Training 2024 Pre-Season discussion

[year of the cat]

From my track watcher they really only do the shuttle test now as its “time trial” stuff. Everything else is integrated into footy drills (ie. they mix the cardio in). They also weave in some handicap sprints

In the shuttle Knevitte beat Dempsey by a split second (the funny story was that they go in threes and nobody else - it was the 1-4 years) wanted to run with them (last year it went Bowes then Dempsey then Knevitte) so Scratcher volunteered. He tried to keep up early and then completely crashed out (much to the amusement of those watching). Those two were well in front of the year 1-4s. They both best last year by almost 9 seconds. And only 3 seconds of the historical record (Blitz) moving into second and third all time.

The rest of the squad (minus Blitz who usually wins) went at it last week. Bowes and Miers clear winners but Bowes was a good 4-5 seconds behind Dempsey this year.

So it is the same leaders as last year but the order changing a bit.

In terms of others, a lot of best times which is a good sign. Jyhe had a good showing.

Most people are back on the track which is good news.

In terms of looking sharpe that comes over next few weeks as they do more match sim before christmas. But really in focus in the new year

So is Clark injured or not?

 

[dudusmaximus]

How's Mullin going? I can't wait to see him improve through..

• Better skills, confidence & familiarity with team structure/mates
• More taking the game on with his speed & endurance
• More penetration with his kicks (the sweet Irish timing + Tuohy's tutelage)

I predict blistering runs ending in raking long pinpoint kicks!

 

[CHAWKTS]

So is Clark injured or not?

I haven’t asked specifically (and I will this week) but I don’t think so. I have seen some of the news on this forum but I don’t think it is true (although I couldn’t be 100%). Certainly he participated (well) in the shuffle

 

[D BRIDGE]

I agree. I think there are genuine spots up for grabs and nobody really a lock to fill them.

Mullin for me has the best chance to be regular I think only because I think he will overtake Bews and he really is that only “like for like”? I think other than Bews…2E, Bowes and maybe even Duncan (unless he is back to full fitness) and Rohan are most vulnerable to losing regular spots - and I agree that if we are going to move forward in 24 they have to lose spots to new ones having break outs.

Mannagh will be talked about but we really wont know until he gets to play in the practice games. He was great in the VFL but no better than Dempsey (votes per game, VFL team of the year etc) and Knevitte at the end of season so I don’t think we should overstate him being a lock. But his age gives him a shot. Dempsey, Knevitt and Clark should all get a chance this year to shine I think. Who knows which one takes the chance..

I agree with plenty you have said of late CHAWKTS... Looking forward to hearing confirmation JC isn't injured by the way.

But I don't agree that Mannagh wasn't a level or two up on Dempsey in the VFL in just general form/stats/output (not votes or anything else).

I think we are looking on sticking Mannagh straight in next season and would have him ahead of Dempsey/Knevitt in the current pecking order.

Yeah sure, he certainly can't just chill now and rest on his laurels (if that is the correct saying) and things could change in the preseason depending on how they all are tracking.

They all gotta put in the hard yards to improve right now and be firing when the season kicks off.

All things being equal though... I think we will have a specific spot/role in mind for Mannagh and that's why we drafted him in.

Demp/Knevitt (as much as I like them) still may need to wait or dislodge someone from the side.

Hopefully Mannagh he can improve on his great form of last year in the VFL now he is in a full-time pro system and be effective in the AFL (I think he will... may take a few games to feel comfortable and believe though).

 

[CHAWKTS]

I agree with plenty you have said of late CHAWKTS... Looking forward to hearing confirmation JC isn't injured by the way.

But I don't agree that Mannagh wasn't a level or two up on Dempsey in the VFL in just general form/stats/output (not votes or anything else).

I think we are looking on sticking Mannagh straight in next season and would have him ahead of Dempsey/Knevitt in the current pecking order.

Yeah sure, he certainly can't just chill now and rest on his laurels (if that is the correct saying) and things could change in the preseason depending on how they all are tracking.

All things being equal though... I think we will have a specific spot/role in mind for Mannagh and that's why we drafted him in.

Hopefully he can improve on his great form of last year in the VFL now he is in a full-time pro system and be effective in the AFL (I think he will... may take a few games to feel comfortable and believe though).

You might be right. I only watched a few of his games - so will watch him closely in pre season. I didn’t mean to say he was behind and certainly play down what he brings - just to say that both of them made the VFL team of the year so they both did all they can to put themselves in the mix.

I know he is (very) different to Hardie but I did think that they hired Mitch for a specific role at mid year and he didnt even look like getting a game.

