List Mgmt. Contract, Trade and Draft Discussions - 2024 Edition

[Keys]

The Contracts Thread

Current contract status (Updated 26/6/24) : Total 45 Players - Main List (37) Rookie List (6) Cat B (2) Contracted to 2027 (3) : Tom Barrass (8/10/95) - Signed a 5 year extension (2023-27) on an existing contract due to expire 2022 in December 2021 Reuben Ginbey (10/9/04) - Signed a 3 year...

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[Woutizmoo]

If busslinger is a project KPD I don't get why bulldogs want want to get rid of him even for a 2nd rounder. Barras was saying KPDs don't really come on until they are 25 - I get bulldogs haven't played him yet but something tells me they aren't so ready to offload him

 

[Obeanie1]

Then suggest WC trial Maric off half back. Tall enough and an elite ball user.

This is in no way belittling Busslinger - but the kid has not played 1 AFL match and many on here are betting the farm on him solving a lot of our woes.

Betting the farm on Busslinger?

How is a 2nd rounder betting the farm?

 

[HoneyBadger35]

Listening to Sam Landberger talking about Logan McDonald as though he isn’t a real West Aussie because he’s not from Perth. They are so ignorant.

Makes sense to me. Now to look up how close to Melbourne CBD Harley Reid grew up…

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Makes sense to me. Now to look up how close to Melbourne CBD Harley Reid grew up…

I know he’s originally from up around Dongara way, but based on his Wikipedia profile McDonald seems to have spent a lot more of his formative years in the capital than Reid.

 

[eaglesnutcase]

Future second for Buss I’d be delighted with but unless we are trading it to upgrade, pick 23 is absolutely crucial this year. There’s some excellent talent that looks to be available like Lindsay, Mraz and Bo Allan for those inclined (not me). A couple of posters have already mentioned the Baker pitfalls and he’ll be 27 by the time he plays a game for us. I can only assume it’s a 5-6 year contract on very good money which is just nuts for a 27yo player of his size and age whose primary weapons are speed and agility which are the first to go with age.

Petch and Bailey Williams will become depth players next year as the young mids (and Flynn) build their tank with the crop of FWD/rucks coming through so I have no qualms trading either of them away to facilitate pick or player upgrades.

The holes that remain would be one but probably two rebounding HBFs, outside mids/wings and another key position defender developing so they are hitting their prime with our mids.

Bakers primary attributes are speed and agility? Agree in part but you forgot toughness and leadership. And in reference to that he’s come out of a system that dominated the last 6-7 years.
I wouldn’t sell the farm to get him but he would be an asset believe me!

 

[Icanwalk]

It would be madness to trade Barrass, and outright insane if it were in the service of acquiring Baker.

Baker is a legitimate role player, who is best suited to filling gaps between the arcs as needed but doesn't really thrive in any specific position. His versatility is his greatest strength along with his attitude and zippiness, but he is undersized, has poor skills, and is a turnover merchant. Richmond, throughout their period of success, employed a gameplan that extracted the best out of such limited, small, low-skilled players, one that played to their strengths and minimised their weaknesses as they revolved around a few elite players in their side (Martin, Cotchin, Lynch, Rance, etc.) This is a mistake waiting to happen.

However, our U-shaped list profile does require trading in some mid-age role players (all the better if they have positional versatility), but not at the cost of the much-needed draft capital needed to fix our larger list deficit, that being high-end talent. We should be looking for opportunities as free agents, late draft picks, or swaps for fringe players like Petch or B.Williams. If Richmond are asking for more, then move on.

 

[Knifey Spoony]

The only way I like the Baker deal is if we are getting some sort of assistance package like Norths must-trade Second and Third rounder.

Otherwise I can't see the value in giving up draft capital for an admittedly good but older player.

 

[stylish]

Betting the farm on Busslinger?

How is a 2nd rounder betting the farm?

Maybe wrong turn of phrase - let me explain

There seems to be a large number of posters who are quite happy to move on guys like Rotham &/or Jamieson &/or Edwards because they believe Busslinger can fill the gap.

We hear things like elite kick, great intercept mark etc based mainly (I think) on u18 attributes. Now I've seen the kid play and he has good skills, but somehow we (well many) have convinced themselves they will automatically translate to senior level.

Now they may well but they may not. Many of those same people believe Busslinger is worth a pick round 2 either this or next year but somehow a kid with exposed AFL a number of years is not.

What some may not realize is that WC need a circuit breaker of a season. They need to convince their youngsters (read H. REID) that their future is rosy. If not, there is a chance they (read he) bales.

Baker brings, toughness, leadership and a desire to win. He appears to be a great team man who knows how to win. None of that should be discounted.

I am in no way saying don't get Busslinger, but I think getting someone like Baker is really important to what 2025 and 2026 looks like.

 

[Keys]

Maybe wrong turn of phrase - let me explain

There seems to be a large number of posters who are quite happy to move on guys like Rotham &/or Jamieson &/or Edwards because they believe Busslinger can fill the gap.

