Review AFL Round 20-Hawthorn defeats Geelong by 36 points.

[thegerman]

I thought Mackie played a good game, saved numerous attacks, especially considering how poor a few of his teammates were alongside him. He's worth another year alongside Enright.

Probably, however I think he'll go downhill quickly. There's no-one to replace him with, however, he played loose, getting a lot of cheapies.

 

[vinum coupe]

If North lose the next three, we just need to win two.

Still too many variables - but I'm quietly confident we're playing the Tigers at the G on the first Saturday night of the finals.

Wow. I've seen optimism on this board, but that takes the cake.

 

[YY_Cat]

Not too bad for me. I wouldn't blame individual players. The chance is slim, but I do think we still can make it. We really have good players.

 

[Herne Hill Hammer]

Long term mega $ contracts, 2 flags, and young kids can do that.

I've mentioned this before and been criticised by all and sundry for it. Not a deliberate thing on his behalf, but maybe just subconsciously relaxed a touch after signing a longterm contract on good coin.

 

[vinum coupe]

By the way, my avatar is of our family cat who we sadly had to put down this week aged 17. It was never going to be a great week for the Cats after that...

Geez mate. I feel way worse about your family than the game

 

[ATSAM]

Poor decision making on too many occasions even from the skipper. Poor game plan-Richmond showed that pressure on hawthorn makes them nervous-we did it for the second half of the 2nd 1/4 only. Poor coaching of our second level and new players, we can see the work that has been put into No 8 it makes a difference. We need new mid field and forwards coaches and we need them next year. Too many of them have been there too long and not performed.
Also remain unconvinced that the strategy of letting them learn the game and then have them play as a team just ain't working.
Scott needs to get more assertive and demand that $s be put into coaching(forget the blasted stands) because in the end he is the one judged on the team performance.

 

[Partridge]

Terribly disappointed in Caddy's performance, add Murdoch to that. I struggle to see what Stokesy is adding at the moment. Not hitting the scoreboard, not using the ball well and falling over an awful lot. I'd favour even Smedts there right now.

Pretty much what some have said for four weeks now. I'm keen to seen the apologists rush in to tell us how he much he offers. Although I will miss the continual comedy of using him as a forward marking target who can't mark.

 

[Lana]

Re Walker….We don't have to hope…he supplies it in spades.

33.33% DE…..it was 16.7% at 3/4 time….last week at half time his DE % showed he didn't make a clanger….because he never touched it.

I'm waiting for him to improve, but all I see right now is a VFL standard player running around for Geelong in a key position not doing enough…and nowhere near it against decent opposition.

Sadly right now, it appears we have few options.

He's the best we've got that is fit and available, and he's helping in the ruck, i can't see him going anywhere unless we want to see more of Johnson in the ruck (as funny as that would be to see). He's 22, was a pick in the Rookie draft and is a better player now than he was 12 months ago. I don't have a lot of expectations on him. Sure if we had Clark available he would probably be running around in the VFL but we don't and I'm glad we have him and I expect him to be with the club next year, and probably a couple of years after that.

 

[fpm84]

Apologies for the incoming rant...

All in all I'm reasonably comfortable with that loss. Of course it's never nice to lose and that loss could potentially be fatal to our finals hopes. But during the week I thought a 3-4 goal loss would have demonstrated some reasonable progress from round 1. In the end we lost by 6 with our second best midfielder missing so it's about what was expected.

The first quarter was very poor but to our credit we turned it around after that and it was very much an even contest for 3 quarters albeit they had a comfortable lead for a lot of it. Hawks were 'on' in the first quarter - a long way from the flatness they showed v Tigers - and some clubs would have rolled over and lost by 80+ after that hot start. It was pleasing we didn't drop our heads.

Ultimately our problems aren't easily fixed unless we recruit from other clubs which we're clearly trying to do. We simply lack a lot of mid age talent - the older guys are mostly still good players but not what they were, and the younger guys show plenty but not necessarily every week. Landing S. Selwood would be handy, landing Danger as well could put us back in top 4 contention IMO.

