Rumour Bluemour Discussion XXXV - 'Loopy' Season has begun

[Blue__Balls]

Happy to take Houston if the price is a first rounder and steak knives (ie. Durdin, or a fourth rounder, or a swap of third rounders).

If they won't budge without it being 2x firsts, or a first and a second, then I'd walk away and just take the pick to the draft for Xavier Lindsay who I think could play the same role we'd want Houston to play from a fairly early stage in his career. I see a lot of Steele Sidebottom

22

Steele Sidebottom

Age

33

Ht

184cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.4

5star

K

14.1

5star

HB

13.3

5star

M

5.5

5star

T

3.7

5star

CL

3.2

5star

D

24.0

5star

K

12.0

5star

HB

12.0

5star

M

4.5

4star

T

4.3

5star

CL

2.3

4star

D

31.6

5star

K

14.4

5star

HB

17.2

5star

M

4.2

4star

T

4.2

5star

CL

6.0

5star

in Lindsay, and if there's an oppo player over the last 5+ years who we could have benefited from greatly, it's the Sidebum and his uncanny ability to find the ball in dangerous spots and then hit a target in an even more dangerous spot.

Houston OR Lindsay, by trading our 2025 first pick into this draft.
Use our other first rounder on a front half player with pace and impact (Berry or Hotton, happy with either).
Try to shuffle our second rounder up the board for a young KPD.
Then take the Campos, any viable rookies, and call it a day.

Haynes too, I guess, if we've got a list spot and his salary expectations are commensurate with being a depth veteran.

 

[frank_frankson]

No point in the nucleus taking unders to keep the core together, then blowing it apart for an outsider to join up.


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[Blue Pulse]

No point in the nucleus taking unders to keep the core together, then blowing it apart for an outsider to join up.


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Correct, especially when we have TDK and Weiters coming out of contract next year

 

[Campoeasy]

Well we're not getting him...

Wouldn't say that just yet

 

[Sam The Doc]

So now we want PA to somehow win this weekend...

 

[RPCB]

So now we want PA to somehow win this weekend...

Nah, would love them to lose by 10+ goals. Give Dan Houston more of a reason not to stick around.

 

[Sam The Doc]

Nah, would love them to lose by 10+ goals. Give Dan Houston more of a reason not to stick around.

pay back for getting us into the finals?

 

[RPCB]

pay back for getting us into the finals?

Yeah, absolutely. Our EF is Port’s fault. ****ing Fremantle.

 

[Coona Blues]

Typical Carlton. Always looking for the quick fix. Chase the big name player that's contracted and will cost a fortune. Voss knows his coaching career is on the line. Stuff up this trade and we could be in a world of hurt in a few years when tassie comes in.

Houston is a great player and would improve us in the short term. But, at what cost?

We need small forward upgrade and key defensive investment.

The other cost is player development. Be assured Saad and Newman don’t make way. Cowan and the other kids will be put on the back burner. We need to develop Cowan, Ollie, Wilson, maybe Matt Carroll if he survives, as well as entrench Cincotta and Boyd types along with both Camporeales being options behind the ball.

Gun player, wants us, but to my mind we can’t afford him, unless they want to take next year’s first and McGovern (cue the “feedback”)

 

[BlueJet]

The other thing I would add is "only a half back". Such a furphy these days, at least one quality attacking half back is essential to any team wanting to reach the pointy end of the season. Two would be even better.

This "oh half back, easiest position on the ground" mentality is very outdated.

IMO it comes down to outlay.
We've got Williams, Saad, Kemp, McGovern & Boyd, that ideally play as attacking defenders as is & Docherty has been displaced, we're not short on big ticket hbf. If anything we've already allocated a disproportionate amount of resources to the position.
If it's 2x firsts, I feel we'd be better suited in addressing mid-forward & KPD needs.

 

[CarmenSandiego]

Really don't see the appeal in Houston, unless we got him cheap (which we won't).

Elite ball user off HBF? We have those...

Saad
Newman
McGovern
Boyd

You could even through Docherty & Williams in there when they're at their best and playing that role.

We just don't utilize our current assets enough.

Honestly, just smells like a Vossy having a hard-on for it because he used to coach him at PA.

We desperately need a small forward and key defender, it could not be more clear.