We hear things like elite kick, great intercept mark etc based mainly (I think) on u18 attributes. Now I've seen the kid play and he has good skills, but somehow we (well many) have convinced themselves they will automatically translate to senior level.

Now they may well but they may not. Many of those same people believe Busslinger is worth a pick round 2 either this or next year but somehow a kid with exposed AFL a number of years is not.

What some may not realize is that WC need a circuit breaker of a season. They need to convince their youngsters (read H. REID) that their future is rosy. If not, there is a chance they (read he) bales.

Baker brings, toughness, leadership and a desire to win. He appears to be a great team man who knows how to win. None of that should be discounted.

I am in no way saying don't get Busslinger, but I think getting someone like Baker is really important to what 2025 and 2026 looks like.

I have reservations with Baker mainly due to what we might have to give up for him in a trade which I expect will be a R2 pick either this year or next as a minimum

Not sure what players of ours might interest Richmond as steak knives but I’d be hesitant to add any extra picks

That said you make a good case for bringing him in given we should be able to get at least 5 decent years from him - would turn 31 in the last year of a 5 year deal

 

[Grahame]

Baker brings, toughness, leadership and a desire to win. He appears to be a great team man who knows how to win. None of that should be discounted.

I'm happy enough to take Baker - if we get him cheap. There was talk he was seriously in the mix as next Rich captain. I reckon that'd be a big plus (given we're seemingly light on for leaders). Of course, that would only be useful if he was a walk up start. ????

 

[Bacchus]

It would be madness to trade Barrass, and outright insane if it were in the service of acquiring Baker.

Baker is a legitimate role player, who is best suited to filling gaps between the arcs as needed but doesn't really thrive in any specific position. His versatility is his greatest strength along with his attitude and zippiness, but he is undersized, has poor skills, and is a turnover merchant. Richmond, throughout their period of success, employed a gameplan that extracted the best out of such limited, small, low-skilled players, one that played to their strengths and minimised their weaknesses as they revolved around a few elite players in their side (Martin, Cotchin, Lynch, Rance, etc.) This is a mistake waiting to happen.

However, our U-shaped list profile does require trading in some mid-age role players (all the better if they have positional versatility), but not at the cost of the much-needed draft capital needed to fix our larger list deficit, that being high-end talent. We should be looking for opportunities as free agents, late draft picks, or swaps for fringe players like Petch or B.Williams. If Richmond are asking for more, then move on.

Yes, absolutely, well said.

 

[WA footy mad]

Im happy not to bring in an expensive recruit like Baker or Mcdonald & take aim at Busslinger.
Then hit the draft again but unfortunately our draft hand is very weak, so we need to see if any of our players are worth at least a 3rd round pick so can bundle a few picks together & maybe get another 1st or 2nd rounder

 

[Monocle]

Baker brings, toughness, leadership and a desire to win. He appears to be a great team man who knows how to win. None of that should be discounted.

So what would you be prepared for the Club to give up to get your favourite trade in player, and accept the trade as being worthwhile and not having paid overs ?

Name the price that you would cough up, in draft capital, to acquire Baker ?

For the record I don't think we can afford him in terms of draft capital and he for me he isn't that good a footballer, to be paying overs for.

I would much rather we go after someone like Perryman or Cumming, who are UFA.

We need to place high value on our draft capital and spend it prudently.

 

[briztoon]

Who’s worth more in draft capital?

BBBW or Baker?

 

[InTheWings]

Plus VAFL bias.

Looking through dark blue and white eyes and glasses as most Victorians do.

Listening to Sam Landberger talking about Logan McDonald as though he isn’t a real West Aussie because he’s not from Perth. They are so ignorant.

Does that mean Harley's not Victorian because he's not from Melbourne?

 

[eaglevision]

So what would you be prepared for the Club to give up to get your favourite trade in player, and accept the trade as being worthwhile and not having paid overs ?

Name the price that you would cough up, in draft capital, to acquire Baker ?

For the record I don't think we can afford him in terms of draft capital and he for me he isn't that good a footballer, to be paying overs for.

I would much rather we go after someone like Perryman or Cumming, who are UFA.

We need to place high value on our draft capital and spend it prudently.

This is spot on. All well and good to say I want this player but put a realistic price on it. Baker for our 2R leaves us with 1 good pick and 1 rubbish pick in a rebuilding phase landing a 27yo when he plays.

 

[Elite Pete]

Plus VAFL bias.

Looking through dark blue and white eyes and glasses as most Victorians do.

Listening to Sam Landberger talking about Logan McDonald as though he isn’t a real West Aussie because he’s not from Perth. They are so ignorant.

Yeah never heard them mention how far Tongala is from Melbourne when they talk about Harley going back.

 

[Deplorable trumpster]

Is Baker eligible for FA next year but he is out of contract this year? Have i got that right?

If so and if Baker really wants to come home i would tell him to sign a one year extension with Richmond and then come as a FA rather than us giving up a pick that is likely in the 20's for him. Or nominate for the PSD and hope North are not interested and Richmond don't redraft him. And if he doesn't like that and signs a longer term deal with Richmond instead then so be it.

