List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion, 2023: Picks 1,20,34,39,53 ,58

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Draft - Allan (Pick 16) Shanahan (Pick 30) Gross...

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Link to Lore ’s excellent draft order thread that is updated to reflect current ladder positions

Resource - 2023 AFL Draft Order

Every trade as it happens!

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[Obeanie1]

I forgot.

They were elite players.

They’re not anymore.

And that is why they are being traded for picks around 3rd rounders and not 1st round picks. Risk v reward.

If Yeo gets back and plays out the second half of the year and proves his fitness he would be the perfect replacement for a retiring Rich.

Cockatoo couldn't get on the park at the Cats. Move to Lions and he's got the body right.

Similar with Daniher and McCarthy. Both struggled with soft tissue injuries. Got to the Lions and haven't looked back.

 

[ziad]

And that is why they are being traded for picks around 3rd rounders and not 1st round picks. Risk v reward.

If Yeo gets back and plays out the second half of the year and proves his fitness he would be the perfect replacement for a retiring Rich.

Cockatoo couldn't get on the park at the Cats. Move to Lions and he's got the body right.

Similar with Daniher and McCarthy. Both struggled with soft tissue injuries. Got to the Lions and haven't looked back.

Must be something going on up there!

 

[BOND 007]

I’d be p!ssed off if we signed Gov to a minimum contract as an unrestricted free agent. Bloke is cooked.

Similarly I’d be p!ssed we traded more than a third round pick for Darling.

I don’t care how much of their salary you pay. If they’re on anything more than the average wage, that’s on your list management team for overpaying players.

Stupid comment. McGovern broke ribs last year which finished his season and this year came back in ripping nick before doing a hammy. If on the open market now would have every team playing eager to sign.

Similar with Darling.

I've read a number of your posts and most show a good deal of common sense. This unfortunately wasn't one if them.

 

[Obeanie1]

Sorry - can't understand the logic here at all.

Why would WC want to trade Yeo for Robertson & the Lions 3rd rounder which is likely to end up in the 50's?
If Robertson wanted to come it would cost WC little.
Not sure why money gets involved at all. Not sure WC have an issue that requires a salary dump.

Yeo gets traded for young player / players we are interested in and instead of costing a 3rd we gain a 3rd back. The two 3rd rounders then could be used to upgrade into a 2nd or used in another form of upgrade. Suns chasing points.

Remwmber Noel Long was a pick 58 last draft in a shallow pool. 2023 draft is deeper. Maybe we just use both or we use two 3rds in a pick upgrade.

Eagles aren't dumping salary at all and that was never the point They may offer to pay some of his 2024 salary to improve the trade return for us.

 

[Obeanie1]

Must be something going on up there!

Warmer weather?

Better S&C team at the Lions.

Not playing on concrete grounds.

They are having a fair amount of success rehabbing players who have been struggling with soft tissue injuries. And that is factual.

 

[Obeanie1]

Agreed, not elite. But certainly still above average.

Jack Darling has kicked 40 or more goals in a season 7 times. Hipwood, contracted out to 2029 (when he will turn a similar age to JD now) at what $600-700k p.a. Has not done that once.

They aren’t the players they once were, but still better than a lot of the competition.


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Darling would be Freo's best forward when fit.

He's proven to be very durable and still has 2 or 3 years in him. Did an ankle close to round one and played round 1.

Fractured arm from a contact injury can't be helped.

 

[Jumpoff Joey]

Those 2 would be fair deals. We have a really good trading relationship with both Brisbane and Sydney and mostly come up with win/win deals.

Anything involving Port, Geelong however….

Also no point being nice with Bombers, Freo, Nth & Hawks (due to them having currency), Carlton, Richmond, Collingwood (I.e. teams who hold up trade period and/or are significant beneficiaries of the go home factor).


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Its unfortunate for Brisbane and Sydney.

But finishing last, we should be taking advantage of everything that is available, even the threat to walk players to the PSD.

 

[JackOutback]

Must be something going on up there!

