Strategy Changes & Pre-match Discussion - Round 15 vs. Adelaide, MCG Sun 25/06, 1:10pm

[Jen2310]

Why do you think Howe will be back for the Adelaide or GC game?

Fly did indicate he would be pretty close to around then. But I wouldn't discount him coming back via VFL

 

[BEEG]

Moore, Frampton and Murphy down back do we consider playing Howe as a defensive forward?

 

[Jen2310]

Moore, Frampton and Murphy down back do we consider playing Howe as a defensive forward?

So far from what I've seen, hasn't had a change of position as yet.

 

[gouki88]

Elliott and one of Krueger / McStay to come in. McInnes & probably Markov out, with the sub to be either Harrison or WHE depending on what we want.

Cameron has to pull his finger out big time. Been shocking since coming back

 

[Bianconeri]

Moore, Frampton and Murphy down back do we consider playing Howe as a defensive forward?

I think the absolute last thing our forward line needs is another undersized key forward.

 

[#23 Hill]

Fly did indicate he would be pretty close to around then. But I wouldn't discount him coming back via VFL

Wow. Last time I checked they were saying rounds 15-17.

 

[Harry O]

I would be trialling Nick Daicos on the wing while Sidey is out. WHE just goes missing too often to be given that role

 

[Anzacday]

I love what Ruscoe brings personally and would like see him get more opportunities unlikely now with Howe almost back.

Whilst I’m not an avid watcher, he seems to lack intensity for mine.

 

[pz5151]

Seems a pretty clear and like for like to have Harrison out for Elliott and McInnes in for McStay. I like Markov as the sub as he brings leg speed but can also cover a defender going down in an emergency. If a forward or ruck goes down Frampton can go forward and they can slide Markov down back and shift the others around to cover whoever is most appropriate.

Harrison looks like he’s got some potential but definitely isn’t ahead of Hill, McCreery and Elliott. Pies need that extra pressure on the defenders at ground level which they’ve lost without Elliott.

McStay didn’t set the world on fire but they need a tall target who can mark or bring the ball to ground for Hill and the boys to crumb from.

 

[Scodog10]

Agreed that the scoreline doesn't tell the whole story.

We got done everywhere but the scoreboard, however no forward had a good game (other than Harrison).

Checkers was just as quiet as AJ so it might be unfair to lay it one and not the other.

Dirty day for most concerned really.

I'm glad McStay and Elliot are in the wings ready to be deployed, with JDG and Sidey to join soon thereafter. The latter 2 were especially missed.

Was Mihocek opposed to May? From what I’ve read some of the frustration toward AJ was due to the dropped marks?

Processing it all is tough because there’s the dominance of the Dees in general play, player unavailability, perhaps a general malaise after being up for so long and then there’s the cumulative effect of the number of guys that had injury or illness questions hanging over them heading in (my count was at least 7). You’d love to give a mulligan to some of the fringe types, but spots are just too tight…

The one element that is troubling me is whether the result says more for our ability to defend or inability to score. I had thought we’d turned a corner on scoring, but the contest dominance and defensive ability of their back 7 would have made it tough.

 

[sr36]

The one element that is troubling me is whether the result says more for our ability to defend or inability to score. I had thought we’d turned a corner on scoring, but the contest dominance and defensive ability of their back 7 would have made it tough.

In terms of scoring, if the handball chains work, we're straight over the top of their defensive wall. But we kept stuffing up the chains. It was very like the Brisbane loss. Our handballing was really sloppy.

 

[Scodog10]

In terms of scoring, if the handball chains work, we're straight over the top of their defensive wall. But we kept stuffing up the chains. It was very like the Brisbane loss. Our handballing was really sloppy.

What about exiting D50 by foot? Gawn got votes in the AFLCA so I’m assuming he clunked a few.

The Crows game was another I missed, but the sense I got was we just couldn’t get ground position because their talls were dominant. I felt the same v Brisbane where we were camped in our D50 which lead to a bunch of repeat entries and repeat contests where they surged it forward.

The loss of both Steele and JDG has a compounding effect on us so as we stand eking out a couple of wins v Adelaide and GC would shock me because I have concerns. Despite the reinforcements in Elliott and McStay.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

We were beaten by a better side. He copped a fair corkie week before , both factual!

