Bluemour Discussion Thread XIII - Facts Not Welcome

[Opine]

Idiots on that tweet criticising the AFL because they supposedly put the Titanic in the graphic

******* haters.

I hadn't caught on until reading your comment, above. IF one is to be honest, they could at least have used some sort of de-identifying feature in the ship graphic; That way there could be no doubt that the ship was not the Titanic. It's either unintentionally sloppy, or mischievous work by the artist.

 

[therubbernub]

I think you can look at Shiel another way.

Think he is a straight laced guy wanting to win something with GWS to make it all worthwhile, and he has loyalty to that notion. That is something that could be respected. Remember GWS have told him he can investigate opportunities in Vic.

I'm not sure he ever came out and said he wants out for his big payday this year. It is more the fact GWS get better compensation so preempt next year.

I think if we get him, we get a no nonsense guy that will do his part with the minimum of fuss. I like that idea.

GWS have known about their salary cap problem for 12 months (since the Kelly, hopper etc renegotiations last year) You can be sure that they have looked at different scenarios in order to find relief. It would be no good looking at trading fringe players, because they are not the ones earning the big dollars. So it is HIGHLY likely that GWS have been open to trading one of their big guns all year (it is the only way out for them) . SOS knows this and so do the player managers concerned.
And so they go through their list looking at possible big fish that would like to move and in the same process net them a decent pick in return. Fast forward to the interview with Shiel mid-year when he was asked point blank, and he blinked a bit and said IIRC that he was happy in sydney assuming that GWS didnt want to trade him. Splinters in bum statement if there ever was one.
Of course we now know from those ITK, that we have been courting him for some length of time. I think SOS's connections allowed him to make the early move, hence we have been the early runners, but as the word got out that Dylan was tradeable, it brought in the Hawks, Saints , *, and Norf. We are now down to a two horse race with the Hawks.
No doubt he has done the hard yards with GWS being a foundation draftee, and looking to seek better times if he does move, is understandable. I think he and his management can see that the * and saints are not the ones with the list potential- it is us. But the Hawks have Clarkson and all that goes with it. So I can see his dilemma .
1 GWS have opened the door for him to move which leads to
2 looking at all offers , which opens the door to big money in victoria but
3 The ones offering THE most $'s are the cheats and the saints, and as a carlton supporter he despises the * and Saints are a joke which leaves
4 The Hawks and Carlton. His heart says the romance of playing for CJ's old team, the team he followed as a kid, AND who's offering the biggest dollars BUT his head says that the Hawks have the best coach and system going around- which is proven and is a huge attraction, given that his financial needs will be covered either way.

 

[Metalcrusher]

GWS have known about their salary cap problem for 12 months (since the Kelly, hopper etc renegotiations last year) You can be sure that they have looked at different scenarios in order to find relief. It would be no good looking at trading fringe players, because they are not the ones earning the big dollars. So it is HIGHLY likely that GWS have been open to trading one of their big guns all year (it is the only way out for them) . SOS knows this and so do the player managers concerned.
And so they go through their list looking at possible big fish that would like to move and in the same process net them a decent pick in return. Fast forward to the interview with Shiel mid-year when he was asked point blank, and he blinked a bit and said IIRC that he was happy in sydney assuming that GWS didnt want to trade him. Splinters in bum statement if there ever was one.
Of course we now know from those ITK, that we have been courting him for some length of time. I think SOS's connections allowed him to make the early move, hence we have been the early runners, but as the word got out that Dylan was tradeable, it brought in the Hawks, Saints , *, and Norf. We are now down to a two horse race with the Hawks.
No doubt he has done the hard yards with GWS being a foundation draftee, and looking to seek better times if he does move, is understandable. I think he and his management can see that the * and saints are not the ones with the list potential- it is us. But the Hawks have Clarkson and all that goes with it. So I can see his dilemma .
1 GWS have opened the door for him to move which leads to
2 looking at all offers , which opens the door to big money in victoria but
3 The ones offering THE most $'s are the cheats and the saints, and as a carlton supporter he despises the * and Saints are a joke which leaves
4 The Hawks and Carlton. His heart says the romance of playing for CJ's old team, the team he followed as a kid, AND who's offering the biggest dollars BUT his head says that the Hawks have the best coach and system going around- which is proven and is a huge attraction, given that his financial needs will be covered either way.

Jibberish …. CFC all the way baby!

 

[Garth Vader]

I hadn't caught on until reading your comment, above. IF one is to be honest, they could at least have used some sort of de-identifying feature in the ship graphic; That way there could be no doubt that the ship was not the Titanic. It's either unintentionally sloppy, or mischievous work by the artist.

It has "Navy Blue" written on the side, though. Also, the main identifier of The Titanic is the distinctive four funnels - I can't see those in the graphic. This just looks like an early-era ship to me.

 

[FootyGeek]

The Mitchell thing is very strange.

He goes away to West Coast for two years and then straight back into the Hawthorn nest even breaking a contract.

Just reeks of dependence.

If that is how he operates then glad he is not part of Carlton. Sounds like he is Hawthorn or nothing. That is great for players but not for football department professionals.