We are just not in the right place in the cycle to be trading for 27 year old's.

 

[mat11]

BBW + R4- Baker
Or
BBW + F3- Baker, take it or leave it Richmond

 

[stylish]

So what would you be prepared for the Club to give up to get your favourite trade in player, and accept the trade as being worthwhile and not having paid overs ?

Name the price that you would cough up, in draft capital, to acquire Baker ?

For the record I don't think we can afford him in terms of draft capital and he for me he isn't that good a footballer, to be paying overs for.

I would much rather we go after someone like Perryman or Cumming, who are UFA.

We need to place high value on our draft capital and spend it prudently.

I agree a UFA is better but perhaps neither want to come. Unfortunately WA & possibly WC in particular (right now) aren't a destination club.

As to cost - its what you have to offer that is the only thing relevant & how you value the player (in terms of contact length & worth).
If there is a 5 yr contact at a reasonable sum, it's hard to then offer a lowball pick. All that does is sour player & departing club like the Essendon guy tends to do. With no 3rd rounder it's hard to imagine WC's 2nd round pick, (either this or next yrs) NOT involved. Maybe something comes back- who knows - maybe a player departs WC as well. I imagine there is a lot at play here & maybe Baker decides he prefers the Melb winter after all & nothing happens.

 

[ArdentEagle]

If we get Baker and keep JJ, that means we have both a Butcher and Baker.

Given what H.Reid can do on field, we also have a candlestick maker. (Don't deny it!)

We're set!!!



Oh - If we pay and more than a direct swap of BBBW for Baker. It's too much.

 

[eaglevision]

I agree a UFA is better but perhaps neither want to come. Unfortunately WA & possibly WC in particular (right now) aren't a destination club.

As to cost - its what you have to offer that is the only thing relevant & how you value the player (in terms of contact length & worth).
If there is a 5 yr contact at a reasonable sum, it's hard to then offer a lowball pick. All that does is sour player & departing club like the Essendon guy tends to do. With no 3rd rounder it's hard to imagine WC's 2nd round pick, (either this or next yrs) NOT involved. Maybe something comes back- who knows - maybe a player departs WC as well. I imagine there is a lot at play here & maybe Baker decides he prefers the Melb winter after all & nothing happens.

So specifically what would you offer Richmond for Baker?

 

[ThePuma #9]

I don't think the Bulldogs want to lose Busslinger. As far as i know he's had a contract extension infront of him for some time and is refusing to sign.

Does he want to come home? Does he want to play first or have further clarity on what his role would be if he stayed? Doe he think he's worth more?

I'm not sure but a few things to keep in mind with Bus.

He's with a club that has a gluttony of KPP.

His season last year was affected by a shoulder injury which eventually turned into a reconstruction in July.

His form has been very good in the VFL this year, he's definitely been consistent too. Those advocating going after DGB instead have rocks in their heads. DGB has had plenty of exposure where as Buss has had none. Below are the stats for both boys over the past two months in the VFL.

Jedd Busslinger	Disposals	Marks
Rd 6 vs Hawks	19	11
Rd 7 vs Tigers (lined up as FWD)	15	3
Rd 8 vs GWS Giants	26	10
Rd 9 vs Port Melbourne	18	8
Rd 10 vs Pies	24	11
Rd 11 vs Lions	27	10
Rd 12 vs Swans	21	9
Denver Grainger-Barras	Disposals	Marks
Rd 6 DNP
Rd 7 vs Sandringham	9	2
Rd 8 BYE
Rd 9 VS Lions	9	3
Rd 10 vs Essendon	8	4
Rd 11 vs Giants	13	10
Rd 12 vs Tigers	12	9

Yes, Bussliinger is from WA and obviously that's always an attraction for us but i also think his form has shown enough promise hes worth going after and since he hasn't played hes the type of player we can get a discount on. That's the type of players we should be looking to bring in regardless of being a WA kid or not.

As for Liam Baker

7

Liam Baker

Age

26

Ht

173cm

Wt

72kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.7

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

7.9

5star

M

3.2

3star

T

2.6

4star

MG

222.2

3star

D

14.6

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

7.9

4star

M

3.8

4star

T

1.8

3star

MG

191.9

3star

D

14.4

4star

K

6.2

3star

HB

8.2

5star

M

1.6

2star

T

1.8

4star

MG

224.2

4star

i'm happy for the club to get him in for a future second and a third or a second rounder and a fringe player but if we are splitting our first pick to accommodate bringing in a 27 year old then we have rocks in our heads.

 

[bradee]

Yeah never heard them mention how far Tongala is from Melbourne when they talk about Harley going back.

It don't matter where in WA a person is from,whether it's Eucla in the south all the way up to Kunnunurra in the north and everywhere in between.

If your from WA your West Australian ,it's as simple as that.

So McDonald is 100% West Australian.

Jeez these Victorians are morons.

 

[stylish]

So specifically what would you offer Richmond for Baker?

Given what WC has at their disposal, it would be our F2 and F3 For a F4 coming back