 

[Campoeasy]

I don’t get the no to Houston on here. He’s an A Grader add would add so much to us.

We lack quality foot skills. Champion Data rate him the number 1 kick in the AFL.

100% agree it’s a no brainier. He is exactly the type of player we need.


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Because they all want the flashy big name xfactor player over and over again, not the one who gets to work and is exceptional in a role we seriously lack in.

 

[CarmenSandiego]

It is getting sucked in to a name. It is not what he has done in the past. It is what he does in the future. He is 28. He sucks up cap space for De Konig. In 2 years he is a true veteran. Look at all the skeletons in the closet

Daisy Thomas, Mitch Mcgovern, Zac Williams, Adam Cerra. Only Saad has been a success & justifies a first rounder. Even if we swap pick 11 for a 2nd rounder coming back

We have seen this type of trade as the solution for 20 years. It does not work. Look, how Sydney, Geelong, Hawthorn mainly recruit role players for needs & they don't pay this type of salary or first rounders
Grundy 2nd Rounder and Pick 46
Ollie Henry - pick 25
Jack Bowes - paid to take.

The Elijah Hollands, Acres Deals are the model. Mark my words we get a season or 2 of "a sugar hit" but this is not how to build sustained success. We are heading back to the depths of the ladder, if we are not careful

Yep, seems very Essendon-esque to me.

 

[ITCHY EYEBALLS]

We have elite ball users under no pressure, as soon as pressure arrives our guys revert to panic dump kicks.
I reckon Newman is about the only one who generally maintains his composure.
Weiters and Doc are by far the worst.
I can't see us challenging until we get players who can hit targets under pressure.
Is Houston that player? I wouldn't know, i've barely watched him....although i note most of the Swans players are elite kicks under pressure.

 

[Schoonerman]

If Port lose this weekend and we DO get Houston, he’ll miss the first 3 rounds of next year....

 

[AndyNicka]

If Port lose this weekend and we DO get Houston, he’ll miss the first 3 rounds of next year....

First 2 rounds - Suspended round 23, missed round 24 vs Fremantle, QF vs Geelong and SF vs Hawthorn.

 

[BringFevBack2021]

We have elite ball users under no pressure, as soon as pressure arrives our guys revert to panic dump kicks.
I reckon Newman is about the only one who generally maintains his composure.
Weiters and Doc are by far the worst.
I can't see us challenging until we get players who can hit targets under pressure.
Is Houston that player? I wouldn't know, i've barely watched him....although i note most of the Swans players are elite kicks under pressure.

He is an unbelievable kick under pressure and has an absolutely enormous boot

I think McGovern, Curnow, Moir and Newman are the only players that would get close to him - I don't think any of them could kick it as far

He is also great as the extra mid at the contest

I do worry that having Houston, Farrell and Burton in the same time boosts all three of their output though, as you can't stop them all. Burton is one we had looked at previously but didn't get over the line. We've always needed a dynamic, quick and good user of the ball in the back half.

I do think though, that Bailey Smith would be the far more suitable pickup for us, but don't know that he is a genuine option for us.

 

[myblueroan]

Because they all want the flashy big name xfactor player over and over again, not the one who gets to work and is exceptional in a role we seriously lack in.

Did not realise Houston was a big name.
Now Trac...that,was a big name.

Houston is a big city and also an iconic name due to Apollo 13. But a big name?
Wouldn't have thought so.
Durable, and an excellent kick.
It'salready been said we won't give up pick 11 for him so what's the issue?

I don't want us missing our window and going into rebuild again. Do you? He'd be part of hopefully a full suite of changes that land us comfortably into the finals next year.
Somewhere fro. 6 -1 you'd hope wouldn't you?
Obviously we'd all like to make top 4.

I don't get all the angst.

 

[Blue since 72]

IMO it comes down to outlay.
We've got Williams, Saad, Kemp, McGovern & Boyd, that ideally play as attacking defenders as is & Docherty has been displaced, we're not short on big ticket hbf. If anything we've already allocated a disproportionate amount of resources to the position.
If it's 2x firsts, I feel we'd be better suited in addressing mid-forward & KPD needs.

