List Mgmt. 2024 List Management discussion

[T Rick]

So Dev couldn't even make emergencies this week with so many out, should we read anything into that about him heading for the exit? There just doesn't seem to be a pathway for him with us anymore, especially with LAshcroft and Marshall coming in as well.

I agree with the pathway issue but this week's injuries really didn't align with Dev's strengths...if our midfield had been decimated, a different story.

 

[mpal6]

Lohmann emergence this year has really pushed Dev out of the final non-midfield spot that he played on last year.

 

[Royboy1961]

I agree with the pathway issue but this week's injuries really didn't align with Dev's strengths...if our midfield had been decimated, a different story.

Dev Robertson played as an inside mid for WA under 18s. He was an elite midfielder who picked up numerous possessions as an under aged. He was also highly regarded for his leadership and application to his craft. His main concern for recruiters as his disposal by foot. He waisted many of his kicks. This is why the Lions have played him as an outside midfielder mainly on the wing and half forward two that he can improve his all round game. He played OK during the Grand Final and was probably one of our better players while playing on the wing. He even kicked a goal. Unfortunately this year he has had a few injuries meaning that he has not have any continuity to solidify his position in the side. In the VFL side he is one of our best players every week and continues to find the ball at will. His kicking still seems to be an issue he appears to miss his target by atleast a metre. This may be an attitude thing or maybe he just doesn’t have the skill. I think he is best used as a pressure forward if he plays AFL as he just doesn’t have that much hurt factor as either an inside or outside mid. He also played a ripper game against Melbourne at the MCG for the final against Oliver. He played as a tagger for the first half of the game and did really well. Berry then took over and also had an impact ad as everyone knows this was one Berrys best games he has played for the Lions. So at the end of the day I suppose Robertsons potential is still unknown.So his history has shown that He has played some serviceable finals games, had a few injuries and then fought his way into the side.He reminds me a little of a player called Ben Keays who tries hard, has great leadership but has questionable disposal skills. As we all know things can change quickly in the AFL and an opportunity can present itself where a player can show case their talent. If either Lachie Neale or Dunkley have an injury both he and Lyon would be the first players to replace them. This is why you need ready made players in the reserves as a squad wins you a premiership.

 

[Berrygood]

Dev Robertson played as an inside mid for WA under 18s. He was an elite midfielder who picked up numerous possessions as an under aged. He was also highly regarded for his leadership and application to his craft. His main concern for recruiters as his disposal by foot. He waisted many of his kicks. This is why the Lions have played him as an outside midfielder mainly on the wing and half forward two that he can improve his all round game. He played OK during the Grand Final and was probably one of our better players while playing on the wing. He even kicked a goal. Unfortunately this year he has had a few injuries meaning that he has not have any continuity to solidify his position in the side. In the VFL side he is one of our best players every week and continues to find the ball at will. His kicking still seems to be an issue he appears to miss his target by atleast a metre. This may be an attitude thing or maybe he just doesn’t have the skill. I think he is best used as a pressure forward if he plays AFL as he just doesn’t have that much hurt factor as either an inside or outside mid. He also played a ripper game against Melbourne at the MCG for the final against Oliver. He played as a tagger for the first half of the game and did really well. Berry then took over and also had an impact ad as everyone knows this was one Berrys best games he has played for the Lions. So at the end of the day I suppose Robertsons potential is still unknown.So his history has shown that He has played some serviceable finals games, had a few injuries and then fought his way into the side.He reminds me a little of a player called Ben Keays who tries hard, has great leadership but has questionable disposal skills. As we all know things can change quickly in the AFL and an opportunity can present itself where a player can show case their talent. If either Lachie Neale or Dunkley have an injury both he and Lyon would be the first players to replace them. This is why you need ready made players in the reserves as a squad wins you a premiership.

I'm a Dev fan, I really wanted him to come on this year and I do think he could play that hunt ball, tackle hard, tag a player role like Berry to a good standard. Hard working reliable depth.

I don't think I've read a better, fairer evaluation of Dev.

 

[irel]

Like Keays, Dev needs to find a club that would give him an oportunity and persist with him in the midfield.
We are not the club for him. Way too many ahead of him and more are coming.
Is there a club out there that would take him?
I think Collingwood would suit him, maybe Adelaide if they lose Berry. Otherwise he will unfortunately remain a VFL player.

 

[mpal6]

Like Keays, Dev needs to find a club that would give him an oportunity and persist with him in the midfield.
We are not the club for him. Way too many ahead of him and more are coming.
Is there a club out there that would take him?
I think Collingwood would suit him, maybe Adelaide if they lose Berry. Otherwise he will unfortunately remain a VFL player.

Challenge for Dev would be the additional roles he'd be expected to carry and deliver. To be fair to Keays he goes forward and something happens. He knows his way around a forward stoppage to convert it into a goal. Dev is like Scotty West mould midfielder, in-and-under feed the ball to the outside. Not sure if those singular skill types get a consistent opportunity these days.

