Anthony Albanese - How long? -2-

[Saint]

Labor have really lost the ablity to govern. They're stuck being LNP lite.

It's strange because most of the state ALP Governments aren't like this. The Federal lobbyists must have a lot more $$$

 

[E Shed]

Albo is the Malcolm Turnbull of Labor.
Talked a great game when not in power, same old same old when he actually gets in.
If anything he’s worse. Had a heap of political capital and could have tackled the hard stuff - scrapping AUKUS, stage 3, proper NCACC etc.

has dogged every hard ball.

If anything he’s worse than MT who was hobbled by the nutters around him.

Mr man of the people Albo is just another bought & paid for liar.

The only way to make any real progress is going to be independents & greens with the balance of power

 

[Saint]

Running gambling ads on racing.com is not what anyone here is talking about. It's staggering that there is anyone who thinks the volume of gambling is at an acceptable level.

The volume of which gambling? Sports gambling?

Gambling revenue in every state/territory except NSW and NT peaked 10 years ago.

The number of betting venues is at all-time lows. People forget that nearly every town used to have stand-alone TABs.

If the Govt bothered to regulate betting apps and pokies, most of the problem would evaporate. (You can't advertise gambling on pokies, btw and it has gone up).

The underlying problem is that the Government is very bad at regulating apps and the internet. That's where the majority of harm in society is occurring.

 

[Carn The Berries]

The volume of which gambling? Sports gambling?

Gambling revenue in every state/territory except NSW and NT peaked 10 years ago.

The number of betting venues is at all-time lows. People forget that nearly every town used to have stand-alone TABs.

If the Govt bothered to regulate betting apps and pokies, most of the problem would evaporate. (You can't advertise gambling on pokies, btw and it has gone up).

The underlying problem is that the Government is very bad at regulating apps and the internet. That's where the majority of harm in society is occurring.

And how do you think those apps are generating their traffic? The answer is actually quite obvious when you take a moment to think about it....

Of course the number of bricks and mortar betting shops has declined... Why would anyone go to a dingy old TAB when you can do the same thing on your phone?

The government is literally trying to do the bolded at present, by regulating how much they can advertise, yet you have also said that you don' think this needs to happen.

 

[Saint]

And how do you think those apps are generating their traffic? The answer is actually quite obvious when you take a moment to think about it....

Of course the number of bricks and mortar betting shops has declined... Why would anyone go to a dingy old TAB when you can do the same thing on your phone?

The government is literally trying to do the bolded at present, by regulating how much they can advertise, yet you have also said that you don' think this needs to happen.

It would be silly to say that advertising doesn't work, otherwise why would they do it?

I think they shouldn't show it where it shouldn't be expected which might trigger addicts or influence children. But don't ban it from 2am basketball matches on Foxtel or during the races.

 

[Saint]

I think the student debt changes the Government are making are a smart policy. Same with payments for prac work.

Good to see the Govt doing something positive for lower income workers.

 

[Carn The Berries]

It would be silly to say that advertising doesn't work, otherwise why would they do it?

I think they shouldn't show it where it shouldn't be expected which might trigger addicts or influence children. But don't ban it from 2am basketball matches on Foxtel or during the races.

Precisely, which is why the government is working to reduce/stop it.

Your second statement is a bit of a contradiction... I daresay the people watching a basketball game at 2am would include those who may be prone to addiction.

One of the things that hasn't been looked at yet (and it should be) is betting agencies being able to broadcast live sport through their apps. Taking that away would definitely help reduce the attraction for those who may become addicted. Nobody in Australia needs to be able to watch a game in the European Handball League at 3:15am on a Thursday.

 

[Gralin]

You've obviously never watched the racing channel which only shows live racing when they're on in Vic/SA. The other 90% of the time, it's shows with replays and analysis. Overnight it's historic races and background stories. If you're watching the racing channel, it's because you like racing, not because you're addicted to gambling. Don't forget the horse auctions where millionaires take punts with even worse payouts than the pokies.

I think there should be less gambling ads when kids would be watching, which would also give respite for problem gamblers. There's whole gambling agencies. It shouldn't be too hard for them to come up with ways of addressing the two actual problems: advertising to children, advertising to addicts.