 

[Goldtone]

They're not wrong. This thing looks like crap.

Regardless of whether or not Shiel likes the pic, Cripps and Docherty deserve heaps better than something that can hint out mockery. These two are going to lead us up the ladder in the coming seasons.

Not to mention those hats are just straight up ridiculoso

On [device_name] using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[djw1952]

So we can deduce the following:
1. Connors and GWS want Carlton (more trade currency, good working relationship with SOS)
2. Dylan loves Carlton
3. Carlton wants Dylan

Just bite the bullet and make the call, Dylan! Don't worry about what the nuffies and doubters out there say. Come 2020, we'll be sailing past the likes of the Dawks and it'll be the best decision you ever made.

It probably comes down to whether or not he trusts that Carlton will have success before his career is over I would imagine........but you are right about the haws, and just because clarkson rattles off to all the players they are trying to pinch that they are not far away from winning more flags, does not mean it`s true..........in fact they are just trying to patch over the cracks like Geelong does, by topping up their list instead of going to the draft!!!

 

[Opine]

It has "Navy Blue" written on the side, though. Also, the main identifier of The Titanic is the distinctive four funnels - I can't see those in the graphic. This just looks like an early-era ship to me.

ah yeah, your right... shows how little I know.

 

[Opine]

The Mitchell thing is very strange.

He goes away to West Coast for two years and then straight back into the Hawthorn nest even breaking a contract.

Just reeks of dependence.

If that is how he operates then glad he is not part of Carlton. Sounds like he is Hawthorn or nothing. That is great for players but not for football department professionals.

Agree re dependance. But probably to early for him to ascertain a coaching role at CFC's as constituting a reasonable risk. Media, and some of our own supporters are giving Bolts a hard time. Probably fearful of whether the coach that he would have been assistant to would be there in 24 + months.

 

[Opine]

GWS have known about their salary cap problem for 12 months (since the Kelly, hopper etc renegotiations last year) You can be sure that they have looked at different scenarios in order to find relief. It would be no good looking at trading fringe players, because they are not the ones earning the big dollars. So it is HIGHLY likely that GWS have been open to trading one of their big guns all year (it is the only way out for them) . SOS knows this and so do the player managers concerned.
And so they go through their list looking at possible big fish that would like to move and in the same process net them a decent pick in return. Fast forward to the interview with Shiel mid-year when he was asked point blank, and he blinked a bit and said IIRC that he was happy in sydney assuming that GWS didnt want to trade him. Splinters in bum statement if there ever was one.
Of course we now know from those ITK, that we have been courting him for some length of time. I think SOS's connections allowed him to make the early move, hence we have been the early runners, but as the word got out that Dylan was tradeable, it brought in the Hawks, Saints , *, and Norf. We are now down to a two horse race with the Hawks.
No doubt he has done the hard yards with GWS being a foundation draftee, and looking to seek better times if he does move, is understandable. I think he and his management can see that the * and saints are not the ones with the list potential- it is us. But the Hawks have Clarkson and all that goes with it. So I can see his dilemma .
1 GWS have opened the door for him to move which leads to
2 looking at all offers , which opens the door to big money in victoria but
3 The ones offering THE most $'s are the cheats and the saints, and as a carlton supporter he despises the * and Saints are a joke which leaves
4 The Hawks and Carlton. His heart says the romance of playing for CJ's old team, the team he followed as a kid, AND who's offering the biggest dollars BUT his head says that the Hawks have the best coach and system going around- which is proven and is a huge attraction, given that his financial needs will be covered either way.

You'd think that CFCs presentation wasn't purely based around heart.
Too much emphasis been placed on the head v heart imbalance atm.
If someone that cares to observe, looks deep enough, there's some sound head based logic that says we are primed to climb.
If he can't see it after a detailed presentation, or if he doesn't believe it, then its best he goes elsewhere.

 

[therubbernub]

You'd think that CFCs presentation wasn't purely based around heart.
Too much emphasis been placed on the head v heart imbalance atm.
If someone that cares to look, observes deep enough, there's some sound head based logic that says we are primed to climb.
If he can't see it after a detailed presentation, or if he doesn't believe it, then its best he goes elsewhere.

I think its more complex than that. GWS have obviously made it known that he is tradeable because of their SC situation. Shiel is obviously torn and a little confused what to do. Hence he is having trouble making a decision

 

[Juddrockz]

View attachment 569171 Dylan likes this

Mitch McGovern also liked it on Instagram.

 

[Just Kreuzing]

Uh yes.

We can debate whether Choco knows...though he does have a close connection in his daughter.

But don't see how you are denying what i'm saying...when someone asks what Carlton's colour is, you say navy blue. You don't say blue and white.
That makes us likely the 1 colour team.

Hawthorn on the other hand are clearly 2 colours.

Pretty poor of Choco to enter into any cryptic discussion about it really. Let the guy make he’s own decision and announce it himself.

Just attention seeking and trying to remain relevant in the AFL community, any wonder he clashed with most he was involved with.