Will Brodie would be a close match to Dev Robertson, he went to Freo - had a great season in 2022, started dropping off in 2023 with injuries and now Fyfe / Young have effectively pushed him out of that midfield. Had a look at his stats for Peel thunder, he's having a really good season but can't get a look into the first 22.

EDIT: forgot to add, I've watched a couple of Fremantle games and Matthew Johnson stood out whenever he was playing in midfield at stoppage or center bounce. He had time and decision making was really good, it was like watching McCluggage or Dal Santo in a different jumper. He might be another one who will play ahead of Brodie. Johnson plays utility role in defense as well which is an added attraction to keeping him in ahead of Brodie.

 

[Cubs2Lions]

Like Keays, Dev needs to find a club that would give him an oportunity and persist with him in the midfield.
We are not the club for him. Way too many ahead of him and more are coming.
Is there a club out there that would take him?
I think Collingwood would suit him, maybe Adelaide if they lose Berry. Otherwise he will unfortunately remain a VFL player.

Challenge for Dev would be the additional roles he'd be expected to carry and deliver. To be fair to Keays he goes forward and something happens. He knows his way around a forward stoppage to convert it into a goal. Dev is like Scotty West mould midfielder, in-and-under feed the ball to the outside. Not sure if those singular skill types get a consistent opportunity these days.

Will Brodie would be a close match to Dev Robertson, he went to Freo - had a great season in 2022, started dropping off in 2023 with injuries and now Fyfe / Young have effectively pushed him out of that midfield. Had a look at his stats for Peel thunder, he's having a really good season but can't get a look into the first 22.

Clubs like Richmond, St. Kilda and West Coast would be interested in him if he explored his options.

Quite a shame he hasn't found regular opportunities though, was really happy we drafted him and thought he would be our next superstar at the club but for reasons unknown, it just hasn't panned out that way and just don't see a place in our lineup anymore (with Ashcroft II & Marshall coming in) unless injuries occur.

The other factor that could have hindered his progress, like mpal6 has alluded to, is the game has changed so much since 2019 and clubs are looking for midfielders that are more flexible to multiple positional changes and flexibility than to be stoned in one position long-term.

While Robertson is a great contested player who plays inside 99% of the time, our young players like McCluggage, Berry, Rayner, Bailey, Ashcroft and even in Fletcher, Lohmann & Sharp are all ahead of him as they can play multiple positions on the ground (when needed).

Unfortunately, this is the direction the recruiters are going in drafting / trading for players and until Robertson becomes a better winger or small-forward on top of his midfield craft, he won't find a spot in our side given Fages philosophy.

 

[lionshine]

I know our midfield is pretty stacked right now and still has Levi & Marshall to come but I wouldn’t be against getting Alex Davies from the Suns. He’s a beast of a midfielder. I could see him joining another club and having a similar rise to Josh Kennedy when he left the Hawks for the Swans.

Would be a great compliment to our younger midfield brigade as that taller, contested type as the Ashcroft brothers, Fletcher ect. are on the smaller side.

Issue is if you added him to our side right now how does he get midfield minutes with Neale, Dunkley, McCluggage, Ashcroft, Berry and Rayner all spending time in there? Probably a couple years too early and surplus to needs but would be perfect in 3 years time when Neale is close to the end.

I’m just thinking our depth outside the 22 midfield wise will be tested if Lyons & Dev depart at years end.

 

[mpal6]

I know our midfield is pretty stacked right now and still has Levi & Marshall to come but I wouldn’t be against getting Alex Davies from the Suns. He’s a beast of a midfielder. I could see him joining another club and having a similar rise to Josh Kennedy when he left the Hawks for the Swans.

Would be a great compliment to our younger midfield brigade as that taller, contested type as the Ashcroft brothers, Fletcher ect. are on the smaller side.

Issue is if you added him to our side right now how does he get midfield minutes with Neale, Dunkley, McCluggage, Ashcroft, Berry and Rayner all spending time in there? Probably a couple years too early and surplus to needs but would be perfect in 3 years time when Neale is close to the end.

I’m just thinking our depth outside the 22 midfield wise will be tested if Lyons & Dev depart at years end.

Yeah Davies sounds slightly premium for us to get him and not play him. Maybe we have to look in draft this year for one of those late picks to get a big frame 190+ midfielder who is happy to bide his time and wait for the opportunity.

 

[Pride of lions]

Like Keays, Dev needs to find a club that would give him an oportunity and persist with him in the midfield.
We are not the club for him. Way too many ahead of him and more are coming.
Is there a club out there that would take him?
I think Collingwood would suit him, maybe Adelaide if they lose Berry. Otherwise he will unfortunately remain a VFL player.