The thing that Mannagh has is his age profile is perfect - ie. if he works out we have closed a little bit of that missing age bracket. In some ways I hope you are right as then he adds to a handful of “new players” ready to contribute at AFL level in 2024 (Guthrie, Mannagh, Knevitt, Dempsey, Mullin, Conway, Jhye to start with) which really. If Mannagh becomes a lock then those other boys will put huge pressure on the incumbant best 22 to keep their spots - can only be great news for the club

 

[D BRIDGE]

I think Mannagh's stats were around 25 disposals, 5.5 tackles, 2.5 goals per game.
Dempsey around 21d, 2.5t, 1.3g which is also very good (and he will go to another level for sure) but Mannagh's stats are just a silly level... In saying that he was in a better side.

25 and 2.5 goals a game for 21 games should get you drafted and thankfully it did.

Yeah Hardie was a weird call mid-year... we did have the chance to play him early but just never pulled the trigger and he didn't really press for selection in the VFL after getting over to us. Mannagh's VFL form was miles ahead of Hardie.

If Hardie makes it I'll be shocked... If Mannagh does I won't be. I expect him to deliver next year.

Time will tell.

Mannagh being drafted certainly does make it a tad harder for Dempsey though... But Dempsey is still a long termer for us I think.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

He can be quick at combine conditions but he plays slow and reactionary. He can’t breakaway from players and instead has a habit of walking into tackles, freeing the arms with his height to hb away. Not ideal for a midfielder. His combine results mean zero when he plays with cement feet

Except his legs have the capacity to move quick. What you are referring to is football nous and intelligence, not speed.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I think Mannagh's stats were around 25 disposals, 5.5 tackles, 2.5 goals per game.
Dempsey around 21d, 2.5t, 1.3g which is also very good (and he will go to another level for sure) but Mannagh's stats are just a silly level... In saying that he was in a better side.

25 and 2.5 goals a game for 21 games should get you drafted and thankfully it did.

Yeah Hardie was a weird call mid-year... we did have the chance to play him early but just never pulled the trigger and he didn't really press for selection in the VFL after getting over to us. Mannagh's VFL form was miles ahead of Hardie.

If Hardie makes it I'll be shocked... If Mannagh does I won't be. I expect him to deliver next year.

Time will tell.

Mannagh being drafted certainly does make it a tad harder for Dempsey though... But Dempsey is still a long termer for us I think.

We will have competition for spots but realistically mannagh is the isaac smith replacement (imo) and dempsey is the rohan replacement. I think both will play a lot next year but i dont think they are competing for the same spot.

 

[D BRIDGE]

We will have competition for spots but realistically mannagh is the isaac smith replacement (imo) and dempsey is the rohan replacement. I think both will play a lot next year but i dont think they are competing for the same spot.

I must admit I do get the feeling that Mannagh will play up the ground and possibly through the middle so it is possible.

A fit Rohan is clearly in our best side though... But he is often in and out due to injury.

 

[CHAWKTS]

I agree with plenty you have said of late CHAWKTS... Looking forward to hearing confirmation JC isn't injured by the way.

But I don't agree that Mannagh wasn't a level or two up on Dempsey in the VFL in just general form/stats/output (not votes or anything else).

I think we are looking on sticking Mannagh straight in next season and would have him ahead of Dempsey/Knevitt in the current pecking order.

Yeah sure, he certainly can't just chill now and rest on his laurels (if that is the correct saying) and things could change in the preseason depending on how they all are tracking.

They all gotta put in the hard yards to improve right now and be firing when the season kicks off.

All things being equal though... I think we will have a specific spot/role in mind for Mannagh and that's why we drafted him in.

Demp/Knevitt (as much as I like them) still may need to wait or dislodge someone from the side.

Hopefully Mannagh he can improve on his great form of last year in the VFL now he is in a full-time pro system and be effective in the AFL (I think he will... may take a few games to feel comfortable and believe though).

Ok. So I have no got an update….

Unfortunately my last update was just after the shuffle test (which he did well and had shown great signs of a great pre pre season) but was BEFORE the next session where he injured his foot. Apparantly they don’t think it is a bad one but we have all heard that before. They are hoping he will be back training pre christmas.

On Toby, they continue to be very cautious so he is not back into full running. hoping to get Jack back from foot also pre christmas. Kolo still cautious with head stuff. Blitz going to be ok - just needs more time for shoulder to get right

On good news, Willis has had a full crack at it so who knows whether he is someone who could surprise with a good long run of training.

I think all others in good shape (although haven’t seen Guthrie as studying and training in USA).

 

[D BRIDGE]

We running on concrete down at Kardinia Park these days with all these foot issues.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Jyhe had a good showing.

So tales of his death are greatly exaggerated?

 

[moond0g]

I think Mannagh's stats were around 25 disposals, 5.5 tackles, 2.5 goals per game.
Dempsey around 21d, 2.5t, 1.3g which is also very good (and he will go to another level for sure) but Mannagh's stats are just a silly level... In saying that he was in a better side.