Guthrie was great and Cadds was quiet but I can handle it because he's been brilliant for the past month - no coincidence that it was when Duncan was back in the side. Cadds was essentially our second midfielder tonight up against guys like Hodge/Mitchell/Lewis/Burgoyne/Shiels, all of whom have age and experience on him.

Blicavs has been immense all season but by having to play him as our number one ruck we're effectively losing in the middle and we've lost a midfielder. Blitz did some great work around the ground tonight (contested mark v Hodge a highlight) but in an ideal world he's sharking someone else's taps and racking up 20+ touches each week. I can only hope we'll be bringing in a mature ruck from another club for 2016 as it's hard to see Simpson being kept and McIntosh is already done. If we go into another season expecting Stanley, Blitz and Vardy to be our only rucks I will tear my hair out.

I thought Lang and Kolo were the best of the youngsters. Kolo hasn't put a foot wrong since he entered the side. He's the most promising young defender we've had since Taylor arrived in 2008.

Selwood is well and truly whatever injury he was carrying earlier in the season. He's been absolutely at his best since the GWS game. Shame he'll likely miss the AA team but I can't fault his game right now. Cockatoo was fairly composed when he came on and that goal was class.

Looking forward, I think we'll win our last 3 but it may not be enough. We're relying on WCE beating Adelaide or NM losing two of Freo/Dogs/Tigers. Either scenario is a big possibility but it's our of our hands. Unfortunately Essendon's pathetic non-appearance today means we won't catch the Crows' percentage. Assuming we win our next two, we need to enter round 23 on equal premiership points with them so all we need to do is win and we're in.

Missing finals would be disappointing but not the end of the world IMO... Ultimately I think we're in the best 8 teams in the comp but a poor run with injuries (fortunately most of them back now) and a wretched fixture have conspired against us. Can someone explain how despite finishing SIXTH last season we've played each of last year's grand finalists twice before we've even played last year's wooden spooners once? WCE and the Bulldogs have shown it's easy to miss finals and then shoot up the ladder on a soft draw the next year.

On a random note I was thinking about our 2011 QF win over the Hawks the other day. Their midfield has literally not changed from that day. Same players, just four years older. As for ours, Selwood is the only constant. Corey and Chapman are long gone and Bartel and Kelly play in other roles now. Our first choice midfield when all players are fit these days is Selwood, Duncan, Caddy, Motlop, Guthrie and Blicavs. It's a completely new side to our last premiership yet we've remained competitive every year. I for one am very optimistic about our future.

 

[year of the cat]

Geez mate. I feel way worse about your family than the game

Thanks VC. I'm a bit embarrassed having mentioned it now. Appreciate all the kind sentiments though.

 

[thegerman]

He's the best we've got that is fit and available, and he's helping in the ruck, i can't see him going anywhere unless we want to see more of Johnson in the ruck (as funny as that would be to see). He's 22, was a pick in the Rookie draft and is a better player now than he was 12 months ago. I don't have a lot of expectations on him. Sure if we had Clark available he would probably be running around in the VFL but we don't and I'm glad we have him and I expect him to be with the club next year, and probably a couple of years after that.

Great post

 

[vinum coupe]

Re Walker….We don't have to hope…he supplies it in spades.

33.33% DE…..it was 16.7% at 3/4 time….last week at half time his DE % showed he didn't make a clanger….because he never touched it.

Today…. he had 2 straight forward opportunities to get us back in the game and he blew both of them.

I'm waiting for him to improve, but all I see right now is a VFL standard player running around for Geelong in a key position not doing enough…and nowhere near it against decent opposition.

Sadly right now though, it appears we have few options.

Did you see him look to give it off on the 2nd shot?
It was his first thought. Then he looked straight at the top of the posts and I thought "we're toast"

 

[GFrost]

By the way, my avatar is of our family cat who we sadly had to put down this week aged 17. It was never going to be a great week for the Cats after that...