Journo: 'Which doctor do you have?'

Brisbane: 'Correct.'

 

[Deplorable trumpster]

Stupid comment. McGovern broke ribs last year which finished his season and this year came back in ripping nick before doing a hammy. If on the open market now would have every team playing eager to sign.

Similar with Darling.

I've read a number of your posts and most show a good deal of common sense. This unfortunately wasn't one if them.

I agree they would get a contract somewhere if they were uncontracted and the club could get them for nothing and negotiate a contract with them from scratch (and pay them a lot less than they are getting now).

But i don't think we would get much for them if we tried to trade them. Only clubs in the window would cough up any picks of any value for players in that age bracket and even then only if we agreed to eat a big part of next years salary. No club that considers themselves outside the window would be interested in giving up anything for them in a trade and that is probably 12 of the 18 clubs who know they are not in a flag window.

The other complication would be their attitude and the attitude of their families to moving across the country. The player would have to be enthusiastic about the move to the new club for the club to risk anything to acquire them. If the other club got the sense that they were bitter and resentful about the trade, or that they just wanted another year or two on AFL level wages and were planning to just go through the motions and pick their pay cheque up, or that their families were against the move and they were likely to have problems on the homefront with an unhappy wife and kids etc distracting them then they would not put anything on the table for them. Might pick them up on a one year deal as a free agent or PSD but they would not want to risk draft capital for them.

 

[briztoon]

Agreed, not elite. But certainly still above average.

Jack Darling has kicked 40 or more goals in a season 7 times. Hipwood, contracted out to 2029 (when he will turn a similar age to JD now) at what $600-700k p.a. Has not done that once.

They aren’t the players they once were, but still better than a lot of the competition.


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Hipwood took less money for a longer term contract, he mentioned this in an interview.

Speculation on our board was that it was $500k per.

 

[briztoon]

Come off it.

It's easy to be Harry Hindsight when you look at the deals now.
Darling signed a 5 new year in 2019, which at the time was considered fair for both player and club.

BTW, speaking of, overly long deals, Eric Hipwood says hi.

Darling turns 31 in 2 weeks time, so he turns 32 next year.

Teams shouldn’t be trading high picks (first or second round picks) for players over 30.

We don’t know when the cliff will come, but usually comes fast for older players.


Edit: read my comment above about Hipwood’s reported contract.

 

[Deplorable trumpster]

Its unfortunate for Brisbane and Sydney.

But finishing last, we should be taking advantage of everything that is available, even the threat to walk players to the PSD.

You can try and threaten it. Might aswell try. But how many times has anybody ever really gone through with it? Unless you get the player onboard with it and willing to threaten the other club in tandem with you then it is a bit of an empty threat.

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

We don’t know when the cliff will come, but usually comes fast for older players.

And even faster for Eagles.

Source: waves hands around

 

[DanWCE]

Hipwood took less money for a longer term contract, he mentioned this in an interview.

Speculation on our board was that it was $500k per.

Based on the past 3 seasons they're both going at about 20k per goal I'd say. Jack just kicks more of them so you win more games.

 

[Tugga27]

Darling turns 31 in 2 weeks time, so he turns 32 next year.

Teams shouldn’t be trading high picks (first or second round picks) for players over 30.

We don’t know when the cliff will come, but usually comes fast for older players.


Edit: read my comment above about Hipwood’s reported contract.

That's all fine and dandy, but you know I was talking/quoting your opinion about Darling should be on minimum wage now.
That's ludicrous.

Hipwood might be on a reduced wage, but you'e still got to pay him for another 6 years regardless.
I can't think of a worst player who has ever gotten a 6 year deal.

 

[CountryLad]

Pure speculation but I reckon one club that does have a decent list but is struggling also with injury is Sydney. Since losing McCartin they have dropped off after a reasonable first month.
Wonder what they would give up for McGovern seeing everyone seems to be shopping our vets around today.

