Bluemour Discussion Thread XI - Facts Not Welcome

[rp84]

Bam Bam, with a full pre-season and fully fit and free of niggling injuries. I still reckon he's the one. And we already have him!

Still wouldn't say no if we could get Shiel for a reasonable deal, but I won't be sooking it up if we don't get him.
Unless of course he ends up at *...

Hope you're right re bam bam but I didnt see much to suggest he's likely to be an A grader or likely to ever stay on the park. Huge 12 months coming up for him. Hope he kills it.

 

[HARKER]

Oh and Whitfield plays off half back these days. He didn't cut the mustard as a mid.

That's how you'll find your best HBF'ers. Look for failed mids.

OK, it's not as simple as that but often shows up to be the case and if so, what does that say?..... Don't recruit nor pay a premium for HBF'ers

 

[plentyblckie]

Not sure if it’s been mentioned but Shiel is the first player to get tagged on that GWS squad and it happened again last night. It’s been happening most his career.

A salary dump wouldn’t surprise me in a big package with Shiel and Setterfield. I noticed Heath Shaw was out too last night. Would he be a salary dump option? Noticed Scully right beside him in the coaches box also. I reckon they missed Patton last night. Himmelman is ok, but not a true KPF to allow Cameron to roam.

Heard last week somewhere that GWS may also be into a big name in from WA. I thought maybe Fyfe, but haven’t got a name. Now that would be ridonculous.

Some rumours lobb will be involved in a lockie neal deal

 

[gandaal]

That's how you'll find your best HBF'ers. Look for failed mids.

OK, it's not as simple as that but often shows up to be the case and if so, what does that say?..... Don't recruit nor pay a premium for HBF'ers

I couldn't agree more

 

[Tommy Alvin]

That's how you'll find your best HBF'ers. Look for failed mids.

OK, it's not as simple as that but often shows up to be the case and if so, what does that say?..... Don't recruit nor pay a premium for HBF'ers

I have to agree with that.

 

[passmark]

That's how you'll find your best HBF'ers. Look for failed mids.

OK, it's not as simple as that but often shows up to be the case and if so, what does that say?..... Don't recruit nor pay a premium for HBF'ers

Sheesh,

You'd think we'd have a dozen top quality HBFs with all the failed mids we've had over a decade.

 

[Arr0w]

But there's no point saying that you'd rather have those three when they aren't available.

You might as well say "I don't want Shiel because Dustin Martin is better". It true but we aren't getting Dusty so why should that stop us getting Shiel? Same goes for those three.

Oh and Whitfield plays off half back these days. He didn't cut the mustard as a mid.

This

Makes me laugh that people are trying to pick weaknesses in players, when 99% of them, have certain flaws.

Shiel would be a starting 3 mid in any other side.

Most important aspect, the only aspect, is what it will cost to add best 22 players, given the current status of our list

 

[jooce8891]

This

Makes me laugh that people are trying to pick weaknesses in players, when 99% of them, have certain flaws.

Shiel would be a starting 3 mid in any other side.

Most important aspect, the only aspect, is what it will cost to add best 22 players, given the current status of our list

people see one average game from him, and then all of a sudden he isnt worth it? i dont get it, we need him desperately.

 

[zeeCFC]

People had the same criticisms of Prestia when the Tigers got him in.

Shiel will instantly make us a more attractive and better team.

... should he choose to come over, otherwise yeah, turnover merchant hack

 

[Bearded Carpenter]

Just liked a post saying no to DS.

Then liked the very next post saying yes to him.

You've all just confused me.

Thanks

 

[BIGGUS 64]

Hope you're right re bam bam but I didnt see much to suggest he's likely to be an A grader or likely to ever stay on the park. Huge 12 months coming up for him. Hope he kills it.

I haven't seen any reason to lose faith in him so far. He's still young (younger than Shiel) and just needs to get fully fit and get confidence in his body. He only had a partial pre-season and was in and out of the side with injury, preventing him from getting a decent run at it. Plus a really sh!tty season to be trying to make his mark. Hard to shine when your team is copping a hiding most weeks.
Once he was staying on the park we started to see glimpses of what he can offer.
I still think Kennedy will be a very good player for us. Doesn't even have to be an "A-grader" to get a pass from me, just a good, solid, physical inside mid to take some of the load off Crippa.

 

[rog1995]

After watching Shiel last night I'm not sure he's the right age bracket for us. He reminds me of a stronger left footed Murphy without the skills. Cognilio on the other hand would be amazing runs both ways and can play forward...

 

[Funk]

I'm no fan of the BT and Bruce show but those guys tonight reached previously unseen lows.

Another good reason to actually go to the game?

To avoid having to listen to those flogs.

(Then I just have to avoid listing to ABC Radio and that flog "dumb comments" guy - I think his name is Malthouse......)

 

[Mr Blonde]

That's how you'll find your best HBF'ers. Look for failed mids.

OK, it's not as simple as that but often shows up to be the case and if so, what does that say?..... Don't recruit nor pay a premium for HBF'ers

Except calling Whitfield a failed mid is a bit of a stretch, he had a good year last year playing as a mid. He was only moved to half back this year because they lost Wilson and Williams was out injured. He can play off half back, on a wing or in the guts in my opinion. He is a star.


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[ShanDog]

Hope you're right re bam bam but I didnt see much to suggest he's likely to be an A grader or likely to ever stay on the park. Huge 12 months coming up for him. Hope he kills it.