Sorry to hear that

 

[Lana]

Wow. I've seen optimism on this board, but that takes the cake.

They don't have a nice end to the year
They play Freemantle, Bulldogs and Richmond. They are just as likely to win two as they are to lose all three. Though I still think we can win our own way into the finals rather than rely on others falling over.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Look the negative is I hate losing to Hawthorn and that win gives them top 2 which means they are pretty likely to win the flag. But the positive is if we play like we did tonight for the next 3 weeks we will win them all which will probably get us into finals.

In terms of the game I thought the lack of a small defender really cost us. Enright was immense (boy I will miss him when he retires) but when we presed up hard and left space over the back we lacked someone with the footspeed to get to their smalls. Bews didnt play vfl today so I assume he was injured, but it would have been good to have him.

Save for goalkicking we played better than I expected, if we had nailed those 4 shots early in the last quarter we really could have had a chance. The good signs for me are that the younger players in Motlop, Guthrie, Murdoch et al are improving and playing much better than they were early in the year. Even Cockatoo really showed some glimpses tonight and I thought Horlin Smith was very good, showing why he shouldn't be sub.

There is no margin for error now, we have to win the last 3 and hopefully we will. The reality is we are playing as well now as we can with what we have. We are short a decent contested midfielder to help Selwood (the gap from him to our next mid is immense, I know Duncan out magnified that but still) and a ruckman, the number of times tonight we didn't even have a ruck compete at the stoppage was too many. This is why I am an advocate of getting even a decent ruck in this offseason, that and Dangerfield I think will give us a genuine chance against the best teams again. We are starting to improve our contested ball issues which shows both the players and coaches are realising the problem and rectifying it, but we cant go to the next level of beating the top teams until we improve the midfield and ruck area of the list. Big pity Stanley is injured as I genuinely think we could have made a tilt at a flag with him fit, and we still may win a final if we get in.

It's pretty bloody sad when we can only improve our contested ball via Selwood getting 19 of them!!! He was magnificent tonight! Followed up from a tough game last week but how much longer can he do this? Great to see Guthrie in double figures (11) and GHS was both a great CP winner (10) as well as a good user of the ball tonight- 84.6% DE
Admittedly we did have a better spread of contested ball winners tonight but it is still disappointing that so much is left up to the Captain.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Q4 Stats
View attachment 162709 View attachment 162711 View attachment 162712
View attachment 162710

From now on, all Geelong supporters are to refer to the Poos+Wees as ******* Hawthorn

Hawks killed us in the clearances late in the game. Selwood had massive numbers early but tailed off- and you can't expect him to have put in any more than the heart and soul he gave tonight.

 

[Partridge]

Sadly I think we have a few here that hope like hell he kicks poorly.

I hope he shows more against good opposition. He has improved a lot from when he started, but he needed to do more tonight.

 

[vinum coupe]

Pretty much what some have said for four weeks now. I'm keen to seen the apologists rush in to tell us how he much he offers. Although I will miss the continual comedy of using him as a forward marking target who can't mark.

Thats what annoyed me about stokes tonight.
He is still really valuable. He has great run. But he runs 40m too far.
They kick it to him down the line and its always a pressure mark.

IF he actually marks it, he gets held up.
In my opinion he is a guy you chip to over the top. He takes a bounce, creates, and handballs or chips 20m sideways to a runner.
Thats his strength.

I reckon its a coaching failure.

 

[Teriyakicat]

Hope you don't mind me intruding...

Bad luck lads, I genuinely like the Cats.

Little bit shattered.. F*ck I hate Hawthorn so f*cking much.

Oh well, best of luck for whats left of 2015 guys

Welcome- you fit right in amongst us here. Didn't even notice you weren't a Cat supporter at first, when I read the bolded

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Well I went to the game and I tipped against us, expecting an honourable loss. Can 36 points be considered honourable??...