So what? He was selected to play so was fit to take the field. No excuse.

 

[jathanas]

Was Mihocek opposed to May? From what I’ve read some of the frustration toward AJ was due to the dropped marks?

Processing it all is tough because there’s the dominance of the Dees in general play, player unavailability, perhaps a general malaise after being up for so long and then there’s the cumulative effect of the number of guys that had injury or illness questions hanging over them heading in (my count was at least 7). You’d love to give a mulligan to some of the fringe types, but spots are just too tight…

The one element that is troubling me is whether the result says more for our ability to defend or inability to score. I had thought we’d turned a corner on scoring, but the contest dominance and defensive ability of their back 7 would have made it tough.

May had Checkers and he usually keeps him quiet.

Full respect to Melbourne for tightening the bolts to the point where we were rendered ineffective for most of the game but I'm treating the way we played this game as an outlier.

Electrifying as per our usual standard for the first 10 minutes then just fizzed.

If we delivered that with a healthy list and JDG playing, I'd be more concerned.

 

[OniAu]

So what? He was selected to play so was fit to take the field. No excuse.

Just pointing it out. Probably a good thing to learn now also , needs a week off with an impact injury like that. I wouldnt be picking him come finals with any previous injuries in games.

Good info moving ahead.

All that being said also

Fly is all over it . With the sub move. Probably even with the glowing praise of Beau who was on crutches 6 days prior.

 

[stormskye]

May had Checkers and he usually keeps him quiet.

Full respect to Melbourne for tightening the bolts to the point where we were rendered ineffective for most of the game but I'm treating the way we played this game as an outlier.

Electrifying as per our usual standard for the first 10 minutes then just fizzed.

If we delivered that with a healthy list and JDG playing, I'd be more concerned.

I’d go one further mate. If we delivered that with a full healthy list two weeks in a row I’d be concerned. All the top teams have had bad days, full list or not. It’s a bloody long season, no team is going to win every game. As supporters our expectations become far too inflated.

 

[Pistol Night]

I’d go one further mate. If we delivered that with a full healthy list two weeks in a row I’d be concerned. All the top teams have had bad days, full list or not. It’s a bloody long season, no team is going to win every game. As supporters our expectations become far too inflated.

If we were told at the start of the year we’d be top of the ladder at 11-2 at the bye I think we’d take it. No team goes undefeated

 

[OniAu]

If we were told at the start of the year we’d be top of the ladder at 11-2 at the bye I think we’d take it. No team goes undefeated

Absolutely. Didnt some "respected" people in the media . ( i use the term respected loosely) have us as 1-5 etc etc

Lions and Dees both outplayed us. Both games had that stifiling slow play and possession ball against us, so we couldnt make it chaotic and fast. Lot to take out of both losses.

We were literally being pinned in our D50 in both games and unable to run it out

 

[sr36]

What about exiting D50 by foot? Gawn got votes in the AFLCA so I’m assuming he clunked a few.

The Crows game was another I missed, but the sense I got was we just couldn’t get ground position because their talls were dominant. I felt the same v Brisbane where we were camped in our D50 which lead to a bunch of repeat entries and repeat contests where they surged it forward.

The loss of both Steele and JDG has a compounding effect on us so as we stand eking out a couple of wins v Adelaide and GC would shock me because I have concerns. Despite the reinforcements in Elliott and McStay.

May beat Mihocek comfortably and Gawn was very good. They had a defensive wall that we couldn't pass - often seemed to have a +1 down the line as well. I just watched on telly, so no idea how they did it or whether this was true, but it appeared like they matched our numbers around the ball, but also had a +1 down the line.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

I’m personally not a fan of Frampton in the backline and Markov as the sub.

I think we are too tall and too slow in the backline. I think our defence plays better when we are on the “edge” rather than when we are slow and heavy.

Everyone in the gameday thread was mad at our forwards for not leading at the ball. I think this is where we missed Elliot & Ginni - who tend to lead at the kicker. AJ is the same, but couldn’t hold onto marks.