It's not like addicts aren't bombarded with gambling adds in their online lives, which is where they will go if the racing channel disappears. There are subtle and complicated factors and unintended consequences to something like a blanket TV ban.

there is not a single legitimate good reason to not ban gambling advertising

not one

 

[SaintsSeptember]

It would be silly to say that advertising doesn't work, otherwise why would they do it?

I think they shouldn't show it where it shouldn't be expected which might trigger addicts or influence children. But don't ban it from 2am basketball matches on Foxtel or during the races.

I'm amazed that it does, but apparently it does.
I remember working out that when Holden were sponsoring Collingwood for 3million, it was a time when their sales were dwindling. It was costing them $50 per car just to sponsor the Pies. Personally i'd rather get free floor mats.

Personally i find that i'm bombarded with so much advertising that i just filter it out. Even if its something i'm in the market for i tend not to look at the adds.

 

[Carn The Berries]

I'm amazed that it does, but apparently it does.
I remember working out that when Holden were sponsoring Collingwood for 3million, it was a time when their sales were dwindling. It was costing them $50 per car just to sponsor the Pies. Personally i'd rather get free floor mats.

Personally i find that i'm bombarded with so much advertising that i just filter it out. Even if its something i'm in the market for i tend not to look at the adds.

And that's where the in-game/in-coverage advertising is so disgusting... That is one time where it is very effective. You're sitting on the couch watching a preview of a game, all of a sudden Daisy Thomas is in your face, telling you that your team is good value and how to put a bet on. You look down at your phone and...

They just want to get you in once, because they know that once they've got their hands on you, they can use your data/email/socials to ramp up the advertising.

 

[Saint]

there is not a single legitimate good reason to not ban gambling advertising

not one

Except for people who like gambling?

It's a bit like saying there's no single legitimate reason not to ban fast food advertising.

If the stuff they're advertising was any good, they wouldn't need to advertise it.

It's very different now to 30 years ago, when the only way you knew about something was if you saw it on a commercial in the paper or on TV. Back then, if you wanted a TV, the only info you had was what was in commercials.

I remember when my parents and I bought our first home computer there was stuff-all knowledge.

Now, if I want to buy something, I don't wait for an ad. I go online and read 5x blogs, 100 reviews, then still go to 2-3 brick and mortar stores (for a large purchase).

So much advertising money for stuff we need is now online that the only ones left on TV are for stuff that we're not going looking for. Like funeral insurance, and guilting us about the state of our yard with Bunnings ads.

You could ban every TV ad with no net-loss to society, probably just an improvement. Same with online.

 

[Saint]

And that's where the in-game/in-coverage advertising is so disgusting... That is one time where it is very effective. You're sitting on the couch watching a preview of a game, all of a sudden Daisy Thomas is in your face, telling you that your team is good value and how to put a bet on. You look down at your phone and...

They just want to get you in once, because they know that once they've got their hands on you, they can use your data/email/socials to ramp up the advertising.

So.... ban advertising before the game, then ban gambling on that game during the game.

But you could still have an ad about a promo for horses for the coming Saturday during a Thursday night football game.

(I wouldn't let ads for gambling be on FTA games before 9:30pm.)

 

[Carn The Berries]

So.... ban advertising before the game, then ban gambling on that game during the game.

But you could still have an ad about a promo for horses for the coming Saturday during a Thursday night football game.

(I wouldn't let ads for gambling be on FTA games before 9:30pm.)

Shouldn't just be FTA. Fox Sports should have to toe the line as well (including getting rid of the BS "programs" that just talk about odds).

 

[Saint]

Precisely, which is why the government is working to reduce/stop it.

Your second statement is a bit of a contradiction... I daresay the people watching a basketball game at 2am would include those who may be prone to addiction.

One of the things that hasn't been looked at yet (and it should be) is betting agencies being able to broadcast live sport through their apps. Taking that away would definitely help reduce the attraction for those who may become addicted. Nobody in Australia needs to be able to watch a game in the European Handball League at 3:15am on a Thursday.

Why shouldn't somebody be able to watch European Handball league at 3:15am? There are handball fans here, and which other media org is going to have the incentive to show it?

This is the very real risk of banning advertising during sport on TV. A lot of sports might disappear from TV and only be visible via online (near-completely-unregulated) or worse, just on gambling apps.

