List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.2

[phantom13]

Couldn't it Judy be as simple as demanding that the points cost for any one player can't be accumulated from more than 1 or 2 different picks?

That way, clubs can't add up 5 or 6 low value picks to get the currency required.

Theres a few options.

• Pick must be in the same round (could extend this to single pick needs to be within X points with an FS discount)
• The accrued debt (although i would note the deficit shouldnt be allowed to just drag on, it should be applied to the teams next first round pick that they cant trade)
• Max of 2 picks with equivalent value (which could also stipulate at least one must be a same round pick)

Theres a stack of ways to skin this cat better than the current.

 

[wolfpac13]

Some of you may remember that I posted how Battle had told the club that he is staying. This came from his father that was also covering for him for whatever goddamn reason.

Anyway, he was never staying and the club had found out he had lied to them, and the boys. Most of the boys are understanding, club is not.

Ps, Mitchito Owen’s is in the steam room at GESAC right now and is looking in ripping knick.

 

[austinnn]

I can't believe how many oppo supporters completely are missing Bassetts' point.

We know we could have drafted Bont or Trac, (he literally mentions this in the speech) but that doesn't change the fact that a fairer price needs to be paid if you want your generational academy or father son

I love the father son rule, Elwood Peckett will win 3 norms but if he was a first rounder, I'd want us to have to pay a fair price, like anyone else

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Exactly!

Frustrating how few people can recognise this

 

[Saint Watto]

Clearly people at the club are motivated by more than the just the decision of Battle to go to Hawthorn. After all, business is business. These things happen.

Sounds like he is toxic. Which suggests that people at the club have lost total respect for him.

We can speculate, but these things happen when people feel emotionally betrayed. Which is not good.

Sad for Josh. He has been at the club since he was a lad and bridges have been burned. He will regret it in years to come.

Great post there St.Neil.

Our game is an incredibly emotional one.

Rusted/welded on passionate supporters(guilty as charged your honor)get emotionally connected to the club and the players.........and all hell can break loose when something/someone goes astray.

Exhibit A.....Josh Battle.

Probably the last time emotions were at "fever pitch" for a player leaving was when Luke Ball departed for the Party Pies.

Prior to that....probably Plugger going to the Swines.

I personally would have been gobsmacked if Josh turned up at the B & F last night.

The atmosphere at times was electric.....with 1,000 there last night and given what has happened,it may have reached an "unpleasant" state....especially when the booze kicked in for many of the punters.

When the leaders board came up and pre block votes highlights were shown......there were small pockets of booing....thankfully very small pockets.

It's all very unfortunate..........have followed Josh's career at the Saints with great interest.

Always thought he'd end up as a foward.

WRONG !!!!!!!

 

[SteeleSaints]

GCS openly want to trade out their pick #12 - how do we do a trade? They have a miriad of picks this year and more than enough points to match a Lombard bid, they will probably look to live trade out some of the later picks when they are done - draft night.

Fortunately the GCS will have more first round kids to chose from next year so they might entertain trading into next years draft. The issue will be how much will we have to give up to get it? I think this years draft and our list demographic lends to us going all in on this draft. If we could go into the draft with picks #7,8,12 & 24 it will set us up for years.

 

[Mat Mann]

The issue isnt just the scale though its being able to bundle up a bunch of late picks to do it.

There has to be some equivalence in the mix (which an FS or academy club needing at the very least a round pick match does address).

if the scale is altered enough so that top picks cost more than an accumulation of 3rd rounders it can.
the other aspect is it will limit how many players clubs can take in top 1st round

 

[Saint Watto]

Battle did the wrong thing..
Club did the wring thing...
Both are guilty....
Neither are guilty....

Who knows, who cares?
1. It is football
2. Battle wanted to go, so go, good for him.
3. Saints players don't want him there? Good for them.

Battle's footy career is at Hawthorn. Everyone deal with it and move on.

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Hear hear Joffa.

It is what it is.

Disappointing....but let's move on....to hopefully the compo pick.

We should find out Friday.

 

[stavro#4]

Not really interested in turning Battle into Ball v2.

It’s a volatile topic and people will want to take sides and blame the other.

Can’t it be Friday already and we get band 1 and this can be the end of this crap show?

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

I can't believe how many oppo supporters completely are missing Bassetts' point.

We know we could have drafted Bont or Trac, (he literally mentions this in the speech) but that doesn't change the fact that a fairer price needs to be paid if you want your generational academy or father son

I love the father son rule, Elwood Peckett will win 3 norms but if he was a first rounder, I'd want us to have to pay a fair price, like anyone else

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It's because they're only reading the the headline and not listening to Bassat's entire speech.

