List Mgmt. 2024 List Management thread - Trade Targets Part 2

[CaseySibosadoHOF]

We can take it further and tie it in with the club clearly chasing Warner very hard while getting Bolton at the same time. Incredibly, the defensive balance isn't there and there's only 22 spots on a field. While Bolton/Warner/Brayshaw/Young/Serong is mouthwatering on paper, you need a support mid to do the dirty work, every top team has them, which means basically every one of those names needs to have a 2nd position making best 22 spots even harder to come by.

I think with the support mid and the "are we too tall?" discussions, you bring up a number of valid problems, but there's enough workarounds to mask or reverse the negatives

On the fwds, you can do Triple J with Jackson rotating btwn midfield, 2nd ruck and fwd with Sturt and still be at least ok in the ground ball and pressure aspects. But it doesn't work right now coz we have too many mediums/smalls who don't contribute in those respects. Switta is hard carrying in those areas so unless we get multiple players in you gotta hang onto him. Sturt has taken a leap there, and if he can further improve that's great but he's no longer the main culprit. Freddy needs to take a leap in those respects or change position. The rest are a mix of developmental projects and players who are what they are: you gotta take it or leave it. Need guys who can pressure, attack the ground ball and score from that (what makes Switta annoying is if he could score from the ground balls he gets he'd be basically perfect).

The midfield is interesting. I don't think we expected Hayden Young to be quite this good offensively. In the first half of the season, it was him and Fyfe that were talked about as being the defensive guys, but now you can't justify making Young be that. If Chad comes, I think you can make defence by committee work with Brayshaw being the head of it: none of the mids firmly on a leash, none of them with fully free reign either. Apart from the few games Berry played significant midfield minutes, Dunkley was really their defensive guy, but he's so much more than that as a player. Brayshaw can be that.

They're both interesting structures, and a clearer division btwn roles would create less headaches. Oliver Henry, unlike Sturt, isn't asked to really do any of the pressure stuff: he's pretty much a key fwd for Geelong. And then you have eg Sydney and Port midfield wise who have a clear division btwn the stars and the workhorses. But, if done right, the team's ceiling would be limitless.

 

[wakojako]

Warner has been absolutely blanketed this game. Great offensive player but not great at winning his own ball and imposing himself on the contest. It will hold him back from being a top 10 player. Young on the other hand...

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I’m not sure you can make that argument while we have shit small forwards who can’t kick goals.

You reckon it can’t work with Bolton instead of Emmett? Emmett, tripping over his own feet running into the forward line, or Bolton showing the ball while kicking snags..

But I'm saying I'd rather the actual elite small forward? Not following how this applies to what I said. If we have Bolton and Warner both playing a fair bit up front.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I think with the support mid and the "are we too tall?" discussions, you bring up a number of valid problems, but there's enough workarounds to mask or reverse the negatives

On the fwds, you can do Triple J with Jackson rotating btwn midfield, 2nd ruck and fwd with Sturt and still be at least ok in the ground ball and pressure aspects. But it doesn't work right now coz we have too many mediums/smalls who don't contribute in those respects. Switta is hard carrying in those areas so unless we get multiple players in you gotta hang onto him. Sturt has taken a leap there, and if he can further improve that's great but he's no longer the main culprit. Freddy needs to take a leap in those respects or change position. The rest are a mix of developmental projects and players who are what they are: you gotta take it or leave it. Need guys who can pressure, attack the ground ball and score from that (what makes Switta annoying is if he could score from the ground balls he gets he'd be basically perfect).

The midfield is interesting. I don't think we expected Hayden Young to be quite this good offensively. In the first half of the season, it was him and Fyfe that were talked about as being the defensive guys, but now you can't justify making Young be that. If Chad comes, I think you can make defence by committee work with Brayshaw being the head of it: none of the mids firmly on a leash, none of them with fully free reign either. Apart from the few games Berry played significant midfield minutes, Dunkley was really their defensive guy, but he's so much more than that as a player. Brayshaw can be that.

They're both interesting structures, and a clearer division btwn roles would create less headaches. Oliver Henry, unlike Sturt, isn't asked to really do any of the pressure stuff: he's pretty much a key fwd for Geelong. And then you have eg Sydney and Port midfield wise who have a clear division btwn the stars and the workhorses. But, if done right, the team's ceiling would be limitless.

It sounds odd but I'd think if we somehow get both Warner and Bolton, Youngs second position actually needs to be defence because no one else in the midfield can go there.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Warner has been absolutely blanketed this game. Great offensive player but not great at winning his own ball and imposing himself on the contest. It will hold him back from being a top 10 player. Young on the other hand...

I think this is why one of Warner or Bolton is perfect. We have the guys to feed it to them to make the flashier plays. Unlike Sydney as well, who don't have anything useful up front, it wouldn't be "stop the midfield stop the team"

 

[Tundrawolf]

If we have been planning for Warner over the last couple of years, which we have. And we reportedly made big offers to Logan McDonald and Gulden and Baker, then surely we must have cap space for all of Pickett, Bolton and Warner.

 

[s_wd6]

If we have been planning for Warner over the last couple of years, which we have. And we reportedly made big offers to Logan McDonald and Gulden and Baker, then surely we must have cap space for all of Pickett, Bolton and Warner.

It sounds logical, but I doubt that’s the case

 

[freo_leo29]

If we have been planning for Warner over the last couple of years, which we have. And we reportedly made big offers to Logan McDonald and Gulden and Baker, then surely we must have cap space for all of Pickett, Bolton and Warner.

