Official Club Stuff Carlton Academy - Next Gen & Father/Son/Daughter Discussion

[PezzDogg95]

In relation to academy/fs/NGA, they can have the best of both worlds and stage the introduction of the changes

For example, if they were to go down the route of different mechanisms being changed ie sliding scale of discount like 20% for first choice, 10% for second, 5% for third, 0% for any further then you could bring that in this year.

If you were changing the points allocation to each pick then I think that needs to wait until 2025

I doubt they are that smart though and goes against their dictatorial DNA


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I think the most logical approach to fixing the system is a combination of amending the points allocated to each pick in accordance with what is typically drafted, and removing the bid discount.

73 picks have points currently which is ludicrous considering recent drafts cap out at 55-65 selections. Perhaps capping points at 54 (3 rounds) or 40 (just above 2 rounds) is the best solution. I'd prefer 54 picks, but with 3rd round heavily tapered back. 4th rounders now have no value, which is reflected in how they're used in practice. This will force fairer value in matching bids (i.e. multiple first and/or seconds needed to match top 10 picks).

The other component is removing the 20% discount to pay full price of points. There is no need for a discount in points - the benefit of nurturing a player through an academy (f/s, northern or NGA) is that you get access to drafting them, and having them play for the club.

The thing that irks me and many others is that GC received a 20% discount on points for 4 players, which made it easier for them to match all bids. Under the above system, they wouldve had to work a hell of a lot harder to get the requisite points to match the picks. I'm not begrudging them taking the players, as Coona noted above it has many many benefits, but teams need to pay up for the players.

With that in mind, NGA talents can be selected anywhere (not just after pick 40), as teams will be paying full price for the player. Might mean that clubs invest in the NGA talent pathway more knowing they can retain access if they develop a star from a multicultural background. This is also good for the expansion of the game in our society.

Changes to come in for the 2025 AFL Draft, but announced prior to 2024 AFL Finals for clubs to gameplan the changes.

It's not that hard AFL House, get it done.

 

[Coops93]

I think the most logical approach to fixing the system is a combination of amending the points allocated to each pick in accordance with what is typically drafted, and removing the bid discount.

73 picks have points currently which is ludicrous considering recent drafts cap out at 55-65 selections. Perhaps capping points at 54 (3 rounds) or 40 (just above 2 rounds) is the best solution. I'd prefer 54 picks, but with 3rd round heavily tapered back. 4th rounders now have no value, which is reflected in how they're used in practice. This will force fairer value in matching bids (i.e. multiple first and/or seconds needed to match top 10 picks).

The other component is removing the 20% discount to pay full price of points. There is no need for a discount in points - the benefit of nurturing a player through an academy (f/s, northern or NGA) is that you get access to drafting them, and having them play for the club.

The thing that irks me and many others is that GC received a 20% discount on points for 4 players, which made it easier for them to match all bids. Under the above system, they wouldve had to work a hell of a lot harder to get the requisite points to match the picks. I'm not begrudging them taking the players, as Coona noted above it has many many benefits, but teams need to pay up for the players.

With that in mind, NGA talents can be selected anywhere (not just after pick 40), as teams will be paying full price for the player. Might mean that clubs invest in the NGA talent pathway more knowing they can retain access if they develop a star from a multicultural background. This is also good for the expansion of the game in our society.

Changes to come in for the 2025 AFL Draft, but announced prior to 2024 AFL Finals for clubs to gameplan the changes.

It's not that hard AFL House, get it done.

I was annoyed that Collingboys were able to get a generational pick 1 at a 20% discount.

They didn't even have to match pick 1 -20% to get him - despite being the clear 1 - due to the other club wanting their actual pick to be pick 1. Just another quirk that favours a f/s - academy picking team.

 

[Juice030103]

Ahhh bout time we had good father sons

(I wasn’t alive for sos)

 

[Stamos]

I think the most logical approach to fixing the system is a combination of amending the points allocated to each pick in accordance with what is typically drafted, and removing the bid discount.