Same. I think he can be a quality B-grade player (and you need them in your team) but no star. Hope he proves me wrong of course.

 

[Jimmae]

You'd be surprised.. I was speaking to a mate who is with the Northern Blues in a Coaching/recruiting capacity and he told me about Hannebery leaving the Swans a good 2 weeks before it 'came out'. He also mentioned Langdon from Pies quite possibly moving on, and ironically I saw that piece on the AFL website yesterday.

Haven't people been pushing the Hannebery rumour for months?

Not sure if it’s been mentioned but Shiel is the first player to get tagged on that GWS squad and it happened again last night. It’s been happening most his career.

A salary dump wouldn’t surprise me in a big package with Shiel and Setterfield. I noticed Heath Shaw was out too last night. Would he be a salary dump option? Noticed Scully right beside him in the coaches box also. I reckon they missed Patton last night. Himmelman is ok, but not a true KPF to allow Cameron to roam.

Heard last week somewhere that GWS may also be into a big name in from WA. I thought maybe Fyfe, but haven’t got a name. Now that would be ridonculous.

Ryan Griffen retiring is good news for that salary cap issue. I wonder if Deledio also gets a nudge

RE: Shiel being tagged, his role as the primary runner out of the clearances makes him an ideal player to tag.

RE: retirements, Shaw has to be next.

This

Makes me laugh that people are trying to pick weaknesses in players, when 99% of them, have certain flaws.

Shiel would be a starting 3 mid in any other side.

Most important aspect, the only aspect, is what it will cost to add best 22 players, given the current status of our list

I don't think he would be at Geelong, West Coast, Richmond, Collingwood, the Bulldogs, Port, and maybe even Adelaide and Hawthorn.

Top 4 for most of them, but that wasn't where you set the bar.

 

[Large Hawaiian]

Top 10 maybe. Let's not go too far.

Nevermind, OK Computer, The Bends, What's the Story Morning Glory?, Ready to Die, Automatic For the People, Achtung Baby, Miseducation of Lauren Hill, White Ladder, Grace, Pinkerton, Straight Outta Compton all better imo.

But then music is a subjective thing so each to their own.

Grace by Jeff Buckley for me. Should never have gone swimming that night, such a talent.

 

[smashbox gill]

Some rumours lobb will be involved in a lockie neal deal

I'd do that, I cant ever see him being a dominant ruckman. He's a forward/2nd ruck imo

 

[HARKER]

Sheesh,

You'd think we'd have a dozen top quality HBFs with all the failed mids we've had over a decade.

Which mids were trialed as HBF'ers though?

There's absolutely no shame in playing HB and you can see we've tried Cuningham there, which tells you that maybe that inside mid position we projected for him early on, simply isn't going to come off.

I'm glad we largely have our backline sorted for now, although we still do need one speedy/disciplined type, so the likes of O'Brien and Williamson (in my view) have the opportunity to learn their craft in tougher running positions.

I worry for Cuningham, as he could easily find his home to be in the Northern Blues back-line.

 

[Blue and Blue]

So maybe Carlton should not recruit anyone because they are imperfect, and continue worrying about whether they are worth the $$$$ that we have to offer up to get them to come to us..........it`s not the supporters decision who the club should spend money on, and if SOS and co only looked at every "potential" recruit with a view to their faults, then the club would be on the bottom for another 20 years.........I think that the Giants game plan is what lets them down in big pressure games, and that goes back to the coaching plan they have............

Yes I was being sarcastic...which seems to have not been picked up... as if the best gws players wouldnt improve us and likely get us into finals..we can worry about winning them when we get there

 

[HARKER]

Except calling Whitfield a failed mid is a bit of a stretch, he had a good year last year playing as a mid. He was only moved to half back this year because they lost Wilson and Williams was out injured. He can play off half back, on a wing or in the guts in my opinion. He is a star.


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Hence the smiley face

Sometimes you can have too much of a good thing. That sounds silly but I don't think it is, as it can sway you to place talent across the ground as opposed to positional strengths and needs.

Balance, balance, balance. Try and have the right amount of everything, giving everyone a chance to be commissioned to play in their preferred positions, as too many weeks in the VFL or NEAFL and you start to become a VFL or NEAFL player.

 

[feffs93]

1. Cripps
2. Coniglio
3. Docherty
4. Shiel

Coniglio I agree but Docherty is a better player than Shiel.

Edit: I reckon Charlie will be better next year as well.


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Your probably right but there isn’t much separating those four

 

[bmaurizio]

Cuningham may just not live up to our expectations, we have to be preparerd for that outcome.

 

[HBF]

Scully and Patton are two they should try to move on imo. Never around when they need them.

Patton yes. Their forward line works pretty well when he's not there. Himmelberg has gone past him anyway.

 

[HARKER]

Cuningham may just not live up to our expectations, we have to be preparerd for that outcome.

Absolutely.
From memory and discounting injury:

Year one: Played many games as an inside mid in the NB's. Just couldn't find the ball. Test aborted.
Year two: Played as an outside mid. Did some good things but just not often enough.
Year three: Trialed as a HBF'er and didn't really cut the mustard.

Players can come back from all sorts of set-backs, but if Cuningham finds he hasn't a home early on in the year, it could pose an issue for him.
Contracted only for next year and we know SOS doesn't mess around.