Treacy's value went up and Baker was probably being decided on when we were starting to pull out of Logan

 

[Cobbler]

If we have been planning for Warner over the last couple of years, which we have. And we reportedly made big offers to Logan McDonald and Gulden and Baker, then surely we must have cap space for all of Pickett, Bolton and Warner.

Treacy would’ve cost a bit

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

If we have been planning for Warner over the last couple of years, which we have. And we reportedly made big offers to Logan McDonald and Gulden and Baker, then surely we must have cap space for all of Pickett, Bolton and Warner.

Except you'd argue Gulden offer was a load of shit just pushing up his price as much as possible and getting him rules out McDonald. Then you'd say Baker is less than Pickett and the McDonald/Gulden money is at least partly going to Treacy.

There is no way we can fit in 3m of capspace without losing at least one highly paid player. Probably more.

 

[Mr Cheese]

Treacy's value went up and Baker was probably being decided on when we were starting to pull out of Logan

No wonder he missed those kicks...

 

[Lach72]

But I'm saying I'd rather the actual elite small forward? Not following how this applies to what I said. If we have Bolton and Warner both playing a fair bit up front.

And I’m saying 3 talls plus Sturt may work better with two elite small forwards not two potatoes

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

And I’m saying 3 talls plus Sturt may work better with two elite small forwards not two potatoes

I'm happy to see how it goes but I think it's too tall in the modern game, even with Sturt improving his defensive side.

 

[Tundrawolf]

We would already have accounted for Warner, that still leaves big offers for Logan and Errol, and the offer for Baker.

That is still big $$$$ despite Treacy's contract.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

We would already have accounted for Warner, that still leaves big offers for Logan and Errol, and the offer for Baker.

That is still big $$$$ despite Treacy's contract.

Then at best, that's Bolton, not Bolton AND Pickett.

 

[Lach72]

I'm happy to see how it goes but I think it's too tall in the modern game, even with Sturt improving his defensive side.

I dunno.
I’d like Jackson to thin out a little to get some
More mobility but Sturt is fast enough and he’s deadly by foot.

I think Bolton changes a hell of a lot

 

[s_wd6]

Except you'd argue Gulden offer was a load of shit just pushing up his price as much as possible and getting him rules out McDonald. Then you'd say Baker is less than Pickett and the McDonald/Gulden money is at least partly going to Treacy.

There is no way we can fit in 3m of capspace without losing at least one highly paid player. Probably more.

Lucky for us we have one player on good money that we can get off the books that will have little affect on our team performance

 

[freo_leo29]

We would already have accounted for Warner, that still leaves big offers for Logan and Errol, and the offer for Baker.

That is still big $$$$ despite Treacy's contract.

Yeah but no way we get Gulden and Warner so they counteract each other

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I dunno.
I’d like Jackson to thin out a little to get some
More mobility but Sturt is fast enough and he’s deadly by foot.

I think Bolton changes a hell of a lot

I know we are all dooming at the moment but man, how exciting to watch Bolton run around for us next year. I can't ****ing wait.

 

[TheMcManusNose]

List management discussion point if we can be objective. Do we think the days of 3 talls up front are done? Is the ideal (and other methods can be varying levels of successful) one genuine clunking tall (Treacy), a mobile hybrid tall (Amiss), a medium and then a fleet of fast running smalls?

If you are confident the three works as much because of what having Jackson as 2nd ruck should be doing in the middle (average year notwithstanding), does Sturt provide enough pace, pressure and ball movement to hold his spot in the future?

Basically, the more I watch of these finals (and even previous years), the more I think the 3 talls and a medium may not be sustainable, particularly because I think Bolton almost is a medium with his leap and marling ability.

As others have said with Treacy, Jackson and Amiss it works better than it would with more lumbering kpfs.

I think on balance you have to look at what we have on the list as well as what the ideal set up is. Pure pressure players that don't kick goals can be such a huge negative if you have to play too many of them.

The positive of the three talls plus Sturt actually kicking goals outweighs the loss of pressure. Vs say playing Emmett plus Switta plus Banners.

That said you get a pressure forward who kicks goals in addition to say Bolton, I'll be the first to drive Sam Sturt to the airport as much as I am a huge fan.

 

[wakojako]

Then at best, that's Bolton, not Bolton AND Pickett.

Bro you are forgetting the fact that Richmond will help us with Bolton's salary. I don't see how we can't afford both unless they have been reckless with the salary cap.

 

[Lach72]

As others have said with Treacy, Jackson and Amiss it works better than it would with more lumbering kpfs.

I think on balance you have to look at what we have on the list as well as what the ideal set up is. Pure pressure players that don't kick goals can be such a huge negative if you have to play too many of them.

The positive of the three talls plus Sturt actually kicking goals outweighs the loss of pressure. Vs say playing Emmett plus Switta plus Banners.

That said you get a pressure forward who kicks goals in addition to say Bolton, I'll be the first to drive Sam Sturt to the airport as much as I am a huge fan.

Why would you do that? What wouldn’t you just get rid of Banfield, Emmett, Walters, Switkowski?

Why not keep the medium forward with pace, great foot skills and accurate goal kicking?

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Bro you are forgetting the fact that Richmond will help us with Bolton's salary. I don't see how we can't afford both unless they have been reckless with the salary cap.

We are talking about Bolton, Warner and Pickett here. All of them

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

Why would you do that? What wouldn’t you just get rid of Banfield, Emmett, Walters, Switkowski?

Why not keep the medium forward with pace, great foot skills and accurate goal kicking?

Switta is adding more than Sturt in that situation. No one has that many goal threats up front, you need a balance

 

[Tundrawolf]

I know we are all dooming at the moment but man, how exciting to watch Bolton run around for us next year. I can't ****ing wait.

Yeah but I'm greedy, I want more.