List Mgmt. 2024 National Draft - November 20-21

[Jen2310]

 

[RobJD]

take em all lol
I think we'll take our forward. one defender and one mid

I'd take two forwards and a forward/mid - roughly 50% of our tall forward draftees end up being a defender, so by selecting two forwards there's a good chance one of them will make it as a backman

 

[sr36]

take em all lol
I think we'll take our forward. one defender and one mid

Two blokes who can catch and compete in the air and have decent agility - work out which end to play them later on.

+ One outside runner.

 

[Couch Coach]

There's no real fuss. Again we're also referring specifically to the draft. the last time we took a key forward in the national draft was Chris Dawes. Or maybe Liam McMahon?

As you said, the two we have are older and will need successors.

People understandably want to know that a kid is coming through. Seems fair enough no?

Dawes is going back a fair way:

2020 Oliver Henry (Prick) Pick 17, Reef McInnes Pick 23 and Liam McMahon Pick 31
2018 Will Kelly Pick 29 and Tom Wilson Cat B
2016 Sam McLarty (more of a back) Pick 30
2011 Jackson Paine Pick 50 and Corey Gault Pick 65
2008 Leigh Brown Pick 73
2007 Tobias Thoolen Pick 47

So we have tried a few in the draft and even more in the rookie draft.
The thing that stands out though is that only two have been taken in the first round and even then at the later end.

 

[loki04]

Dawes is going back a fair way:

2020 Oliver Henry (Prick) Pick 17, Reef McInnes Pick 23 and Liam McMahon Pick 31
2018 Will Kelly Pick 29 and Tom Wilson Cat B
2016 Sam McLarty (more of a back) Pick 30
2011 Jackson Paine Pick 50 and Corey Gault Pick 65
2008 Leigh Brown Pick 73
2007 Tobias Thoolen Pick 47

So we have tried a few in the draft and even more in the rookie draft.
The thing that stands out though is that only two have been taken in the first round and even then at the later end.

Henry and Reef are not KPF.

Reef is borderline but doesn't play like a true KPF like say Mihocek does at 193cm. Reef was also originally recruited as a big Midfielder.

Kelly was a defender.

McClarty was a CHB, fwd Ruck/CHF as a junior. Who came with a hearing disability was going to be a hard ask.

Paine undersized. Gault a massive long shot and going back to 2011...a reminder we are entering 2025.

 

[loki04]

We actually have two who were drafted late (admittedly only one by us) and have been better contributors than Lord or Lewis. With McStay and Checkers, I'm not sure what all the fuss is about with us and our KPFs - they're really solid players. I do hope we draft one this year though as neither are young.

I think people want a genuine regular Match winner type KPF, a 70 goal fwd.

Ie a Jez Cameron type.

McStay and Checkers are definitely good enough to be premiership duo.

Neither are going to be a 70 goal gun FF though.

The other issue is nothing coming underneath them means any injury and we have sweet fa that can even attempt to fill the role.

 

[loki04]

Two blokes who can catch and compete in the air and have decent agility - work out which end to play them later on.

+ One outside runner.

Given where we are drafting them I'd load up on 3 talls and hope at least 1 works out.

Always hit the rookie draft looking for your Sharod Wellingham's (players with stand out attributes but weakness in game).

 

[sr36]

Given where we are drafting them I'd load up on 3 talls and hope at least 1 works out.

Always hit the rookie draft looking for your Sharod Wellingham's (players with stand out attributes but weakness in game).

We don't have space for rookie draft - doubt we'll use it again for kids either. It'll be 2 or 3 draftees and done. I'd be fine with 3 talls - but will there be 3 we're interested in at that stage of the draft?

I'd love them to go back to 52on a list and space for a heap of speculative guys, but with lists at 42 you just can't if you want to have a crack at a flag with a bit of depth as injury cover.

 

[Matt_352]

Is Sims a fwd that can ruck or a ruck that can go fwd?

I think we need a KPD, a KPF and then I'd go best available with last pick.

 

[OniAu]

Dawes is going back a fair way:

2020 Oliver Henry (Prick) Pick 17, Reef McInnes Pick 23 and Liam McMahon Pick 31
2018 Will Kelly Pick 29 and Tom Wilson Cat B
2016 Sam McLarty (more of a back) Pick 30
2011 Jackson Paine Pick 50 and Corey Gault Pick 65
2008 Leigh Brown Pick 73
2007 Tobias Thoolen Pick 47

So we have tried a few in the draft and even more in the rookie draft.
The thing that stands out though is that only two have been taken in the first round and even then at the later end.

Is the bolded the position or club he played for ?

