List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade and FA

[stormskye]

Not sure why the interest here. You are aware of his personal issues are you not…? I think st kilda were happy to run down his contract and supportively say thanks, and best of luck…

It’s more said in jest city. But I still like his aerial game. I’d take him for the lack of cost but with our lack of list spots nothings happening

 

[cfc19902010]

Imagine if he tidied that stat up then?
You get points for identifying one stat he could be better on but he still did just fine everywhere else.
I think he’ll do even better next season.

When your a small forward

A big part of your job is to kick and handball well and efficiently and make the most of your opportunities which he doesn’t do yet

 

[Pleasedontfail11]

I’m no draft expert. But simply saying our first next year should net us 12 this year is far to simplistic.
This year’s draft is reported as very deep. Next year by all reports is not as strong, and seems even more full of academy players. So to simply say for example pick 10-12 next year is the same as pick 12 this year makes no sense. If the top 20 this year is the equivalent of top 10 next year then the pick value is diff. None of us have scouting notes in every kid this year or next. The clubs do. So they know the values of the picks more than anyone here. They will know what quality they could potentially get in pick ranges. That’s their job.

Second to this, it’s already clear Gold Coast has multiple suitors wanting pick 12. It’s a bidding war. In an auction, you are going to pay more.

I don’t know the value. But it’s not a straight swap.

That's why you insist that Noble is part of the trade. We get first shot at getting that pick.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Pendles and Mitchell at the end… but agree there’s enough there for next year… look at another mid in 12 months time

Now time to find the Murphy replacement we need to stabilise things down back… but not much quality left in the out of contract market

Best hope is a quality contracted defender suddenly nominates the pies

Otherwise.,, with Moore down on form, Howe ageing and Dean and Frampton average…holding oppositions forwards could become an Achilles heel for the pies next year…

Moore was back to his best in the final month of the season. It just wasn't widely acknowledged because we were out of finals contention

I'm still willing to give Dean one more season to show something

Otherwise Eyre needs a chance to show what he can do

 

[brockbruiser]

There appears to be a complete misunderstanding on this board about what it takes to get free agents in the door.

Yes, comparatively you are paying for free agents more than their market value, but the trade off is you aren't using a pick. The above market payments is exactly that cost. Good projections will show that the $850k for instance over 6 years falls in line with an average payment and if we have spotted talent effectively he will reach that potential.

Our biggest issue at the moment is not being able to get players in due to lack of picks. We have the cap space which will only free up further next year with retirements.

If we win the premiership next year you won't be coming back here complaining about slightly over paying for perryman.

 

[Bramax]

When your a small forward

A big part of your job is to kick and handball well and efficiently and make the most of your opportunities which he doesn’t do yet

Nothing wrong with wanting improvement mate but you be being a bit harsh.
His disposal efficiency is better than other small forwards such as Toby Greene, Tyson Stengle, Charlie Cameron, Tom Papley and Dan Butler.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

 

[FromTheBoundaryLine]

Why is it that we’re always the gentleman?
I don’t see Geelong or Hawthorn doing these sorts of deals.

I was suggesting both sides being gentlemen. Not just us. Maybe I’m undervaluing Noble but if the conditions I suggested come to fruition I don’t think we’ll play hardball and will try and facilitate a trade that satisfies both parties. Admittedly part of my thinking is that JFN is a quality person seeking a move and the club probably feels the same way and will seek a fair deal. Not suggesting we accept unders.

 

[Exambolor]

If other clubs are interested this could throw a spanner in the works should he decide to leave

 

[satanshoof101]

I’m no draft expert. But simply saying our first next year should net us 12 this year is far to simplistic.
This year’s draft is reported as very deep. Next year by all reports is not as strong, and seems even more full of academy players. So to simply say for example pick 10-12 next year is the same as pick 12 this year makes no sense. If the top 20 this year is the equivalent of top 10 next year then the pick value is diff. None of us have scouting notes in every kid this year or next. The clubs do. So they know the values of the picks more than anyone here. They will know what quality they could potentially get in pick ranges. That’s their job.

Second to this, it’s already clear Gold Coast has multiple suitors wanting pick 12. It’s a bidding war. In an auction, you are going to pay more.

I don’t know the value. But it’s not a straight swap.

Dialogue around future draft strength changes all the time. Whenever its midfield heavy a year out there are always KPP and whenever its a KPP heavy draft there are gun mids. For the most part most teams want to be in the top 30 of every draft. I agree that Noble + F1 should really be pick 12 + 26 but it is a hot pick.

One thing I get worried about is if we have another injury interrupted year and we finish 14-10 and it is pick 6-10, while McGuane is looking like a first round pick maybe there is a chance a bid does not come before those picks. I am sure it won't happen and we will contend next year but worth considering.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Surprise surprise..Joe Richards hasn't revealed his inner most thoughts to a bunch of blokes he's never met.

They have no clue what Joe's thinking..why would they?

 

[cfc19902010]

Nothing wrong with wanting improvement mate but you be being a bit harsh.
His disposal efficiency is better than other small forwards such as Toby Greene, Tyson Stengle, Charlie Cameron, Tom Papley and Dan Butler.