I'll take out Williams because he's a better small forward than any of our small forwards bar perhaps Owies (re score impact) and should be persisted there especially if Martin is offloaded, Gov and Kemp play tall and Gov is generally last line stuff rather than counter attack while Kemp should be investigated forward more.

If Houston came Boyd would be pushed out and rightly so, for a guy with an elite foot he just doesn't get himself in positions to allow his hoof to impact transition enough. The guy should be delivering into the forward 50 but he's pretty much always fairly deep back and is much more outlet than attack.

That leaves Saad who should stay where he is.

One of this team's biggest issues is transition from defence, we are most often way too slow about it which manifests itself down the ground as a dump kick to H or C with half the opposition team hanging off them.

Agree re outlay, wouldn't want to give up this year's first given the purported strength of the draft but there are other options to make it work.

 

[ctwenty1]

If Port lose this weekend and we DO get Houston, he’ll miss the first 3 rounds of next year....

so we only give them one first rounder, instead of two

 

[Campoeasy]

Did not realise Houston was a big name.
Now Trac...that,was a big name.

Houston is a big city and also an iconic name due to Apollo 13. But a big name?
Wouldn't have thought so.
Durable, and an excellent kick.
It'salready been said we won't give up pick 11 for him so what's the issue?

I don't want us missing our window and going into rebuild again. Do you? He'd be part of hopefully a full suite of changes that land us comfortably into the finals next year.
Somewhere fro. 6 -1 you'd hope wouldn't you?
Obviously we'd all like to make top 4.

I don't get all the angst.

That was kinda my point, he's not a big name. Hence why a lot around here don't want him. They'd rather have the big name than a role filled

 

[Campoeasy]

Did not realise Houston was a big name.
Now Trac...that,was a big name.

Houston is a big city and also an iconic name due to Apollo 13. But a big name?
Wouldn't have thought so.
Durable, and an excellent kick.
It'salready been said we won't give up pick 11 for him so what's the issue?

I don't want us missing our window and going into rebuild again. Do you? He'd be part of hopefully a full suite of changes that land us comfortably into the finals next year.
Somewhere fro. 6 -1 you'd hope wouldn't you?
Obviously we'd all like to make top 4.

I don't get all the angst.

You misunderstood my comment, I'm all for getting him in. He's what we need

 

[myblueroan]

That was kinda my point, he's not a big name. Hence why a lot around here don't want him. They'd rather have the big name than a role filled

Oh I see! I didn't get it because people are saying the opposite..like he's a big name and therefore we shouldn't go for him over developing from draft. At least I think that's what I'm reading from a few. As in don't go for a 'name' player.

 

[myblueroan]

You misunderstood my comment, I'm all for getting him in. He's what we need

Yep yep. With you now. See post above.
I got confused.

 

[BlueJet]

I'll take out Williams because he's a better small forward than any of our small forwards bar perhaps Owies (re score impact) and should be persisted there especially if Martin is offloaded, Gov and Kemp play tall and Gov is generally last line stuff rather than counter attack while Kemp should be investigated forward more.

If Houston came Boyd would be pushed out and rightly so, for a guy with an elite foot he just doesn't get himself in positions to allow his hoof to impact transition enough. The guy should be delivering into the forward 50 but he's pretty much always fairly deep back and is much more outlet than attack.

That leaves Saad who should stay where he is.

One of this team's biggest issues is transition from defence, we are most often way too slow about it which manifests itself down the ground as a dump kick to H or C with half the opposition team hanging off them.

Agree re outlay, wouldn't want to give up this year's first given the purported strength of the draft but there are other options to make it work.

Williams has had limited exposure forward, he's primarily played back both with us & the Giants, perhaps he'll be repurposed full time.
McGovern & Kemp are flankers/pockets - neither should be playing key position so they're in competition for the same position. McGovern is our primary intercept/counter-attack player & Kemp has been forced to play KPD due to the absence of any meaningful alternative, rather than his skillset matching the position. While they're all different, they're all essentially attack first, defend second players.
Houston is better than most if not all of them (thinking Saad) but my point is it's the one area where we've assembled anything approaching a reasonable depth of quality, I'd be looking to address more pressing deficiencies given the Power are reportedly looking for a kings ransom in exchange for him.
Rather than trying to repurpose players, I'd love it if we tried addressing the deficiencies with players that have some form in these positions.