 

[satanshoof101]

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Dawes is going back a fair way:

2020 Oliver Henry (Prick) Pick 17, Reef McInnes Pick 23 and Liam McMahon Pick 31
2018 Will Kelly Pick 29 and Tom Wilson Cat B
2016 Sam McLarty (more of a back) Pick 30
2011 Jackson Paine Pick 50 and Corey Gault Pick 65
2008 Leigh Brown Pick 73
2007 Tobias Thoolen Pick 47

So we have tried a few in the draft and even more in the rookie draft.
The thing that stands out though is that only two have been taken in the first round and even then at the later end.

I'd argue that Henry, Wilson and Reef aren't key position. I'd say most would agree with me

Many of the others I flat out forgot about honestly and I guess further shows how bad we are at recruiting and developing key position players.

I did already mention McMahon in my post

 

[loki04]

We don't have space for rookie draft - doubt we'll use it again for kids either. It'll be 2 or 3 draftees and done. I'd be fine with 3 talls - but will there be 3 we're interested in at that stage of the draft?

I'd love them to go back to 52on a list and space for a heap of speculative guys, but with lists at 42 you just can't if you want to have a crack at a flag with a bit of depth as injury cover.

I think you can certainly justify it but you/they are choosing not to and trying something different in loading up on mature vfl types.

Not like having a bunch of VFL players helped win a flag last year is it? Covered injuries sure but at what expense further delaying AFL development of youth like Allan, Ryan, Reef etc would of been a greater long term benefit.

Where as iirc there were 6 or 7? premiership players who came off the rookie list from drafting them in 2010. Including the captain.

 

[loki04]

I'd argue that Henry, Wilson and Reef aren't key position. I'd say most would agree with me

Many of the others I flat out forgot about honestly and I guess further shows how bad we are at recruiting and developing key position players.

I did already mention McMahon in my post

Most of them go back over a decade ago.

 

[Chunky Steak]

Henry and Reef are not KPF.

Reef is borderline but doesn't play like a true KPF like say Mihocek does at 193cm. Reef was also originally recruited as a big Midfielder.

Kelly was a defender.

McClarty was a CHB, fwd Ruck/CHF as a junior. Who came with a hearing disability was going to be a hard ask.

Paine undersized. Gault a massive long shot and going back to 2011...a reminder we are entering 2025.

Just as a side note, to be fair to Sam McLarty there was no indication that his cochlear implant was a significant factor in him not making it. Just wasn't up to the level from a performance perspective unfortunately.

His drafting, although it didn't work out, was a big step forward and hopefully inspires other kids with hearing issues to stick with footy.

 

[sr36]

I think you can certainly justify it but you/they are choosing not to and trying something different in loading up on mature vfl types.

Not like having a bunch of VFL players helped win a flag last year is it? Covered injuries sure but at what expense further delaying AFL development of youth like Allan, Ryan, Reef etc would of been a greater long term benefit.

Where as iirc there were 6 or 7? premiership players who came off the rookie list from drafting them in 2010. Including the captain.

We're not alone in taking a heap less kids. The rookie draft used to run for nearly as many picks as the National Draft, but list sizes have dropped and now it's mainly mature guys. Last year it was down to 18 guys drafted with most of them from the AFL or state leauges and only a couple of kids.

The 6 or 7 rookies in 2010 were kids drafted really late when teams had bigger lists and regularly added 8-10 kids a year.

No one is doing that with the current list sizes - except Richmond this year - as they've got that many high picks.

To have depth for multiple positions, you need to have about 35 guys who can realistically come in and play a role. Clubs enter the draft with about 3 or 4 blokes already on the list who you wouldn't want to count as depth yet. Leaves about 4 spots - some a couple more and some a couple less - we look like we're aiming for the lower end and are just taking 2 or 3 kids.

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

To have depth for multiple positions, you need to have about 35 guys who can realistically come in and play a role. Clubs enter the draft with about 3 or 4 blokes already on the list who you wouldn't want to count as depth yet. Leaves about 4 spots - some a couple more and some a couple less - we look like we're aiming for the lower end and are just taking 2 or 3 kids.

Worth pointing out that any long-term injuries eat into those numbers as well. We selected additional mature age guys last year because we had McStay with a knee and Murphy with the eventual retirement hanging over him, so we were even less able to select untried kids to replace that depth.

I've got our least viable reserves players currently as Smit, Steene, DeMattia and Jiath (despite him making his debut in 2024). Assuming we add Membrey, and take three kids at the draft, that list will sit at 7 players you can't rely on to play, which out of a list of 42 gives us 35 "contributors". The hope would then be that a couple of the existing 4 guys go on to prove that they're at least viable depth by the end of 2025.

We have the luxury of Wil Parker sitting outside the main list and being a very viable senior option in our reserves too. Really big resource to get a free additional player.