25 and 2.5 goals a game for 21 games should get you drafted and thankfully it did.

Yeah Hardie was a weird call mid-year... we did have the chance to play him early but just never pulled the trigger and he didn't really press for selection in the VFL after getting over to us. Mannagh's VFL form was miles ahead of Hardie.

If Hardie makes it I'll be shocked... If Mannagh does I won't be. I expect him to deliver next year.

Time will tell.

Mannagh being drafted certainly does make it a tad harder for Dempsey though... But Dempsey is still a long termer for us I think.

The thing I found strange after looking at Mannagh’s stats was how good his first half of the year was.

I know a lot was made of his GF performance, but other than that his first half of the season definitely appeared better than his second, on paper at least. It makes me wonder why we (or someone else) didn’t pick him up in the mid season draft if we rated him so highly.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Ok. So I have no got an update….

Unfortunately my last update was just after the shuffle test (which he did well and had shown great signs of a great pre pre season) but was BEFORE the next session where he injured his foot. Apparantly they don’t think it is a bad one but we have all heard that before. They are hoping he will be back training pre christmas.

On Toby, they continue to be very cautious so he is not back into full running. hoping to get Jack back from foot also pre christmas. Kolo still cautious with head stuff. Blitz going to be ok - just needs more time for shoulder to get right

On good news, Willis has had a full crack at it so who knows whether he is someone who could surprise with a good long run of training.

I think all others in good shape (although haven’t seen Guthrie as studying and training in USA).

I posted too soon! RIP

 

[moond0g]

If we are to make it in 24 I reckon at least 3 of Knevitt, Dempsey, Clark, Mullin, Mannagh, Stevens, Neale, Conway need to find a way to be regular contributors in the best 22
Not all playing every week but making regular contributions

Absolutely agree. Last year our 3 recruits (OHenry, Bruhn, Bowes) made their way into the side, but none of our kids that were already on the list forced their way in.

If we are to progress next year, at least 2 or 3 of those need to push out a couple of the senior guys.

I know we had a lot of injuries, but I don’t think we can roll with the same 22 as 2022 and expect to win. We have a few players that will have naturally declined from then because of age etc., so we need some of the kids to step up for us to be competitive.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Injury update??

 

[Mr Meow]

We running on concrete down at Kardinia Park these days with all these foot issues.

Feet issues are a nightmare. Injure one badly and it's always almost going to be a recurring issue.

I hope Clark doesn't go through what Henry has. And I still worry for Jack.

 

[Mr Meow]

Absolutely agree. Last year our 3 recruits (OHenry, Bruhn, Bowes) made their way into the side, but none of our kids that were already on the list forced their way in.

If we are to progress next year, at least 2 or 3 of those need to push out a couple of the senior guys.

I know we had a lot of injuries, but I don’t think we can roll with the same 22 as 2022 and expect to win. We have a few players that will have naturally declined from then because of age etc., so we need some of the kids to step up for us to be competitive.

It's not only about new youngsters playing in the team, although a couple breaking out like SDK and Holmes in 2022 would help (and maybe Mannagh excelling like Stengle did).

Moreso J.Henry, SDK, Kolodjashni, Zuthrie, O'Connor, Holmes, Close, Stengle, Miers, Bruhn, O.Henry and Bowes having career best seasons. Some of them taking a sizable step up. One of besides Holmes proving they are capable of a strong season on the wing or with midfield minutes.

If, and it's a big IF, you get a lot out of the above group it makes a bigger difference than Knevitt and Dempsey pushing out Tuohy and Rohan (for example).

 

[Lingsface]

From my track watcher they really only do the shuttle test now as its “time trial” stuff. Everything else is integrated into footy drills (ie. they mix the cardio in). They also weave in some handicap sprints

In the shuttle Knevitte beat Dempsey by a split second (the funny story was that they go in threes and nobody else - it was the 1-4 years) wanted to run with them (last year it went Bowes then Dempsey then Knevitte) so Scratcher volunteered. He tried to keep up early and then completely crashed out (much to the amusement of those watching). Those two were well in front of the year 1-4s. They both best last year by almost 9 seconds. And only 3 seconds of the historical record (Blitz) moving into second and third all time.

The rest of the squad (minus Blitz who usually wins) went at it last week. Bowes and Miers clear winners but Bowes was a good 4-5 seconds behind Dempsey this year.

So it is the same leaders as last year but the order changing a bit.

In terms of others, a lot of best times which is a good sign. Jyhe had a good showing.

Most people are back on the track which is good news.

In terms of looking sharpe that comes over next few weeks as they do more match sim before christmas. But really in focus in the new year

Thanks for this update.

 

[Shadow89]

Ok. So I have no got an update….

Unfortunately my last update was just after the shuffle test (which he did well and had shown great signs of a great pre pre season) but was BEFORE the next session where he injured his foot. Apparantly they don’t think it is a bad one but we have all heard that before. They are hoping he will be back training pre christmas.

