List Mgmt. Contract, Trade & Draftee Discussion, 2023: Picks 1,20,34,39,53 ,58

[Keys]

Link to contract status of all players

The Contracts Thread

2024 List Changes : Out: Retired- Gaff Delisted - Jones, Trew(R), Baker(R), Witherden, Burgiel, Culley(R), Rotham, L Edwards Traded - Darling (NM) Barrass (Hawthorn) In: Trade/FA acquisitions - Graham (Richmond) Baker (Richmond) Owies (Carlton) Current contract status (Updated 31/10/24) ...

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Link to Lore ’s excellent draft order thread that is updated to reflect current ladder positions

Resource - 2023 AFL Draft Order

Every trade as it happens!

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[plays tall 1]

On Gettable Cal Twomey said the Eagles are interested in a ruck this year, and specifically Sweet and Flynn.

 

[mattyc75]

Denver Grainger Barrass would be worth a pack of twisties at the moment.

It’s not his skill or ability.

There were genuine concerns over his ability to build a tank. He looks exhausted after a half of footy.

There haven’t been any real concerns over his application. A view is starting to form that he may just be an extremely poor endurance athlete (genetics?) and he may not make it on that basis.

Not much you can do if that is the case.

If we want a KPD we should look at Zakoletsky who is WA boy and starting to get attention (gettable).

If we are into DGB it should be a token pick, or wait til next year.

Hard to see a deal getting done. Hawks would want to retain him rather than sell low. Under no circumstances do we offer Ryan for DGB.

Yeah i really think we should draft zakostelsky, started fast as an undersized ruck but going well as a backman.
Hopefully he's still available late

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[Dom sheed pocket]

YEah I don't see why we would shoehorn BWiliams into a forward role when we have Allen, JD (for now) and Maric looks to be the athletic tall flanker. J Williams has had a few games towards the back end of the season and there is a lot of promise there- I'd like to see him get a lot more games under his belt next year as I think he will grow into that role really well to take over from JD. HE wont get that opprotunity if we have all of BBW, OA, JD and Maric up forward.
So I don't see why we would take Bailey, who has broken out this year as number 1 ruck and slot him forward with 3 other talls or at the expense of Jilliams who I think will be a much better forward, so we can bring in English. After what we have seen from BBW this year and given his age, it is not unreasonable to think he will be a top 3 or 4 ruck in the league in the next few years.
Let BBW work on his ruck craft, let JWill work on his forward craft and lets develop our young rucks as back up and perhaps get a back up on the cheap and save the $s for a big acquisition in a position of need in a few years where we are putting the finishing touches on our next premiership team.

Almost ever week we get destroyed in points form stoppage.

Bailey has done well, but he isn’t a first ruck.

We might have a slight logjam of tall forwards, but we also need to provide better support to Allen.

Notice on the weekend he was up the ground more, he’s getting clobbered week in, week out as a makeshift FF.

Given how precious our supporter base is with making sure Allen isn’t used in the ruck, I’m surprised they’re so ok with Allen in the goal square getting piled into and clobbered by 2 defenders 10 times per game every week.

 

[TerryFilk]

Another interesting comment that was made on gettable (or was it tradies) about Tim English.

Talking about English and his value, someone said he’s a million dollar a year player “according to the Eagles”.

Confirms that we had offered English a big deal. My understanding is that he is not coming this year, and not next year either.

Tim turning down our interest might have also forced us to look at other more “bargain” options, while we continue to develop Barnett- although I’m slightly concerned about putting all our eggs in that basket (I really like Barnett but his year has been just ok, verging on slightly disappointing).

Lots of rumours about unhappy dogs at the kennel. Wouldn’t be surprised if Naughton wants out.

Would we offer pick 3?

I’m probably on an island by myself, but I would love an Allen and Naughton forward duo.

I’d offer them our first round pick this year in exchange for Naughton and their first, but I wouldn’t consider just giving them 2 or 3 with nothing good coming back.

I don’t think they’ll get a better offer than that next year, as I still believe pick 2 is better than the 2 mid 1sts they might get from someone else next offseason, also puts them ahead of the Croft bid.

They have JUH who’s on the verge of becoming a bonafide star, Darcy, Lobb, Croft is incoming, I think cashing in on Naughton could be a decent outcome for them.

 

[Big_Birdy]

I’m probably on an island by myself, but I would love an Allen and Naughton forward duo.

I’d offer them our first round pick this year in exchange for Naughton and their first, but I wouldn’t consider just giving them 2 or 3 with nothing good coming back.

I don’t think they’ll get a better offer than that next year, as I still believe pick 2 is better than the 2 mid 1sts they might get from someone else next offseason, also puts them ahead of the Croft bid.

They have JUH who’s on the verge of becoming a bonafide star, Darcy, Lobb, Croft is incoming, I think cashing in on Naughton could be a decent outcome for them.

