List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion, 2023: Picks 1,20,34,39,53 ,58

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R) Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Current contract status (Updated 18/10/24) : Total 39 Players -...

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Link to Lore ’s excellent draft order thread that is updated to reflect current ladder positions

Resource - 2023 AFL Draft Order

Every trade as it happens!

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[Miguel Sanchez]

Is it wrong that I’m aroused by this?

 

[kane249]

Is it wrong that I’m aroused by this?

 

[DanWCE]

Just a randoms opinion.

If I was trading for Barrass, I’d be reluctant to offer up a top 10 pick. I certainly wouldn’t offer a top 10 pick, plus and early second round pick.

If I was trading for English, I would be even more reluctant to trade a top 10 pick for him.

I really don’t see the benefit of trading out Barrass for English.

Your opinion on TBs value is already well documented. Thank you

 

[AsterixTheGaul]

So of the 23 named in the AA team,
5 are Academy prospects with only Sanders (at this stage at least) not able to be matched
no father sons
3 bottom agers
2 from Sandringham Dragons which raises the "mummy's boys" questions

4 WA prospects only 1 of which is at the pointy end of the draft and the rest seen as late first (if lucky) and second rounders

Sorry, we need to back ourselves in to retain whoever we draft

That said, I would be open to trading out pick 1 and Barrass for 2 of Curtain, Watson and McKercher plus O'Sullivan or Murphy while keeping 19 and seeing what Suns will do with 6 if we (a) carry points to the draft through available list spots, (b) offer fair points, (c) promise not to bid on ANY Suns prospects and (d) be prepared to dip into future picks to play backwards and forwards on using and hiding of points like we did for Sydney.

 

[swomovacrom]

Collard and Livingston and Hine Bastion
I thought as long as they last past pick 40 we can match any bid, so on the main list

There is also Tyler Senge who was BOG for Subi in the colts on weekend

After the champs i want Hine-Bastion i see a spot for him in our team round 1 as a small backman with a lovely kick

Big week for these NGA boys as they'll all be facing off this weekend. Collard and Senge for Subiaco trying to knock off an undefeated Perth with Livingstone and Hine-Baston. Will hopefully be a ripper and certainly an easy game for West Coast recruiters to have a look at all of their boys!

 

[Eastern Rangers]

All this talk about Harley Reid...I can't wait for us to take Curtin at #1

Curtin would be a worthy #1 pick.

 

[Chump Change]

Only way I can fathom WC getting English is if they Trade Tom. Use that Sydney pick 5ish and Ports 2nd. Would the Dogs do that? Pick 5 will be better than the compo + a late 2nd rounder - just as likely they value another year with Tim despite what would likely be a mid to late 1st compo pick.

I’m guessing there will be a significant salary squeeze next year at the Dogs.Tim and Aaron are going to be on some serious coin, Bont has been paid and Jamarra has the potential to be the best of the lot. Might be best to move Tim on and try and secure Aaron early.

I do like English, might be the only one on this board though

This is unwise.

We're trying to build a list to win our next few flags. With Tim we'll probably get 3 years peak, 2 years shoulder, and anything after is off-peak. We need to aim for that flag window in 2027 (best case scenario). By the time that comes around, he's winding down.

This is what you typically need to win a flag:

• A top 4 midfield is pretty much a minimum
• 2x A+, 4x A, then lots of role players in peak form
• You don't need a gun ruckman. Whilst Gawny or Cox are handy, Richmond won 3, and we've won 3 out of 4 with average ruckmen.
• You need midfielders more than anything else

So roughly in the draft, the gun mids sit at 1 - 5, the gun KPFs sit their too but they are hit a miss, then the elite small/mid forwards sit 5-15, KPDs 10-20, rucks 15+, and flankers 20+.

When you build an elite midfield, the best chance of finding them is top 5. You build a pool, some early ones will be spuds but you probably find a gem in Rnd2 to counter balance.

So we know English is a gun. We'd know what we're getting. A top 5 pick however is a risk. At pick 5, it's roughly 50% chance of getting a below average player to complete dud.

So why is the better decision to go with #5? Because over 3-4 years we draft in a pool of talent. Some of them are top 5 and top 10 picks, which we know the odds of getting a gun are higher. Whilst we don't know what that #5 pick will bring, we don't know it will give us a larger pool of top picks, and hence more chance of picking more winners.

English can wait until next year. If he wants to come home, we pay him well and the Dos get a compo pick. And we don't compromise our draft rebuild. And if he doesn't want to come next year, or the Dogs sign him up - there will be other opportunities with other ruckmen. If we need it.

If we were to get #5 for Barrass, take another hit at the lucky dip. Curtin or Watson may slide. If not, take Durrsma. We shouldn't even be considering trading out top 10 picks until we're mid table and on rapid rise.

 

[Convocation]

Curtin would be a worthy #1 pick.

Mark McGowan Article.

Pick by pick: The top 25 if the AFL draft was on now

No.4​

Daniel Curtain

The clear-cut best prospect out west, and the most versatile tall in this year’s draft crop. Curtin’s clash with Jed Walter boosted his stocks – even though the Allies star kicked three goals – but he is now viewed every bit as much as a midfielder.

There is even confidence in his ability to play as a forward, too. Curtin played two of his four championships games as an on-baller, racking up a combined 53 touches and 14 clearances to prove his bona fides in that position, after some impressive performances there for Claremont. West Coast are desperate to get him, and rival clubs know it. Could push into the top three.

 

[3agles87]

Lol.

Don't wear knickers BTW.

The connection between English and TB is us gaining a pick to satisfy a trade without using pick 1.