 

[Manhattanite]

Pretty poor of Choco to enter into any cryptic discussion about it really. Let the guy make he’s own decision and announce it himself.

Just attention seeking and trying to remain relevant in the AFL community, any wonder he clashed with most he was involved with.

Agreed poor form. He’s probably also not keen to see his grandkids in Navy Blue one day.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Pinnell]

Just a thought. You're a 25 year old seeing seeing a hot chick and you work pretty hard at staying in the good books with the old school, shoot from the hip father in law to be who you know isn't a big fan of Carlton - but you respect the old bloke, the mans man, and ex premiership coach. So when in conversation the old bloke says to you "why'd you go to Noosa, that's just a waste of a day", you feel a bit nervous that he won't like what you've got to say so you make the situation a little more comfortable for yourself and get him off your back and say "yeh, well, I have to keep and open mind you know?". When you know full well there's more to it. Just to keep the old big mouth fu$ker off your back...
The old bloke goes to the radio interview thinking he's influenced the kid to stay away from the club he hates...

Just another way it may have unfolded if you put yourself in Dylan's shoes?

 

[blueballs99]

Its a difficult one for him to make ..We won 2 games for the entire season and both of those wins were only possible because the teams we beat had a very tough game the week before ...added to the fact that we can barely score over 60-70 points a game ...not really comforting for the Bloke who is chasing success ..has an affinity with the club but will that be enough ..We will see

 

[esoteric]

So IF Shiel chooses Hawthorn, they will need to satisfy GWS. How about
Carlton get Burton and #13 for Carlton’s 2019 #1
Hawks get Shiel
GWS get Carton’s 2019 #1

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

I’d love Dylan but if we get Setterfield and McGovern after a 2 win season, we’ve done really well. Take 1 to the draft, stay the course.

In 3 years time, midfield of Cripps, Dow, SPS, Setterfield, Walsh, Kennedy, Fisher is going to be hard to top

 

[Juddrockz]

I’d love Dylan but if we get Setterfield and McGovern after a 2 win season, we’ve done really well. Take 1 to the draft, stay the course.

In 3 years time, midfield of Cripps, Dow, SPS, Setterfield, Walsh, Kennedy, Fisher is going to be hard to top

And Crippa the poor bugger will be broken down with no immediate support!

 

[Press Box Wing]

Yep, Levi's efforts for the team have largely been under rated by many on these pages.

Agree. But it is more than that. I love BigFooty but it sh!ts me to tears when posters feel the need to belittle and insult players they do not like. You might think a player falls short in an area of their game and I have no problem with that discussion, but many take it way too far by exaggerating the issues out of all proportion and getting personal. The interest Levi is attracting now is a testament to the many positives he brings to the table and it seems to make a few on here uncomfortable. Jokes like 'what do we need to give for them to take him?' and putting his value at a fourth or fifth rounder are just designed to insult a player who has given his all in a losing side for many years. He deserves better.

 

[Iamcarlton]

Uh yes.

We can debate whether Choco knows...though he does have a close connection in his daughter.

But don't see how you are denying what i'm saying...when someone asks what Carlton's colour is, you say navy blue. You don't say blue and white.
That makes us likely the 1 colour team.

Hawthorn on the other hand are clearly 2 colours.

He'd be an idiot to give away the team in an interview its not his right so if you deduct hawthorn from the interview then its Carlton or elsewhere imo .

 

[Rosscoe]

Agree. But it is more than that. I love BigFooty but it sh!ts me to tears when posters feel the need to belittle and insult players they do not like. You might think a player falls short in an area of their game and I have no problem with that discussion, but many take it way too far by exaggerating the issues out of all proportion and getting personal. The interest Levi is attracting now is a testament to the many positives he brings to the table and it seems to make a few on here uncomfortable. Jokes like 'what do we need to give for them to take him?' and putting his value at a fourth or fifth rounder are just designed to insult a player who has given his all in a losing side for many years. He deserves better.

Agreed he is an elite mark and has improved his kicking significantly under Rocca.

 

[Canyouhearthedrums]

And Crippa the poor bugger will be broken down with no immediate support!

I’m sure there is a plan B on that front. It just might not be an AA gun like Shiel

 

[Worm4]

putting his value at a fourth or fifth rounder are just designed to insult a player who has given his all in a losing side for many years. He deserves better.

Unfortunately it's the stark reality of modern day football. Sure, we would love him clunking marks in the forward line, but Harry, Charlie, and now probably Gov get to share that space now. He just wont be anything more than a spare parts player with us, hence we test the market.
Hopefully Carlton get something decent for him, but I highly doubt it ( and that's not being disrespectful )

 

[blueballs99]

I’d love Dylan but if we get Setterfield and McGovern after a 2 win season, we’ve done really well. Take 1 to the draft, stay the course.

In 3 years time, midfield of Cripps, Dow, SPS, Setterfield, Walsh, Kennedy, Fisher is going to be hard to top

No we havent ..We havent done well ...bringing in two players if you wanna add fasolo you can ..not gonna make much difference ...havent done enough ...need to bring in around 6 to make the team alot better ..6 quality players