List Mgmt. Collingwood Trade and FA

[JuniorB]

They may upgrade 2 given their picks are in the 70's after pick 33

A 33 year old "rookie".

 

[35Daicos]

Once again, this point is not something addressed in the CBA. It is a matter for the clubs and the AFL, not the players.

From the Rules

10.12 Payments to Rookie Players Outside Total Player Payments

(a) Category A Rookies
Any amount paid by a Club to a Player listed on its Category A Rookie List in excess of the base payment payable to a first year 41+ choice selection shall be included as Football Payments for the purposes of calculating the Club’s Total Player Payments.

(b) Category B Rookies
Subject to Rule 11, all payments made by a Club to a Player listed on its Rookie List are excluded as Football Payments for the purposes of calculating a Club’s Total Player Payments.

New versions of the AFL Rules and AFL Regulations documents were released in February this year: https://www.afl.com.au/policies
From AFL Rules:

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Agree. Just change the name from rookie to something else.

Its the faux controversy of the week .

 

[Apex36]

It wasn't mentioned on bf only.

Where? Give me something legitimate, not just fans on forums making up theories about him suffering because of the nasty words.

And not all those targetted by online abuse, including racial abuse want to bring it up publicly or be spokespeople for such abuse. It doesn't mean it didn't happen because he didn't speak publicly about it.

AJ simply chose to delete his social media accounts. How much it affected him personally, none of us can judge, imo.

Yeah ok, but at the end of the day nobody actually knows whether he’s been affected by this to the extent that people are claiming, or whether he just thought, “**** it, I’m over the cretins on socials, gonna delete my accounts so I don’t have to deal with them anymore”.

You can call me insensitive or try to tell me I don’t understand how mental health affects people if you want, (I do I’ve been there fwiw) I don’t really care. Fact is that he could well have been well beyond those incidents months and months ago.

 

[Apex36]

You seem to be taking it personally.

You seem to be completely missing the point.

Johnson hasn't made any excuse, he might just have reached his ceiling. Why frame that as a failure?
He was a speculative mature pick, cost nothing. Maybe he has worked hard. Or maybe he doesn't really want to play at AFL level - which is fine, he doesn't owe that to anyone.

^This is the point you actually missed. My issue isn’t AJ, my issue is the people lining up to make excuses for him based on undocumented mental health issues that AJ himself hasn’t spoken of.

If he were short, slow or injury prone you wouldn't blame him for not making it. He shouldn't cop it for not having the competitiveness of Selwood.

Plenty of people here don't reach their "maximum potential" but are still "productive members of society".

100% you seem to be furiously agreeing with me for the most part.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Just bring him home

 

[Apex36]

Apex, please leave this alone.
Enough, already.

To clarify, I’m not having a go at AJ here. The reasons for his decline could be numerous. I take exception to the people on here preaching about his mental health struggles when they actually have no knowledge of if he even has them.

I know if I was in his shoes and in the middle of a form slump I’d be annoyed if people were preaching on forums about the state of my mental health which is nobody’s business but my own.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Where? Give me something legitimate, not just fans on forums making up theories about him suffering because of the nasty words.

Yeah ok, but at the end of the day nobody actually knows whether he’s been affected by this to the extent that people are claiming, or whether he just thought, “**** it, I’m over the cretins on socials, gonna delete my accounts so I don’t have to deal with them anymore”.

You can call me insensitive or try to tell me I don’t understand how mental health affects people if you want, (I do I’ve been there fwiw) I don’t really care. Fact is that he could well have been well beyond those incidents months and months ago.

He did receive a lot of abuse online. I don't follow twitter nor do I have copies of what he received via direct messages

Others on social media saw the messages directed at him which were public.

He chose to delete his social media accounts.

He also chose not to make a big deal out of it publicly. Fwiw, I have spoken to a close friend of his online, and I know from them that he was receiving lots of online abuse. They never used it as any excuse for anything, he simply chose to disengage from social media.

Who knows whether it is still affecting him? He could very well have moved on from it, or whether it has/had anything to do with his on field performances. He's never used that as an excuse. Others have just simply tried to show a bit of empathy.

Not sure why you keep bringing it up.

 

[Hardas]

To clarify, I’m not having a go at AJ here. The reasons for his decline could be numerous. I take exception to the people on here preaching about his mental health struggles when they actually have no knowledge of if he even has them.

I know if I was in his shoes and in the middle of a form slump I’d be annoyed if people were preaching on forums about the state of my mental health which is nobody’s business but my own.

Fine, mate.
I'm not having a go at you, and I don't plan to add anything on any aspect of it.
Can you let it go now, please?

 

[Apex36]

He did receive a lot of abuse online. I don't follow twitter nor do I have copies of what he received via direct messages Others on social media saw the messages directed at him which were public.

He chose to delete his social media accounts.

He also chose not to make a big deal out of it publicly. Fwiw, I have spoken to a close friend of his online, and I know from them that he was receiving lots of online abuse. They never used it as any excuse for anything, he simply chose to disengage from social media.