 

[Tugga27]

Pure speculation but I reckon one club that does have a decent list but is struggling also with injury is Sydney. Since losing McCartin they have dropped off after a reasonable first month.
Wonder what they would give up for McGovern seeing everyone seems to be shopping our vets around today.

Sydney are getting a pass because they lost both McCartins and Rampe from their backline.
We on the other hand lost Hurn, Gov and Barrass.

I'm pretty sure most picked us to finish bottom four this year.
But sides like Richmond, Sydney and Carlton have so far really undelivered.

 

[TerryFilk]

Stupid comment. McGovern broke ribs last year which finished his season and this year came back in ripping nick before doing a hammy. If on the open market now would have every team playing eager to sign.

Similar with Darling.

I've read a number of your posts and most show a good deal of common sense. This unfortunately wasn't one if them.

Are you guys not tired of the “oh McGovern was in ripping form for 2 games before he got injured” no one’s saying the injuries are his fault or that he hasn’t been unlucky but the fact is you can not rely on him at all, I don’t see how that’ll get better with age. He has played 40 out of last 71 games ffs

 

[ArdentEagle]

BOND 007
I'd love to hear your thoughts on Boyd Woodcock mate.

 

[TerryFilk]

Pure speculation but I reckon one club that does have a decent list but is struggling also with injury is Sydney. Since losing McCartin they have dropped off after a reasonable first month.
Wonder what they would give up for McGovern seeing everyone seems to be shopping our vets around today.

Sydney would want Barrass (like they did last year), don’t see them being interested in this version of McGovern

 

[briztoon]

You can try and threaten it. Might aswell try. But how many times has anybody ever really gone through with it? Unless you get the player onboard with it and willing to threaten the other club in tandem with you then it is a bit of an empty threat.

Carlton and Adelaide recently.

 

[briztoon]

That's all fine and dandy, but you know I was talking/quoting your opinion about Darling should be on minimum wage now.
That's ludicrous.

Hipwood might be on a reduced wage, but you'e still got to pay him for another 6 years regardless.
I can't think of a worst player who has ever gotten a 6 year deal.

Jack Martin.

Wasn’t saying they should be on minimum wage. Pretty sure I said average wage (i.e 400k’ish I believe it is now) for Darling.

My personal opinion is Yeo and Gov are pretty much cooked. (That’s ok, I reckon Rich is cooked as well, but we keep selecting him when fit)

 

[Keys]

Carlton and Adelaide recently.

I think Port may also have made it known they were prepared to walk Rioli to the PSD if we got too uppity in what we were asking.

It’s why we included Rioli in the pick swap and on face value got unders in the deal. North also took unders because they didn’t want to have a disgruntled negative influence around the club so took what they could get

 

[shooshka]

Are you guys not tired of the “oh McGovern was in ripping form for 2 games before he got injured” no one’s saying the injuries are his fault or that he hasn’t been unlucky but the fact is you can not rely on him at all, I don’t see how that’ll get better with age. He has played 40 out of last 71 games ffs

Sure, can’t rely on him. But the same poster has now called him ‘cooked’ twice.

Constantly unluckily injured yes, but when on the field he is far from cooked.

That is the risk/reward with him and Darling (Yeo a different scenario as he needs to turn his injuries around rather than just have better luck!), and why teams in the window might pay around pick 30 (with reduced cap spend) for those guys.


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[Tugga27]

Jack Martin.

Wasn’t saying they should be on minimum wage. Pretty sure I said average wage (i.e 400k’ish I believe it is now) for Darling.

My personal opinion is Yeo and Gov are pretty much cooked. (That’s ok, I reckon Rich is cooked as well, but we keep selecting him when fit)

Ok fair enough, average wage.
But Darling is in the second last year year of a 5 year deal.
So when his contract is up, if he's still playing he will be on reduced money like Gov and NN etc.

Hard to say he should be on average wage when he signed the deal 3 years ago TBH.

Think Jack Martin got 5 years at $600 000 per year.
Up on the podium with Mitch McGoverns contract.

Still don't know of any footballers as average as Hipwood getting a 6 year deal.