 

[sr36]

Worth pointing out that any long-term injuries eat into those numbers as well. We selected additional mature age guys last year because we had McStay with a knee and Murphy with the eventual retirement hanging over him, so we were even less able to select untried kids to replace that depth.

I've got our least viable reserves players currently as Smit, Steene, DeMattia and Jiath (despite him making his debut in 2024). Assuming we add Membrey, and take three kids at the draft, that list will sit at 7 players you can't rely on to play, which out of a list of 42 gives us 35 "contributors". The hope would then be that a couple of the existing 4 guys go on to prove that they're at least viable depth by the end of 2025.

We have the luxury of Wil Parker sitting outside the main list and being a very viable senior option in our reserves too. Really big resource to get a free additional player.

I agree with all of that and I'd probably add Ryan as another in the not depth yet category - meaning 3 draftees will have us at a squad of 35 with 8 developing guys. I think most teams would be aiming for a similar breakdown.,

 

[Vinnie Vegas]

I'd probably add Ryan as another in the not depth yet category.

I'm giving more leeway in that I think he was more injury affected than we realised last year, and that he was seemingly viable depth in 2023 when we were a premiership side.

I doubt he can look as lost in 2025 as he did this year. I think he's got the talent.

 

[Couch Coach]

I'd argue that Henry, Wilson and Reef aren't key position. I'd say most would agree with me

Many of the others I flat out forgot about honestly and I guess further shows how bad we are at recruiting and developing key position players.

I did already mention McMahon in my post

Just trying to point out that we do draft talls but mostly with speculative picks.

Our only Top 10 draft picks (that we have retained in the last 20 years) have been:

• 2017 Pick 6 Jaidyn Stephenson F
• 2014 Pick 5 Jordan De Goey F and Pick 9 Darcy Moore B
• 2013 Pick 6 Matthew Scharenberg B and pick 10 Nathan Freeman M
• 2006 Pick 8 Ben Reid B and Pick 10 Nathan Brown B
• 2005 Pick 2 Dale Thomas M and Pick 5 Scott Pendlebury M

20 years, 9 top 10 draft picks for 3 mids, 4 key backs and 2 medium forwards

 

[Fat Jesus]

I'm giving more leeway in that I think he was more injury affected than we realised last year, and that he was seemingly viable depth in 2023 when we were a premiership side.

I doubt he can look as lost in 2025 as he did this year. I think he's got the talent.

Definitely worth another 12 month contract.
Piss him off next year if he shows nothing.

 

[sr36]

I'm giving more leeway in that I think he was more injury affected than we realised last year, and that he was seemingly viable depth in 2023 when we were a premiership side.

I doubt he can look as lost in 2025 as he did this year. I think he's got the talent.

I'm not writing Ryan off, I quite like his chances, but I'd have his game in 2023 as like Jiath's last year - just a taster. I'd be pretty concerned if at this stage we were picking either of them in a big game - but that can change quickly - like it did for Richards and Parker last year.

You'd be hoping that half of the 5 I've listed and 3 draftees become "depth" or better by the end of 2025.

 

[Chunky Steak]

We're not alone in taking a heap less kids. The rookie draft used to run for nearly as many picks as the National Draft, but list sizes have dropped and now it's mainly mature guys. Last year it was down to 18 guys drafted with most of them from the AFL or state leauges and only a couple of kids.

The 6 or 7 rookies in 2010 were kids drafted really late when teams had bigger lists and regularly added 8-10 kids a year.

No one is doing that with the current list sizes - except Richmond this year - as they've got that many high picks.

To have depth for multiple positions, you need to have about 35 guys who can realistically come in and play a role. Clubs enter the draft with about 3 or 4 blokes already on the list who you wouldn't want to count as depth yet. Leaves about 4 spots - some a couple more and some a couple less - we look like we're aiming for the lower end and are just taking 2 or 3 kids.

Speaking of those Richmond picks, even though this is a deep draft by all accounts I think the Tigers would be mad to be use all those picks this year. All your eggs in one basket seems like it would be a mistake.

I would want to capitalise on the pick grab fever for this draft and look to do something like package up picks for a real high end future first or similar.

 

[Jen2310]

Definitely worth another 12 month contract.
Piss him off next year if he shows nothing.

He's already contracted until end of 2026

 

[sr36]

Speaking of those Richmond picks, even though this is a deep draft by all accounts I think the Tigers would be mad to be use all those picks this year. All your eggs in one basket seems like it would be a mistake.

I would want to capitalise on the pick grab fever for this draft and look to do something like package up picks for a real high end future first or similar.

I'd take 6 and try to trade 2 out for future firsts. 6 first rounders and probably pick 1 next year is all the draft injection I'd do and then you'd have those two firsts next year to chase trades - assuming half of the 6 I took are looking good.