Anyway that's for individuals to decide for themselves.

Well what can you say, we got thrashed in the hitouts which gave the Hawks first use of the pill. First 40 minutes or so we didn't apply enough pressure and they pinpointed passes and we let them get off to a good start.

2nd quarter that improved and we got back in the game.

Stokes is cooked, he's done, sorry for the Stokes fans but surely our younger boys can offer more.

What I did notice is that when we were hemmed into our back 50 and the pacy players in poo Cyril and Hill put our backs under pressure forcing the bail out kick, well quite often that bail out kick would have 2 Hawks and one cats player and it would be pumped straight back in, particularly in the first 40 minutes. In contrast when we had it in our F50 that bail out kick was 1v1 a lot of the time and they cleared it more often. This was a problem as our backs came under a lot of pressure.

On our backline, I feel they largely kept us as close as we were. Rivers showed why he's best 22 and Kolo again looked good, with Lonners to return that's a damn good dilemma to have. 4 fitting into 3 spots.

Guthrie was very good tonight and he's starting to gain that consistency which will be required to go to the next level. Hopefully Caddy's quiet game is just a blip on the radar, shame that we needed a big game from him tonight.

Murdoch continues to frustrate me with his turnovers and gregson and Mots had quiet nights also.

Selwood was again good, for someone his size he's not bad above his head in the marking contest, whilst he had some support tonight he's been carrying this midfield for 18 months and I can't wait for the young brigade to really step up and give him the assistance he deserves (a couple of potential recruits would be nice ).

As for the Hawks, I'm not usually one to like giving them platitudes but they were a cut above us tonight, we still have a way to go. Their ball use is much publicised but they are also well drilled. They knew we were under pressure down back so they kept pumping the ball long to Gunston, Hale, McEvoy and in contrast to us when we spoiled they had good crumbers at their feet. Bews should have played??

Cyril gave us a bath tonight, plain and simple and he had able mosquito fleet support from Puopolo and Bruest who got the better of Mackie tonight.

That said there are two aspects of the game that if the afl actually cleaned up and officiated more competently then the Hawks would be f****d. Firstly the 15m kicks, quite a few times each game they play they are paid 10-12 metre marks, one from Mitchell tonight was barely 10 metres, did they kick the goal on that one? Iirc I think they did. The 2nd bit is Frawley and particularly Lake man handling their direct opponent and getting away with it.

I still have concerns over CHF, some say Walker is only 22? And played less than 30 games give him a chance but apart from the last quarter (missed two gettable shots) he was largely unsighted. I still think CHB could be his calling.

GHS showed enough for me to suggest he's worth persisting with, especially given his solid VFL form this season. He's slow but he can also accumulate the ball as well.

As for the battle of the Steven's Miss Moneypenny it's a no brainer tonight, SJ by a mile.

All in all I thought we went with them for roughly 3 quarters tonight and I'm not overly irate at the loss, they had a crack tonight but just don't have the class, experience or overall ability at the moment to go with the Hawks for 4 quarters. Duncan was sorely missed.

If Kelly is out injured I'd go Stokes and Kel out alongside one KPD and Bews, Duncan and Menz in, it's time. Time to bring him in.

 

[James1970]

Wow. I've seen optimism on this board, but that takes the cake.

Common sense - our next three are quite gettable.

Win those, we're playing finals no matter what the other results.

I'd also back us in with a first Elimination Final against the Tigers or Dogs.

ie - I'd keep your September shopping at Bunnings on hold.

 

[catamaran]

On a random note I was thinking about our 2011 QF win over the Hawks the other day. Their midfield has literally not changed from that day. Same players, just four years older. As for ours, Selwood is the only constant. Corey and Chapman are long gone and Bartel and Kelly play in other roles now. Our first choice midfield when all players are fit these days is Selwood, Duncan, Caddy, Motlop, Guthrie and Blicavs. It's a completely new side to our last premiership yet we've remained competitive every year. I for one am very optimistic about our future.