Stats don’t lie
I hope he improves
His tacking and pressure are elite

 

[WakeUpPies]

I can’t believe we’re still talking about the Schultz trade. Yes in hindsight we overpayed. The club took a risk and topped up thinking we’d be challenging for a flag again this season. Which we would have if we didn’t have to field 1/2 a VFL team for the majority of the season. And we STILL manage to beat the premiers twice and only missed finals on % in one of the most even seasons in history.

The trade could have gone either way to be honest. Shit happens. Freo will draft a dud anyways. Was 100% worth the roll of the dice for more flags given most our stars will be retiring within 2 years.

 

[thommo_legend]

 

[manicpie]

I can’t believe we’re still talking about the Schultz trade. Yes in hindsight we overpayed. The club took a risk and topped up thinking we’d be challenging for a flag again this season. Which we would have if we didn’t have to field 1/2 a VFL team for the majority of the season. And we STILL manage to beat the premiers twice and only missed finals on % in one of the most even seasons in history.

The trade could have gone either way to be honest. Shit happens. Freo will draft a dud anyways. Was 100% worth the roll of the dice for more flags given most our stars will be retiring within 2 years.

I struggle to understand how freos first pick is already better than Schultz. He could be a complete spud that we'd be waiting 3 years until he becomes a regular contributor

 

[VinnieB]

I wonder what Perryman would have cost in a trade?
Probably much more than Peatling given he is in the GWS leadership group and they offered him 6 years, as opposed to upping their offer to 4 years for Peatling.

 

[VinnieB]

I struggle to understand how freos first pick is already better than Schultz. He could be a complete spud that we'd be waiting 3 years until he becomes a regular contributor

I expect that pick to deliver Freo a Denver Grainger-Barass type success

 

[WakeUpPies]

I struggle to understand how freos first pick is already better than Schultz. He could be a complete spud that we'd be waiting 3 years until he becomes a regular contributor

Exactly, our list and recent draft history is full of 1st & 2nd round draft busts yet somehow this next 18 year old kid we’re missing out on is guaranteed to be a 200+ gamer?

 

[Exambolor]

Wait what? An hour ago Cal Twomey said we weren’t in the running

 

[Matt_352]

Mixed messages haha. An off season of Perryman, Peatling, a cheap full back and keep Richards and get a couple of teens picks to take to the draft would be a hell of an off season imo

 

[Tadpole]

Wait what? An hour ago Cal Twomey said we weren’t in the running

I'm getting whiplash from people changing their minds so frequently.

 

[Scodog10]

You got the ‘love’ for rejection of humility

Nah **** that it’s only the peasants that take that path! Could you imagine Sidey having a footy debate and getting down to that level?

 

[Ugene41]

Exactly, our list and recent draft history is full of 1st & 2nd round draft busts yet somehow this next 18 year old kid we’re missing out on is guaranteed to be a 200+ gamer?

No one is saying the pick needed to be taken on an 18 year old kid though. It could've been used in a trade for Houston. Even Petracca could be in the frame if we have pick 10 plus F1 plus Pick 20 from Noble available to offer to Melbourne.

 

[Scodog10]

I’d argue that you don’t come 3rd in the best and fairest of a star studded GWS team without at least being a very good player…

2022 the year they finished bottom 3, yeah? I mean Greenwood had a top 3 B&F result in the year we recruited him, but he was never higher than an 11-20 list fit

 

[sr36]

It’s a novel way of looking at it, but players minds aren’t won over by trade currency it’s money that matters to them. Ergo the main currency in footy is cap space because it’s what shifts the mindset of the games biggest commodity.

I’m less convinced on the bolded. Neither Brisbane or Sydney is flooding the market with cap space to strengthen underneath. Geelong is doing it to strengthen their top end and GWS are having their hand forced in valuing picks because they’re being raided.

We're shopping top end as well, but that costs salary cap and picks. Houston would probably be a done deal if we had both.

Obviously Port and us would like to add to our depth through adding to the top end, but that requires you persuading someone to be willing to come with salary cap and the other advantages your club has and then also being able to have the trade currency to get the deal done. And for both of us if you can't get those top end guys the next best alternative is adding second tier players

You can already trade picks for salary cap or vice versa to an extent, but when that comes in fully. It really will be just two different currency with different clubs valuing it differently depending on where their list is at.

With the clubs you've mentioned, my view is that:

Port and us need more quality runners throughout our 22 and thus we're willing to pay for it. They also need small forwards.

Geelong need top end kids, thus they're interested in a couple of high risk ones and would be willing to pay more for them.

Sydney need talls, but without knowing about their contracts, it's likely that they need to save salary cap for big pay rises to guys like Warner, Gulden, Blakey and Heeney.

Brisbane don't really need much at all, so probably won't be willing to pay a lot for anything and probably won't do much at all.

GC need matching points for the future and immediate players and have seemingly identified running defenders as their big need and hopefully will be willing to pay overs for both of the guys they've got to nominate them. But they'll also be looking to park some of their current pick value into next year.