73 picks have points currently which is ludicrous considering recent drafts cap out at 55-65 selections. Perhaps capping points at 54 (3 rounds) or 40 (just above 2 rounds) is the best solution. I'd prefer 54 picks, but with 3rd round heavily tapered back. 4th rounders now have no value, which is reflected in how they're used in practice. This will force fairer value in matching bids (i.e. multiple first and/or seconds needed to match top 10 picks).

The other component is removing the 20% discount to pay full price of points. There is no need for a discount in points - the benefit of nurturing a player through an academy (f/s, northern or NGA) is that you get access to drafting them, and having them play for the club.

The thing that irks me and many others is that GC received a 20% discount on points for 4 players, which made it easier for them to match all bids. Under the above system, they wouldve had to work a hell of a lot harder to get the requisite points to match the picks. I'm not begrudging them taking the players, as Coona noted above it has many many benefits, but teams need to pay up for the players.

With that in mind, NGA talents can be selected anywhere (not just after pick 40), as teams will be paying full price for the player. Might mean that clubs invest in the NGA talent pathway more knowing they can retain access if they develop a star from a multicultural background. This is also good for the expansion of the game in our society.

Changes to come in for the 2025 AFL Draft, but announced prior to 2024 AFL Finals for clubs to gameplan the changes.

It's not that hard AFL House, get it done.

I don't have an issue with a discount, which is necessary to be able to match a bid with the very next pick after a bid. And it incentivises F/S, Academy etc.
As to what the correct amount of discount is, that can only be assessed once the points values/curve is fixed. No new rules make sense until the points are fixed, and if it is done correctly, other restrictions that have been mooted are likely unnecessary.

Perhaps one restriction could be that once a bid is placed on your player, that your very next pick is locked in and cannot be live traded, rather than restrictions on the number of players taken, or the number of picks live-traded for.

 

[BluStreak]

I dont understand how they compare the academies with Father/Sons.
Academies are churning out aprox 10 top tier kids each year and teams only get a F/S every so often.
Silvagni had 3 boys all touted as future stars. Only 1 has made a career out of AFL and is often considered fringe best 22.

 

[Sector 7G]

I was annoyed that Collingboys were able to get a generational pick 1 at a 20% discount.

They didn't even have to match pick 1 -20% to get him - despite being the clear 1 - due to the other club wanting their actual pick to be pick 1. Just another quirk that favours a f/s - academy picking team.

The only pleasing thing is they traded out their first so it wouldn't be used on ND and then finished 2nd bottom and could have take a gun like Callahan as well. The picks they took with those trades have been wasted/unremarkable

 

[Juddrockz]

The Afl would never have changed the whole drafting situation when the Daicos boys were available.
This whole new Afl Makety uppety rules mid season is absolutely absurd!
I hope the CFC along with other clubs that have been planning for this next draft for years,band together and take things further.

 

[Coops93]

Somehow it completely passed me by that Colling came 2nd last, no idea how that happened. It's like that Covid time is a different dimension or something

 

[jj1978]

That surprises me, looks the opposite.

Lovely kid, but I ain't holding out any hope he will be anywhere near AFL material.

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Can already kick 50m drop punts and picks up the ball quite cleanly. Lets see how he looks at 17 when he grows into his body a lot more.

 

[jj1978]

Robbo was very strong in supporting Voss and said no way should we back down and accept this change so soon and said to take this to the AFL commission if that's what it takes.

Has Robbo gone off the grog for a week? This and his latest article calling out the farcical umpiring throughout 2024. See kids, get off the grog and you rescue a few brain cells.

 

[Coops93]

Can already kick 50m drop punts and picks up the ball quite cleanly. Lets see how he looks at 17 when he grows into his body a lot more.

I think he's a very case of that chubby kid that suddenly grows into his body and is buff and athletic out of nowhere.

Sometimes that's just genetics. I went to school with a guy who was exactly this, but the time we were 16/17 he was the strongest and among the fastest in the school at 6'2 despite being short and chubby his whole life until hitting that growth spurt. His younger brother did exactly the same thing at exactly the same age.

Based on the Kouta genetics it looks to me like that could well be the case.