If you're a gambling addict watching 2am basketball games, I doubt a commercial is going to change your decision about gambling or not.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

And that's where the in-game/in-coverage advertising is so disgusting... That is one time where it is very effective. You're sitting on the couch watching a preview of a game, all of a sudden Daisy Thomas is in your face, telling you that your team is good value and how to put a bet on. You look down at your phone and...

They just want to get you in once, because they know that once they've got their hands on you, they can use your data/email/socials to ramp up the advertising.

Anti laundering laws mean that if you have money in your gambling account, its far easier to put it on another bet than it is to withdraw it.

 

[Saint]

Shouldn't just be FTA. Fox Sports should have to toe the line as well (including getting rid of the BS "programs" that just talk about odds).

Would be incredibly easy to have streaming services have an opt-in and opt-out option for gambling advertising. Stan and Netflix already have ad opt-ins and opt-outs, don't they? Most have a kids portal so they don't see inappropriate content.

This is where simple regulation would be far better than blanket bans.

 

[Saint]

Anti laundering laws mean that if you have money in your gambling account, its far easier to put it on another bet than it is to withdraw it.

I reckon it takes about the same amount of time, or less, to withdraw as to place a bet. To withdraw, you go to account and then withdraw, enter the amount and confirm.

If you're placing a bet, you need to find the sport, event, bet type, enter the number, are you sure, confirm.

Maybe that's what the anti-gambling ads should be saying "Isn't it time to withdraw those winnings and buy the Mrs something nice".

A withdrawal is a pretty decent dopamine hit. Probably the best associated with gambling. If more people did it more often, they might find that!
(I should add to all this, that I've withdrawn all my money from gambling accounts after I win too much betting with them and they gradually cut me off).

 

[Gralin]

Except for people who like gambling?

no that is not a legit reason to advertise

It's a bit like saying there's no single legitimate reason not to ban fast food advertising.

there isn't

If the stuff they're advertising was any good, they wouldn't need to advertise it.

kind of makes the point about the problem with advertising doesn't it

It's very different now to 30 years ago, when the only way you knew about something was if you saw it on a commercial in the paper or on TV. Back then, if you wanted a TV, the only info you had was what was in commercials.

that might be why online gambling ads is something they also want to target

I remember when my parents and I bought our first home computer there was stuff-all knowledge.

Now, if I want to buy something, I don't wait for an ad. I go online and read 5x blogs, 100 reviews, then still go to 2-3 brick and mortar stores (for a large purchase).

so why are you fighting so hard to keep gambling ads around

So much advertising money for stuff we need is now online that the only ones left on TV are for stuff that we're not going looking for. Like funeral insurance, and guilting us about the state of our yard with Bunnings ads.

You could ban every TV ad with no net-loss to society, probably just an improvement. Same with online.

again, so why are you arguing against a ban on gambling advertising

 

[Carn The Berries]

Would be incredibly easy to have streaming services have an opt-in and opt-out option for gambling advertising. Stan and Netflix already have ad opt-ins and opt-outs, don't they? Most have a kids portal so they don't see inappropriate content.

This is where simple regulation would be far better than blanket bans.

No - Fox Sports shouldn't need an opt-in or opt-out. Just don't have ads on where kids can access them. Period.

Also - Fox isn't purely streaming. My understanding is opt-in wouldn't work with cable subscriptions, even if they wanted to offer it.

 

[Gralin]

pretty shit of the AFL to suggest Auskick would have to go if gambling ads were banned

this is the kind of bullshit we're dealing with

 

[Theseventhhamster]

pretty shit of the AFL to suggest Auskick would have to go if gambling ads were banned

this is the kind of bullshit we're dealing with

They're just revealing what's bottom of their priority list for spending.

 

[Gralin]

They're just revealing what's bottom of their priority list for spending.

yeah pretty much

 

[Gralin]

can you imagine if they dropped auskick when they are already struggling to keep kids though?

seems like shooting themselves in the foot to keep their executive bonuses which kind of tells you everything you need to know about whether those kind of people are worth the salaries they get

 

[Forward Press]

pretty shit of the AFL to suggest Auskick would have to go if gambling ads were banned

this is the kind of bullshit we're dealing with

It's on brand with the modern AFL.

In bed with whatever makes them money, they only take positions of integrity if the opposite position hurts their bottom line.

 

[fs88]