USA 2024 US Presidential Election: Trump vs Harris (pt II)

[Ohitsthatguy]

Think it will be the closest since 2000.

 

[Blue1980]

Ex-UK Tory politician on the radio yesterday with his theory that polling companies are so rattled by how wrong they all got it in 2016 that all they ever do now is predict it will be close.

He reckons Harris will win in a canter but the pollsters are terrified to say so

Whatevs.

If polling get it wrong re the republicans they bang on about it for a decade, get it wrong like they did in 2022 midterms re the democrats the world moves on.

 

[spinynorman]

…. But not for a lack of trying.

Have you forgotten January 6th?

Imagine, for a moment, the insurrection plans didn’t fail. And you have to remember the angry mob was plan D, there was a lot of other moving parts.

What would that have represented? The election would have been given to the candidate that didn’t win it. What does that look like for America? You think people just sit at home and are happy with the flagrant betrayal of democracy? It would have ripped the country apart at the seams.

That’s pretty damn extreme to me.

That happened in 2000 and the Democrats and Gore chose not to fight it. I’d like to believe they would’ve done otherwise in 2020 (and I think there’s a fair chance they would’ve given Trump was particularly egregious to them in a way that Bush wasn’t at that point), but history gives me pause for thought.

Or even in Biden’s presidency with the Supreme Court running rogue and the response is to make it a fundraising opportunity. I can’t help but think a successful theft of an election would’ve been seen as a perfect excuse to email supporters asking for money.

 

[spinynorman]

Hopefully these ads, which make up around 40% of Trump’s ad spend in the last month, backfire in a big way.

 

[FireKrakouer]

None at all? Name a few of the predictions and we can examine this "none" claim.

I'll start. Deportations.

Immigrants he claimed to empathise with, he promised to protect as Syrian Christians in danger from militant Islam. Once elected, he deported many of them, or retracted their visas.

Family of Syrians Deported From Philadelphia Supported Donald Trump

An Allentown family who is fighting to have their relatives return to the United States after they were detained at Philly International Airport and sent back to Syria under the immigration order, admitted that they supported Donald Trump.

www.nbcphiladelphia.com

Your turn.

Thanks for asking, boss. One example would be nukes, Hillary and Wapo and MSNBC went hard on the "4 minutes" fearmongering.

Trump can launch a nuclear weapon within four minutes

Ploughshares Fund President Joe Cirincione talks with Ari Melber about widespread fear of Trump's imminent takeover of "the most capable death machine on the planet" -- America's nuclear arsenal.

www.msnbc.com

I can't find the Trump threads from 2016 here on my phone but we both know there was a lot of over-the-top fearmongering about him being the new Hitler and whatnot. We got weeks of "kids in cages" headlines until people realised those cages were built by the Obama admin (not to mention then being expanded upon by the Biden admin) and everyone went quiet.

 

[liz]

Hopefully these ads, which make up around 40% of Trump’s ad spend in the last month, backfire in a big way.

Just on the table in the tweet (do we still call them tweets?), it shows the hypocrisy of many Republicans.

They are traditionally the party of small government, of keeping their noses out of private lives. And many current-day republican voters (including the MAGAs) would still argue that until they’re blue in the face on many aspects of society - such as unfettered access to firearms, lower environmental regulation etc.

Yet more than half of them want to stick their noses into other peoples sexuality and/or gender identity.

 

[Gough]

Just on the table in the tweet (do we still call them tweets?), it shows the hypocrisy of many Republicans.

They are traditionally the party of small government, of keeping their noses out of private lives. And many current-day republican voters (including the MAGAs) would still argue that until they’re blue in the face on many aspects of society - such as unfettered access to firearms, lower environmental regulation etc.

Yet more than half of them want to stick their noses into other peoples sexuality and/or gender identity.

Republicans have been targeting the LGBTQI community since the Commos were slayed at the end of 80s and they needed a new other to scare the shit out of their supporters. That we were also facing down AIDS at the time was an added bonus for them.

 

[OneGreatClub]

Pro life hey

 

[Crankyhawk]

Thanks for asking, boss. One example would be nukes, Hillary and Wapo and MSNBC went hard on the "4 minutes" fearmongering.

Trump can launch a nuclear weapon within four minutes

Ploughshares Fund President Joe Cirincione talks with Ari Melber about widespread fear of Trump's imminent takeover of "the most capable death machine on the planet" -- America's nuclear arsenal.

www.msnbc.com

I can't find the Trump threads from 2016 here on my phone but we both know there was a lot of over-the-top fearmongering about him being the new Hitler and whatnot. We got weeks of "kids in cages" headlines until people realised those cages were built by the Obama admin (not to mention then being expanded upon by the Biden admin) and everyone went quiet.

I thought the fear re trump (in 2016 after election) was more around some concern re the locker room talk (grab by the pussy) and then around the outright lie about the "biggest inauguration ever" which made many question his ability to comprehend history and reality. And that he would pass laws for the rich end of town etc (trickle down economic type, though really that is standard USA government now so it wasn't a big fear)

I don't recall Hitler comparisons at that time. They were more after the "stolen election" crap.

 

[OneGreatClub]

If Trump is winning bigly then why is Musk doing this?

 

[Blue1980]

I thought the fear re trump (in 2016 after election) was more around some concern re the locker room talk (grab by the pussy) and then around the outright lie about the "biggest inauguration ever" which made many question his ability to comprehend history and reality. And that he would pass laws for the rich end of town etc (trickle down economic type, though really that is standard USA government now so it wasn't a big fear)

I don't recall Hitler comparisons at that time. They were more after the "stolen election" crap.