 

[TheJackal]

God listening to Barrett, Jenkins and Johnson as a St Kilda supporter is incredibly challenging....

A caller actually made the best point of the day when he mentioned Lions didn't just get Ashcroft, they got Dunkley as well. That's the part that was glossed over, the double dipping kills it.

I love how Johnson named every single father son and academy pick in history but omitted any Dogs, eg Darcy, JUH... convenient when they got a leg up as premier as well.

The only half interesting bit was when the Geelong mouthpiece, ie Josh Jenkins

11

Josh Jenkins

Age

35

Ht

200cm

Wt

108kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.9

3star

K

9.1

4star

HB

3.8

3star

M

5.1

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.1

5star

No current season stats available

D

11.0

3star

K

7.6

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

1.2

3star

G

1.6

5star

brought up SDK in relation to getting Oliver and Smith. Basically said can't pay them all or words to that effect, I'm manifesting this one big time! But Jenkins was no doubt quite positive about Oliver, which probably means Oliver to Geelong is more chance of happening than not.

 

[phantom13]

if the scale is altered enough so that top picks cost more than an accumulation of 3rd rounders it can.
the other aspect is it will limit how many players clubs can take in top 1st round

That feels extremely unlikely TBH

 

[beside the seaside]

Imagine if GWS get band 1 for Perrydude and we get band 2.

 

[St_Laz]

It's the way he went about it that's pissed everyone including the players and the club off. Heck, the captain didn't even acknowledge him in his speech. Did Ross? Wilkie was the only one to do so but they're very close mates

Literally lied to their faces

Please show where it was officially stated he “literally lied to their faces”. And don’t say some board ITK heard from someone maybe.


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[Mat Mann]

That feels extremely unlikely TBH

not announced officialy but the proposed changes by the AFL

The draft change adding another element to upcoming trade frenzy

Cal Twomey takes a look at how changes to the points model could impact this year's Trade Period

www.afl.com.au

Draft bidding and future picks revamp on hold, 'Jamarra rule' to change

The AFL Commission has approved a raft of player movement rule changes to come in over the next three seasons

www.afl.com.au

 

[Munga]

Ps, Mitchito Owen’s is in the steam room at GESAC right now and is looking in ripping knick.

How is your phone working in the steam room?

 

[phantom13]

not announced officialy but the proposed changes by the AFL

The draft change adding another element to upcoming trade frenzy

Cal Twomey takes a look at how changes to the points model could impact this year's Trade Period

www.afl.com.au

Draft bidding and future picks revamp on hold, 'Jamarra rule' to change

The AFL Commission has approved a raft of player movement rule changes to come in over the next three seasons

www.afl.com.au

View attachment 2128205View attachment 2128206

Interesting that the drop from pick 1 to pick 2 has increased, which is sort of anti this (given the reluctance of clubs to nominate with the first pick)

 

[Saintos The ITK]

God listening to Barrett, Jenkins and Johnson as a St Kilda supporter is incredibly challenging....

A caller actually made the best point of the day when he mentioned Lions didn't just get Ashcroft, they got Dunkley as well. That's the part that was glossed over, the double dipping kills it.

I love how Johnson named every single father son and academy pick in history but omitted any Dogs, eg Darcy, JUH... convenient when they got a leg up as premier as well.

The only half interesting bit was when the Geelong mouthpiece, ie Josh Jenkins brought up SDK in relation to getting Oliver and Smith. Basically said can't pay them all or words to that effect, I'm manifesting this one big time! But Jenkins was no doubt quite positive about Oliver, which probably means Oliver to Geelong is more chance of happening than not.

I hope Clarry has a long injury and drug free career at his new club and doesn’t go off the rails and disrupt the culture there.

 

[botts]

Please show where it was officially stated he “literally lied to their faces”. And don’t say some board ITK heard from someone maybe.


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Got told by an x player. Who knows the coaching staff. Why do you think he wasn’t invited to the bnf?

 

[stavro#4]

Imagine if GWS get band 1 for Perrydude and we get band 2.

I suppose right now, it’s up to each individual and which journo you want to believe.

Jon Ralph & Jay Clark

The AFL’s free agency period kicks off on Friday, with compensation for St Kilda over Josh Battle’s departure the most intriguing question mark given a six-year Hawks offer of just under $900,000 a season
Cal Twomey

Josh Battle's six-year deal at Hawthorn will net St Kilda either a first-round selection or end-of-first-round pick, with the contract expected to be on the verge of the band one grading. That would hand the Saints picks No.7 and 8.