Who knows whether it is still affecting him? He could very well have moved on from it, or whether it has anything to do his with his on field performances. He's never used that as an excuse. Others have just simply tried to show a bit of empathy.

Not sure why you keep bringing it up.

I’m not the one bringing it up, I’ve just finally dared to question the people claiming he’s been suffering mental health issues from this abuse. I’m well aware of the abuse he undeservingly copped and I’m certainly not condoning it.
I just take exception to randoms on the internet making unsubstantiated claims about the mans state of mind as a way to excuse his poor on field performances. That shit is nobody’s business but AJ’s unless he makes the choice to be public with it.

 

[Apex36]

Fine, mate.
I'm not having a go at you, and I don't plan to add anything on any aspect of it.
Can you let it go now, please?

I’ll respond to any post as I see fit on a public forum, within forum rules.

 

[partypie]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If the AFL's intent is to allow clubs an opportunity to assess fringe junior, state league, or recently delisted / younger ex-AFL prospects an (initial) one year trial to see if they are worth keeping on for longer, then it might be easier to just put a flat games cap on "over-age" rookie list additions.

They're already going down that path sort of with the (10 game?) limit for (post-) third year rookie extensions, so it's not a huge leap to just put an (AFL) games played number on it, maybe something around 20 (AFL) games just to throw a number at it?

That would cover the more "mature" prospects who have developed further at state league level after not managing to get a look in via the draft when they were eligible coming out of U18 footy, as well as those who couldn't make it stick in their first crack at AFL level (if they were drafted).

Clubs probably wouldn't like it, but in the end they'd adjust and we'd see more with 38 + 4 lists (with 4 genuine rookies), as opposed to having clubs that stash one or more older / late career players on the rookie list in the name of "list management".

 

[JLC]

Its the faux controversy of the week .

If it was Geelong it would be known as great list management.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

I’m not the one bringing it up, I’ve just finally dared to question the people claiming he’s been suffering mental health issues from this abuse. I’m well aware of the abuse he undeservingly copped and I’m certainly not condoning it.
I just take exception to randoms on the internet making unsubstantiated claims about the mans state of mind as a way to excuse his poor on field performances. That shit is nobody’s business but AJ’s unless he makes the choice to be public with it.

Agree. It is no one else's business to judge the effect of the abuse.

Just as some may be assuming the online abuse he received at the beginning of the 2024 season has or did affect his on field performance, there are others suggesting it shouldn't have.

There's nothing wrong with expressing empathy for those who are the target of online abuse.

This is simply a footy forum where it was discussed.

He's never used it as an excuse.

 

[Hardas]

I’ll respond to any post as I see fit on a public forum, within forum rules.

Okay, then. Be that way. Bye.

 

[Apex36]

He's never used it as an excuse.

Exactly. And neither should anyone else on his behalf.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Exactly. And neither should anyone else on his behalf.

It's called empathy.

 

[celestial]

Just bring him home

We are never going to get petracca, unless we trade someone like de goey first.

Think after next year, probably wont see collingwood trading future firsts for some time.

 

[Gone Critical]

The last time you educated me it was to reinforce the lesson to never expect much from family.

Makes me a successful teacher

 

[Apex36]

It's called empathy.

You can be empathetic to someone’s experiences without using those experiences to make assumptions about them.

Making excuses for him based on his bad experiences that may or may not be affecting him is not empathy.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

You can be empathetic to someone’s experiences without using those experiences to make assumptions about them.

Making excuses for him based on his bad experiences that may or may not be affecting him is not empathy.

You say 'excuses', others suggested 'reasons'.

Let's leave it, hey? I think we can all agree there is no reason to abuse people online for a poor football performance.

 

[sr36]

I think the days of telling a player to effectively “get over it”, is remnant of a bygone era.
Mental health issues are now far more prevalent than that time, and need a far more nuanced approach.

"Drink a cup of cement and harden the **** up."

Ultimately it didn't work as a counselling message. There's obviously the potential to over correct. Perhaps we have. But either way, the original message wasn't the right answer.

 

[Apex36]

You say 'excuses', others suggested 'reasons'.

Let's leave it, hey? I think we can all agree there is no reason to abuse people online for a poor football performance.

The definition of excuse:

a reason or explanation given to justify a fault or offence

You’re dressing up the same thing and pretending it’s different.

You’re right about one thing, we should leave it here.

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

The definition of excuse:


You’re dressing up the same thing and pretending it’s different.

You’re right about one thing, we should leave it here.

Alternatively...

Yes, there is a difference between a reason and an excuse:

Reason
A logical explanation or justification for an action or event. It's a stimulus that causes something to happen, and it's a way to help others understand what happened.

Excuse
A pretense or subterfuge that's used to deflect blame or justify bad behavior. It's often an attempt to avoid or remove censure.

 

[Brad Goodman]

But you're pretty macho. We can't expect everyone to be as tough as you.

One can but dream of reaching that level of keyboard warrior