And English is two years younger than TB.

We bring in Reid using pick 1 plus English for the TB picks traded in.

If we were to get Sydney’s first for Barrass would rather just use it (maybe get Curtin) and hope for English in 12 months. If we don’t get Sydney’s 1st or a good young player, just keep TB. Trading TB to get English cause he is a couple of years younger doesn’t feel like the right strategy to me. As others have said, we may get English in 12 months time for free and building through the draft is the stage we are in.

Now if you can come up with an Obeanie special 5 team trade that sees us losing TB to gain English and Sydney’s first, that would be something to untwist all knickers (except for Briztoons as he police’s this thread pretty seriously for unrealistic parochial trades).

 

[stylish]

For the sake of the exercise let's assume North got priority pick #3 for McKay leaving & WC received Sydney's 1st rounder for Barass either 5 or 6 - how many would be amenable to swapping hands?

 

[Obeanie1]

If we were to get Sydney’s first for Barrass would rather just use it (maybe get Curtin) and hope for English in 12 months. If we don’t get Sydney’s 1st or a good young player, just keep TB. Trading TB to get English cause he is a couple of years younger doesn’t feel like the right strategy to me. As others have said, we may get English in 12 months time for free and building through the draft is the stage we are in.

Now if you can come up with an Obeanie special 5 team trade that sees us losing TB to gain English and Sydney’s first, that would be something to untwist all knickers (except for Briztoons as he police’s this thread pretty seriously for unrealistic parochial trades).

Realistically next season if he goes as a FA Dogs get a single 1st round compo or need to negotiate with us whilst we likely hold pick 1 or 2 in the PSD.

Say Dogs finish with pick 13. Compo pick 14 is the FA compo. Or they force a trade and we offer something similar say a pick around 12 we somehow get in. 2024

Now if we trade a year earlier the offer starts with a pick around 12 and we need to add something more. Say a 2nd rounder.

So how do we get a pick around 12?

Essendon have 11 and Saint Kilda 13. Dogs have 12.

Only way we get close to those is maybe Bailey Williams is traded. Maybe with a pick. Can't think of another player with value other teams would consider.

 

[bzparkes]

For the sake of the exercise let's assume North got priority pick #3 for McKay leaving & WC received Sydney's 1st rounder for Barass either 5 or 6 - how many would be amenable to swapping hands?

Keep Reid, give up on Curtin.

Do what the Vic clubs are trying with Reid and get Curtin to request a trade back home in 2 years.

 

[DanWCE]

For the sake of the exercise let's assume North got priority pick #3 for McKay leaving & WC received Sydney's 1st rounder for Barass either 5 or 6 - how many would be amenable to swapping hands?

I don't follow. 1 and 5 or 6 for 2 and 3?

 

[stylish]

I don't follow. 1 and 5 or 6 for 2 and 3?

Yes

 

[Chump Change]

For the sake of the exercise let's assume North got priority pick #3 for McKay leaving & WC received Sydney's 1st rounder for Barass either 5 or 6 - how many would be amenable to swapping hands?

#1 and #6 for #2 and 3#?

Nope.

On the surface it's Harley and Duursma for McKercher and Curtin.

At face value I think McKercher and Curtin is the better package.

BUT

Tasmania are going to come for McKercher. They're going to be able to offer way more than we can. The incentive for him to go home will be massive. It's a massive risk IMO.

So even though it seems the gap has closed on Harley, it's actually widened. I can't see any club offering us a worthwhile deal to cough him up.

 

[DanWCE]

Yes

Struth. I would never do that deal.

 

[TerryFilk]

I’d only trade 1 if it was for 2 and 3, McKercher and Curtin is better than just Reid, but yeah I definitely wouldn’t be including anything else, especially not the pick we might get for Barrass.

 

[Obeanie1]

Keep Reid, give up on Curtin.

Do what the Vic clubs are trying with Reid and get Curtin to request a trade back home in 2 years.

Who was the last WA kid to be drafted interstate and requested a trade back after two years?

Cripps. Kelly with kids.

 

[bzparkes]

Who was the last WA kid to be drafted interstate and requested a trade back after two years?

Cripps. Kelly with kids.

And?

Then we just put up with the fact we don't have Curtin and go for someone else

 

[Chump Change]

Who was the last WA kid to be drafted interstate and requested a trade back after two years?

Cripps. Kelly with kids.

How to say, "WA kids are tough, Vic kids are pussies" without even saying it.

 

[DJMac]

Who was the last WA kid to be drafted interstate and requested a trade back after two years?

Cripps. Kelly with kids.

Jackson was the most recent.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Yeo, McCarthy. Clark (think he did three years).

 

[JackOutback]

I’d only trade 1 if it was for 2 and 3, McKercher and Curtin is better than just Reid, but yeah I definitely wouldn’t be including anything else, especially not the pick we might get for Barrass.

There's no way 1 is worth 2 and 3, there has to be something going back.

 

[ziad]

How to say, "WA kids are tough, Vic kids are pussies" without even saying it.

I raise you Andrew McDougall and a few others

 

[BartBart]

#1 and #6 for #2 and 3#?

Nope.

On the surface it's Harley and Duursma for McKercher and Curtin.

At face value I think McKercher and Curtin is the better package.

BUT

Tasmania are going to come for McKercher. They're going to be able to offer way more than we can. The incentive for him to go home will be massive. It's a massive risk IMO.

So even though it seems the gap has closed on Harley, it's actually widened. I can't see any club offering us a worthwhile deal to cough him up.

I too reckon whoever drafts McKercher will be getting games into him in preparation for an almost certain trade to the Tassie tesm.