Probably easier if you stick with these guys

 

[hangdog]

Richmond are the worst team. They finished last.

They should have unfettered access to Levi Ashcroft (and anyone else at pick 1), and if Brisbane want to get Ashcroft, they should have to satisfy Richmond.

Any system that denies the worst team to access to any player with pick 1 is unfair and cannot be fixed, only made less worse. End of.

Agree with this. I like the idea of a FS selection but also, grow up AFL.

If the son of an AFL player loves his dad's club so much he can ask to be traded there in 2 years.

I'd just prefer the points system to remain but;
- clubs must use a pick within the same round to match,
- clubs can't package any more than 3 picks to match,
- Clubs must must retain next season's First Rounder, and can't trade it to accumulate points, because...
- If the club is still in deficit, the remainder comes off their 1st pick the next season.

Brisbane in 2024 would be the most extreme case possible, so let's look at that first.

The points difference between Richmond's pick 1 (3000) and Brisbane's pick 18 (985) is 2015 points. Therefore the sum of Brisbane's 3 picks must be at least 2015 points.

Eg, Brisbane wish to match Pick 1 with pick 18, but they only hold 18, 56 and 69.

Pick 1 = 3000
Pick 18, 56 & 69 = 985+194+49=1228

They're nowhere near the minimum amount of 2015. They would be forced to trade a player, or players, to accrue the draft capital before draft night. If they don't, they simply can't match.

Let's assume Brisbane traded Zac Bailey to St Kilda for pick 8 (1551 points) before the draft.

Now Brisbane have...
Pick 8, 18, 56 = 2730

They can match and lose 270 points from their FR in 2025. If they finish with pick 18 again, pick 18 becomes 27.

Would ultimately mean the Premiers lose Pick 18 and a decent player to get the number 1 pick. Seems pretty fair.

In a less extreme case...

Let's say Elwood Peckett is considered the number 1 pick this year.

We finished 12th and hold pick 7 (1644 points) and get compo for Battle in pick 8 (1551).

We can trade one of them, retain one of them, or use both to match.

If we use our natural selections of 7, 24 & 43 we hold 2807 points. We can still retain pick 8 but lose 193 points off our FR in 2025.

Total haul, Pick 1, Pick 8, junk picks or other picks traded in.

If we just use Pick 7 & 8 (3195 points), the excess 195 points gets added to our second rounder making pick 24 become pick 19

Total haul Pick 1, pick 19, pick 43 etc.

I would be open allowing clubs to trade players during the draft, but the AFLPA would never allow it.

Eg, Richmond selects Ashcroft. Brisbane call them and offer their pick 18 and Kai Lohmann. Richmond nut in their pants and accept.

I haven't applied the discount to FS's either. It's generous enough you get priority access to a player, now pay market value.

 

[St Neil]

Honestly can’t believe all they’ve done is modify the points a little.

And they need to grandfather these changes, which they didn’t do with the NGA changes. Ie, should be some rules around changes not being applicable to those that haven’t benefited. I know that’s very hard to create a rule such as that, but let me have a sook.

Not only did we miss out on McKenzie at pick 7 when the NGA changes weren’t Grandfathered, but Melbourne missed out on being able to match a bid for Mac Andrew at pick 5.

The irony is that Andrew was drafted by, wait for it, Gold Coast. One of the charity cheats who have a protected academy where they have exclusive access to all players regardless of when a bid is made.

And now Gold Coast have signed Andrew to a multi-year multi-million dollar contract.

Demons are just as filthy as we are. And the fact that the club that benefitted is a Northern Academy club makes it even more putrid.

The AFL are rancid.

 

[SaintersUnite]

They can keep the F/S and Academy bullshit if they really want to, but it should NEVER impact the 1st round. Nothing should. Picks 1-18 should be in order of final ladder position and NOTHING else (apart from trading obviously).


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[St Neil]

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Wouldn't going after Oliver be classed as a 'sugar hit' which would be contrary to the strategy outlined by the Prez last night?

Yes.

But Oliver will end up at Geelong anyway. They don’t have a salary cap.

 

[stavro#4]

Yes.

But Oliver will end up at Geelong anyway. They don’t have a salary cap.

Well no not really.

The cost would be minimal. So the impact on what we are trying to do at the draft would be nil.

 

[Goddardwetrust]

Not really interested in turning Battle into Ball v2.

It’s a volatile topic and people will want to take sides and blame the other.

Can’t it be Friday already and we get band 1 and this can be the end of this crap show?

Yes.

But Oliver will end up at Geelong anyway. They don’t have a salary cap.