List Mgmt. 2024 List Management 📃

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Blue_Fusion said:
No doubt JGov appreciates that he won a flag with Simpson as coach.

Would not be against bringing him across at all... he along with his brother and Weiters in the back line... I get he's not at his best any more but still more than decent if we can get him for a cheap price
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He's borderline AA this year. Probably make the squad at least. Still reckon he has a couple years of good footy left.

Much more of a natural interceptor than Weiters too imo, best I've ever seen in his prime.
 
J McGovern has been great this season. He'd be under less pressure in our side. He is someone who we could park at fullback and allow Weitering to play CHB or back pocket.

I think he would be gettable. Not going to see another flag at WCE, chance to play with his brother which he has been open about wanting to do and play in a flag with him.

For us. He really only has to play 4 games at the right time of the year for us. His acquisition would allow us to let go 2 of Marchbank, Young and/or Durdin.

Ideally you would love to bring in McGovern and have a young player come in developing in the 2s. Or you take the 1-3 years you would get out of McGovern to focus on trading in another key defender.

I see this as a bit of a Brian Lake moment for us. I think the timing would be excellent for us to bring him in.
 

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Adam Simpson was good enough to win a premiership with the Eagles. The very best coach can not take a poor list off the bottom of the ladder.

What makes a good coach good is not their ability to perform miracles and make a weak list win games. That's not possible. What makes a good coach is their ability to get the best out of a good list. To get a good list to win a flag and not just be an also-ran up the top of the ladder.

He would be a good get as an assistant. Quality. Experienced. New ideas from a different place. Not many of our coaches come from really successful coaching backgrounds, he'd be the most successful coach in our group instantly.
 
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HavUEvaSeenTheRain said:
I wouldn’t be against McGovern but has there ever been a less athletic KPD duo then Weitering and Gov who have had success?
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JMcGovern is an extraordinary athlete. Fat as a house but could launch over a pack, was unmovable by his opponents and still had freakish closing speed.

It almost boggles the mind how someone in such visibly poor condition has managed to keep his speed and power for so long.
 
Gethelred said:
Alright.

I don't do this much, but it's become pretty clear that we need to come up with some alternatives for KPD. I do not think that Young is a never option - for all that he's looked poor when played alongside Weitering, he's been more than fine in Jacob's absence - but if Jacob goes down and Young truly isn't up to it, we need other options. So, find below a series of different players out of contract over the next two seasons*:

2024
Emerson Jeka, 22, 198cm, Geelong
Denver Grainger-Barras, 22, 194cm, Hawthorn
Jacob Blight, 22, 196cm, Richmond
Dougal Howard, 28, 199cm, St Kilda
Harry Arnold, 25, 196cm, Sydney

2025
Josh Draper, 20, 197cm, Fremantle
Leek Aleer, 22, 193cm, GC
Charlie Ballard, 24, 197cm, GC
Josh Gibcus, 21, 196cm, Richmond
Tylar Young, 25, 197cm, Richmond
Arie Schoenmaker, 19, 194cm, St Kilda
Will Edwards, 21, 197cm, Sydney

I'd like to highlight two for this season, and three for next year.

Dougal Howard might be 28, but needs must when the clock's ticking. He's been a leader for them down back, and has been heralded by St Kilda and around the comp for being able to perform when it's hot. He's possibly a little slow, but he's a true key defender and could potentially take the monsters which would free up Jacob to be more aggressive. He'd slot straight in and more or less make a difference from day dot.

Denver Grainger-Barras went in the first round of 2020, as pick 6; the bogeyman pick, so there's a buyer beware there. Still, he was heralded as the best KPD prospect in the draft pool since Jacob himself, so dominant was his U18's. For whatever reason - unprofessionalism, fitness, the demands of an AFL lifestyle - he's not gotten much runtime for Hawthorn under Mitchell - who has preferred Frost and others over him - so he'd absolutely be worth a look to see if the change of club and a change of mindset could spark something in him. The thought of playing in finals almost immediately might also appeal. Of this list, he's got the biggest risk/reward IMO; if he's not up to it and Mitchell's Hawthorn are fair in their assessment, he's a wasted trade target, but if he is that's our backline sorted for 10 years.

Josh Draper played a ****ing good game against Charlie early in the season for three terms, holding him and competing brilliantly. There's not all that many 20 year olds who can do that, and he was 19 at the time. He's got good speed, is tall enough for genuine KPD, and is used to playing second fiddle to a dominant KPD in Pearce. He'd be a spectacular get, as he's very young and has plenty of time to develop with us; there's also that Freo have been excellent talent scouts, and their backline's stacked. If he's getting games this young, he's a prospect.

Charlie Ballard is someone GC would be ****ing crazy to let go, so it amazed me that he was even allowed to be 18 months away from being out of contract. It could be out of sight out of mind due to playing for GC, but he's genuinely an intercepting machine. He's the player that Caleb Marchbank has threatened to be when fit, and in all honesty would immediately enter our 22 - this year or next year - and have arguably the most impact. He's also a good player to have with your back to the wall.