Fwiw the school mates were of Greek heritage. Somethin' bout them Greeks, it would seem.

 

[jj1978]

If both Campo twins get selected in the first round we will need to find two first rounders to match if the alleged changes go ahead.

Got to pick up the phone now to Campo and get one of the boys to add a few less desirable performances for the remainder of the year. To be honest I think other clubs (although depends on SOS's mindset and an outgoing Dodo ) will do the honorable thing this year and not put us in a situation by bidding on both in the same round. Daicos slipped to 4th when he was clearly a top 2 pick and most father and sons get to their destination relatively fairly, so I think clubs have a bit of a gentleman agreement on these matters (and will probably talk behind closed doors if this farce gets pushed in for 2024 to orchestrate how things should unfold this draft fairly).

 

[Coops93]

Just have them get a drink driving charge a couple nights before*. Worked a treat for Charlie.

*may not be best advice...

 

[jj1978]

I think he's a very classic case of that chubby kid that suddenly grows into his body and is buff and athletic out of nowhere.

Sometimes that's just genetics. I went to school with a guy who was exactly this, but the time we were 16/17 he was the strongest and among the fastest in the school at 6'2 despite being short and chubby his whole life until hitting that growth spurt. Then his younger brother did exactly the same thing at exactly the same age.

Based on the Kouta genetics it looks to me like that could well be the case.

Fwiw the school mates were of Greek heritage. Somethin' bout them Greeks, it would seem.

My Mrs is Greek and I went to high school with a lot of Greek kids in year 7 and 8 (Oakleigh high) with a high Greek population for remainder of high school (McKinnon) and they're definitely late bloomers physically. Well fed by their YiaYia's so carry around a bit of baby fat when young but once they hit 16+ and start doing teenage things and becoming more independent they trim down quite quickly and have some serious growth spurts.

My 14 year old still has a bit of chub, but has already shot up well beyond my height already and will no doubt shed the baby fat in a couple of years.

 

[Aphrodite]

‘Shouldn’t be able to do that’: Voss fears sudden AFL draft rule change to ruin Blues’ plans

‘Shouldn’t be able to do that’: Voss fears sudden AFL draft rule change to ruin Blues’ plans

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[Dramoth]

Young Kouta is very, very athletic……
I’m sure however the AFL will make it impossible for us to finally receive what other clubs have.

I've been watching young Kouta. It's going to be interesting to see what interest there will be from the US in terms of basketball. He's turning into a very good player there as well.

It's been interesting watching him grow from a gawky overweight kid to being around 5' 11" at 13 (14 next month). I think that when his growth spurt started, he started getting serious about training. Looking at pictures of Jamie from last year, I reckon he might end up around 198-203cm tall.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

Has Robbo gone off the grog for a week? This and his latest article calling out the farcical umpiring throughout 2024. See kids, get off the grog and you rescue a few brain cells.

He’s clearly come to the conclusion that being in the AFLs bad books is no worse than being in their good books

It’s unusual for Robbo to be this way, wonder what has happened in the background


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[Opium]

I've been watching young Kouta. It's going to be interesting to see what interest there will be from the US in terms of basketball. He's turning into a very good player there as well.

It's been interesting watching him grow from a gawky overweight kid to being around 5' 11" at 13 (14 next month). I think that when his growth spurt started, he started getting serious about training. Looking at pictures of Jamie from last year, I reckon he might end up around 198-203cm tall.

Loves his footy and the mighty blues. Reckon he will seriously commit to try making it in the AFL in the next 12-18 months.

 

[Opium]

He’s clearly come to the conclusion that being in the AFLs bad books is no worse than being in their good books

It’s unusual for Robbo to be this way, wonder what has happened in the background


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Don't think he's a fan of Kane. Absolute shocking start and defending that 50 metre non decision shows how out of depth she is.

 

[teagueyubeauty]

I think he's a very case of that chubby kid that suddenly grows into his body and is buff and athletic out of nowhere.