On Toby, they continue to be very cautious so he is not back into full running. hoping to get Jack back from foot also pre christmas. Kolo still cautious with head stuff. Blitz going to be ok - just needs more time for shoulder to get right

On good news, Willis has had a full crack at it so who knows whether he is someone who could surprise with a good long run of training.

I think all others in good shape (although haven’t seen Guthrie as studying and training in USA).

They really need to get to the bottom of these foot issues...seems too common now to just be coincidence.

Maybe there are similarities to the issues the Eagles have at Optus...maybe it's our training loads...maybe it's the drills...maybe it's the recovery program...or maybe it is just bad luck. Conway, Clark and Jack Henry though - those are 3 players who I'm sure we all hope guide us to the next flag.

Really depressing seeing this news over and over - especially for such highly touted players. Add all our injuries last season, and it honestly seems like something is going wrong with our training/recovery programs - especially since big H left.

Probably seems like I'm an overreacting, but I've honestly had a gutful of this news. We really do seem to blow it when it comes to first rounders. Lang, Thurlow, Cockatoo, Stephens, and now possibly Clark...why do all these highly touted players end up so damn injured? Lol.

 

[BORIS332]

I think Mannagh's stats were around 25 disposals, 5.5 tackles, 2.5 goals per game.
Dempsey around 21d, 2.5t, 1.3g which is also very good (and he will go to another level for sure) but Mannagh's stats are just a silly level... In saying that he was in a better side.

25 and 2.5 goals a game for 21 games should get you drafted and thankfully it did.

Yeah Hardie was a weird call mid-year... we did have the chance to play him early but just never pulled the trigger and he didn't really press for selection in the VFL after getting over to us. Mannagh's VFL form was miles ahead of Hardie.

If Hardie makes it I'll be shocked... If Mannagh does I won't be. I expect him to deliver next year.

Time will tell.

Mannagh being drafted certainly does make it a tad harder for Dempsey though... But Dempsey is still a long termer for us I think.

Hardie's SANFL form was just as good as Mannagh's in the lead up to the MSD:

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Ok. So I have no got an update….

Unfortunately my last update was just after the shuffle test (which he did well and had shown great signs of a great pre pre season) but was BEFORE the next session where he injured his foot. Apparantly they don’t think it is a bad one but we have all heard that before. They are hoping he will be back training pre christmas.

On Toby, they continue to be very cautious so he is not back into full running. hoping to get Jack back from foot also pre christmas. Kolo still cautious with head stuff. Blitz going to be ok - just needs more time for shoulder to get right

On good news, Willis has had a full crack at it so who knows whether he is someone who could surprise with a good long run of training.

I think all others in good shape (although haven’t seen Guthrie as studying and training in USA).

Gee that’s devastating.

 

[moond0g]

It's not only about new youngsters playing in the team, although a couple breaking out like SDK and Holmes in 2022 would help (and maybe Mannagh excelling like Stengle did).

Moreso J.Henry, SDK, Kolodjashni, Zuthrie, O'Connor, Holmes, Close, Stengle, Miers, Bruhn, O.Henry and Bowes having career best seasons. Some of them taking a sizable step up. One of besides Holmes proving they are capable of a strong season on the wing or with midfield minutes.

If, and it's a big IF, you get a lot out of the above group it makes a bigger difference than Knevitt and Dempsey pushing out Tuohy and Rohan (for example).

That's probably fair. Those mid-tier players probably have greater scope to become 'A' graders next year, which would certainly help us.

I guess I was talking more generally about how our 'best 22' should evolve each year, with new additions based on the natural progression of <22yo players that push out senior players. Last year those players were all imports. It would be nice to see a Dempsey, Clark, Knevitt etc. become a best 22 regular by seasons end in 2024.

 

[Footy Smarts]

In terms of this season the most important change for our team would probably be someone like O'Connor, Mannagh, Bowes or Parfitt having a breakout year as a genuine mid. Something similar to what Atkins has done the last 2 years.

Bruhn is possible but perhaps still 1-2 years off physically as a genuine inside mid. Holmes similar to Bruhn but if he goes inside we also need another dominant winger.

We're definitely short in midfield and generally 25-26 year olds are more likely to do the job in there than 21 year olds.

 

[Sire of Claude]

Bruhn approached 20 disposals a game this season; next year it could be 25 or more, matching the progression of many of our former mid-field champs.

Dempsey's assets - tank, marking, evasive skills etc - could see him become s semi-regular too. Clark and Conway too if they can overcome their issues.

Knevitt is an unusual player, as we saw with the debate above about his pace; he was very unlucky to be dropped after his excellent and important game v the Dogs.

The fact is if we don't see a few new faces appearing fairly regularly then we're going backward.