Im not in same boat with giving up our first this year, but would love Naughton. Teams would be genuinely at a loss how to cover both him and Oscar.

My preference is to get him next year perhaps using our 2025 first somehow. By 2025 we should start our move up the ladder (as in out of bottom 4) all going well, so less risk.

No idea if he has any interest in coming to us though.

 

[Hangover Noir]

I exaggerate often, but I am not exaggerating here when I say Denver Grainger Barrass is one of the worst footballers I’ve ever seen lol.

Trent Carroll?

 

[Deepthroat]

The familiar is comforting.

When was the last time our ruck wasn’t an area we heavily invested in?

25,30 years ago?

Invested as in $ or draft selections?

Paul Harding / David Hynes / Ryan Turnbull 92/94

Cox 06 (Although he was neither a massive trade in, nor a high pick)

Lycett / Vardy 18


Naitanui an outlier in terms of draft pick and $ paid

Michael Gardiner in terms of draft pick

 

[Deepthroat]

I’m probably on an island by myself, but I would love an Allen and Naughton forward duo.

I’d offer them our first round pick this year in exchange for Naughton and their first, but I wouldn’t consider just giving them 2 or 3 with nothing good coming back.

I don’t think they’ll get a better offer than that next year, as I still believe pick 2 is better than the 2 mid 1sts they might get from someone else next offseason, also puts them ahead of the Croft bid.

They have JUH who’s on the verge of becoming a bonafide star, Darcy, Lobb, Croft is incoming, I think cashing in on Naughton could be a decent outcome for them.

I'd prefer Naughton over English.

We need a second genuine KF for 2025 onward.

BWilliams holds the ruck well, Barnett comes on and we have two fwd 50 pillars for the mids to kick to.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Im not in same boat with giving up our first this year, but would love Naughton. Teams would be genuinely at a loss how to cover both him and Oscar.

My preference is to get him next year perhaps using our 2025 first somehow. By 2025 we should start our move up the ladder (as in out of bottom 4) all going well, so less risk.

No idea if he has any interest in coming to us though.

Sometimes you have to strike while the iron is hot.

Freo have the same “one that got away” relationship with Naughton that we had with Kelly.

They would re enter the picture next year. Issues at the dogs might get resolved in 12 months and he may choose to stay, and other clubs would no doubt be in to Naughton if they’re not already tripping over themselves as we speak.

If our #1 and #2 targets are off the table in Reid and Curtin the question becomes who would you prefer Duursma/Mckercher or Naughton?

 

[Big_Birdy]

Sometimes you have to strike while the iron is hot.

Freo have the same “one that got away” relationship with Naughton that we had with Kelly.

They would re enter the picture next year. Issues at the dogs might get resolved in 12 months and he may choose to stay, and other clubs would no doubt be in to Naughton if they’re not already tripping over themselves as we speak.

If our #1 and #2 targets are off the table in Reid and Curtin the question becomes who would you prefer Duursma/Mckercher or Naughton?

Fair. I reckon Naughton.

Back ourselves in with Hewett, Ginbey and Culley in the middle, finding a couple more along the way. Top end forwards are hard to find.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Opposition clubs are calling player managers of Dogs players to see where players are at.

Club needs to sort things out as soon as season end as players are unsettled.

Just saw this on the dogs board in the last 45 minutes.

Edit: bulldogs poster posted after I posted here raising Naughton as FYI.


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[Bestbird]

Going hard for English would signify we learnt nothing from the Tim Kelly trade.

Just because they are there and available doesn't make it smart business.

The Tim Kelly trade in hindsight wasn't that bad when looking at what players were taken and where the picks were taken in the end.

The main components being

2020 Draft - Pick 18 R Angwin

2019 Draft - Pick 16 C Stephens
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp
2019 Draft - Pick 38 N Bryan

 

[Big_Birdy]

The Tim Kelly trade in hindsight wasn't that bad when looking at what players were taken and where the picks were taken in the end.

The main components being

2020 Draft - Pick 18 R Angwin

2019 Draft - Pick 16 C Stephens
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp
2019 Draft - Pick 38 N Bryan

We would be significantly worse without Kelly, even taking into account getting Warner instead of him.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

The Tim Kelly trade in hindsight wasn't that bad when looking at what players were taken and where the picks were taken in the end.

The main components being

2020 Draft - Pick 18 R Angwin

2019 Draft - Pick 16 C Stephens
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp
2019 Draft - Pick 38 N Bryan

The actual players taken at those picks make it look like a good deal.

The potential players we might have taken make it less favourable.

2020 Draft - Pick 18 O’Driscoll (27)

2019 Draft - Pick 16 Georgiades (18) or Robertson (22)
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp or Rivers (32)
2019 Draft - Pick 38 Chad Warner (39)

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

The actual players taken at those picks make it look like a good deal.