Sometimes that's just genetics. I went to school with a guy who was exactly this, but the time we were 16/17 he was the strongest and among the fastest in the school at 6'2 despite being short and chubby his whole life until hitting that growth spurt. His younger brother did exactly the same thing at exactly the same age.

Based on the Kouta genetics it looks to me like that could well be the case.

Fwiw the school mates were of Greek heritage. Somethin' bout them Greeks, it would seem.

Yep, have one of those in my sons age group at his footy club
Was a very rotund kid in under 8’s right up until top age U12’s, could barely run because of it but just loved footy. Showed up bottom age u14’s training 5 months later as a unit and a half with his body shape changing dramatically, not with a lot of speed but just taller and very solid build. Top age u14’s this year and probably the third tallest in the team.
Opposition kids jump out of the way because he’s got white line fever and will go harder than anyone else.

Not Greek, but He’s of Italian heritage. Still waiting for my skip/anglo Saxon son to have his growth spurt, one of the smallest nowadays



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[FlowersByIrene]

Sooo….. are we in danger of not drafting the Campo twins and Cody Walker?

Doubt we're in danger. We would probably just need to trade back in a 3rd round pick or two into this draft from next year. Then we would need to prep for Cody the same in 2026 (potentially with 27 picks). But it would impact our draft picks as a whole and it would fk us because last year we traded a 3rd for three 4ths which we wouldn't have done otherwise.

 

[jj1978]

He’s clearly come to the conclusion that being in the AFLs bad books is no worse than being in their good books

It’s unusual for Robbo to be this way, wonder what has happened in the background


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Push for Ralphy to become Chief Football Writer.

 

[jj1978]

Yep, have one of those in my sons age group at his footy club
Was a very rotund kid in under 8’s right up until top age U12’s, could barely run because of it but just loved footy. Showed up bottom age u14’s training 5 months later as a unit and a half with his body shape changing dramatically, not with a lot of speed but just taller and very solid build. Top age u14’s this year and probably the third tallest in the team.
Opposition kids jump out of the way because he’s got white line fever and will go harder than anyone else.

Not Greek, but He’s of Italian heritage. Still waiting for my skip/anglo Saxon son to have his growth spurt, one of the smallest nowadays



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I was helping PT one of my wifes greek sons who loved his footy as a kid and had quite the appetite (8yo eating 2 big macs kinda appetite) when I gave him pointers at 15 to help get his cardio up he become a tank and top player at his junior club and could've got drafted but didn't want to push himself that bit more to take him to that level thus enjoyed a few years of playing in suburban seniors and studying.

Genes play a big part even from my side chubby kid, hit 18 weight fell off, growth spurt and still a healthy weight (still keep relatively fit) well into my 40s. So definitely Koutas son will come of age in the coming time. Like Campo's boys will always be a bit lanky from their dad's side. And of course AW's boy will have a hat.

 

[ctwenty1]

I was helping PT one of my wifes greek sons who loved his footy as a kid and had quite the appetite (8yo eating 2 big macs kinda appetite) when I gave him pointers at 15 to help get his cardio up he become a tank and top player at his junior club and could've got drafted but didn't want to push himself that bit more to take him to that level thus enjoyed a few years of playing in suburban seniors and studying.

Genes play a big part even from my side chubby kid, hit 18 weight fell off, growth spurt and still a healthy weight (still keep relatively fit) well into my 40s. So definitely Koutas son will come of age in the coming time. Like Campo's boys will always be a bit lanky from their dad's side. And of course AW's boy will have a hat.

Cody will have several hats, like his dad.

 

[Pinnell]

I've been watching young Kouta. It's going to be interesting to see what interest there will be from the US in terms of basketball. He's turning into a very good player there as well.

It's been interesting watching him grow from a gawky overweight kid to being around 5' 11" at 13 (14 next month). I think that when his growth spurt started, he started getting serious about training. Looking at pictures of Jamie from last year, I reckon he might end up around 198-203cm tall.

Admittedly Lukas is a bottom ager, but he is averaging 2 points a game (from 18 games) in rep basketball this season. Not sure the US will be showing too much interest. Fingers crossed for his footy.