Out: AJ, Cameron, Harvey
In: Elliot, McStay

Sub: WHE

I’d play Frampton as the ruck and Cox as the KPF. I love AJ, but he goes missing too much at the moment. Harvey very unlucky, but we just need forwards to lead at the football.

 

[sr36]

I’m personally not a fan of Frampton in the backline and Markov as the sub.

I think we are too tall and too slow in the backline. I think our defence plays better when we are on the “edge” rather than when we are slow and heavy.

Everyone in the gameday thread was mad at our forwards for not leading at the ball. I think this is where we missed Elliot & Ginni - who tend to lead at the kicker. AJ is the same, but couldn’t hold onto marks.

Out: AJ, Cameron, Harvey
In: Elliot, McStay

Sub: WHE

I’d play Frampton as the ruck and Cox as the KPF. I love AJ, but he goes missing too much at the moment. Harvey very unlucky, but we just need forwards to lead at the football.

Agree with you, but you need another in - I think. I get a bit confused with the sub.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

May beat Mihocek comfortably and Gawn was very good. They had a defensive wall that we couldn't pass - often seemed to have a +1 down the line as well. I just watched on telly, so no idea how they did it or whether this was true, but it appeared like they matched our numbers around the ball, but also had a +1 down the line.

Mihochek was simply outclassed and outsized. When he is forced to play CHF he looks undersized and overwhelmed and May made him look to be the VFL player he was. Whether or not McStay will ever be a strong CHF himself is unlikely, but his services are required there simply to allow Mihochek and Johnson to play against smaller opponents.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

In terms of scoring, if the handball chains work, we're straight over the top of their defensive wall. But we kept stuffing up the chains. It was very like the Brisbane loss. Our handballing was really sloppy.

Interesting to hear you say that.

I thought against Brisbane they interrupted our handball chains by getting amongst them and spoiling or intercepting them. We also struggled to find an outlet by foot as we lacked tall personnel (Cox, Cameron both out).

Against Melbourne we seemed to stuff up out own handball chains due to inconsistent overlap run. No De Goey running past, no Sidey ahead of the ball, and even McCreery who normally gets the ball and bolts was stopping and waiting for players to run past, perhaps a sign of that ankle limiting him. By foot, even with a near-full list of talls to choose from, we couldn’t buy a mark on half-back to wing. Gawn shut us down completely and we were getting outmarked by the likes of bloody Rivers!

 

[stormskye]

I’m personally not a fan of Frampton in the backline and Markov as the sub.

I think we are too tall and too slow in the backline. I think our defence plays better when we are on the “edge” rather than when we are slow and heavy.

Everyone in the gameday thread was mad at our forwards for not leading at the ball. I think this is where we missed Elliot & Ginni - who tend to lead at the kicker. AJ is the same, but couldn’t hold onto marks.

Out: AJ, Cameron, Harvey
In: Elliot, McStay

Sub: WHE

I’d play Frampton as the ruck and Cox as the KPF. I love AJ, but he goes missing too much at the moment. Harvey very unlucky, but we just need forwards to lead at the football.

I’m not opposed to this. Both frampton and mcstay offer good coverage for us. If Moore was to cop something frampton could go back. Cox full time ruck and mcstay pinch hit. Or even mcstay has played defence. It’s def something to think about

 

[sr36]

Interesting to hear you say that.

I thought against Brisbane they interrupted our handball chains by getting amongst them and spoiling or intercepting them. We also struggled to find an outlet by foot as we lacked tall personnel (Cox, Cameron both out).

Against Melbourne we seemed to stuff up out own handball chains due to inconsistent overlap run. No De Goey running past, no Sidey ahead of the ball, and even McCreery who normally gets the ball and bolts was stopping and waiting for players to run past, perhaps a sign of that ankle limiting him. By foot, even with a near-full list of talls to choose from, we couldn’t buy a mark on half-back to wing. Gawn shut us down completely and we were getting outmarked by the likes of bloody Rivers!

Good points. Im not concerned about this match. I think we were sloppy and missing a couple of key runners - otherwise our handball chains would have cut through them and got straight past their wall.

The Brissy loss however caused a bit of a rethink. We were trying those handball chains through the guts from defensive 50, which worked the first few weeks, but we've since put away.