The potential players we might have taken make it less favourable.

2020 Draft - Pick 18 O’Driscoll (27)

2019 Draft - Pick 16 Georgiades (18) or Robertson (22)
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp or Rivers (32)
2019 Draft - Pick 38 Chad Warner (39)

If we wanted O’Driscoll or Warner, it’s not like we couldn’t have manufactured a trade to get us the picks required, given where they went.

Could also add Jack Carrol to that list.

It’s not like pick 27 and pick 39 are hard to get your hands on and take a kings ransom.

Talent ID… sigh.

 

[FKASC]

Ya mum wouldn't be nearly as highly rated either. Except by me.


English is about to be the AA ruck. Not sure fantasy points is why he's getting that accolade babe.

AA is usually all about stat padders you peanut. Reinforces my point

The actual players taken at those picks make it look like a good deal.

The potential players we might have taken make it less favourable.

2020 Draft - Pick 18 O’Driscoll (27)

2019 Draft - Pick 16 Georgiades (18) or Robertson (22)
2019 Draft - Pick 27 J Sharp or Rivers (32)
2019 Draft - Pick 38 Chad Warner (39)

I don’t know how many times I’ve had to post this after people keep referring to the spuds Geelong chose

Jake Bowey and Max Holmes also went directly after that 2020 pick 18.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

AA is usually all about stat padders you peanut. Reinforces my point

I don’t know how many times I’ve had to post this after people keep referring to the spuds Geelong chose

Jake Bowey and Max Holmes also went directly after that 2020 pick 18.

Geelong traded a future first with Tigers for that pick.

If we wanted Holmes, we could have done the same to get him.

Richmond probably would have taken our deal over Geelongs given respective finishing positions that year.

 

[ArdentEagle]

I love the idea of Naughton and Oscar together but I'm torn.

I recon McKercher is going to be an out and out absolute gun

 

[amazingjoshy]

AA is usually all about stat padders you peanut. Reinforces my point

I don’t know how many times I’ve had to post this after people keep referring to the spuds Geelong chose

Jake Bowey and Max Holmes also went directly after that 2020 pick 18.

4 different clubs ended up with those picks and none seemed to nail them

Yet we definitely would have without a doubt nailed all 4

 

[FKASC]

Geelong traded a future first with Tigers for that pick.

If we wanted Holmes, we could have done the same to get him.

Richmond probably would have taken our deal over Geelongs given respective finishing positions that year.

More about who was available at our original picks. People refer to who got taken, as if we would have ended up with the same guys. Of course for all we know we would have picked even worse players

 

[dkalphy]

Well * off to the Doggies board then!!!

stfu

 

[Ishmael_]

Fair. I reckon Naughton.

Back ourselves in with Hewett, Ginbey and Culley in the middle, finding a couple more along the way. Top end forwards are hard to find.

Is Naughton a top end forward though?

He's been out of form this year but even looking at his full career, I'm not sure he's crafty enough as a forward to find multiple scoring avenues or a good enough set shot to make his aerial dominance worth it.

I'd prefer him down back but then his field kicking isn't great. It would be like having two Barrasses.

Happy to grab him at a reasonable price but he wouldn't be a free agent so we'd have to pony up.

 

[Dom sheed pocket]

Is Naughton a top end forward though?

He's been out of form this year but even looking at his full career, I'm not sure he's crafty enough as a forward to find multiple scoring avenues or a good enough set shot to make his aerial dominance worth it.

I'd prefer him down back but then his field kicking isn't great. It would be like having two Barrasses.

Happy to grab him at a reasonable price but he wouldn't be a free agent so we'd have to pony up.

Naughton has publicly said he doesn’t want to go back.

He would not come under those circumstances. He is a forward.

He’s an elite forward who has a particular zone 25-40m out where his set shots are a weakness.



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[Mop]

People need to remember that Naughton is NOT eligible to be an RFA. He will need to be traded for.
Keep that in mind when discussing any hypotheticals

 

[Doashuey]

Almost ever week we get destroyed in points form stoppage.

Bailey has done well, but he isn’t a first ruck.

We might have a slight logjam of tall forwards, but we also need to provide better support to Allen.

Notice on the weekend he was up the ground more, he’s getting clobbered week in, week out as a makeshift FF.

Given how precious our supporter base is with making sure Allen isn’t used in the ruck, I’m surprised they’re so ok with Allen in the goal square getting piled into and clobbered by 2 defenders 10 times per game every week.

Both of those issues are down to the midfield, not the ruck. Even with NN rucking our midst get destroyed, there is omly so much a ruck can do and I would absolutely guarantee English wouldn't make this midfield win significantly more clearances.
Allen doesn't need extra talks down there we needs fast ball movement so he can get good delivery on the lead rather than a slow build up that forces long deep balls I to a crowded forward line.
JW also did a good job backing up BW in the ruck.

The