I think the big drawback with Dev is his lack of class with his ball use, particularly his kicking. I believe this was the knock on him as a junior and was the reason he dropped so far down in the draft. He is a great ball hunter and tackler but in modern football if you turn the ball over consistently you can’t expect to play at the highest level. And to try to modify his kicking style now would be incredibly difficult.

 

[buttermuffs]

Watching him in the VFL he just isn't improving. Would probably rather keep him and get rid of Tunstill instead but wouldn't be a big deal if Dev left

We have a logjam at midfield with no injuries and players like Berry, Bailey, Rayner and Ashcroft who are all better midfielders in the first team anyway.

 

[mpal6]

We have a logjam at midfield with no injuries and players like Berry, Bailey, Rayner and Ashcroft who are all better midfielders in the first team anyway.

With Levi and Marshall on their way !

 

[morsie]

2 or 3 years ago he scored a quite brilliant goal and I thought he had arrived or at least was on the plane.Just disappointed it hasn't happened.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Like Keays, Dev needs to find a club that would give him an oportunity and persist with him in the midfield.
We are not the club for him. Way too many ahead of him and more are coming.
Is there a club out there that would take him?
I think Collingwood would suit him, maybe Adelaide if they lose Berry. Otherwise he will unfortunately remain a VFL player.

It took a very fortunate set of circumstances for Keays to end up with an AFL career. A struggling side with injuries to similar footballers allowing him time to develop at the elite level with a lack of young talent to push him out

 

[briztoon]

With Levi and Marshall on their way !

And Annable the year after.

 

[martinson]

It took a very fortunate set of circumstances for Keays to end up with an AFL career. A struggling side with injuries to similar footballers allowing him time to develop at the elite level with a lack of young talent to push him out

Nathan you and others go out of your way to knock Ben every chance you get. You've all been doing it for years.

There was no set of 'fortunate circumstances' that ended up in an AFL career.

He runs his guts out both ways ,he's going to be a 200 game player and most clubs would love to have him.

End of story.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Nathan you and others go out of your way to knock Ben every chance you get. You've all been doing it for years.

There was no set of 'fortunate circumstances' that ended up in an AFL career.

He runs his guts out both ways ,he's going to be a 200 game player and most clubs would love to have him.

End of story.

Disagree

Could’ve not been rookied and ended up playing VFL. Or rookied by a strong team and never got a chance. Or Crows might’ve had a decent run with injuries and he doesn’t get an extended run in the seniors

 

[mpal6]

Disagree

Could’ve not been rookied and ended up playing VFL. Or rookied by a strong team and never got a chance. Or Crows might’ve had a decent run with injuries and he doesn’t get an extended run in the seniors

Well that rookie career path could've happened to anyone to be honest. Keays was included at a rebuilding phase for a club knowing what they'll get. His relentless work ethic got him the well deserving career he currently has.

I've kept my eye out for game day threads in the last 2-3 years for Adelaide and Keays will get consistent praise for his work ethic and never stop trying attitude. He had to adapt along the way too, got moved out of center handing over the midfield keys to someone else. But he went forward and found another way to contribute and produce the goods. Well done to him.

 

[Elixuh]

Nathan you and others go out of your way to knock Ben every chance you get. You've all been doing it for years.

There was no set of 'fortunate circumstances' that ended up in an AFL career.

He runs his guts out both ways ,he's going to be a 200 game player and most clubs would love to have him.

End of story.

Are you saying we shouldn’t have let Ben keays go? Because I agree.

 

[Dalions]

Are you saying we shouldn’t have let Ben keays go? Because I agree.

I still dont see him in our team right now.

 

[martinson]

Are you saying we shouldn’t have let Ben keays go? Because I agree.

I think overall letting him go was justifiable but in hindsight I would've loved to have had him in the team in last year's GF.

Whatever ,they absolutely love him in Adelaide. We had plenty of other options who looked better on whatever biometric is used to plot the future but he's just one of those guys who's made the absolute best out of himself and is therefore often able to give you more than what you would've expected.

 

[martinson]

I still do t see him in our team right now.

It's a disease Dalions.

Overrating your own players.

I've been doing it since the '60's.

 

[mpal6]

I still do t see him in our team right now.

Would've become our Jarryd Lyons if he stayed on and got the midfield role. It's sliding doors, if Keays was retained and he flourished, maybe we would not have gone for Lyons ? - hard to say.

 

[Dalions]

Would've become our Jarryd Lyons if he stayed on and got the midfield role. It's sliding doors, if Keays was retained and he flourished, maybe we would not have gone for Lyons ? - hard to say.

He has been pushed out of Adelaide’s midfield

 

[mpal6]

He has been pushed out of Adelaide’s midfield

Yep, same as what we did with Lyons this year. Lyons and Keays were at Lions in 2019 season. Lyons walked in and got paired with Neale which started our swing up the ladder. We never know what the outcome would've been if Keays got that role and allowed to grow.

Also after being pushed out of midfield, Keays has found a home as small forward kicking 28 goals so far this season. Decent return for an average battler.