Leek Aleer won't be leaving GWS, but imagine if he did. Imagine his athleticism as both a KPD adjacent and a rebounder. He's quick, he's got an amazing leap, and he's a smart footballer; I can remember a game early in the season in which he gave a free kick away and his opponent rubbed it in his face only to have it spur him to being a wall for the entire second half. He mightn't be as immediate an in as the others - although, he really might; we're not all that deep - but he'd add dimensions to our defense that we lack at present in that while Saad and Boyd are fast, we do not have someone who can successfully spoil someone like Charlie Cameron, Elliott or Howe when they choose to leap. Aleer would provide that in spades.

*Player contract data taken from Footywire. If it's wrong, it's not my fault and don't at me.
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Those names you’ve elaborated on are great but I doubt we have the salary cap or the trade capital to get any of them.

Caleb Graham is probably a more realistic option given he has barely played the last 2 seasons at Gold Coast.
 
Beyond Blue said:
Those names you’ve elaborated on are great but I doubt we have the salary cap or the trade capital to get any of them.

Caleb Graham is probably a more realistic option given he has barely played the last 2 seasons at Gold Coast.
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Barely played in the last 2 seasons, contracted to 2026, and only 194cm.
Pass.
 
teddy-hopkins said:
As much as we've had enough of recruiting injury prone players I'd take JGov in a heartbeat.

Would be the perfect fit (when fit). Big risk but the reward is huge.
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And while we're at it, draft Taj Hotton as he slides to our first pick.
We will have to release a few of our other chronically injured, can't have too many on the list.
 
Lets get serious for a minute - we’ve got enough injury prones as it is and we don’t need another one in JGov.

Hawks brought in Brian lake and won 3 flags.

For us a second KPD Doesn’t need to be a superstar - let’s find a robust type that can work with weits.
 

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I'm open to JGov if it's off the back of 3-4 other injury prone players getting cut. Can't add him to the rehab group with a heap of company though.

Cut Durdin, cut Cunners, trade Martin and Carroll, serious consideration to cutting Marchbank. Replace that lot with JGov, Campo 1, Campo 2 and our first round draft pick.

That draft pick could be any of a number of players depending on how aggressively we can trade up using Martin, Carroll and our future picks as collateral. Depending on how high we can/want to get, could target any of Moraes, Shanahan, the Whitlocks, O'Farrell, Berry, Travaglia or Gross. Hell, I wouldn't be averse to trading our 2025 first rounder forward to this year and grabbing two of those players. O'Farrell and Berry would be a lovely combination, and a realistic one I think (though plenty of water to go under the bridge still) - on current estimates, would just need to move our first rounder up to the mid teens for O'Farrell and bring our future first into the late teens this year for Berry. KPD to develop and an express small forward who has shown he can consistently hit the scoreboard and apply pressure.

Out: Marchbank, Durdin, Carroll, Cuningham, Martin
In: McGovern, O'Farrell, B. Campo, L. Campo, Berry

Lose 4 players who are rarely on the park, and one depth mid who may get more opportunity elsewhere.

Gain one genuine (but old) best 22 KPD, a developing KPD, a balanced mid with elite endurance and workrate, a HBF/wing with elite endurance and potentially elite disposal, and a lightning small forward who immediately puts more pressure on Durdin/Motlop/Fogarty/Owies.

It improves us in the short term for the flag tilt and also shores up some gaps for the long term.
 
Westy's_Warriors said:
Rumour is Marchbank has indicated that he will retire at the end of this year. His mentally fatigued from all the injuries.
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Fair enough. Would be pretty hard to keep going when you never get a clean run at it. Even worse when it looks like you've fallen down the pecking order.
I wish him well if he does. Showed signs that he could've been a very good player when healthy, but I feel we've gone past him with Gov and Kemp and he was purely depth.
Can only carry players on unfulfilled talent for so long.
I wouldn't be against a farewell game against North, Hawks, Eagles or Saints. Give one of Gov or Kemp a rest.
 
I’m open to Jeremy McGovern as well - at 32 years of age he could be our Brian Lake, 3 more flags would be good too. 😉👍
 
skadoosh said:
Is O'Farrell an actual possibility or is his name being thrown around jokingly given the relation?
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Most draft rankings and write-ups have him in the frame for 2nd best of the KPPs, probably 10-15 range in the draft. There's some competition with both Whitlocks impressing, and always a chance someone like Shanahan climbs if he has a form spike late in the year.