For me it was very obvious in the lead up to the 2020 election he was planning to do what he did, with the mail in ballot conspiracies, articles were being leaked about him and his teams plans to claim victory before the mail in ballots were counted, and it all came to fruition.

 

[OneGreatClub]

I'm only complaining about her being off the campaign trail. That can only help her.

I don’t think it is unfair it’s just how things go in US and Stokey’s mind.

 

[liz]

If Trump is winning bigly then why is Musk doing this?

I see Elon has now tweaked what he's doing, presumably because he (or his lawyers) think its "more legal". So now he's picking a person to "earn" $1m as a spokesman, rather than just for signing a piece of paper.

Regardless of the dubious legal and ethical dimensions, this just seems like a humungous waste of money. His money. Though when you pay yourself billions of dollars a year I guess a million dollars is just the spare change you find underneath the sofa cushions. (Which in itself illustrates the hideousness of the ultra-rich.)

But surely he's just giving this money to rusted on MAGAs?

 

[Satan]

If Trump is winning bigly then why is Musk doing this?

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/10/24/politics/elon-musk-super-pac-lottery-winner-doj-warning/index.html

 

[Ohitsthatguy]

If Trump is winning bigly then why is Musk doing this?

There's no way this is legal, right?

 

[liz]

For me it was very obvious in the lead up to the 2020 election he was planning to do what he did, with the mail in ballot conspiracies, articles were being leaked about him and his teams plans to claim victory before the mail in ballots were counted, and it all came to fruition.

It did, but it didn't work.

I realise a lot more planning has gone into it this time around, but I still reckon a steal (ie by the losing party, not suggesting the election process is actually possible to be materially rigged more than it is via gerrymandering, voter purges, voting poll queues etc etc) will be hard to pull off.

I think the Supreme Court will do everything it can to stay out of the process. A couple of the justices (Thomas, Alito) might think they've been sent by God to do his work and decide who should be president, but I think the other conservative judges will want no part of it. In the lower courts, there was remarkable consistency last time in throwing out cases where not a skerrit of actual evidence was provided to support the claims. That seemed to apply regardless of the "political affiliation' of the judges. I expect the same to happen this time.

Most of the Republican governors of the swings states also seem to be not full-MAGA. I don't think they, or their election secretaries, will play along. They resisted last time and I think they'll resist again.

There is potential for lower-level officials to try to disrupt the process by delaying counts and certifications. But we're already seeing their right to do so denied in the state courts.

What I am less confident off is that the process will be peaceful. I expect a lot more "violent protests" than last time if the Democrats win at the ballot box.

 

[Blue1980]

Hopefully these ads, which make up around 40% of Trump’s ad spend in the last month, backfire in a big way.

It just seems such a minor issue that it confuses people why they are so fixated on it. Its only a big thing for terminally online right wingers.

 

[Blue1980]

It did, but it didn't work.

I realise a lot more planning has gone into it this time around, but I still reckon a steal (ie by the losing party, not suggesting the election process is actually possible to be materially rigged more than it is via gerrymandering, voter purges, voting poll queues etc etc) will be hard to pull off.

I think the Supreme Court will do everything it can to stay out of the process. A couple of the justices (Thomas, Alito) might think they've been sent by God to do his work and decide who should be president, but I think the other conservative judges will want no part of it. In the lower courts, there was remarkable consistency last time in throwing out cases where not a skerrit of actual evidence was provided to support the claims. That seemed to apply regardless of the "political affiliation' of the judges. I expect the same to happen this time.

Most of the Republican governors of the swings states also seem to be not full-MAGA. I don't think they, or their election secretaries, will play along. They resisted last time and I think they'll resist again.

There is potential for lower-level officials to try to disrupt the process by delaying counts and certifications. But we're already seeing their right to do so denied in the state courts.

What I am less confident off is that the process will be peaceful. I expect a lot more "violent protests" than last time if the Democrats win at the ballot box.

I could see bombings, shootings by MAGA nutbags if Trump doesn't win, hopefully I am wrong.

I think the dems are more orangised against such BS but so are the republicans. A lot of it isn't fully about overturning the result for Donnie, a lot of it is him never admitting to losing ever so he can keep his aura of an unassailable God to his cult.

 

[Satan]

I could see bombings, shootings by MAGA nutbags if Trump doesn't win, hopefully I am wrong.

I think the dems are more orangised against such BS but so are the republicans. A lot of it isn't fully about overturning the result for Donnie, a lot of it is him never admitting to losing ever so he can keep his aura of an unassailable God to his cult.

DNC shootings suspect ‘was planning mass casualty event’ as FBI find 120 guns

Jeffrey Michael Kelly was arrested by Tempe Police after series of incidents - now authorities have raided his home

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Stokey]

I don’t think it is unfair it’s just how things go in US and Stokey’s mind.

This seems quite selective.

Can you share what Axelrod and Bash said of her Townhall performance?

 

[Blue1980]

DNC shootings suspect ‘was planning mass casualty event’ as FBI find 120 guns

Jeffrey Michael Kelly was arrested by Tempe Police after series of incidents - now authorities have raided his home

www.independent.co.uk

I should of said hopefully the attempts are thwarted, as there 100% will be attempts by right wingers of violence both leading up and especially after the election if Trump loses.

 

[Maggie5]

Can you share what Axelrod and Bash said of her Townhall performance?

They were slightly critical, expected more from her.

 

[QuietB]

I just found this - America is even more cooked than I thought

The Hammer - lol

 

[OneGreatClub]

This seems quite selective.

Can you share what Axelrod and Bash said of her Townhall performance?

As usual you miss the point.
And nothing you post is in good faith.

 

[Stokey]

They were slightly critical, expected more from her.

'I expected more from her' seems to be the theme after every appearance.