paid Port $50K for the privilege and then let “the development coach” deliver the worst development of young players that i have ever seen.
We will be still paying for the Richo cluster**** for at least another 5 years.

 

[Diehard Saint]

I don’t think supporters still realize what an absolute farcical appointment Richo was. Refused to interview for the position, we gave him the job anyway, paid Port $50K for the privilege and then let “the development coach” deliver the worst development of young players that i have ever seen.
We will be still paying for the Richo cluster* for at least another 5 years.

A F*Up of the highest order - as you say, which will affect us for years.

 

[stavro#4]

 

[Coconut_twirl]

After tonight, a big NO THANKS to James Jordan

He looks like solid depth. I’m not entirely sure he would be in the Saints best 22. Still could be an upgrade on Bytel, Connolly. Disposal seems good, it’s just whether he can find enough of the footy and have an impact.

 

[puntking]

So what we know so far is we look likely to get Dow and Henry what else is highly likely to happen?

 

[stavro#4]

He looks like solid depth. I’m not entirely sure he would be in the Saints best 22. Still could be an upgrade on Bytel, Connolly. Disposal seems good, it’s just whether he can find enough of the footy and have an impact.

He didn’t get a lot.

But better than everyone we delisted and improves the list. We have nothing in midfield outside what’s classed as our best 23.

 

[Coconut_twirl]

Dunno whats worse, us giving him away for Hill for steak knives, or Freo letting him walk after a borderline AA season

Freo didn’t even get a good pick by memory. That’s bad management from them since Acres was really good last year. At least one positive is that Hill has been durable over the journey and has played some great games.

 

[Armitage2Riewoldt]

How depressing is it thinking that McCartin, Acres, Dunstan and Billings should all be in their primes right now and leading us to top 4 positions

Melbourne completely fumbled (through injury and other) pick 1 (watts) pick 1 (Scully) pick 2 (Trengove) pick 4 (Toumpas) pick 4 (Morton) mini draft (hogan)

Gysberts, Tapscott, Blease, cook all first round picks similar ranges to acres and dunstan.

Then we gifted them trac to get them back in form haha

Point being even a recent premier had a period of about 6-8 years of completely screwing up the draft.

 

[gringo2011]

Maybe but I also remember spending a lot of time on the wing. Just never took his opportunity. Let's not forget he also got dropped two or three times at Freo.

It's taken until 27 to finally click for him and I don't think anyone that watches him closely couldn't see that he's clearly working a lot harder out on the ground than he ever has.

He was never one that you would say left everything out there on the ground until this year.

Not suggesting it was the right thing to get rid of him for us, because clearly that Hill deal was an absolute stinker, but he looks like a player that had to get a couple of kicks in the arse to realise what it takes to he an AFL footballer.

He had a year at Freo where he as getting talked about as the best wing in the AFL. His first year there he was ordinary. He was off broadway over there so we din't see him. He was badly mismanaged even when we were developing him.

 

[Coconut_twirl]

Gotta feel for the guy, had a terrific body of work then discarded when a couple come back from injury

That reduces his trade value and will help the Saints. Blues can’t expect a decent pick if not getting a game in two finals. Unlikely to get pick for the prelim barring injury at training.

 

[Diehard Saint]

So what we know so far is we look likely to get Dow and Henry what else is highly likely to happen?

Chances are that they’re both in / very close to our best 22 going forward?
And hopefully not cost too much?
Then that’s a good start I suppose.

 

[stavro#4]

So do we start talking about band 1 or 2 now for Gresh?

 

[gringo2011]

Acres is becoming a poor mans Mason Wood.

Okay. Wood had a great start to the season and levelled out. Acres has been BOG in two finals and a big part of Carlton's turn around. Acres has 5 to 6 years left. Wood has one or two.