Hopefully this also means the Dawk's midfield will seriously decline in quality as we are on the up.

 

[David the Cat]

Bews won't play….didnt come up for the VFL and is obviously struggling with an injury.

 

[Vdubs]

Apologies for the incoming rant...

All in all I'm reasonably comfortable with that loss. Of course it's never nice to lose and that loss could potentially be fatal to our finals hopes. But during the week I thought a 3-4 goal loss would have demonstrated some reasonable progress from round 1. In the end we lost by 6 with our second best midfielder missing so it's about what was expected.

The first quarter was very poor but to our credit we turned it around after that and it was very much an even contest for 3 quarters albeit they had a comfortable lead for a lot of it. Hawks were 'on' in the first quarter - a long way from the flatness they showed v Tigers - and some clubs would have rolled over and lost by 80+ after that hot start. It was pleasing we didn't drop our heads.

Ultimately our problems aren't easily fixed unless we recruit from other clubs which we're clearly trying to do. We simply lack a lot of mid age talent - the older guys are mostly still good players but not what they were, and the younger guys show plenty but not necessarily every week. Landing S. Selwood would be handy, landing Danger as well could put us back in top 4 contention IMO.

Guthrie was great and Cadds was quiet but I can handle it because he's been brilliant for the past month - no coincidence that it was when Duncan was back in the side. Cadds was essentially our second midfielder tonight up against guys like Hodge/Mitchell/Lewis/Burgoyne/Shiels, all of whom have age and experience on him.

Blicavs has been immense all season but by having to play him as our number one ruck we're effectively losing in the middle and we've lost a midfielder. Blitz did some great work around the ground tonight (contested mark v Hodge a highlight) but in an ideal world he's sharking someone else's taps and racking up 20+ touches each week. I can only hope we'll be bringing in a mature ruck from another club for 2016 as it's hard to see Simpson being kept and McIntosh is already done. If we go into another season expecting Stanley, Blitz and Vardy to be our only rucks I will tear my hair out.

I thought Lang and Kolo were the best of the youngsters. Kolo hasn't put a foot wrong since he entered the side. He's the most promising young defender we've had since Taylor arrived in 2008.

Selwood is well and truly whatever injury he was carrying earlier in the season. He's been absolutely at his best since the GWS game. Shame he'll likely miss the AA team but I can't fault his game right now. Cockatoo was fairly composed when he came on and that goal was class.

Looking forward, I think we'll win our last 3 but it may not be enough. We're relying on WCE beating Adelaide or NM losing two of Freo/Dogs/Tigers. Either scenario is a big possibility but it's our of our hands. Unfortunately Essendon's pathetic non-appearance today means we won't catch the Crows' percentage. Assuming we win our next two, we need to enter round 23 on equal premiership points with them so all we need to do is win and we're in.

Missing finals would be disappointing but not the end of the world IMO... Ultimately I think we're in the best 8 teams in the comp but a poor run with injuries (fortunately most of them back now) and a wretched fixture have conspired against us. Can someone explain how despite finishing SIXTH last season we've played each of last year's grand finalists twice before we've even played last year's wooden spooners once? WCE and the Bulldogs have shown it's easy to miss finals and then shoot up the ladder on a soft draw the next year.

On a random note I was thinking about our 2011 QF win over the Hawks the other day. Their midfield has literally not changed from that day. Same players, just four years older. As for ours, Selwood is the only constant. Corey and Chapman are long gone and Bartel and Kelly play in other roles now. Our first choice midfield when all players are fit these days is Selwood, Duncan, Caddy, Motlop, Guthrie and Blicavs. It's a completely new side to our last premiership yet we've remained competitive every year. I for one am very optimistic about our future.

That's no rant, that was brilliant.

 

[Teriyakicat]

lol Save that one for Hell Kitty every week Very good!