Both the below, which are probably the most "official", have him at 13. RookieMe's was posted about a month back, the ESPN one is from May (doesn't look like they've release another since).

central.rookieme.com

AFL Draft Power Rankings: June 2024

Rookie Me Central's first AFL Draft Power Rankings for 2024 have dropped, featuring 25 of the nation's top prospects. See who made the cut!
central.rookieme.com central.rookieme.com
THE SWINGMAN
While certainly capable of playing at either end of the ground, O’Farrell has found a home in defence at the highest levels. He featured there for the National Academy, Vic Metro and Calder Cannons, but has also been exposed to the forward half while playing school football over the journey. The 196cm high-flyer takes up good positions behind the ball and isn’t afraid to crash packs, although can work on taking his contested marks more cleanly and consistently. O’Farrell’s athleticism and distributive skills add to his appeal as a key position prospect, to go with the versatility a swingman offers. He’ll contend to be the second-best tall behind Trainor.
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www.espn.com.au

Draft Power Rankings: Key position twins rocket up the top 20

In an AFL draft crop top-heavy with midfielders, a pair of key position players -- twins, in fact -- have made their move up ESPN's May Power Rankings, writes Jasper Chellappah.
www.espn.com.au www.espn.com.au
A masterful shutdown defender, O'Farrell can play at both ends of the ground but looks most comfortable playing back shoulder and coming over the top of packs in contested marking situations. He has the length and sneaky-good closing speed to play on a variety of talls.
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Given we don't have a developing KPD, and yes, given the link to his father, he certainly looks a likely prospect for us depending on what we can do with our first pick.
 
Hopefully we can go after another tall nature defender. I know Hardwick isn’t as tall but it makes sense to get some experience back in.

In the other hand why would he be playing vfl currently if he’s planning on retiring.
 
Red_man2008 said:
Hopefully we can go after another tall nature defender. I know Hardwick isn’t as tall but it makes sense to get some experience back in.

In the other hand why would he be playing vfl currently if he’s planning on retiring.
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One last crack? Still a chance to be a premiership player if the injury curse works his way for once in his life
 
Red_man2008 said:
Hopefully we can go after another tall nature defender. I know Hardwick isn’t as tall but it makes sense to get some experience back in.

In the other hand why would he be playing vfl currently if he’s planning on retiring.
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You do realise that planning on retiring is not the same as retiring, right?
 
Red_man2008 said:
Hopefully we can go after another tall nature defender. I know Hardwick isn’t as tall but it makes sense to get some experience back in.

In the other hand why would he be playing vfl currently if he’s planning on retiring.
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Retiring from the AFL level football isn't the same as retiring completely from football. Less pressure and fewer expectations at the VFL level really.
 
Westy's_Warriors said:
Rumour is Marchbank has indicated that he will retire at the end of this year. His mentally fatigued from all the injuries.
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I don't blame him. He wants to play football, but his body has let him down. With the amount of injuries he's had, I would have retired a couple of years ago. Took a year off completely from football, then make a comeback at the VFL level.
 
Honestly, I'm kind of relieved to hear this. Not because I want him to have to give the game away - he's been dealt a shitty hand, and we all appreciate that he could have been an incredible player if his body had held up. But because I think it's the best thing for the list as a list (not people) to replace him with someone who can get on the park 20+ games a year - whether that's a developing kid, a journeyman or an ageing veteran - and sometimes making the hard call on a fantastic person who is universally loved and respected by the club proves too hard for the decision-makers at the club.

Delisting him could have been destabilising, retaining him could prove costly from a list management and short-term success perspective, but him retiring could be the best overall outcome for all.
 
Westy's_Warriors said:
Rumour is Marchbank has indicated that he will retire at the end of this year. His mentally fatigued from all the injuries.
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There have been plenty of careers prematurely and sadly ended over my 60 plus years. Marchy will be somewhat lost on that list soon enough.

I firmly believe Kempy has now gone past him, but this should not cloud the tragedy his perennial injury history has become. Rarely has a key/tall defender enjoyed the hype Caleb had in his draft year and his development years. One J.Brown has periodically lauded his early years in the media.

Sadly, our bodies can let us down, each passing episode removes half a yard of pace, or a level of lateral movement or spring. Caleb has had his share and then some. We will never see what he could have become.

Retirement would be a sensible outcome. No trying to hang on to the dream, to reach the levels his body no longer can. He could take a payday of sorts at another club, but likely at very basic money. I would hate to be a club official who has worked with him tasked with ending his career. Players are people and it hurts. (What I have lost to injury gives me first hand experience) We are a long time retired, young men (and women these days) push their bodies to extreme with little regard for future years. Life goes on, and the need to keep one’s body as healthy as possible cannot be undersold.

Watching the seconds the last couple of weeks, I have noticed and commented that Caleb is carrying more weight than he ever has. I was thinking that his preparation had changed, that he was just happy to get on the park, rather than striving for the ultimate comeback (again). Thought he may have been tapped on the shoulder, likely there has been no contract discussion.

This rumour does not surprise me. I hope the club assists him to set up for life after footy, softening the blow, so to speak.
 
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